5 in September (don’t mind the names, nobody outside Apple ever know the final marketing names)
+1 in spring 2025: the SE.
= 6 phones in the pipeline
(if the above table is not fake, which could very well be)
Got a tip for us?
Let us know
Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.
Apple Negotiating With OLED Suppliers for Next Year's iPhone SE 4
- Thread starter MacRumors
- Start date
- Sort by reaction score
5 in September (don’t mind the names, nobody outside Apple ever know the final marketing names)
+1 in spring 2025: the SE.
= 6 phones in the pipeline
(if the above table is not fake, which could very well be)
For anyone wondering about the 32" 6K iMac this is likely the primary reason why none has come out in 2021 & 2023.
Apple is likely waiting for the next gen 32" 6K parts to push down prices of the 5yo 2019 Pro Display XDR.
If that table ends up being true… that would change many things, actually.
But just seeing at the price points, yeah, it seems fake.
At a minimum, there is a typo. The "16 SE" with 128GB would not be the same price ($699) as the "16" with 256GB. The 16 would presumably be $799, not $699. It's also very unlikely that the price difference between "16 SE" with 128GB and "16" with 256GB would only be $100.
Definitely seems fake and I doubt even Apple knows what prices will be at this point.
Thanks. You and a couple others that gave less complete versions of the same answer are surely right. I'm just in depressed denial over the loss of the Mini.
I thought it was pretty much confirmed that Apple had given up on the in-house modem and would keep using Qualcomm modems for the foreseeable future…
As for mmWave, honestly, I don’t see it as a big feature, and I wouldn’t put it on the SE if that allows it to be cheaper. But I think it will probably have mmWave, and the latest (iPhone 16) Qualcomm modem.
Yeah I had noticed that typo. (the typo is only in dollars, not in that other currency)
The iPhone 16 would start at 799$ just like the iPhone 15 does today.
But it would finally get high refresh rate (like many Android phones have had for years) and AOD to enjoy iOS features like StandBy and Live Activities at their fullest.
The SE and SE Plus would be a way for Apple to keep selling 60Hz phones. (btw I prefer calling them "Lite", the SE moniker is reserved to the 2025 iPhone SE)
Incidentally, based on that table they would cost exactly as the iPhone 14 and iPhone 14 Plus today.
So it's not exactly a groundbreaking pricing strategy. They're the same price tiers as today.
It's just a reshuffling of features:
- 699$: iPhone 16 Lite with dynamic island, modern silicon and 1 camera (vs current iPhone 14 with notch, old silicon but 2 cameras); leverages the production lines (or stockpile) of 6.1" OLEDs currently used on iPhone 15, and the iPhone 15 chassis; no Spatial Videos (if they didn't come up with these new 1-camera phones, eventually Spatial Videos would trickle down to the "last year phone" tier, but this move will avoid that in 2025); cloud-based Siri GPT; action button but no capture button
- 799$: iPhone 16 Lite Plus with dynamic island, modern silicon and 1 camera (vs current iPhone 14 Plus with notch, old silicon but 2 cameras); leverages the production lines (or stockpile) of 6.7" OLEDs currently used on iPhone 15 Plus, and the iPhone 15 Plus chassis; no Spatial Videos (if they didn't come up with these new 1-camera phones, eventually Spatial Videos would trickle down to the "last year phone" tier, but this move will avoid that in 2025); cloud-based Siri GPT; action button but no capture button
- 799$: iPhone 16 with 120Hz, AOD, A18 silicon, and 2 cameras, moves to brand new 6.3" OLED and new chassis design; an aggressive move to fight tougher competition in Asia; 1080p Spatial Videos; double the base storage (compared to the current 128GB iPhone 15) because those Spatial Videos are twice as big; fully local Siri GPT; capture button
- 999$: iPhone 16 Pro with 5x tetraprism, the new 48MP UW, 4K Spatial Videos, the new 6.3" OLED and new chassis design; fully local Siri GPT; capture button
- 1099$: iPhone 16 Pro Max with 5x tetraprism, the new 48MP UW, 4K Spatial Videos, the new 6.9" OLED and new chassis design; aggressive -100$ pricing to fight tougher competition environment; fully local Siri GPT; capture button
- 499$-599$: 2025 iPhone SE with narrow notch, iPhone 14 chassis and 6.1" OLED, FaceID, modern silicon, 1 camera, cloud-based Siri GPT, action button but no capture button; aggressive move to fight tougher competition and conquer the Indian market (possibly manufactured in India too).
These above may be the next 6 iPhones.
If we think hard about it, Apple NEEDS the new 1-camera phones (16 Lite and 16 Lite Plus) to:
- have a way to continue selling 60Hz OLEDs with dynamic island without being viciously mocked (anybody remembers the drama about the 60Hz iPhone 15/15+ last year?)
- keep Spatial Videos an exclusive premium feature for the next few years (otherwise it would eventually trickle down to the 699$ tier)
Last edited:
The "16 SE" price is listed as the same as the 14 (with connectivity discount) but the "16 SE Plus" is actually $100 less as it has 256GB. A 14 Plus with 256GB is $899 (with connectivity discount) yet the table shows $799 for the "16 SE Plus."
I just don't think even Apple knows what prices will be at this point.
Yeah there are some typos and probably errors (I don't think the 16 SE Plus would actually start at 256GB, probably 128GB).
The gist of the matter is that the new 1-camera models (16 SE and 16 SE Plus) would occupy the slots in the lineup currently occupied by the "last year" models (14 and 14 Plus).
One thing I forgot to mention in the previous post: Apple also needs to kill lightning and move to usb-c as fast as possible. This aggressive "deluge of new models" strategy may also facilitate that.
given up? No.
"...Qualcomm said today during its first earnings call of 2024. Apple's existing agreement has now been extended for two years, so we can expect to see Qualcomm modems in the next several iPhone generations.
...
November 2023, Bloomberg's Mark Gurman said that Apple's work on a modem chip had been postponed until late 2025 or 2026, and it is possible it could see further delays. Apple was initially aiming to have an Apple-designed modem chip ready to go by 2024, but it missed that target. ..."
Apple Extends Modem Licensing Deal With Qualcomm Through March 2027
Apple has extended its modem chip licensing agreement with Qualcomm through March 2027, Qualcomm said today during its first earnings call of 2024. Apple's existing agreement has now been extended for two years, so we can expect to see Qualcomm modems in the next several iPhone generations...
forums.macrumors.com
"foreseeable future" ... well this whole rumor thread is about the SE 4 not appearing in the "foreseeable immediate future" also. If Apple "gave up" then they probably would have signed something better than just a 2 year deal.
If it is 'late 2025' then probably a miss for the SE4. But targeting 2024 and sliding into 1H 2025 wouldn't be surprising. And if a substantive number of the 'problems' were clustered in mmWave and C-Band coverage then 'chucking' those features would speed up deployment (but not 'solve' the bulk of the 'Qualcomm' problem.).
Likely also that is not an exclusive contract. The bulk of the modems they intend to use, but not necessarily all of them. ( The SE-models aren't in Apple's top 5 selling iPhone models. Qualcomm loosing them is something that isn't going to have substantive impact on Qualcomm's revenue numbers. So they don't need to mention that. It is provisioning the bleeding edge iPhone that their stockholders have their underwear in a twist about. )
Apple could try to initially 'trail' their 'version 1.00' modem in an iPad but that is a more than a bit dubious approach. Most iPads sold are Wi-Fi only. There is a very high likelihood that even celluar iPads spend the substantial majority of their time on Wi-Fi networks. Apple is not going to be able to collect feedback on how well their cellular modems are doing if they are not be substantively used in the field if a extreme broad number of places. A far better 'field trial' candidate would be a phone. But if the modem is unproven sticking that into your most expensive phone is extremely risky ( if modem surfaces an embarrassing bug).
The SE4 is a good candidate for a broader set of folks who might 'suffer through' a 'OK most of the time' modem if necessary. Also more likely for them to take the phone places where perhaps are not always connected to the most modern, feature complete radio towers. (the sides of town/contryside where cellular companies don't maximize their infrastructure investment.)
Once they get to version '1.25' , '1.5' , or '2.0' then that would be time for max volume iPhone time. And yes ... that is probably years away. Mainly because Qualcomm isn't 'sleeping'. Their modem two years down the road is probably going to be even better still (and non trivial to replace ... several years down the road looking at 6G and even more stuff to do. ). But Apple has to get to the point where they deploy something.
If they are keeping Qualcomm then adding mmWave adds even more costs. If Apple is aiming at Scrooge McDuck pricing on the screens ( $20/screen) then very good chance they are aiming at Scrooge McDuck pricing on the modems also. Perhaps Apple slides C-band coverage into the modem ( technically not mmWave and in 'Sub6' range). That likely would be more upside than mm-Wave ( better , broader celluar coverage versus hot rod drag racing covering in limited zones.) A substantive amount of these SE models are heading off to locations that are 'budget challegned' ( countries where the high end iPhone is relatively largely unaffordable). The infrastructure there isn't going to be fast adopters of mm-Wave either.
That said... one way to get an overly complicated modem out the door sooner is to chop off parts of the overly complicated specs. Make it work and then worry about make it 'faster'.
"iphone 16 SE ... $699" ... "iphone 16 ... $699" .... "if the above table is not fake". Is there really an 'if' there?
If take out the middle line, what have is the current 2 'plain' +2 'Pro' line up . Two '16' era phones selling for almost exactly the same price and screen size isn't likely going to happen. Especially since also have 15's and 14's also in the product line up.
Perhaps a typo. Where the 'plain' 16 should be $799 ( since 5999 = $799 on the line above). The other possible move is that those top two are 15 and 15 Plus. Currently the 14 Plus is $799. ( and Apple is dropping the 'Plus' going forward because it doesn't sell any better than the mini did. And with 'plain' iPhone screen creeping up from 6.1 -> 6.3 it makes even less of a market gap difference. It is a 'big enough for vast majority of people' screen. And Apple 'herds' folks who want 'even bigger screen' into the Pro prices. )
The current SE 3 is $429 USA list price. Originally the SE was $399 list price. There is no rational way Apple can crank the price of the SE up to $699 and it still be playing same role in the line up as the current SE plays.