Apple Knowingly Sold 2016-17 MacBook Pro Models With 'Flexgate' Display Defect, Judge Says

[MacRumors]

In 2019, some customers of 2016 and 2017 MacBook Pro models began to notice an odd "stage lighting" effect that would impact their screen, potentially causing the laptop to be unusable. The odd occurrence resulted from a weak and fragile flex cable that can experience wear and tear with repeated opening and closing of the computer.

Image via MacRumors reader SourceSunToM​

Now, two years later, a judge who's presiding over a case from a group of consumers accusing Apple of knowingly selling the laptops, despite the defect, says that Apple would have been alerted to the issue thanks to pre-release testing.

As reported in a paywalled report from Law360, Judge Edward Davila sided with the plaintiffs by agreeing that testing the laptops before their release would have informed Apple engineers of the issue. Hence, the company knowingly sold the laptops with the defect.

U.S. District Judge Edward Davila determined that the consumers' allegations of Apple conducting intensive pre-release testing, which the consumers say was conducted by a team of "reliability engineers" who carried out stress tests and other procedures that would have alerted Apple to defects behind the display failures, sufficiently demonstrate that Apple was aware of the alleged defect.

"The court finds that the allegations of pre-release testing in combination with the allegations of substantial customer complaints are sufficient to show that Apple had exclusive knowledge of the alleged defect," the judge wrote in his opinion.

The plaintiff, Mahan Taleshpour, representing a larger group of consumers, says that Apple "continues to deny there was ever a defect in its display cables," and goes further to say that Apple attempted to cover any evidence of "Flexgate."

According to Talehspour, Apple deliberately deleted comments and threads from its Apple Support Community Forum, which often serves as a go-to place for crowdsourcing information on potential issues with Apple devices. Talehspour accues Apple of deleting comments that outlined "‌Flexgate‌" and the issues around the display. The judge says that if the accusation is true, it will act as further proof that Apple was aware of the issue.

If Apple deleted comments on its website from consumers complaining about display issues attributable to the alleged defect, that suggests that Apple had knowledge of the alleged defect, superior to that of plaintiffs or potential class members.

Apple is pushing back, saying that Talehspour bought his MacBook Pro in 2017, and used it without any issues for more than three years until the case was filed. Apple also says that the allegation is based on false assumptions,not hard-ironed facts.

Specifically, Apple says that the idea that pre-release testing of the device would have alerted it to the issue is not accurate. Alexander Wheeler, an attorney for the case, says that the plaintiffs are "naturally pleased" with the judge's current stance on the issue and their decision to allow the case to move forward. Wheeler goes on to state the specifics of "Flexgate."

"Those thin cables stretch and wear out as consumers open and close their laptops," Wheeler said. "As those thin cables tear, the laptop display screens — which Apple touts as the 'best Mac display ever' — stop working long before the expected life of an expensive Apple laptop."

With the release of the MacBook Pro in 2018, Apple addressed the issue by adding a longer and seemingly stronger flex cable to the display, reducing the likelihood of wear and tear.

Article Link: Apple Knowingly Sold 2016-17 MacBook Pro Models With 'Flexgate' Display Defect, Judge Says

 

[MauiPa]

"carried out stress tests and other procedures that would have alerted Apple to defects". and if the stress tests did not alert Apple to the "Problem"? How can a legal finding not be based on facts. How about entering the reports of the stress testing as evidence, did they show the problem? It is very common for actual problems to arise from factors not included in the stress test. Over extending the hinges, chemical exposures, thermal stresses. Admittedly, the test suite should cover all likely exposures, but if they didn't, then it was not known. Seriously, this judge is stretching things

 

[itsmeaustend]

Honestly, good.

Apple’s either lying or they don’t QA their new products. Which one is it, Apple?

 

[02275629]

Deleting all those threads on their forums about flexgate is soo shady on Apple’s part! Wow! Screams poor CS too! (Not something Apple is known for, thankfully)

 

[Piggie]

I think we all know the truth here.
A company like Apple does the maths of the financials.

What's cheaper?
Stop selling the product, re-engineer the bad design flaw, then re-release the fixed design?
Or simply carry on selling as is, deny the issue and simply pay to fix the machines which show the problem?

I'm guessing that the second option is of course the easiest to do, and probably the cheapest option also.
Plus it avoids the negative publicity of having to stop selling/issue a recall.

 

[-DMN-]

“IN TIM CROOK WE TRUST”

 

[macinfojunkie]

Evidently the judge is not a fanboy!

 

[MBAir2010]

Apple would never pull this prank under the last Honcho

 

[Piggie]

Our management have actually done something similar in my workplace.
In the past we have made a product the customer is screaming for, we find there is a slight flaw with the parts. Perhaps one of the tolerances is oversize or undersize.
Rather than phoning up the customer, telling them we messed up, and are going to have to remake the parts.
We have just said nothing and shipped them anyway, in the hope the customer never notices, and we get away with it.
And often we have done.
I'm sure many many many companies are doing things like this every single day.

 

[Spock]

I think we all know the truth here.
A company like Apple does the maths of the financials.

What's cheaper?
Stop selling the product, re-engineer the bad design flaw, then re-release the fixed design?
Or simply carry on selling as is, deny the issue and simply pay to fix the machines which show the problem?

I'm guessing that the second option is of course the easiest to do, and probably the cheapest option also.
Plus it avoids the negative publicity of having to stop selling/issue a recall.

It’s cheaper to leave it to the customer to find and deal with a defective product. I worked at a furniture store several years ago and would find dressers and tv stands missing drawers, shelves and knobs right from the factory. You could tell that they knew as they were packing up the furniture for shipping that it was missing these parts. When my boss called to complain, the sales person said that once the product goes to shipping to get packed, they don’t want it to go backwards in the assembly process so they just ship it out and deal with the complaints later. Things like missing knobs could easily be replaced by us so we wouldn’t contact them for replacements and that’s what they were counting on.

 

[LFC2020]

I think we all know the truth here.
A company like Apple does the maths of the financials.

What's cheaper?
Stop selling the product, re-engineer the bad design flaw, then re-release the fixed design?
Or simply carry on selling as is, deny the issue and simply pay to fix the machines which show the problem?

I'm guessing that the second option is of course the easiest to do, and probably the cheapest option also.
Plus it avoids the negative publicity of having to stop selling/issue a recall.

So what do they do about the piss yellow and green tint issue on the iPhone 12 series 🤔

Should I wait for a big payout? 😂

 

[Roller]

Apple would never pull this prank under the last Honcho

You mean Jobs?

 

[swingerofbirch]

They lie through their teeth.

I'm not sure if anyone remembers staingate. But I paid for a repair to the display during that period. I only found out about the unannounced internal display program more recently which was never made public.

I talked to their Tier 2 support requesting a refund given that I had paid for the repair during the period the repairs should have been covered. They denied up and down that there was ever any repair program. I could only refer them to sources like Macrumors etc which reported on the internal program, which they said they could not accept.

So, I requested all of my AppleCare documents from Apple (which you can do through privacy.apple.com).

It took them two months to get me the records because initially they don't send you AppleCare notes--you have to appeal to get those and it takes a really long time.

In the AppleCare records the person I spoke to in their notes referred to the internal program multiple times that she told me did not exist. She also documented that she could not accept sources like Macrumors.

So they know it exists, even mention the program in their notes (part of it is redacted), and then tell you that they can't acknowledge a program exists if I only know about it from a third party source.

It's like dealing with the mafia.

Fortunately their notes are now proof of the program's existence (even though they redacted the name of the program or some other reference to it that I can't see), so hopefully I can finally make some headway.

 

[Juicy Box]

Apple also knew they had a keyboard issue, and continued to sell Macs with that major design flaw.

I'm sure many many many companies are doing things like this every single day.

You might be right, but it is very unethical.

Most companies might not be called out for it, but Apple might and they should be held accountable.

 

[PimpDaddy]

I have a row of dead pixels that honest to god appeared out of thin air. Only thing I did was open the lid and there it was. Does anyone know if that defect is likely to occur because of the flex cable as well?

On topic: Apple deleting threads and comments from their forums as well as changing the design show they became fully aware there was a design flaw. I don’t know enough about QA to say if they should have caught it before release, but they should at least support customers that experience issues after the fact!

 

[MBAir2010]

I am so happy i invested in my Dell XPS 13'
instead of getting an Iphone SE, or an iTouch with a homepod mini this week.
Apple thinks they are bigger than us.

 

[PimpDaddy]

They lie through their teeth.

I'm not sure if anyone remembers staingate. But I paid for a repair to the display during that period. I only found out about the unannounced internal display program more recently which was never made public.

I talked to their Tier 2 support requesting a refund given that I had paid for the repair during the period the repairs should have been covered. They denied up and down that there was ever any repair program. I could only refer them to sources like Macrumors etc which reported on the internal program, which they said they could not accept.

So, I requested all of my AppleCare documents from Apple (which you can do through privacy.apple.com).

It took them two months to get me the records because initially they don't send you AppleCare notes--you have to appeal to get those and it takes a really long time.

In the AppleCare records the person I spoke to in their notes referred to the internal program multiple times that she told me did not exist. She also documented that she could not accept sources like Macrumors.

So they know it exists, even mention the program in their notes (part of it is redacted), and then tell you that they can't acknowledge a program exists if I only know about it from a third party source.

It's like dealing with the mafia.

Fortunately their notes are now proof of the program's existence (even though they redacted the name of the program or some other reference to it that I can't see), so hopefully I can finally make some headway.

Infuriating experience you had there :-(

 

[iapplelove]

yeah let’s all continue to **** on Google.

yay Tim Cook

 

[syklee26]

I am not surprised that this happened under Tim Cook. This guy has no soul. He doesnt see the value of loyalty on Apple's end; he only demands customers' loyalty. I cannot imagine Jobs would let this kinda stuff fly.

















Jobs: hold my beer and iphone 4 antenna

 

[MauiPa]

Honestly, good.

Apple’s either lying or they don’t QA their new products. Which one is it, Apple?

or.....the causes of the problem were outside the testing parameters. i.e. over extending screen (who does that right?), chemical exposure (hairsprays.....something which caused reaction in shielding material - it happens), thermal exposure, or just plain installation errors or cheating from suppliers (that never happens). So, while stunningly simple in your assertion, not accurate. If they are lying, then it would be shown in the QC reports, otherwise, there are other issues going on.

 

[qoop]

You mean Jobs?

Al Gore.

 

[billk711]

Honestly, good.

Apple’s either lying or they don’t QA their new products. Which one is it, Apple?

Are you asking apple a question?

 

[qoop]

I have a row of dead pixels that honest to god appeared out of thin air. Only thing I did was open the lid and there it was. Does anyone know if that defect is likely to occur because of the flex cable as well?

On topic: Apple deleting threads and comments from their forums as well as changing the design show they became fully aware there was a design flaw. I don’t know enough about QA to say if they should have caught it before release, but they should at least support customers that experience issues after the fact!

One of my iMac threads vanished (re: dark marks appearing on the screen) — so it's nothing new for them.

 

[CarpalMac]

~snip~
I'm sure many many many companies are doing things like this every single day.

You are correct in everything you say, in my experience.

I don't agree with it, but I have personally witnessed it from global bluechips to small traders. This one by comparison to some, is minute.

That said, it shows their true selves, behind all the fluffy "we love our customers" BS.

 

[norbinhouston]

Good riddance Johny Ives.