They very publicly resisted orders to do this.
I mean, maybe it's PR to resist 11 district court orders to just... hand that information over anyways?
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Apple Likely Adopting RCS Messaging Standard to Comply With Chinese Law
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I mean, maybe it's PR to resist 11 district court orders to just... hand that information over anyways?
You might be confusing Gruber with Gurman. Gruber doesn’t say anything to MacRumors, this was posted on his own blog and he’s been well known for a long time. Gurman is the guy that puts out the weekly newsletter stating the obvious.
There should be no need to turn it off, it should be entirely transparent to you and work in every situation you could send an sms.
iMessage costs money to run and is subsidized by sale of iOS devices. So yes it is because of money but I don’t think it’s cynical to say that, just realistic. There is no business reason to bring iMessage to other platforms. In this case I don’t think it’s Apple being spiteful.
And for the record I think the bullying is overblown and I certainly don’t think Apple endorses it. Kids bully each other for all kinds of stupid reasons, and that’s just an easy meme to repeat.
Yeah... airplanes... automobiles... building supplies for houses... pharmaceuticals... where will government stop!!
Water, air, food, charging ports and app stores. When will it stop.Yeah... airplanes... automobiles... building supplies for houses... pharmaceuticals... where will government stop!!
1. The US has laws and courts and oversight and whistleblower protections that, while imperfect, at least intend to keep unwarranted searches at bay.
2. Even if you’re the type who believes all the hype or recognizes that getting a FISA warrant is about an easy as getting a cup of coffee, it’s hard not to appreciate that, despite all the faults, the US stands for freedom. China, and communism in general, have no such restrictions on their behavior.
3. Apple can, and has, publicly come out against the US government, requiring the FBI to sue Apple openly. The Chinese can simply decide what they want Apple to do and Apple will have little choice but to silently comply. Completely.
No you're right and perhaps I was a bit too cynical. iMessage is very much a differentiator for Apple on its products. I'm sure if Apple could find a way to monotize iMessage on Android they would but I suppose now with rcs coming it's kind of moot
I don't think Apple see RCS as a threat. Yeah right now iMessage's primary product advantages over SMS/MMS are reactions, group chats, high res photos, etc. which RCS will (presumably) bring, but my prediction is Apple will build iMessage out into something that competes with Discord/Facebook Messenger; more of a social hub with better streamlined integration into the rest of iCloud (Find My, Photos, iWork collab stuff, whatever).
Whatever may be the reason, it is good to see RCS finally being supported. Good for users!
It is really a sad state of affairs that you'd even joke about being shunned for talking to Android users. I know you were making a joke of it, but it's really pathetic that there is a significant Apple user base that have this snobbery about the phone they use.
As if flagship Android phones aren't just as expensive or even more expensive than iPhones. But again, that is a very shallow and toxic perspective. So much for "thinking different". It's more like "think the same or you will be shunned".
iMessage should have adopted RCS a long time ago. iMessage isn't that great of a messaging app. Apple will still have the blue bubbles and green bubbles, but the actual experience and difference between the two colours won't be nearly as dramatic. Night open some iPhone users' eyes that iMessage isn't the only game in town.
Apple's surprise decision to bring RCS support to its Messages app for iPhone later this year was not a result of impending EU legislation, but an about-face caused by Chinese political pressure, claimed a report over the weekend.
In November 2023, Apple announced that it planned to bring RCS (Rich Communication Services) support to Messages alongside iMessage, a move that seemingly came out of the blue, given Apple's staunch resistance to pressure from Google and Samsung to adopt the communication protocol.
In the weeks that followed, one popular theory for Apple's reversal was that its hand had been forced by the EU's Digital Markets Act, which would have required Apple to make changes to iMessage to make it interoperable with other platforms.
That theory has since been debunked for two reasons. First, the DMA does not specifically mention RCS as a requirement of interoperability between messaging platforms. And second, the EU earlier this month concluded that iMessage does not hold a dominant enough position to be brought under the DMA's strict rules for services provided by big tech's so-called digital "gatekeepers."
A more plausible theory has since been offered by John Gruber, who says "little birdies" (Gruber's code for sources at Apple) tell him that "iOS support for RCS is all about China."
Writing on his blog Daring Fireball, Gruber points to China's Ministry of Industry and Information Technology, which in July 2023 solicited feedback for upcoming rules that would require new 5G devices to support RCS (an English translation of the law can be found on Reddit).
"I can't say for certain," admits Gruber, "but after spending the last few months periodically poking around the trees inhabited by little birdies, I do have good news for fans of coercive government regulation. Apple's hand was effectively forced. But by China, not the EU."
As Gruber notes, reports that Apple's decision was influenced by inbound EU regulations subsequently make "zero sense." Apple would prefer, says Gruber, "simply to continue ignoring RCS, on the grounds that they want to support neither any new non-E2EE protocols, nor any new carrier-controlled protocols (whether encrypted or not). But when the [Chinese Communist Party] says device makers must jump to sell their products in China, Apple asks 'How high?'"
Gruber's full piece is worth a read over on Daring Fireball. As for RCS coming to the Messages app, support for the protocol should result in several improvements to the default messaging experience between iPhones and Android devices, such as higher-resolution photos, audio messages, read receipts, improved group chats, and typing indicators.
Apple said RCS support in Messages would arrive "later" in 2024, which corresponds with the timeframe we expect iOS 18 to be released, suggesting it could be a feature of Apple's next major software update.
Article Link: Apple Likely Adopting RCS Messaging Standard to Comply With Chinese Law
I hope so. I don’t want to have to respond to “no connection - send as sms?” with every message that I try to send. I only have to go 2-3 miles to get outside of cell service. As it is, iMessage will freak out and require logging back in if my data service cuts out at the wrong moment.
I didn't realize Google Messages and Apple's Messages app were one and the same.
Everything you said had exactly zero relation to my original post.
RCS can support E2E encryption. Apple is the one choosing not to add that part in.
Your other choice is SMS which does even support it at all and even easier to read than RCS.
I like iMessage and think it is a great messaging app. In the past I’ve tried WhatsApp, signal and others. WhatsApp may have more features but 1. Features I don’t care about and 2. The parent company.
Trying other messaging apps is what opened my eyes about how good iMessage is. YMMV.
A big part is you can not change you sms app on iOS. Google RCS would need to be able to integrate in with the sms side seamless. What makes iMessages so great is those 2 things live side by side same app. Android you can replace your default sms app and multiple apps can read sms from the phone. IOS it can not be done.
The only SMSes I get these days are 2FA codes and spam adverts. RCS literally does nothing for me except maybe, spam in higher definition?
I don’t believe it will work quite the same way. iMessage tries to send as data when it looks like there’s an internet connection. But RCS will, I believe, still send on the SMS data channel. It may automatically try as data first but it will then automatically go as sms.
I see what you mean though, it’s possible it won’t be implemented that smoothly. But I believe since it’s connected to the cell network via the sms channel for delivery anyway it will be smoother in operation.
Yeah people get too religious about it but the fact is there are real issues. Just the other day I took a picture I wanted to send to an Android using family member. But what am I supposed to do, text it? So she can see the postage stamp size 1998 256 color 3GPP image file? The only other option is to agree to a third party messaging service which in effect means I have to use Facebook (yuck) to send anything but a ****ing carrier pigeon with a single packet strapped to its leg.
This is the difference with the US vs China that people overlook. At least in America there is a process to fight this kind of surveillance or at least ostensibly control it to keep it to necessary purposes.
In China they have to follow the law as well, and those laws just don’t have that process. China requires that they have ownership of all the hardware the data is on, and no doubt the encryption keys as well or what’s the point.
At least in theory that is not how the US legal system works.
Everyone agrees that there are cases where the government should have that data to stop criminals, the countries just differ on the definition of criminal and the methods to achieve that.