Apple Must Compensate Brazilian Customer Over $1,000 for Selling iPhone Without a Charger, Judge Rules

[ninecows]

Cables wear out, but I’ve never had one of those 5W charging bricks wear out.

But the new cable won’t fit in the old 5W charging brick.

It is really well played by Apple. I’m thrilled by this move from Apple because my employer pays for my phone (and whatever charger I want) and I’m rich enough to be an Apple shareholder, so all in all it’s more money from you poor buggers to me. Thank you

 

[deeddawg]

According to some people in here it’s not a profit maximizing exercise from apples side, but solely to do good and be more green. And surely it’s good for the environment not to produce and ship chargers that nobody needs.

So if the environment is the sole argument then just include a voucher for a free USB-C charger with new phones. Solves the problem about not adapting new technology.

But what really happened here was that apple decided to make 2 y.o. chargers obsolete, not including chargers with new phones and claiming that people could use their old (but obsolete) chargers…

I'm curious exactly how Apple has made USBA chargers "obsolete"? By including a forward-looking USBC to Lightning cable?

'cuz my kitchen, desk, and night stand charge points using multiport USBA chargers and lightning cables all seem to still work fine?


(and anyone with a modicum of business sense understands Apple's reasons for the change were likely multifaceted; cost reduction, as well as reduced packaging, lower bulk shipment costs from smaller packaging, etc. plus the benefits of marketing spin regarding reduced environmental impacts from the materials sourcing and ewaste from the chargers so many people never use and end up throwing away. but then those same people remember that Apple is a for-profit megacorporation and thus wouldn't be surprised at them spinning an action one way even when there are other aspects to the decision)

 

[ksec]

I am disappointed by macrumors yet again. Not a single top voted comment calling for Apple to pull out of Brazil ?

 

[JazzyGB1]

Nonsense.

The X is comparable to the current similarly sized descendants, such as the 13 or 13 pro.

You cannot get a fairer comparison than products from the same lineage.

As you note - the X departed from prior models, and thus was a new flagship not comparable to prior flagship models.
The same logic applies to the Max variants. Flagship to flagship is not comparable when the underlying product changes substantially.

What are you talking about?
You're making it up as you go a long by your self determined 'lineage' now.
Here's the lineage...FLAGSHIP V FLAGSHIP - that's all there is to it!
The X had no direct descendant. It was the first iPhone without a home button and at the time offered the largest screen on the iPhone - just like the Pro Max does.
It was the flagship...just like the Pro Max is.
You can argue the facts but you can't change them!

 

[I7guy]

I am disappointed by macrumors yet again. Not a single top voted comment calling for Apple to pull out of Brazil ?

I don’t believe you read the entire thread. But yeah, apple should pull out of Brazil.

 

[I7guy]

[…]. plus the benefits of marketing spin regarding reduced environmental impacts from the materials sourcing and ewaste from the chargers […]

There is no spin. There is a straight up positive benefit to the environment with less e waste, less greenhouse gases, less raw materials.

 

[Slow Programmer]

If I buy a none Apple branded charger to use with my new phone and it damages the battery am I still covered under the warranty? If the third party charger charger burns my house down is Apple somehow responsible since they did not include an approved charger? Does Apple have a list of approved chargers or just any old thing I have on hand is OK? Does Apple only want me to buy their branded charger to go with my iPhone? If so why not include it with the phone?

 

[bobcomer]

I don't know about Brazil, but it seems in most parts of the world it's rather easy to buy USB-A and USB-C chargers from a wide variety of manufacturers. I'm unsure why anyone would have to purchase it from Apple.

They don't have to of course, but that's not what the law reads like. Apple sells phone. (no charger, and if you don't have one you have to buy one.) Apples sells charger to this guy, probably when he bought the phone at the store, who then sues Apple for breaking the law. He wins as it's an open and shut case.

 

[powerslave65]

This is maybe a $30 per plaintiff class action but who knows maybe later it will make senses when we will find out 3 out of 5 iPhones in Brazil are owned by the gov’t. South America and us just don’t play nice. Too bad we are just as bad. We didn’t give them the Covid vaccine recipe which was very dickish. Don’t be surprised when the Russian Federation pops missiles down there soon. Bottom line the US has a ton of relations repairing to do.

 

[I7guy]

If I buy a none Apple branded charger to use with my new phone and it damages the battery am I still covered under the warranty? If the third party charger charger burns my house down is Apple somehow responsible since they did not include an approved charger? Does Apple have a list of approved chargers or just any old thing I have on hand is OK? Does Apple only want me to buy their branded charger to go with my iPhone? If so why not include it with the phone?

If a third party charger burns your house down, whether apple will service your iPhone is the least of your worries.

I’m not an arm chair lawyer and I don’t play one on tv, so I’m guessing apple is not responsible, because the iPhone didn’t burn down your house , the charger did. So I’m the end, it’s on you. You can sue the manufacturer of the third party charger. You can try to sue apple, but probably will be thrown out of court.

 

[bobcomer]

I am disappointed by macrumors yet again. Not a single top voted comment calling for Apple to pull out of Brazil ?

And lose all that money they would have made in Brazil? That just isn't going to happen. Apple's shareholders wouldn't stand for it. (and rightly so)

 

[deeddawg]

What are you talking about?
You're making it up as you go a long by your self determined 'lineage' now.
Here's the lineage...FLAGSHIP V FLAGSHIP - that's all there is to it!
The X had no direct descendant. It was the first iPhone without a home button and at the time offered the largest screen on the iPhone - just like the Pro Max does.
It was the flagship...just like the Pro Max is.
You can argue the facts but you can't change them!

The X's direct descendant was the XS. Perhaps you've heard of it?

Speaking of which, that's when the XS Max was released. It and the XS were claimed as co-flagships per PCMag. Similarly, Apple markets the iPhone 13 Pro as something which comes in two sizes. Again, dual flagship status.

You might also note that the XS Max was sold at $1099 in September 2018, which would've been $1204.14 in October 2021, presenting an effect cost reduction of over $100 on the Max model. Interestingly that's even more savings to the consumer as compared to the XS's $999 being worth $1094.57 in 2021 dollars.

Thus both flagship to flagship comparisons - 2018 to 2021 - represent approximately $100 reductions in effective cost to the consumer, whether one chose the Max version or not.

Those, dear sir, are the facts.

 

[deeddawg]

If I buy a none Apple branded charger to use with my new phone and it damages the battery am I still covered under the warranty? If the third party charger charger burns my house down is Apple somehow responsible since they did not include an approved charger? Does Apple have a list of approved chargers or just any old thing I have on hand is OK? Does Apple only want me to buy their branded charger to go with my iPhone? If so why not include it with the phone?

In order:
1. Of course you are. Notice that Apple sells non-Apple branded chargers on their website in the US.
2. Nope.
3. Not that I'm aware of, and I wouldn't expect such a thing to exist since there are industry standards for USBA and USBC charging.
4. Can't speak for Apple, but the fact that they offer non-Apple branded chargers ought to help you figure out the answer.

 

[lartola]

if Apple were to include the charger, they'd simply make the phone 50 bucks more expensive.

No doubt they would, abusive as they are, but it would be a rip off. Apple was already selling iphones with charger until 2019. In 2020 they removed the charger, but the iphones continued to be priced the same as the year before, when they still included a charger in the box. Therefore, we’re still paying for a charger even though we no longer get one. If Apple were to make the phone $50 more expensive on the excuse of re-adding a charger, they’d just be making us pay two chargers to get only one: one already included in the original price of the iphone but not supplied, and one more -the one we’d get- paid by the increase on the price of the phone.

 

[I7guy]

No doubt they would, abusive as they are, but it would be a rip off. Apple was already selling iphones with charger until 2019. In 2020 they removed the charger, but the iphones continued to be priced the same as the year before, when they still included a charger in the box. Therefore, we’re still paying for a charger even though we no longer get one. If Apple were to make the phone $50 more expensive on the excuse of re-adding a charger, they’d just be making us pay two chargers to get only one: one already included in the original price of the iphone but not supplied, and one more -the one we’d get- paid by the increase on the price of the phone.

New phones always cost more. There’s r&d, development, manufacture of new components. That apple removed the charger and held the price, was one mitigating another.

 

[ds2000]

I kind of doubt that, most likely whoever's thing you buy that needs batteries doesn't actually make batteries too, so it's not a follow on product that you have to purchase from them.

 

[agenda893]

Apple must compensate a Brazilian customer who recently purchased an iPhone for selling the device without a charger included in the box, which violates consumer law, a judge has ruled.

Apple's decision to remove the charger in the box sparked controversy in 2020. Apple claims the move is for environmental reasons, claiming the decision is equivalent to removing nearly 450,000 cars from the road per year.

Nonetheless, the move has sparked some public and legal outcry. In the latest development, a judge in Brazil, a country that has long-questioned Apple's reasoning to remove the accessory, is forcing Apple to compensate a customer nearly $1,075 for the lack of a charger. As reported by Tecmundo:
Last year, Brazil fined Apple $2 million as a punishment for violating consumer law and disrespecting Brazilian customers, according to the head of the consumer group Procon-SP, Fernando Capez.

At one point, it seemed plausible that Brazil would have forced Apple to include a charger in the box for every iPhone sold in the country. Procon-SP said that the charger is an "essential part" of the smartphone experience.

By not providing one alongside the device, Apple was therefore breaching the Brazilian Consumer Defense Code, according to the consumer protection agency. Apple responded by arguing that many customers already have chargers in their homes, adding the environmental benefits of removing the charger and significantly reducing the overall iPhone box footprint.

Article Link: Apple Must Compensate Brazilian Customer Over $1,000 for Selling iPhone Without a Charger, Judge Rules

Considering Brazil’s rate of inflation the $1075 award was probably only $30 a few years ago. 🤦🏻‍♂️

 

[Sophisticatednut]

You can just buy the charger. If the charger were included, Apple would simply make the iPhone a bit more expensive. They have a certain margin they want to hit and they're going to do that with or without the charger in the box.

It's a fallacy to think you wouldn't pay extra for the charger if it were included in the box.

You would pay extra for the charger no matter what, so you can just as well buy it separately.

People just need to include the charger price in the total price for buying an iPhone if they need it. It's as simple as that.

Sad that apple didn’t lower the price of any iPhone equivalent to the chargers

 

[Sophisticatednut]

Didn't read article or look into it, but could the $1,075 be a mix of compensation for missing charger AND punitive damage to discourage behavior? Not that a measly $1,075 is discouraging to Apple when they're willing to pay millions for a Dutch fine

This is essentially giving every iPhone buyer in Brazil their phone for free. Imagine you buy your phone for 1.000$ and suddenly get a 1.000$ check. That’s effectively wiping out 100% of their earnings in Brazil for breaking the law knowingly

 

[Sophisticatednut]

It seems to me you don’t understand the positive environmental impact all around by not including a charger on hundreds of millions of iPhones.

While you may be personally annoyed I support the move and it has nothing to do with kool aid. It’s unfortunate there are those who can’t see the forest from the trees.

There are completely environmentally friendly ways to provide a charger free of charge.
1: an option to chose a charger to come with the box when ordered online.
2: option to receive a charger free of charge at the counter next to the box.

iPhones and chargers you can buy separately are shipped from the same warehouse anyways.

 

[I7guy]

There are completely environmentally friendly ways to provide a charger free of charge.
1: an option to chose a charger to come with the box when ordered online.
2: option to receive a charger free of charge at the counter next to the box.

iPhones and chargers you can buy separately are shipped from the same warehouse anyways.

The above isn't a solution to having one sku without a charger. One sku will reduce raw materials, manufacturing, green house gases and so on and so forth.

Apple will no longer provide a charger "free of charge". If they have to provide one, my guess is there will be an upcharge. The base price of the iphone no longer includes a charger.

 

[I7guy]

This is essentially giving every iPhone buyer in Brazil their phone for free. Imagine you buy your phone for 1.000$ and suddenly get a 1.000$ check. That’s effectively wiping out 100% of their earnings in Brazil for breaking the law knowingly

Which is maybe why Apple should call it quits in Brazil. They won't, but maybe they should consider it.

 

[bobcomer]

Har har.

 

[Macative]

In Brazil Apple could charge less for an iPhone without a charger. ▶️

How about on the checkout page, there is a checkbox for "send me a charger" and it is unchecked by default, which also applies a $20 discount in your cart. You can leave it unchecked, accept the discount, and not get a charger (which most people will do since it is the default), or you can check it and get a separate $20 charger sent to you along with your iPhone (pretty much the same as if you added one to your cart during checkout today).

This would be the reasonable approach. But Apple won't do that because it is entirely about the money.

 

[I7guy]

How about on the checkout page, there is a checkbox for "send me a charger" and it is unchecked by default, which also applies a $20 discount in your cart. You can leave it unchecked, accept the discount, and not get a charger (which most people will do since it is the default), or you can check it and get a separate $20 charger sent to you along with your iPhone (pretty much the same as if you added one to your cart during checkout today).

This would be the reasonable approach. But Apple won't do that because it is entirely about the money.

Apple is not going to reduce the price if one doesn't select a charger. In Brazil it doesn't matter, it seems apple has to include a charger. So Apple will include a charger and add $20 to the price of the phone and the environment be damned.