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Apple is selling (expensive) hardware that can unlock a bunch of nice software based free-ish services.
If they are “free-ish”, why are they such a big part of Apple’s revenue (not to mention profit)?

You are just regurgitating an opinion that hasn’t been true for a decade at least.

Also, I didn’t actually argue against what Apple actually is, but what they consider themselves to be. Which may or may not be different things.
 
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Yes sure, that’s why I have no doubt staying in the Apple ecosystem. The problem (or non-problem) for me is to keep my current perfectly fine 15PM (unlike my terrible 14 Pro with really bad battery health one year in) for another year.
The summary of opinions on this forum is that Apple should revolutionize every product every year, while ensuring that the products stay the same to avoid planned obsolescence.
 
If they are “free-ish”, why are they such a big part of Apple’s revenue (not to mention profit)?

You are just regurgitating an opinion that hasn’t been true for a decade at least.

Also, I didn’t actually argue against what Apple actually is, but what they consider themselves to be. Which may or may not be different things.
oh. I didn’t knew that we were debating what someone else thinks and having to provide evidence of that. That’s a tough debate to have.

Sure. A lot of the revenue is from various services. Who’s denying that?

With free-ish I refer to that you can get far with not paying directly for any services. HomeKit, 5Gb cloud storage, a lot of nice apps, features, ecosystem benefits etc, including very basic productivity tools and without being flooded with ads. The experience is very clean compared to eg Windows.

Obviously this is not enough for most people and they will be paying for extra cloud storage or other services.

But the price you pay for entering that world is expensive hardware. If you really like the iOS/macOS you either have to pay for it or be willing to experiment with a hackinstosh
 
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The only point I was trying to make is that you can get up and running on an Android and/or in the PC world much cheaper than with Apple. But it’s a more DIY or ad/bloatware flooded experience. And very little extra productivity apps is for free.
 
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So I am an iPhone 13 Pro Max user, and I also happen to be a HEAVY ai user.

I pay for ChatGPT and also perplexity, and have used midjourney and also Leonardo AI for image generation.

And this is why I am not buying apples BS about upgrading.

See, because I have been using these services on my three year old phone just fine, I know that there are AI features that can be run on the iPhone I have now.

I accept that some things like reading email and creating summaries take on device power, but don't you dare tell me that I need to pay you to get "all" the AI features.

To make things worse, this is the first apple event I missed.

I tuned into it, but then had a work call and missed pretty much everything iPhone related, and when I went to go look at Macrumors I saw what exactly. Typical Apple talking points rubbish:

* NEW PROCESSOR FASTEST BESTEST EVER.
* LOOK AT THE CAMERA WOW!

That is pretty much it, that and the mention of how the phone was "built for AI..." when again most of us that are actually interested in AI understand totally that we can use it on our three, four or even FIVE year old devices.

And let's talk about that launch, shall we?

I updated my M1 Pro macbook to 15 today because it was the RC, and there are ZERO ai features in this build. Not a single one.

So you expect users to pay to upgrade devices for software that is "coming soon," which can already run mostly fine on older devices now, huh?

Forced obsolesces is a thing. And apple is bringing this to an absurd degree.

Their tactics started getting really out of hand when they told users they cannot use portrait mode or noise isolation unless they are on Apple Silicon (when you can 100% do noise isolation with an app called Krisp on any processor), and it is getting way out of hand here.

I do love my apple products, but the way they are forcing upgrades is really unnerving, especially in the economy we are in where many of us decide what payment arrangement to make that much to feed out families.

Just gross.
What an unhinged and uninformed rant; if you can't be bothered to inform yourself accurately, go and buy a Samsung.
 
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the difference between US and EU apple main pages, without apple intelligence coming to the eu, there isn’t much for us even with the 16 Pros and iOS 18, real shame
 

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Forced obsolesces is a thing. And apple is bringing this to an absurd degree.
I’ve seen this comment time and time again on this forum. Forced obsolescence occurs when a product’s advertised capabilities are diminished or rendered obsolete. New features not available on your iPhone model are not examples of forced obsolescence. While it’s likely that Apple is greedy and could have integrated Apple Intelligence or ChatGPT on older iPhones, Apple never promised that these features would be available on those devices and they are in their right to gatekeep new features however they like. That doesn't mean that your iPhone is now obsolete, you will still have 5+ years of software upgrades
 
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Siri sucked at launch (still sucks IMO). I really don't get the excitement about "Apple Intelligence", I hope we have the ability to disable/remove it.
Yep, and in 5 years or so Apple will get around to getting it right. Apple has become a marketing company and is no longer a Tech company. Apple does not care if it works, just that it looks good in the keynote.
 
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Couldn’t care about AI. Not upgrading my 14PM this year. AI holds no interest for me.
 
I’ve seen this comment time and time again on this forum. Forced obsolescence occurs when a product’s advertised capabilities are diminished or rendered obsolete. New features not available on your iPhone model are not examples of forced obsolescence. While it’s likely that Apple is greedy and could have integrated Apple Intelligence or ChatGPT on older iPhones, Apple never promised that these features would be available on those devices and they are in their right to gatekeep new features however they like. That doesn't mean that your iPhone is now obsolete, you will still have 5+ years of software upgrades
The problem is Apple arbitrarily deciding, for example, that an AI response time of 0.1 second is the target, when most of us normal people would be just fine with 0.8 second response time. This is Apple hiding forced obsolescence behind false specs. It is our device and we should be able to decide what we want.

Disclaimer: I have no idea if the response times quoted above are accurate, it was just an example to make a point.
 
This is Apple hiding forced obsolescence behind false specs. It is our device and we should be able to decide what we want.
Nope, you're wrong. Your iPhone is still doing exactly what it was supposed to do when you bought it, so this is not forced obsolescence. Is Apple arbitrary in its design of feature specifications? Absolutely. Doesn't mean that your device is obsolete. If you think your device is obsolete because you don't get AI features, that's a you problem.
 
Nope, you're wrong. Your iPhone is still doing exactly what it was supposed to do when you bought it, so this is not forced obsolescence. Is Apple arbitrary in its design of feature specifications? Absolutely. Doesn't mean that your device is obsolete. If you think your device is obsolete because you don't get AI features, that's a you problem.
When my device is perfectly capable of running something that Apple limited it not too, it is forced obsolescence.

And, Apple does not only do this for AI, they do for all kinds of features. It is also why my music servers, and everything not iPhone related are moving to Linux. Wherever someone produces a secure phone that is not apple, I will move immediately. This artificial limiting may be profitable in the short term, but it is not a good long term strategy.
 
So I am an iPhone 13 Pro Max user, and I also happen to be a HEAVY ai user.

I pay for ChatGPT and also perplexity, and have used midjourney and also Leonardo AI for image generation.

And this is why I am not buying apples BS about upgrading.

See, because I have been using these services on my three year old phone just fine, I know that there are AI features that can be run on the iPhone I have now.

I accept that some things like reading email and creating summaries take on device power, but don't you dare tell me that I need to pay you to get "all" the AI features.

To make things worse, this is the first apple event I missed.

I tuned into it, but then had a work call and missed pretty much everything iPhone related, and when I went to go look at Macrumors I saw what exactly. Typical Apple talking points rubbish:

* NEW PROCESSOR FASTEST BESTEST EVER.
* LOOK AT THE CAMERA WOW!

That is pretty much it, that and the mention of how the phone was "built for AI..." when again most of us that are actually interested in AI understand totally that we can use it on our three, four or even FIVE year old devices.

And let's talk about that launch, shall we?

I updated my M1 Pro macbook to 15 today because it was the RC, and there are ZERO ai features in this build. Not a single one.

So you expect users to pay to upgrade devices for software that is "coming soon," which can already run mostly fine on older devices now, huh?

Forced obsolesces is a thing. And apple is bringing this to an absurd degree.

Their tactics started getting really out of hand when they told users they cannot use portrait mode or noise isolation unless they are on Apple Silicon (when you can 100% do noise isolation with an app called Krisp on any processor), and it is getting way out of hand here.

I do love my apple products, but the way they are forcing upgrades is really unnerving, especially in the economy we are in where many of us decide what payment arrangement to make that much to feed out families.

Just gross.
Dude, where's Apple and where's ethics? Apple is about making $$$ and squeezing margin. It's the essence of any corporation and capitalism as a whole. Just don't buy their product if it goes against your values. As simple as that:)
 
So I am an iPhone 13 Pro Max user, and I also happen to be a HEAVY ai user.

I pay for ChatGPT and also perplexity, and have used midjourney and also Leonardo AI for image generation.

And this is why I am not buying apples BS about upgrading.

......



Since you seem to like AI a lot, i asked ChatGPT to give you a response with the new "o1-preview":



I understand your concerns about Apple's approach to integrating AI features and the feeling that they're pushing consumers toward unnecessary upgrades. However, there are several reasons why Apple might require newer hardware for certain AI functionalities, which could offer a different perspective on the situation.

On-Device AI vs. Cloud-Based AI

While services like ChatGPT, Perplexity, Midjourney, and Leonardo AI run effectively on older devices, they rely on cloud computing. Your device acts as a terminal that sends requests to powerful servers, which handle the heavy computational tasks and send back the results. This setup works well for applications that don't require real-time processing or can tolerate some latency.

In contrast, on-device AI processes data locally, providing immediate responses without needing an internet connection. This is crucial for features like real-time language translation, augmented reality, and personalized content generation. These tasks demand significant processing power and are optimized for the advanced neural engines found in newer devices like the latest iPhones and Macs.

Hardware Limitations and Optimizations

Apple's newer devices come equipped with specialized hardware components designed for AI and machine learning tasks. For example, the A18 Pro chip includes a more advanced Neural Engine capable of handling trillions of operations per second. This allows for sophisticated features like enhanced photography, real-time video analysis, and complex computational tasks that older processors weren't designed to handle efficiently.

While your iPhone 13 Pro Max is still a powerful device, it may not deliver the optimal experience for these advanced features. Running high-intensity AI applications on older hardware could lead to increased battery drain, overheating, or reduced performance, which would negatively impact the user experience.

Software Development and Quality Assurance

From a software development standpoint, supporting a wide range of hardware configurations can be challenging. Developers have to optimize and test features across multiple devices with varying capabilities, which can dilute resources and delay innovation. By focusing on newer hardware, Apple can ensure that the features work seamlessly and meet their quality standards.

Privacy and Security Benefits

On-device AI also enhances privacy and security. Processing data locally means sensitive information doesn't need to be sent to external servers, reducing the risk of data breaches or unauthorized access. Apple's commitment to user privacy is one of their core values, and leveraging the capabilities of newer hardware aligns with this philosophy.

Economic Considerations and Longevity

While upgrading devices can be a significant investment, Apple typically provides software support for older devices for many years. This long-term support allows users to continue receiving security updates and basic functionality without immediate pressure to upgrade. Additionally, the resale value of Apple products tends to be higher, which can offset the cost of purchasing new devices.

Alternatives and User Choice

It's also worth noting that upgrading is not mandatory. If the current capabilities of your devices meet your needs, you can continue to use them without adopting the new features. Third-party applications, like Krisp for noise isolation, offer alternatives that can extend the functionality of older hardware.

Conclusion

While it may seem like forced obsolescence, Apple's approach is often driven by the desire to provide the best possible user experience through hardware and software integration. Advanced AI features require the processing power and efficiencies that newer devices offer. Balancing innovation with support for older devices is a complex challenge, and focusing on new hardware capabilities allows Apple to push technological boundaries while still offering long-term support for existing customers.
 
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Because only Apple products can be used worldwide, more or less, unlIke Google android which is unavailable in a few countries. Plus I am not comfortable with third party android OS.
I was unaware of the Android availability challenges (given the many proponents on here) until you raised the issue. The latest Dithering episode with John Gruber and Ben Thompson includes a great example of Ben Thompson intending to get the new Pixel Pro but can’t get it in Taiwan, and none of the Samsung models available in Taiwan offer dual eSIM (which he needs and doesn’t want to implement third-party utilities and workarounds) — so he’s going to get a new iPhone 16 instead .. because “it just works.” I was not aware of this issue until you mentioned it and really did not appreciate the real world implication until hearing Ben Thompson’s very real example. Net-net: another opportunity to recognize and appreciate the importance of the seemingly little things we take for granted as Apple users.
 
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