If anyone's thinking about getting the new MacBook Pro 2011 model I'd advise them to wait until some updates have been released as it's terribly buggy.
I speak from experience, alas...
What problems are you having?
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Apple Launches MacBook Pros with Thunderbolt, Quad Core CPUs, AMD GPUs
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What problems are you having?
I was going to raise the point that if you room for the Tunderbolt controller then you had room for a USB 3.0 on all along. That thing is massive.But, theThunderChickenThunderBirdThunderbolt controller isn't native either! It's a humongous separate chip.
(click to enlarge)
It's gob-smacking to hear arguments that "USB 3.0 sucks, it's not native - I want Thunderbolt".
well, for starters a dongle that i'd been using happily under previous builds of 10.6.5 and 6.6 suddenly stopped working because the driver wasn't recognised
secondly, on the windows partition via bootcamp a strange beeping noise was emanating from the mother board when i used two finger scrolling
also via windows, when i listened to music really loudly it would skip and the OS would hang, sometimes on OS X too.
finally, if tethering my iphone to OS X with the USB cable i'd get a kernel panic, usually if i tried running utorrent but even if i just downloaded a lot using my iphone for the internet.
very peculiar, but there we are...
Oh, i should add that i haven't had any issues with overheating, so that's a blessing i guess
Yeah those are odd. I would take it to Apple and show them, if they are repeatable.
Don't taunt the arm-chair circuit-board engineers....
So amusing that Thunderbolt has so much hype on MacRumours - yet no one here has used it with any off-the-shelf (or off-the-web) product.
I think that is the definition of "faith" - belief in something without any empirical evidence to support the belief.
Hmm anyone have quick pics of the FW controller Apple uses. Cause Intel sure doesn't support that natively...
Please, don't....
Please don't post any pics - because with the logical inconsistency of dissing USB 3.0 because it's not in the chipset, embracing Thunderbolt even though it's not in the chipset - the shock of realizing that the beloved firewire controller is not in the chipset could cause some Apple fans' heads to explode.
You wouldn't want to be responsible for that, would you?
Please don't post any pics - because with the logical inconsistency of dissing USB 3.0 because it's not in the chipset, embracing Thunderbolt even though it's not in the chipset - the shock of realizing that the beloved firewire controller is not in the chipset could cause some Apple fans' heads to explode.
You wouldn't want to be responsible for that, would you?
With the kind of bandwidth Light Peak has, one would think that giant chip could simply absorb both USB3 and Firewire (and even up FW to 3200 as an option). Intel should be thinking standards within standards if they want one connector for everything. People have been talking about a breakout box to use as a single wire dock for Apple notebooks, but that simply cannot fly without it encompassing all the other connector standards in one bus. Otherwise, you'd still need another wire for USB, another for Firewire, etc. Thunderbolt doesn't seem very well thought out, IMO.
Ignore the expense, Thunderbolt can do everything
Note that Thunderbolt doesn't support any high level standards - it's a PCIe to PCIe bridge that has a parallel channel for DisplayPort video. Look at Intel's simplified diagram:
(click to enlarge)
Put whatever you want in your breakout box. USB 3.0, 1394a, 1394b, eSATA, serial, parallel, whatever.
All you'll need to do is put a PCIe->USB3.0 controller, a PCIe->1394a controller, a PCIe->1394b controller, a PCIe->eSATA controller, a PCIe->serial controller, and a PCIe->parallel controller into your breakout box. (Maybe the last two would be USB->serial/parallel.)
That does sound kind of expensive, doesn't it though.
Note that Thunderbolt doesn't support any high level standards - it's a PCIe to PCIe bridge that has a parallel channel for DisplayPort video. Look at Intel's simplified diagram:
Put whatever you want in your breakout box. USB 3.0, 1394a, 1394b, eSATA, serial, parallel, whatever.
All you'll need to do is put a PCIe->USB3.0 controller, a PCIe->1394a controller, a PCIe->1394b controller, a PCIe->eSATA controller, a PCIe->serial controller, and a PCIe->parallel controller into your breakout box. (Maybe the last two would be USB->serial/parallel.)
That does sound kind of expensive, doesn't it though.
My point was to never advocate for the presence of TB, but to explain the absence of the USB 3.0 port. It being in the chipset and them not offering a port is a lot different than their option to leave it out. It would be like the channel of superdrives drying up and Apple only able to put blu-ray/DVD+/-RW drives in but refuse to support blu-ray.
I personally sell 15-20 macs a day now at my job. I do not believe I have met a SINGLE person who would want to do what it takes for a hackintosh. Not saying I wouldn't, I am looking into building a hackintosh. But Buddy, we are in the less than 1%.
It is Apple's product, they can make it however they want. You do realize that is how it has been from the beginning? They are a software and HARDWARE company. You want them to release glossy? matte? i7s, i5s, radeon 6990s, USB 3.0, Thunderbolt, in every option of all of their computers? What about including FW800 and 400, and I want them to use HUGE DVI PORTS, so their computers never get thinner, maybe we should use them forever actually? why not? Lets ALWAYS use 7200 drives, and get PC battery lifes of 3-5 hours, and lets throw in SSD drives, I mean come on, we could just slap in a little 60 gig right? Just as expensive as 250 gigs of HD, thats what people want right? Less hard drive space.
Think outside of your own realm of self absorption and I bet your distain for all things technology, not up to par with your standards, won't ride your pony through the river every 6 months.
It is Apple's product, they can make it however they want. You do realize that is how it has been from the beginning? They are a software and HARDWARE company. You want them to release glossy? matte? i7s, i5s, radeon 6990s, USB 3.0, Thunderbolt, in every option of all of their computers? What about including FW800 and 400, and I want them to use HUGE DVI PORTS, so their computers never get thinner, maybe we should use them forever actually? why not? Lets ALWAYS use 7200 drives, and get PC battery lifes of 3-5 hours, and lets throw in SSD drives, I mean come on, we could just slap in a little 60 gig right? Just as expensive as 250 gigs of HD, thats what people want right? Less hard drive space.
Think outside of your own realm of self absorption and I bet your distain for all things technology, not up to par with your standards, won't ride your pony through the river every 6 months.
That's funny. I thought I just said they were playing that game.
I don't presume to speak for "most people" on here, but a lack of "tedious upgrades" is not even in my top 10 list of reasons to use OSX. In fact, it's not in the list at all. I already have one Hackintosh and most updates are the same as any other Mac through Software Update. Once I had to reload the audio driver. Once in awhile you update the program that provides the machine specific drivers. It's not exactly rocket science, dude.
I like/use OSX because it's free of malware and I like the interface better than Windows. I like it doesn't slow down as you add more software. I like the Unix underpinnings. I like not having a registry (for both speed and ease of installing and removing most software).
I don't like Apple telling me I cannot have a matte screen or that I don't need a card slot on a MBP or that they refuse to provide an access door so I can swap the battery if I need to (all about them providing a replacement for a fee, not "ease of use"). I don't like Apple using Mini-Display Port (my MBP has full size DVI which many monitors come with a cable for even) when very few monitors support it (means you have to keep track of adapters and probably purchase one or more adapters). I don't like them not offering BTO options for anything from 7200 PRM drives to SSD drives whenever they feel like not offering them (leaving me in a situation where I might have to void my warranty just to install something they don't want to sell on a particular model at a particular time while other companies offer any build option you might like (or let you build your own whereas Apple says you're not allowed). I also don't like Apple heading towards iOS features instead of keeping up with OpenGL, improving dual-display support, etc. (i.e. real features).
Any Comments?
I have been using a Mac Mini for 1.5 years now and love it. Now I want to switch my wife from PC to Mac. She does a lot of Photoshop Elements work (importing photos and spending hours modifying them), Email, and general Web surfing. We both do not play any video games on our computers. A very cost effective solution for moving her to Mac and a 27" screen would be to buy an 27" IMac.
However, I have contemplated buying the new 13" Macbook Pro (base model) and hooking it up to a 27" ACD with magic mouse and wireless keyboard. She would only use the laptop screen in rare cases. My reasoning is that when she has problems with anything that I can not help her with, she can simply take the laptop downtown to the Apple experts and ask them as she demonstrates her problem. Is there any downside to this course? Any issues with driving the 27" ACD from the 13" (given no video games)? I know you can transport an IMac, but it is 30 pounds and not as easy as a laptop to move around.
I have been using a Mac Mini for 1.5 years now and love it. Now I want to switch my wife from PC to Mac. She does a lot of Photoshop Elements work (importing photos and spending hours modifying them), Email, and general Web surfing. We both do not play any video games on our computers. A very cost effective solution for moving her to Mac and a 27" screen would be to buy an 27" IMac.
However, I have contemplated buying the new 13" Macbook Pro (base model) and hooking it up to a 27" ACD with magic mouse and wireless keyboard. She would only use the laptop screen in rare cases. My reasoning is that when she has problems with anything that I can not help her with, she can simply take the laptop downtown to the Apple experts and ask them as she demonstrates her problem. Is there any downside to this course? Any issues with driving the 27" ACD from the 13" (given no video games)? I know you can transport an IMac, but it is 30 pounds and not as easy as a laptop to move around.
But your argument for the absence of USB 3.0 is an argument to omit Thunderbolt - it's not on the chipset, and needs a separate chip.
That's why everyone is laughing out loud.
No, it's a comment on Apple's seemingly arbitrary nature. They are completely motivated by what they think is in their best interest, and that usually means trying to pioneer and/or dictate the standards that the industry runs on. Whether it's shunning blu ray, flash or supporting HTML 5, TB or creating the facetime standard, it's all about shaping the market to their advantage.
You have to take them as separate issues because that's what they are. USB 3.0 isn't forced on them and everyone else is using it, so they don't use it because it does nothing to differentiate their product. Arguably, it's not hurting sales either. TB isn't forced on them but they have a chance to be the first and possibly dictate products on the market and position themselves as a market leader, so they do that. It's not as simple as it is for every other PC manufacturer: we have the space and it could cause more pure hardware sales, so let's add it.
It's completely naive to look at any apple design decision solely from a technical viewpoint. That is not how they function and it is not how they decide features.
It's hard to tell what you're trying to communicate beyond the Apple can do whatever it feels like bit. You seem to contradict yourself with the 7200 RPM versus SSD comments and seem obsessed with the thickness of their notebooks (which spells "fanatical" to me given no one but Steve Jobs really gives a crap about making the already plenty thin even thinner).
BTW, I have no clue what the riding my pony through a river comment means, but it sounds pretty wrong.
Apple has offered more BTO options in the past...a LOT more. Given their relative share of the high-end computer hardware market, asking for the option of a larger and/or faster hard drive isn't asking a whole lot. I shouldn't have to tear my brand new computer apart as soon as I get it home. They might as well just leave the hard drive out. As it is, you have to sell it to get some of that wasted money back. And not offering battery doors when they clearly had no trouble offering them in the past is purely another avenue to rip the consumer off, not any kind of "advantage" for their computers.
Their "arbitrary" nature is precisely what is motivating me to not buy one of their computers the next time around. In fact, given the dreary one step forward, two steps back nature of Lion, removing more good features (like grid spaces and Rosetta) than it adds, I'm thinking of making my next desktop a Windows/Linux machine instead of a Mac/Windows machine. I need my existing MBP for Logic Pro, but I arguably don't "need" OSX for my next desktop. Windows can run iTunes (and a heck of a lot more games) and I can get a machine that I want in terms of hardware, not something that Apple feels like selling me, only to abandon support for it 4 years later.
Frankly, with AppleTV 2 now having XBMC support, I would no longer need iTunes to access 98% of my library (barring the couple of HD movies I bought off iTunes before converting BD to HD instead). XBMC doesn't do HD on Gen1 ATV too well, but it's not an issue with ATV2. I could then just connect my USB3 media drive directly to my Netgear WNDR3700 router and I wouldn't even need a computer running any longer to access my media library. It's stupid that I have to now as it is (Apple apparently never heard of UPnP/DLNA or any kind of NSA share for that matter; having to leave a computer on 24/7 (and not disturb its CPU too much if someone else is watching a movie from it) kind of SUCKS, really.
Apple acts like it cares about the future, but obviously, they only care about THEIR future. They don't support any technology that conflicts with another one of their side-markets (like iTunes). Thus we get no Blu-Ray support, no USB3 support, no UPnP support and soon no DVD/CDR support (already devalued in several of their programs from removing the icon for CDR burns and the overall icon in iTunes to signs in Lion of heading away from all optical drive support in the near future), all in an effort to push people to the iTunes/App Store. Macs are fast becoming "niche" computers once again rather than general computing devices. It's a shame because the only other real alternative to Windows (whose worst attribute these days is Malware) is Linux (which has no real commercial consumer support and probably never will given their attitude against the things it takes to get it. Oh well.
Windows7 is much better than Vista, at least. If it weren't for the Malware, I think it'd be an obvious choice at this point. I bought my first Mac when Windows future appeared to be Vista, but Windows7 isn't that bad in the areas that used to suck and wipes the floor of OSX for gaming purposes and general availability of software. I'd miss things like the easy backup method of Carbon Copy Cloner and just deleting software in the trash can, etc., but those aren't enough to keep having to use outdated, crappy hardware, IMO.
If I can find the hardware I want that still leaves me the option, I'll go Hackintosh, but honestly, I'd have to ask myself whether it was worth losing the extra GPU power (no SLI, for example) just to get those niceties. It's just a shame that a Mac user has to make that choice at all because it doesn't have to be that way. Apple could offer modern competitive up-to-date desktop computers and support better graphics options (like SLI), Blu-Ray, USB3 and get OpenGL up to 4.x if they wanted to. They don't want to and that is the problem. That may work OK for mobile devices that are their own environment (like the iPhone), but it's not so great for a general purpose PC at home. I shouldn't have to use USB2 speeds on my 3TB external drive simply because Apple doesn't 'like' USB3, for example. I don't give a rat's hind end what Apple likes or does not like when it comes to PC hardware. It should be about what the consumer needs or wants. I'm the one that has to live with that machine, after all.
I personally like Firewire because it's discreet components and NOT in the cpu.
MacBook Pro i7 quad core - freezing and overheating?
Hi,
I've been reading many postings on Apple's discussion website about the 2011 MacBook Pro i7 essentially freezing and/or overheating. Bottom line, they just stop working and require a hard reboot.
What are other's experiences with the new 2011 MacBook Pro? I need a quality laptop and cannot afford to reboot multiple time per day just to do development work.
Hi,
I've been reading many postings on Apple's discussion website about the 2011 MacBook Pro i7 essentially freezing and/or overheating. Bottom line, they just stop working and require a hard reboot.
What are other's experiences with the new 2011 MacBook Pro? I need a quality laptop and cannot afford to reboot multiple time per day just to do development work.
I haven't had any issues with my new 17" i7. Just used it on a show and had to make a looping dvd in DVD Studio Pro, edit and render a bunch of motion graphics in Motion, play movies in Pro Presenter to a projection system, create a looping Keynote to produce a 1920x1080 movie and edit photos in Photoshop. No issues.
Don't know what issues other people are having but it may be important to note that I didn't migrate anything from my old computer. Everything was installed from scratch, including my Bootcamp partition with Windows 7 and Office 10. I also have VMWare Fusion on it to access Windows outside of Bootcamp and it works well.
Received my 15" quad on 2/28 migrated everything from a santa rosa mpb. No problems to date
Glad to hear things are well. I should receive my new MacBook Pro i7 17" on Monday 03/21 so I got my fingers crossed that all is well. Good luck to you and your Mac!!
Sure others are better experts than me, but I think it's a great solution. My mate is going to do exactly the same thing (upgrading from an old G5) to a 13" MBP and hooking up to an older (smaller) Apple Display. Your only issue maybe that I'm not sure the MBP would support the full resolution of the new Cinema Displays though?
The MBP will support up to a 30" monitor running at a resolution of 2560x1920 so you and your mate should be fine for running another monitor.
I was in the same boat as your mate as well, except I have already sold off my Power Mac G5 about two years ago. My 17" MBP has been my sole machine and has been kicking it hard.
You know that's not the actual controller, right? (Not saying the actual controller isn't big, but that ain't it).
not a single hitch with my 13" i7 MBP, I've never run into the issue you're mentioning... this thing has been rock-solid so far, and I have a hunch that I'll be hanging onto it for awhile!