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Apple Introduces New Mac Pro with Nehalem Xeon Processors

azentropy said:
It was a great explanation if it wasn't dealing with computers prices....But if you won't concede that Consumer Price Index has nothing to do with a "Computer Price Index" then I give up... Those are the number you need to look at.
Click to expand...

I understand your point, but the problem with your argument is that the changes in computer technology & cost that you're talking about are already included in the relevant Government Statistics.

Specifically, the Producer Price Index (PPI) expanded its coverage to include the output of the computer industry starting in 1991.

And the Consumer Price Index (CPI) incorporates a PC index as a ~24% subcomponent within its 'Technology, Hardware and Services' component, which has been part of the CPI since 1989.

FWIW, it very well may be for this very reason that the CPI was the lowest inflation index available on the website that I had cited.

-hh
 
My order was confirmed (with academic discount):

製品番号： Z0G1
製品名： Mac Pro, Two Quad-Core Intel Xeon
オプション：
アクセサリキット
2 x 2.26GHz Quad-Core Intel Xeon
8GB (4X2GB)
ATI Radeon HD 4870 512MB
1TB 7,200rpm シリアル ATA 3Gb/s
1 - 18x SuperDrive
AirPort Extreme Wi-Fi Card with 802.11n
Apple Wireless Mighty Mouse
Apple Wireless Keyboard (JIS) + 製品マニュアル
単価： ￥357,592
数量： 1
小計： ￥357,592
出荷予定日： 2-3 週

小計： ￥357,592
消費税： ￥17,880

ご注文合計金額 ￥375,472

I will take 2~3 weeks to be delivered according to this. The sooner the better.
 
mjteix said:
One explanation that I find simple enough is that Apple wants to generate more profit from the juicer segment of the market: the workstations. Especially when they have probably one month advantage before the competition starts offering equivalent models. That's common practice.
Click to expand...

I would say they're generating it with the latest models of the Mac Pros.

We can argue all we want on perceived value and Apple's markup, but there is no way that anywhere near 89% of the baseline Mac Pro is component pricing. There is an extreme markup on these models that goes beyond anything I can remember in the past.

It makes you wonder if Apple is trying to milk everything it can out of the workstation line in order to account for potential diminished sales in the consumer line.

Pricing totals taken directly from Intel's ARK Web site (bulk pricing per 1,000; it's likely that Apple pays even less):

New models (Early 2009)

Mac Pro "Quad-core", $2499, One 2.66Ghz Intel Xeon W3520 ($284) (Cheapest Nehalem XEON Intel offers) or 11 percent of total price.
Mac Pro "8 Core", $3299, Two 2.26Ghz Intel Xeon E5520's ($373 each, $746 total) (Mid-range XEON Intel offers in the "E-series" line) or 23 percent of total price.

Previous models (Early 2008)

Mac Pro "Two 2.8Ghz Quad-core", $2799, Two 2.8Ghz Intel XEON 5462 ($797 each, $1594 total) or 57 percent of total price.
Mac Pro "Two 3.0Ghz Quad-core", $3599, Two 3.0Ghz Intel XEON 5472 ($1022 each, $2044 total) or 57 percent of total price.

[iMac processor pricing removed]
 
YoshiKing said:
Hey guys, How does Apple get these processors without Intel releasing them properly?
The cards performance is outstanding! The Nahalem card really packs a boost to the new Mac Pro. Would they be able to introduce these into the Macbook Pro's? Maybe 17" without the beautiful long life battery?

YoshiKing
Click to expand...

While it is possible, (see the Eurocom Phantom-i7,) it's not very likely at the moment. Apple's notebooks are high midrange in performance generally; not 'mobile workstations' like some PC makers do. The monster linked above has four large blower fans, and gets a mere 60 minutes of battery life.

If Apple were to be willing to produce a three inch thick behemoth, maybe. But Apple likes their sleek industrial design; which precludes any Core i7-based notebook for the time being. And the laptop-oriented Nehalems are still some months off. While they may be able to release the Xeons thirty days before official launch, the laptop chips are way too far off for that.
 
Umbongo said:
Nope it's a Xeon 3520 on the single quad core. The much requested xMac, just $1500 more than Dell.
Click to expand...

Holy s**t you're right!!! :D

I F**KING WANT A MAC PRO. :mad:

Is there such a thing as a mini-DisplayPort "Y" adapter so two LED cinema displays can be used with one graphics card? Somebody needs to get on that if there isn't. :(
 
Bring-on the benchmarks.
That will help many of us narrow-down which mac is best suited for us in relation to performance and price.

It would be great if the benchmark could show the comparison between the previous to the current models.
Baseline model for comparison could be Two 2.8Ghz Quad-core (previous base model)

So the results would be something like:

One 2.66GHz Quad-Core is ??% faster/slower than (Baseline model)
One 2.93GHz Quad-Core is ??% faster/slower than (Baseline model)

Two 2.26GHz Quad-Core is ??% faster than (Baseline model)
Two 2.66GHz Quad-Core is ??% faster than (Baseline model)
Two 2.93GHz Quad-Core is ??% faster than (Baseline model)
 
mangis said:
My order was confirmed (with academic discount):

製品番号： Z0G1
製品名： Mac Pro, Two Quad-Core Intel Xeon
オプション：
アクセサリキット
2 x 2.26GHz Quad-Core Intel Xeon
8GB (4X2GB)
ATI Radeon HD 4870 512MB
1TB 7,200rpm シリアル ATA 3Gb/s
1 - 18x SuperDrive
AirPort Extreme Wi-Fi Card with 802.11n
Apple Wireless Mighty Mouse
Apple Wireless Keyboard (JIS) + 製品マニュアル
単価： ￥357,592
数量： 1
小計： ￥357,592
出荷予定日： 2-3 週

小計： ￥357,592
消費税： ￥17,880

ご注文合計金額 ￥375,472

I will take 2~3 weeks to be delivered according to this. The sooner the better.
Click to expand...

I know... I too have to wait 2-3 weeks, and it feels like a year.
 
Paying Apple for Memory?

What is the best strategy for the initial memory config from Apple with the new Mac Pro 2.26 8-core?

Is it best to only get the base 6GB even though it fills 6 DIMM slots, or better to spring the extra $100 for the 8GB which only uses 4 DIMM slots, then add 2 more DIMMS so that 6 slots are used by the processors?

Thanks.
 
Tarkio said:
What is the best strategy for the initial memory config from Apple with the new Mac Pro 2.26 8-core?

Is it best to only get the base 6GB even though it fills 6 DIMM slots, or better to spring the extra $100 for the 8GB which only uses 4 DIMM slots, then add 2 more DIMMS so that 6 slots are used by the processors?

Thanks.
Click to expand...

Well that would be the cheapest way to get 12GB right now. $100 to Apple and crucial have 2x2GB for $100, you may be able to get it for less elsewhere.
 
Tallest Skil said:
Probably the part where you've mistaken it for sarcasm. Had you said sarcasm, I would have agreed with you. Irony makes absolutely no sense in this situation.
Click to expand...

Sarcasm is a form of Irony. If you think Irony has anything do to with that song by Alanis Morissette, I have bad news for you...
 
Memory Configuration and Turbo Boost

I just read an article in the German print magazine c't about the Core i7. They used it in several x58 mainboards and made some comments that surprised me (I think those should also be valid for the Xeon versions, shouldn't they?):

1. It's not advisable to use four memory modules (probably the same with eight), as part of the memory will then be addressed in Single-Channel-Mode. I would have expected all four modules to be addressed in Dual-Channel-Mode in that case, but apparently they're not, which doesn't shed a good light on Apple's decision to use 4/8 memory slots.

2. They say Turbo Boost can increase the clock speed by one step (=133,33MHz). I thought I had read about a maximum of two steps (=266,66Mhz) before, but that seems to be wrong.

3. Even when all four cores are under load, Turbo Boost will kick in as long as the maximum power consumption of 130 Watts (in the case of the i7) is not exceeded, so it's dependent on the code being executed at the moment, the CPU used and the cooling.
 
Taipan said:
1. It's not advisable to use four memory modules (probably the same with eight), as part of the memory will then be addressed in Single-Channel-Mode. I would have expected all four modules to be addressed in Dual-Channel-Mode in that case, but apparently they're not, which doesn't shed a good light on Apple's decision to use 4/8 memory slots.
Click to expand...

Absolutely not true. If you have 3GB on 3 chips, each one will have an access rate optimized for tri-channel mode. If you have 4GB on 4 chips, then the same three will operate in tri-channel mode, and the 4th will operate a bit slower - but you still get a benefit from having more RAM. That doesn't make the computer slower or mean it was a bad decision on the part of Apple.
 
Umbongo said:
Well that would be the cheapest way to get 12GB right now. $100 to Apple and crucial have 2x2GB for $100, you may be able to get it for less elsewhere.
Click to expand...

Thanks, that settles it for me. I'm ordering the 8-core 2.26 with 8GB RAM and the ATI 4870 for $3,311 (w/company discount). Adding the extra RAM pushes delivery to 2-3 weeks though. :(

I'll pick up 2x2GB additional RAM (putting me at 6 DIMM slots) and a couple of TB drives later.
 
Taipan said:
I just read an article in the German print magazine c't about the Core i7. They used it in several x58 mainboards and made some comments that surprised me (I think those should also be valid for the Xeon versions, shouldn't they?):

1. It's not advisable to use four memory modules (probably the same with eight), as part of the memory will then be addressed in Single-Channel-Mode. I would have expected all four modules to be addressed in Dual-Channel-Mode in that case, but apparently they're not, which doesn't shed a good light on Apple's decision to use 4/8 memory slots.

2. They say Turbo Boost can increase the clock speed by one step (=133,33MHz). I thought I had read about a maximum of two steps (=266,66Mhz) before, but that seems to be wrong.

3. Even when all four cores are under load, Turbo Boost will kick in as long as the maximum power consumption of 130 Watts (in the case of the i7) is not exceeded, so it's dependent on the code being executed at the moment, the CPU used and the cooling.
Click to expand...

In Quad code mode: 2.93Ghz
In Dual code mode: 3.06Ghz
In Single core mode: 3.2Ghz

According to an old article.

Apparently according to apple Single core mode is 3.33Ghz and dual core could be 3.06 or 3.2 depending on temps etc.

Won't know until people get them :)

Is what i've read :)
 
Grimace said:
Absolutely not true. If you have 3GB on 3 chips, each one will have an access rate optimized for tri-channel mode. If you have 4GB on 4 chips, then the same three will operate in tri-channel mode, and the 4th will operate a bit slower - but you still get a benefit from having more RAM. That doesn't make the computer slower or mean it was a bad decision on the part of Apple.
Click to expand...

Sadly, that's not the way it works with the desktop X58. If you add a fourth module, it drops to single-channel mode for all RAM. Intel's desktop Core i7 motherboard is this way, with four sockets.

Note that on the Mac Pro, this is per processor, though.

So Apple's 8 GB configuration that is four 2 GB modules (two per processor,) would be a good configuration. You have the speed of dual-channel, with the expandability to easily move to 12 GB by buying two more 2 GB modules later and moving to triple-channel mode. Plus, Apple's $100 for +2 GB isn't that bad of a price. Moving from six 1 GB to four 2 GB modules for $100 is a steal for Apple. And not that bad even from other sources. (Crucial.com charges $56 for a single 1 GB ECC module, $103 for a single 2 GB ECC module; for a total cost of $336 for 6 GB, $412 for 8 GB, in Apple's configurations. That's not a bad markup for Apple. The 12 GB upgrade price isn't bad, either. $300 at Apple vs. $282 difference from Crucial.)

The only reason for adding a fourth module per processor is if you absolutely positively need the RAM capacity over speed.
 
Flavioparentiq said:
You really want to know why? Well, those people don't spend a dollar on OSX research, hardware research (firewire? bluetooth?), compatibility issues & software/Os integration research, merging different hardware together (MAC, APPLE TV, IPHONE, IPOD) into a lifestyle, CUSTOMER CARE...

You know, I don't even understand those people who pay for Photoshop, final cut, after effect.. I mean, you can download them for free on the internet, why the hell should I pay a 100000% more if I can have the same exact thing at almost no cost? It's a mistery for me...
Click to expand...

You are wrong. If ExpressHD can build and sell at a profit this kind of PC for $1,400, due to economies of scale, Apple could sell one for say $1,600-1,800 and make a killing. Enough to pay for all the software development/hardware integration.

There is plenty of evidence of Apple's greed and stupidity in its history. Choosing to offer a very narrow product line is stupid in my opinion. Apple could offer non-Xeon lower end towers for the bulk of such market.

Again, when not enough Mac Pros sell, Apple will rationalize it by saying that market is dying. Delusional greed is what they are affected with.
 
Voltaic said:
You are wrong. If ExpressHD can build and sell at a profit this kind of PC for $1,400, due to economies of scale, Apple could sell one for say $1,600-1,800 and make a killing. Enough to pay for all the software development/hardware integration.

There is plenty of evidence of Apple's greed and stupidity in its history. Choosing to offer a very narrow product line is stupid in my opinion. Apple could offer non-Xeon lower end towers for the bulk of such market.

Again, when not enough Mac Pros sell, Apple will rationalize it by saying that market is dying. Delusional greed is what they are affected with.
Click to expand...


I hope you are at least a senior economic manager of a "A" ranked corporation. Because if you're not, how can you say those numbers with such arrogance like you know what you're talking about? You work at apple? You have their market polls? You did research on apple customers need worldwide? And if you're not, like everyone else here, you just don't know what you're talking about.
 
Voltaic said:
You are wrong. If ExpressHD can build and sell at a profit this kind of PC for $1,400, due to economies of scale, Apple could sell one for say $1,600-1,800 and make a killing. Enough to pay for all the software development/hardware integration.

There is plenty of evidence of Apple's greed and stupidity in its history. Choosing to offer a very narrow product line is stupid in my opinion. Apple could offer non-Xeon lower end towers for the bulk of such market.

Again, when not enough Mac Pros sell, Apple will rationalize it by saying that market is dying. Delusional greed is what they are affected with.
Click to expand...

One can save a fortune on not getting a PHD in marketing by remembering this...an item is worth whatever people will pay for it.

Yes, Apple is culling the herd and moving their pro machines upscale. Upscale is not only about performance, it's also about perception and people who think they want "the best" will go for the high-end shiny box.

I'm not rich, but the extra few hundred bucks I'm spending on an 8-core MP makes me happy, just like it will for others.

Another marketing phrase...like it or lump it. :D
 
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