All those suggestions you example, all must be backed up by an Apple lie...since they deny an issue.
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Apple Knowingly Sold 2016-17 MacBook Pro Models With 'Flexgate' Display Defect, Judge Says
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TBH.. This is what most companies do. Re-engineering in a late state of product development is expensive as the whole supply chain and manufacturing is already ordered and (partly) setup at that point.
The only difference with Apple: A giant crowd of fanboys defending every **** move Apple does. Yeah, Apple has great products and I also like them, but they're still a profit oriented shareholder company, and will do whatever is necessary to gain maximum profits for the shareholders. Like every other big company does.
Apple is just better at hiding their **** than most other companies.
For all the bigger problems of Apple devices that got released. I cannot imagine that Apple doesn't know about them. If that's really the case, that would mean they don't properly test their devices and just rush out one after the other.
Then they "magically" fix that issue with the next iteration (or some way later iteration *cough* Butterfly keyboard *cough*) and introduce at least one new issue.
The only difference with Apple: A giant crowd of fanboys defending every **** move Apple does. Yeah, Apple has great products and I also like them, but they're still a profit oriented shareholder company, and will do whatever is necessary to gain maximum profits for the shareholders. Like every other big company does.
Apple is just better at hiding their **** than most other companies.
For all the bigger problems of Apple devices that got released. I cannot imagine that Apple doesn't know about them. If that's really the case, that would mean they don't properly test their devices and just rush out one after the other.
Then they "magically" fix that issue with the next iteration (or some way later iteration *cough* Butterfly keyboard *cough*) and introduce at least one new issue.
I have a 2016 macbook pro esc, and had to replace my keyboard, and get the flexgate repaired. It's not the most reliable laptop I've bought, however, it's still going strong after 5 years of use, and mac customer service (as long as it is covered under a repair program) is great! Can't be sure to say that for other brands. If you bought a PC laptop, where would you take it for repairs and replacement, and have it shipped back to you in a week for free?
Surely nobody is surprised by this - it's exactly the sort of thing Apple (and many/most other companies, I suspect) does. They kept selling the dodgy keyboards for years knowing they had serious problems. They released the Magic Keyboard for iPad using the same material as the Smart Keyboard Folio knowing full well how poorly that holds up to the test of time. Antennagate goes without saying. Those are just off the top of my head examples, I'm pretty sure there are a lot more.
I hope they get in big trouble and, more importantly, get some very bad publicity from this that encourages them and other companies to mend their ways.
I hope they get in big trouble and, more importantly, get some very bad publicity from this that encourages them and other companies to mend their ways.
These butterfly keyboard
Macs are some of the worst macs ever built...
Macs are some of the worst macs ever built...
That's not entirely fair. The other difference with Apple is the army of haters pouncing on any opportunity to criticise them. Essentially, anything they do, good or bad, is more visible than when another company does it. They get more defenders, more accolades, but also more attackers, more criticism.
You mean the guy who did an entire keynote just to deny antennagate, despite knowing about the problem early on?
Perhaps you would like to detail how you test for problem that takes three years to show up !
I don't understand why Apple engineers put such tight tolerances on moving parts.
And I do understand that sometimes it may not be possible to rewind a production design, and it's better to take care of the problem later. So take care of the customers. But Apple seemingly is inconsistent in their policy for services, sometimes costing their own customers a lot of money to put a band aid on a design flaw. I mean someone is not doing their job. If you really feel you can take care of the customers, make sure you do. This is what I feel, based on the stories I read, that Apple is declining. Under Jobs, seems like we heard more winning stories about Apple customer service, even for out of warranty devices. Seems like things went south when there was a change in the retail executives.
And I do understand that sometimes it may not be possible to rewind a production design, and it's better to take care of the problem later. So take care of the customers. But Apple seemingly is inconsistent in their policy for services, sometimes costing their own customers a lot of money to put a band aid on a design flaw. I mean someone is not doing their job. If you really feel you can take care of the customers, make sure you do. This is what I feel, based on the stories I read, that Apple is declining. Under Jobs, seems like we heard more winning stories about Apple customer service, even for out of warranty devices. Seems like things went south when there was a change in the retail executives.
well, not that easy. The tests also need to be sufficiently reliable, lack of knowledge is not necessarily an excuse and we, as customers, wouldn’t want for a “test didn’t show it” argument to be enough to dismiss a case. Usually this stuff is a combination of factors (engineering, media team, testing etc) and this appears to be the case here. It’s not simply a case of Apple did or didn’t know, but also about what Apple did once it knew about the issue.
not taking sides here but this is an interesting case.
Concorde engineering was found guilty of a design flaw after 30 years on a very low probability scenario. Granted, the stakes are way different.
Lol, there's no way apple could have known this -- or at least, there's no way they could have known for sure. I have the same macbook pro and I have had it for almost 4 years with no issue and I open and close the thing often.
If the prosecutor can absolutely prove that apple KNEW about this then they'll win. The issue is that it's not possible to prove this and furthermore, if apple knew this rare issue was a thing they would have already improved the flex and strength of the wire that connects to the display in the 2016/17 models instead of waiting until the 2018. Case and point, they likely did not know about the issue until it naturally occurred to someone who works at apple or someone who owns a macbook told apple about it.
This is like saying apple knowingly sells lemon iphones on purpose (iphones that have glitchy screens or bad display or whatnot) ... like sure apple knows that not every product is perfect but that doesn't mean they are selling them to us knowing that "This specific iphone is a lemon" ... anyone who had this issue with "flexgate" which is a terrible name because that implies that apple did this on purpose which we can't actually know which means it's not true currently -- anyways, anyone with the issue I am certain apple would repair it if it's brought to their attention ASAP (if you wait 3 years before telling apple you have an issue with your macbook that is your own fault and you don't really deserve anything repaired cause for all apple knows you could have done that "flexgate" on purpose by purposefully bending your screen further than you should)
Every product that is sold in mass like macbooks are going to have issues i.e there will be some that aren't as good as they should be. However, the 2016-2017 line of macbooks actually have less overall issues than any other macbook released up until that point, you might say "what about the keyboard issues the butterfly keys", well you'd be right to say that the 2016-17 macbooks had more keyboard issues that other macbooks but overall they had less issues and they were the most reliable macbooks made up until the next year models came out
If the prosecutor can absolutely prove that apple KNEW about this then they'll win. The issue is that it's not possible to prove this and furthermore, if apple knew this rare issue was a thing they would have already improved the flex and strength of the wire that connects to the display in the 2016/17 models instead of waiting until the 2018. Case and point, they likely did not know about the issue until it naturally occurred to someone who works at apple or someone who owns a macbook told apple about it.
This is like saying apple knowingly sells lemon iphones on purpose (iphones that have glitchy screens or bad display or whatnot) ... like sure apple knows that not every product is perfect but that doesn't mean they are selling them to us knowing that "This specific iphone is a lemon" ... anyone who had this issue with "flexgate" which is a terrible name because that implies that apple did this on purpose which we can't actually know which means it's not true currently -- anyways, anyone with the issue I am certain apple would repair it if it's brought to their attention ASAP (if you wait 3 years before telling apple you have an issue with your macbook that is your own fault and you don't really deserve anything repaired cause for all apple knows you could have done that "flexgate" on purpose by purposefully bending your screen further than you should)
Every product that is sold in mass like macbooks are going to have issues i.e there will be some that aren't as good as they should be. However, the 2016-2017 line of macbooks actually have less overall issues than any other macbook released up until that point, you might say "what about the keyboard issues the butterfly keys", well you'd be right to say that the 2016-17 macbooks had more keyboard issues that other macbooks but overall they had less issues and they were the most reliable macbooks made up until the next year models came out
butterfly keyboard is the best keyboard ever made. Just because it has issues doesn't change the fact that it's the best typing experience on any notebook. You can bet that apple will re-introduce it someday or make something that feels exactly like it. That's what they are already trying to do with the current 2019/2020 macbook pro 16 inch
They all use a crap gasket that allows dust to get in between the LCD and digitizer on all newer 2018 - 2020 models as well. Never ever buy a Macbook if you plan to use it in a semi dusty environment.
Whenever i read about keyboard or hinge issues and how fragile a MacBook is, it‘s obvious why I chose the iPad Pro. The thing has no moving parts, that I know that I would broken a MacBook a few times over in the lifetime of my iPad Pro. Especially before the M1 Macs where the iPad Pros were superior performance wise.
That’s strange, because the official internal guidance in the Genius Bar was to replace the cable. It was a big deal to us because the next iterations had the same cable but was millimetres longer, but the sku was different, so we were not allowed to use the new cables on the 16/17 MBPs.
It is sleazy on so many levels. It is more common than it should be: setup what *should* be valuable troubleshooting resource for *both* corporations and consumers and then destroy faith in it by selective deletion.
Sigh. So much effort to create an image and they tarnish it in seconds with stupidity.
Sounds like you'd be a great witness
They should have, but in simulated testing it may not have show up as a problem as its not every MacBook that displays the symptoms.
There are machines that simulate real world tasks like pressing buttons, opening and closing lids etc ... 1000's of times.
But
Lets assume for a second that Apple did testing on MacBooks that simulate the opening and closing of a MacBook lets say 20,000 times (Appx opening and closing 10 times per day over 6 years).
Lets just say all units passed the stress tests.
Lets assume that they have the documentation to prove it.
Lets just say that the backlight issue has only started affecting a small percentage of users after 3 years.
The question I have, is how long can a company be held responsible for an roll-of-the-dice issue that did not affect test machines ?
The Judge appears to be taking the side of the plaintiff based on deleted forum comments.
I'm not taking sides on this as Apple has had numerous issues in the past from the Powerbook Hinges "Exploding" ... original MacBook's keyboard yellowing and Cracking, the butterfly issues among other problems.
But it'll be an interesting case as the plaintiff will need to prove that Apple knowingly sent out this model with the likelihood it would fail eventually.
I'd take a stab that the outcome will be that Apple will replace this cable or complete display on all affected MacBooks free for the next 3-4 years.
Imagine spending the premium that Apple products demand only to get something that is no better than a cheap off the shelf Asus. I'd be furious. Shame on Apple. Yes, every company probably does this sort of shady **** but they are not Apple. Apple are supposed to be better than this. They charge a premium for their products and there should be zero chance of this type of thing with them.
Of course, they've done this before many other times. Butterfly keyboard, MB air with subpar cooling, bent ipads, iphones, batteries, throttling, etc etc etc
You see shady moderator behavior on every forum, so it’s not surprising.