I heard the same about the apple watch and other products. Like it or not this is likely the future of tech going forward but it's sure as hell isn't going to be a purchase in the first year for many
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Apple Mixed-Reality Headset Shipments Now Estimated to 'Fall Short of 100,000 Units' This Year
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I just wanna know what the Fanny pack that holds the battery will look like.
I thought I recently saw a conflicting Macrumor that said the headset wouldn’t ship for another 4 years…
I can think of plenty educational opportunities. Surgeons already use simulators to learn new surgical techniques. Simulations of dangerous scenarios. Military. Uses to create a larger world for disabled people. Use your imagination beyond gaming
And yet the VR headsets that have been on the market for years (at a much lower price point) haven’t really been used for any of these use cases, nor have they caught on outside of gaming. What makes Apple’s any different other than Apple fan enthusiasm?
You're making a big assumption that the two things are equivalent. AR could be the 8 track or betamax.
But music on tape and video on tape were very successful. I'm not sure what point you're trying to make? Aren't we discussing the future of a kind of technology instead of one particular implementation of it?
Transparent display technologies are irrelevant for near eye displays. You have to use some thing like a waveguide or birdbath optics to be able to focus on the image.
I don't understand why some think this type of product is an immediate failure.
I've probably noted this before, but to me VR+MR+AR devices are a clear progression of display technology, and then so much more. There have been huge strides in the quality of screens and resolution. These next gen headsets are large steps in the right direction, showing how far we've come.
I still remember old green screen monitors. The Retina displays we have today are amazing in comparison to monitors from just 15 years ago. The fact that we can even get two 4K displays per eye in a device that we can wear is amazing, and it seems, this is just the beginning still of where it's all headed. If you only considered that aspect, where you replace a desktop of screens with virtual displays, where you can still see your workspace around you, that alone is valuable to many. And then, then I think, the rumor is, Apple's headsets will have 2 of their new processors. Wow! So we're getting virtual display, as many as we want or need, at any size, anywhere plus processing power of at least a MacBook, possibly more all in a package the size of your hand? How is that not game changing? How is that not impressive?
But all of that is amazing even if you are only thinking 2 dimensionally, think beyond 2 dimensions. Try out the LiDar on your phone, and some of the amazing apps that truly use it to its full potential. For example, not so long ago, my wife was shopping for furniture and a rug. AR allowed us to size all perfectly and see those things in our living room, before we bought them. When they arrived, it PERFECTLY matched our expectations, what had been presented and planned. That's an obvious use case, and extensions to that are obvious.
For fun, I recently tried out a new game that has a virtual pet. I know, it sounds silly, but I was mostly interested in how well it used LiDar and AR capabilities. I was blown away. This little virtual character skipped and flew around the entire room, landed on my real desk, walked behind chairs with a cool occlusion effect, and then when we set a case on the floor, it "saw" the new item in the room, walked over to it, and hopped up on it. In short, the real world metrics became a part of the game, not just a simple plane surface or bounding wall, but all the features in the space, measured and integrated well, seamlessly into the interaction and presentation.
Now take that data, that ability, and the prior, then imagine developers creating new types of apps and interactions, new ways of visualizing information, creating content, producing tools and interactions that are no longer constrained by rectangular screens, that can virtually sit on your desk or against a wall, that can be handled, tossed, scaled, and manipulated beyond the constraints of the real world. It will change how software, user interfaces and experiences are design, completely. Will we throw our real world screens and handheld rectangles away? No, but I do believe that mixed-reality user interfaces and full immersion technology will prove to be superior to those devices in many settings and uses.
Why haven't these ideas come to fruition in first generation headsets? For the same reason that the old green screen 640 x 480 monitors weren't rendering content at 5K with 16 million colors. The whole tech stack wasn't there and wasn't ready.
If all these cool, popular, and useful devices and services that Apple has produced over the past decade are any indication of the quality that they can deliver in combining them, I think it's a winner out the gate, the beginning of a whole new evolution, a revolutionary cycle of content, production, media, communication, and apps in general.
I've probably noted this before, but to me VR+MR+AR devices are a clear progression of display technology, and then so much more. There have been huge strides in the quality of screens and resolution. These next gen headsets are large steps in the right direction, showing how far we've come.
I still remember old green screen monitors. The Retina displays we have today are amazing in comparison to monitors from just 15 years ago. The fact that we can even get two 4K displays per eye in a device that we can wear is amazing, and it seems, this is just the beginning still of where it's all headed. If you only considered that aspect, where you replace a desktop of screens with virtual displays, where you can still see your workspace around you, that alone is valuable to many. And then, then I think, the rumor is, Apple's headsets will have 2 of their new processors. Wow! So we're getting virtual display, as many as we want or need, at any size, anywhere plus processing power of at least a MacBook, possibly more all in a package the size of your hand? How is that not game changing? How is that not impressive?
But all of that is amazing even if you are only thinking 2 dimensionally, think beyond 2 dimensions. Try out the LiDar on your phone, and some of the amazing apps that truly use it to its full potential. For example, not so long ago, my wife was shopping for furniture and a rug. AR allowed us to size all perfectly and see those things in our living room, before we bought them. When they arrived, it PERFECTLY matched our expectations, what had been presented and planned. That's an obvious use case, and extensions to that are obvious.
For fun, I recently tried out a new game that has a virtual pet. I know, it sounds silly, but I was mostly interested in how well it used LiDar and AR capabilities. I was blown away. This little virtual character skipped and flew around the entire room, landed on my real desk, walked behind chairs with a cool occlusion effect, and then when we set a case on the floor, it "saw" the new item in the room, walked over to it, and hopped up on it. In short, the real world metrics became a part of the game, not just a simple plane surface or bounding wall, but all the features in the space, measured and integrated well, seamlessly into the interaction and presentation.
Now take that data, that ability, and the prior, then imagine developers creating new types of apps and interactions, new ways of visualizing information, creating content, producing tools and interactions that are no longer constrained by rectangular screens, that can virtually sit on your desk or against a wall, that can be handled, tossed, scaled, and manipulated beyond the constraints of the real world. It will change how software, user interfaces and experiences are design, completely. Will we throw our real world screens and handheld rectangles away? No, but I do believe that mixed-reality user interfaces and full immersion technology will prove to be superior to those devices in many settings and uses.
Why haven't these ideas come to fruition in first generation headsets? For the same reason that the old green screen 640 x 480 monitors weren't rendering content at 5K with 16 million colors. The whole tech stack wasn't there and wasn't ready.
If all these cool, popular, and useful devices and services that Apple has produced over the past decade are any indication of the quality that they can deliver in combining them, I think it's a winner out the gate, the beginning of a whole new evolution, a revolutionary cycle of content, production, media, communication, and apps in general.
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But you can't see your surroundings, you see a digital representation that the glasses reproduce, and the AR software draws on top of that
No offense, but this sounds like pr from Apple.
Just because apple is making VR goggles doesn’t also mean it’s going to be some sort of world changing thing. More like a solution to a problem nobody asked for. For one, apple needs to take that LiDAR out of their phones as it’s taking up useful space, most people use it once and never again.
VR stuff will always be a niche market until the technology can be at a place where it can stimulate all a humans senses so that it’s indistinguishable from reality. I believe that might be possible one day, but probably not for decades, post 2050 stuff. What’s more promising is AR, I don’t want to be stuck in a desk chair wearing goggles, I want to freely walk around town with nothing more than sunglasses, or an implant, terminator style. That tech is also a long long way away, no clue as to how far, but I wouldn’t expect the glasses from Apple for 5-10 years, and fully implanted ar for at least 30-40 years from now.
I expect these goggles to be as impressive as Apples AirPods Max, another apple product, hmmmm whatever. I’d rather they put their talent to work on things that people actually want.
No, I don't work for Apple, I just think the tech is cool.
I'm not sure anyone is even working on full sensory levels of immersion. Perhaps with wider adoption we'll see new types of peripherals though.
Although, I did watch an interesting bit of news this morning about "mind-reading" tech, and the huge boost that AI has given that. I imagine advances there could lead to greater accessibility hardware, and eventually integration into these types of headsets. https://www.cnn.com/2023/05/23/tech/chatgpt-mind-reading/index.html
However, I don't think we need Matrix-level immersion for this next generation of headsets to make their impact. For now, I'd be very happy to be able to carry my entire multi-monitor workstation around in a device smaller than a laptop, clear off my actual desk, and have a whole new platform for creating new types of apps and experiences.
With no usb ports, how are you going to use your kB + mouse?or even use your desktop apps?
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I bought one of these back in 1995:
I used it a handful of times to play Wolfenstein 3D and then the original Doom. After that, it sat on a shelf and gathered dust until it found it's way into my attic.
Fast forward a few years and we bought our youngest son this:
He used it a handful of times to play a few games that came with the headset. After that, it sat on a shelf and gathered dust until it found it's way into our walk-in closet.
Now, I won't be buying this:
Because I'll use it a handful of times to play some stupid limited feature game that Apple comes out with to sell the device. After that, it will sit on a shelf and gather dust until it finds its way onto Ebay for far less than I paid for it...
So, the problem here is that you've never experience good VR. Not your fault, most people have not experienced good VR at this point as it's stupid-expensive and best for those of us who are highly into "immersion" - the stuff being made for casual gamers, it's unfortunately kind of pointless IMHO because casual gamers by definition don't want a huge time investment and without a time investment your experience will suck. It's an evolving field. I've spent way more money than is logical, because I knew how much I enjoyed the experience.
I have very, very good VR equipment. It's such a PITA to get setup and then tweaked that it is no wonder that most people don't want to be bothered. Basic VR seems the way to go, but even that is somewhat difficult OR incredibly limited; there are zero great experience to be had easily. But I do spend that time and my experiences in VR are breathtakingly good. I can experience racing historic race cars and classics in Assetto Corsa with a ton of mods and Patreon content that, alone, even for a flat screen, can take days to setup properly. Now add a wide fov high-resolution HMD (in my case Pimax 8k-x) and it's simply impossible to describe the level of experience this provides. To say that it's incredible is such a vast understatement that it doesn't do it justice. Flabbergastingly good is the best way to describe it.
Image it is 1913, you love watching silent black and white movies. Now imagine that the next day someone takes you to an iMax theatre for a 3D experience. The transition from flat-screen to *really good* VR is about that level.
I expect that, if anyone can crack the "simple but amazing" puzzle it will be Apple, with their Apple Stereoscopic Simulation Hat. (Come on, we just have to make that one stick!)
I have mild-to-severe hearing loss and I use a hearing aid. The top-quality hearing aid products today cost over $1500 per unit (times 2, one per ear) and they make a huge difference in your life. I pay for them while I await more affordable - and better - products from Apple et al.
I have relatives that are legally blind due to macular degeneration. I hope a MR product, or evolutions, would help them. And a MR product may also help deaf people with real-time subtitles.
Done well, this product may have a very large market. Think of reading glasses, progressive glasses and hearing aids. Most of us will need them
I have relatives that are legally blind due to macular degeneration. I hope a MR product, or evolutions, would help them. And a MR product may also help deaf people with real-time subtitles.
Done well, this product may have a very large market. Think of reading glasses, progressive glasses and hearing aids. Most of us will need them
This guy does 2000! I had to look it up, apparently the first bluetooth mouse was commercially introduced by Logitech in 2001.
They'll be luck to sell 100,000 units considering 1) its very high price of around $3,000 and 2) the slowing economy could hamper sales. It will be sold more like a development tool for future Apple VR/AR headsets.
You're exactly right, a MR device creates a whole new opportunity there as well for new types of apps and interactions, which require no other peripherals.
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I would love to be able to sit outside by my firepit and augment that reality with a huge movie screen. Make my backyard look like a Swedish forest while I sit in a hot tub. Explore natural wonders only really skilled adventurers can go. Hang glide. Scuba dive. Float in space or the ISS. Fight zombies in my house and neighborhood. Make a VR video using my iPhone of a great place while travelling and sit in that place again any time I want when I get home to remember it. Can you imagine being able to 3D record the inside of your childhood home with family and be able to revisit it in VR 10+ yrs later? So many possibilities!
I agree. Calling it Virtual Reality isn't even accurate. It won't be Virtual Reality until it's a neural implant and all senses can be manipulated. Until then, it's goggles strapped to your face that manipulate what you see and hear. That's all. No touch, no taste, no smell, no hot, no cold, no wind on the skin, etc.
I expect this product to be the best consumer grade VR/AR product, but I'm not convinced that will move the needle much in terms of the public's interest in VR. I also think it has to be cheap for there to be any serious uptake. There are niche use cases where I feel people will pay more, but the general public isn't interested in any of those.
Most people can't afford a $3K TV, which the entire family can watch. Friends can come over and enjoy it too. I don't see many people paying $3K for a solo TV/movie watching experience unless they're super rich. No doubt those customers exist, but are there enough of them to make the product successful? I doubt it.
Multiple monitors. Another great niche use case. Creatives and coders will no doubt appreciate this feature. Will it be a selling point for the general public, many of whom are perfectly happy with their 13" laptop screens? I doubt it.
For there to be any serious consumer interest, I think the product has to sell for under $500. It needs to be an accessory, like the Watch. Many people would buy them at that price point. I also think a lot of features will likely be wasted on such customers. There's probably a good market for just the screen part of the product. No cameras, no movement tracking, none of the AR stuff. Just a high-quality virtual big screen to enjoy movies on go, use a big virtual monitor on a plane, etc.
Before a "peripheral" can exist, we need the tech. There are companies working on neural interfaces. Elon's Neuralink, for one.
Most people aren't going to pay $3K for that. Most people don't buy Apple's Studio Display, much less their pro display. It all sounds great until you think about the price tag. What is a family of four supposed to do? Buy four goggles so they can all watch a movie together? The average person doesn't use multiple monitors and certainly isn't going to pay thousands of dollars for a headset for that purpose.
I'm also not convinced that even the biggest proponents of this use case will want to wear goggles for hours on end. When the product is under $500, people will buy it as an accessory to use while traveling or for fun novelty purposes like hopping in one's hot tub and pretending like they're in a natural hot spring. Lots of fun possibilities but only if the price point is right. $3K? Forget it. $1K? Unlikely. $500? It becomes another Watch-level product for Apple.
These are the exact same arguments naysayers have proclaimed against every product Apple has ever introduced. And it has always been wrong. Apple is a premium product company. They never do cheap. At most, they offer an “SE” version that is somewhat less expensive but still more expensive than any other company’s bc even the SE version is superior. This isn’t a product Apple expects everyone to buy. Its “nicheness” is baked into the economic equation. I think the Apple speakers are too expensive considering they can’t be wired to my receiver like a normal speaker. But many people have them.