Apple Negotiating with Hyundai for Apple Car Production [Updated x2]

[PinkyMacGodess]

...said Flow39 of MacRumors forums fame, based on a trickle of publicly available information. I’m sure the Apple and Hyundai leadership teams have taken notice and are reconsidering their decisions. 🤣

Nice...

Why would Apple partner with Hyundai? Because they are hungry, and won't insist on things that a partnership with Mercedes would. I'm sure many other automakers would try to wag Apple over 'features' they want, or won't tolerate. There could be pitched battles over the style, shape, color, layout, etc. And with Cadillac apparently having problems retaining dealers over their plans to introduce an electric car, maybe Hyundai was the only one that jumped at the opportunity. We'll likely never know.

 

[PinkyMacGodess]

Hyundai is a joke of a car manufacturer. If Apple is going with an affordable brand, how about Toyota? I would never buy anything associated with Hyundai.

Toyota?

Um, because they already have quite an extensive lineup of electric cars already? I can't see them going in with Apple and taking a hit on profit and risk downplaying their existing product line. Simple...

Unless they did it as a side project, and I doubt that Apple wants to be put in a dead zone box so someone like Toyota can save their profit margins.

 

[moabal]

If you honestly think that Hyundai makes quality vehicles, then you have no idea what quality is, with all due respect. Those cars are rattling, plastic-y pieces of trash compared to a Mercedes, any Mercedes. This is not subjective, this is fact. Asian and American vehicles cannot compare to German vehicles when it comes to build quality alone. I'd rather buy American, but they are junk by comparison. Nothing in heaven or on earth would ever get me to buy an Apple car that has anything to do with Hyundai.

Most vehicles are plastic-y pieces of trash (for lack of a better term) at the lower end of the spectrum to be fair.

 

[Falhófnir]

If you honestly think that Hyundai makes quality vehicles, then you have no idea what quality is, with all due respect. Those cars are rattling, plastic-y pieces of trash compared to a Mercedes, any Mercedes. This is not subjective, this is fact. Asian and American vehicles cannot compare to German vehicles when it comes to build quality alone. I'd rather buy American, but they are junk by comparison. Nothing in heaven or on earth would ever get me to buy an Apple car that has anything to do with Hyundai.

Mercedes really aren't that good when it comes to engineering - that's why BMWs are almost always lighter with better handling than equivalent Mercedes models. Mercedes today trades off the rapidly fading whiff of prestige the brand still holds for the over 50s. Generally speaking Japanese/ South Korean cars are some of the best engineered you can buy. If you want mechanical reliability you don't buy German [anymore].

 

[v3rlon]

lul. No one's paying Apple's premium markup for a rebranded Hyundai. foh.

Yeah, and back in the early 80s, you would have said the same thing about Japanese cars. I hear they have a couple of good ones now.
In the 70's, Sony was cheap junk. No one would buy a Sony TV if they could afford an US made Magnovox.
Now Korea is doing exactly what Japan did: Introduce cheap products to get into the market, and scale up quality and costs. Now Samsung and LG are well regarded manufacturers for example.

The Hyundai Equus was nice, at least on paper. I never owned one. Their Genesis line seems to draw a bit of praise, and it is easy to run one of those up to $60,000 US. They are to Hyundai what Lexus is to Toyota of Cadillac is to Chevrolet. Imagine Apple design and solid manufacturing applied.

Also, for everything says about "Apple Tax," their prices are actually not nearly as crazy when compared to similar quality products. No one seriously considers the cheap $15 earbuds as 'equal' to AirPods Pro. Lets look at ACTUAL competitors:
Apple AirPods Pro: $149
Bose QuietComfort Earbuds $279
Samsung Galaxy Live: $149
Sony WF-1000XM: $299. (as an aside, their top over the ear cans are $1800, and you thought $549 was bad).
JBL Live 300TWS: $149 (assuming 'smart ambient' is noise cancelling)
JBL UA Project Rock: $199 (and they don't say noise cancelling)
Senheiser Tru Wireless 2: $299

And Apple at least popularized the 'true wireless' earbuds.

You can do the same with computers anything else. There are a list of features to make a hotel a 5-star hotel, and it is possible to check all those features off on a budget. But the 5-star places I stay in certainly don't match the 5-star places James Bond stays in. Saying, "well I found a place with a pool, too" doesn't make them the same product.

 

[Mac Prodigy]

Most vehicles are plastic-y pieces of trash (for lack of a better term) at the lower end of the spectrum to be fair.

There is a difference in the quality between even a $35k Mercedes and a $35k Hyundai. The Hyundai will rattle like there's no tomorrow. The interior will have far more plastic as well, instead of metal and wood. It won't handle like the Mercedes will. The price point doesn't matter. That is my point.

 

[Mac Prodigy]

Mercedes really aren't that good when it comes to engineering - that's why BMWs are almost always lighter with better handling than equivalent Mercedes models. Mercedes today trades off the rapidly fading whiff of prestige the brand still holds for the over 50s. Generally speaking Japanese/ South Korean cars are some of the best engineered you can buy. If you want mechanical reliability you don't buy German [anymore].

How many Mercedes, BMW's, and Hyundai's do you currently own? And what models please.

 

[v3rlon]

Mercedes really aren't that good when it comes to engineering - that's why BMWs are almost always lighter with better handling than equivalent Mercedes models. Mercedes today trades off the rapidly fading whiff of prestige the brand still holds for the over 50s. Generally speaking Japanese/ South Korean cars are some of the best engineered you can buy. If you want mechanical reliability you don't buy German [anymore].

Everyone makes cheap stuff, and most everyone makes a premium product.

I have owned American, Japanese, Korean, British, and German. They all have their ups and downs, but you can't make a top tier product in the low end of the budget. There is a reason the quality cars (from any manufacturer) cost more. It is the same reason that the lower end of the price range is 'plastic-y junk.'
Look at low end Ford Focus versus the top end Lincoln, Chevy Aveo versus Cadillac, Toyota Camry at the rental place versus Lexus, and yes, Hyundai Sonata versus Genesis G70.

 

[Blu-ray1972]

At least they aren't going with KIA. They should probably talk with Toyota as they are years ahead in R&D on hybrid and EV tech/batteries over Hyundai. Toyota's are way more reliable as well.

 

[v3rlon]

At least they aren't going with KIA. They should probably talk with Toyota as they are years ahead in R&D on hybrid and EV tech/batteries over Hyundai. Toyota's are way more reliable as well.

Define "way more reliable." When talking about 1 more complaint per 1000, I wouldn't characterize that as a dramatic difference.

Hyundai offers a better warranty, and are looking to increase the prestige of their brand (and quality of their products). Toyota seems happy with Lexus. The Korean giant has more incentive to negotiate.

 

[jlc1978]

If you honestly think that Hyundai makes quality vehicles, then you have no idea what quality is, with all due respect. Those cars are rattling, plastic-y pieces of trash compared to a Mercedes, any Mercedes. This is not subjective, this is fact. Asian and American vehicles cannot compare to German vehicles when it comes to build quality alone. I'd rather buy American, but they are junk by comparison. Nothing in heaven or on earth would ever get me to buy an Apple car that has anything to do with Hyundai.

Having owned a number of Mercedes (and BMW's, US cars, though oddly no Asian) over the years; my expereince with Mercedes is they are not as good as they were and the rest of the world has caught up in many ways. i mean, the old Mercedes woul dnot design engine mounts that fail at ~40K, or a glove box that won't open, for example.

They build great cars, but they are no longer, better than, let alone a big step above, others in terms of quality at any point in the price spectrum. Yes, their AMG models are amazing cars, but as one MB mechanic told me "AMG stands for A Money Generator."

As much as I love BMWs I'd be the first to admit the Stinger is a pretty amazing car at the right price point. Hell, the first time I saw a preproduction model I didn't recognize it as a KIA until I was told that was who made it.

 

[spinedoc77]

lul. No one's paying Apple's premium markup for a rebranded Hyundai. foh.

Your thinking is outdated by about 20 years, Hyundai is a great company, they top quality and satisfaction lists every year. I typically had Audi's and before that Mercedes for my leases, but have ALWAYS had issues with them, but just accepted them as the price you had to pay to drive upscale. I'm talking about big issues like engine and transmission failures. My last lease was a Genesis G80, that really really changed my mind about buying German ever again, what a car. Finally for me the biggest determiner of "quality" is how much the company is willing to stand behind their vehicles. If you look at Hyundai/Genesis warranties clearly they stand behind their vehicles more than pretty much anyone else.

No, I think the opposite is true, you are going to have people lined up to buy this, equally because it's Apple AND Hyundai.

 

[JBGoode]

If you honestly think that Hyundai makes quality vehicles, then you have no idea what quality is, with all due respect. Those cars are rattling, plastic-y pieces of trash compared to a Mercedes, any Mercedes. This is not subjective, this is fact. Asian and American vehicles cannot compare to German vehicles when it comes to build quality alone. I'd rather buy American, but they are junk by comparison. Nothing in heaven or on earth would ever get me to buy an Apple car that has anything to do with Hyundai.

Why would you compare a Hyundai to a Mercedes? They are not in the same league and not aimed at the same market so the comparison is silly at best. That’s like comparing dollar store ear buds to audiophile grade headphones and announcing that the expensive ones are better.

People that buy Hyundai know what they’re getting. A reliable vehicle at a good price. I’ve owned 3 and they've been the most trouble free cars I’ve ever owned.

 

[Flow39]

...said Flow39 of MacRumors forums fame, based on a trickle of publicly available information. I’m sure the Apple and Hyundai leadership teams have taken notice and are reconsidering their decisions. 🤣

And it’s not exactly a secret that Hyundai is cheap and isn’t known for producing a quality car (other than a whopping total of one model, which still can’t compete with any Lexus/Acura/Infiniti). Let’s have Apple outsource development of the Mac chassis to HP’s cheap budget line and see how that goes. Open your eyes.

 

[RogerWilco]

Like clockwork -- share price lagging? -- bring out the car rumors!

 

[Mac Prodigy]

Why would you compare a Hyundai to a Mercedes? They are not in the same league and not aimed at the same market so the comparison is silly at best. Thats like comparing dollar store ear buds to audiophile grade headphones.

They make automobiles that are at the same price point genius. Nice try. Run along.

 

[Mac Prodigy]

Your thinking is outdated by about 20 years, Hyundai is a great company, they top quality and satisfaction lists every year. I typically had Audi's and before that Mercedes for my leases, but have ALWAYS had issues with them, but just accepted them as the price you had to pay to drive upscale. I'm talking about big issues like engine and transmission failures. My last lease was a Genesis G80, that really really changed my mind about buying German ever again, what a car. Finally for me the biggest determiner of "quality" is how much the company is willing to stand behind their vehicles. If you look at Hyundai/Genesis warranties clearly they stand behind their vehicles more than pretty much anyone else.

No, I think the opposite is true, you are going to have people lined up to buy this, equally because it's Apple AND Hyundai.

Hyundai quality issues hammer quarterly profit report

South Korea's Hyundai Motor Co said on Monday it swung to a net loss for July-September, missing market estimates by a wide margin, as costs related to engine quality issues and recalls smashed what would otherwise have been strong earnings. Hyundai, the world's fifth-biggest automaker when...

www.autoblog.com

 

[Mac Prodigy]

Having owned a number of Mercedes (and BMW's, US cars, though oddly no Asian) over the years; my expereince with Mercedes is they are not as good as they were and the rest of the world has caught up in many ways. i mean, the old Mercedes woul dnot design engine mounts that fail at ~40K, or a glove box that won't open, for example.

They build great cars, but they are no longer, better than, let alone a big step above, others in terms of quality at any point in the price spectrum. Yes, their AMG models are amazing cars, but as one MB mechanic told me "AMG stands for A Money Generator."

As much as I love BMWs I'd be the first to admit the Stinger is a pretty amazing car at the right price point. Hell, the first time I saw a preproduction model I didn't recognize it as a KIA until I was told that was who made it.

What years of Mercedes did/do you own?

 

[Mac Prodigy]

Why would you compare a Hyundai to a Mercedes? They are not in the same league and not aimed at the same market so the comparison is silly at best. Thats like comparing dollar store ear buds to audiophile grade headphones.

Ever hear of the failed Hyundai Equus? They tried to play with the big dogs. Didn't work out well for them now did it?

​

 

[v3rlon]

Having owned a number of Mercedes (and BMW's, US cars, though oddly no Asian) over the years; my expereince with Mercedes is they are not as good as they were and the rest of the world has caught up in many ways. i mean, the old Mercedes woul dnot design engine mounts that fail at ~40K, or a glove box that won't open, for example.

They build great cars, but they are no longer, better than, let alone a big step above, others in terms of quality at any point in the price spectrum. Yes, their AMG models are amazing cars, but as one MB mechanic told me "AMG stands for A Money Generator."

As much as I love BMWs I'd be the first to admit the Stinger is a pretty amazing car at the right price point. Hell, the first time I saw a preproduction model I didn't recognize it as a KIA until I was told that was who made it.

Well on the opposite side, I read hat the Stinger out of the box was great, but a year in, it hadn't held up as well as a BMW 3 Series.

But Kia is the lower end brand of Hyundai in the same way that Genesis is upper end.

 

[Falhófnir]

How many Mercedes, BMW's, and Hyundai's do you currently own? And what models please.

Don't like Mercedes, they're for old men. Never had a Hyundai and probably wouldn't get one myself. Previously had a Mini (sort of a BMW hatchback I guess?). Don't really think that makes any difference though, what matters is cumulative reputation not individual data points. In reliability tables East Asian manufacturers skew towards the top, the Germans tend towards mid table at best. Apple wants that expertise in engineering a reliable car, not tips from their interior styling team.

Everyone makes cheap stuff, and most everyone makes a premium product.

I have owned American, Japanese, Korean, British, and German. They all have their ups and downs, but you can't make a top tier product in the low end of the budget. There is a reason the quality cars (from any manufacturer) cost more. It is the same reason that the lower end of the price range is 'plastic-y junk.'
Look at low end Ford Focus versus the top end Lincoln, Chevy Aveo versus Cadillac, Toyota Camry at the rental place versus Lexus, and yes, Hyundai Sonata versus Genesis G70.

Fair comment on interior build quality and price points, but that doesn't change the underlying mechanical engineering. Mercedes aren't particularly notable for that now, if they ever were. They're mid table at best on reliability, and there's way better to be had for ride and handling.

 

[v3rlon]

Ever hear of the failed Hyundai Equus? They tried to play with the big dogs. Didn't work out well for them now did it?

​

Not all of Japan's early attempts were rousing successes either. How about that Toyota IQ back in 2012? They thought they would sell 100k a year and managed just 16k in 5 years.

 

[jlc1978]

What years of Mercedes did/do you own?

I've owned everything from late 90's to 2015's; so a broad base to compare; and a family member owns a current one. I am not impressed by them anymore; they're good but for the price I question the value over other brands.

 

[Mac Prodigy]

Don't like Mercedes, they're for old men. Never had a Hyundai and probably wouldn't get one myself. Previously had a Mini (sort of a BMW hatchback I guess?). Don't really think that makes any difference though, what matters is cumulative reputation not individual data points. In reliability tables East Asian manufacturers skew towards the top, the Germans tend towards mid table at best. Apple wants that expertise in engineering a reliable car, not tips from their interior styling team.


Fair comment on interior build quality and price points, but that doesn't change the underlying mechanical engineering. Mercedes aren't particularly notable for that now, if they ever were. They're mid table at best on reliability, and there's way better to be had for ride and handling.

I'm sorry but you've lost all credibility. Anyone in the automobile engineering field would laugh you out of the room for your second point regarding mechanical engineering. Your first point is nonsensical and not even worth addressing, although I will say you have no frame of reference here which is precisely what I expected, therefore I will refer you to my first sentence in this reply.

 

[Falhófnir]

I'm sorry but you've lost all credibility. Anyone in the automobile engineering field would laugh you out of the room for your second point regarding mechanical engineering. Your first point is nonsensical and not even worth addressing, although I will say you have no frame of reference here which is precisely what I expected, therefore I will refer you to my first sentence in this reply.

For stating a fact?