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Apple Offers Developers a Closer Look at the New Mac Pro
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Last Christmas I was almost ready to build a Hackintosh. Do you know what stopped me? First of all, noise: I couldn't get a top CPU with a top of the line GPU without having a lot of fans in the box. And I need either no fan at all, or one very good designed fan, because being a Mac user for several years, there's one thing I appreciate when working with computers, and it's silence. I want absolute silence, please.
Second, I wanted a very durable system. Yes, silent and durable. But that's a problem, because lack of fans seems to suggest overheating and premature hardware failures.
Third, the Hackintosh still has compatibility problems. I said goodbye to compatibility issues many years ago, and I don't want them back.
So, I decided to wait, I halted my Hackintosh purchase in order to see the next move by Apple.
And I'm glad I waited, because this is -exactly- -I really mean exactly- the computer I wished to have: good thermal design, super silent, super CPU, super GPU, and no more HDD.
Yes, I'd love to build this myself for $1500, but please tell me how can I buy an ultra silent PC with great performance yet good thermal design. What components must I choose so that I don't end up with 5 fans or a loud liquid cooling system and at the same time I've top performance for CPU intense tasks and heavy OpenGL?
I just see no competition. Sorry but I don't see any competitor for the new Mac Pro.
I'm glad I waited
I think it's not attractive, nor a practical shape, not just "form over function" but "form separated from function".
Only the early Crays had a convincing arguement for the round design.
This is a ridiculous form-factor, never mind the fact that I think it looks like a trash-can prop from Star Wars - The Empire Strikes Back.
When I first saw the photo of the thing, I had to double check if it was an Onion spoof.
I will wait till I see it in the flesh but I agree with you - at first glance it looks almost comical.
The have 150 Billion in the bank by taking 30% cut of other peoples work and selling a $200 phone for $600... Take away the iOS device sales and apple would still be back where it was in early 2000s.
They have NO IDEA on desktop hardware.. its functional, if all you do is surf the net.. The PRO was the only exception, until now. I don't want EXTERNAL upgrades, i don't want the rats nest of ugly wires, the slew of PSUs needed to power all the external devices and the expensive of having to get a contractor in to add a bank of socket to my wall to accommodate those PSUs because i don't want a load of extensions all over the show.
I feel so disgusted by complaints i've read about the lack of optical drive. I can't conceive that there are people that can't handle progress! If you need an optical drive go buy an external one, buy ten i don't care. But please don't force the rest of us to have useless 80s' tech in our computers! I'm glad Apple ignores such ridiculous requests, even if i'm angry with Apple for other reasons!
Accommodating
What, exactly, does a "pro" machine need to accommodate? This thing has an ultrafast CPU and blazing fast video. Presumably it'll cost less to produce than the immense bulk it supersedes. Pro machines often have scads of external storage attached anyhow, so losing the internal drive bays is no big loss (the old Pro didn't have enough of those anyhow for many use cases).
About the only "loss" I see is the ability to slap in multiple video cards. We'll have to wait and see regarding how external options shake out costwise. That'll impact some professionals, but not the vast majority of them.
What, exactly, does a "pro" machine need to accommodate? This thing has an ultrafast CPU and blazing fast video. Presumably it'll cost less to produce than the immense bulk it supersedes. Pro machines often have scads of external storage attached anyhow, so losing the internal drive bays is no big loss (the old Pro didn't have enough of those anyhow for many use cases).
About the only "loss" I see is the ability to slap in multiple video cards. We'll have to wait and see regarding how external options shake out costwise. That'll impact some professionals, but not the vast majority of them.
Interesting but inflexible
The cooling tower approach is interesting but it is a very inflexible arrangement.
There are many types of existing Mac Pro/workstation users and this is only aimed at a small subset. For example, I as a computer scientist want lots of cores and RAM but only need a simple graphics card that can do 2D well. Someone into 3D CAD might want two very powerful graphics cards but not care so much about non-video RAM and processing. Someone into CUDA/GPGPU will want to have several well cooled co-processors. Video editors want a bit of everything and lots of disk drive space and might not want to clutter up their desks with cables.
The cooling tower approach means you have to have 3 cards to form the shape and they have decreed that two of these are graphics, and non-CUDA graphics at that.
On the positive side it will presumably be quiet and nicely made though rather ugly in my personal opinion.
This is designed to fit in with the rest of the Apple line, unnecessarily small/slim, non-upgradable/expandable but well constructed and expensive. Though I'm surprised they made it black rather than the normal silver aluminium look.
The cooling tower approach is interesting but it is a very inflexible arrangement.
There are many types of existing Mac Pro/workstation users and this is only aimed at a small subset. For example, I as a computer scientist want lots of cores and RAM but only need a simple graphics card that can do 2D well. Someone into 3D CAD might want two very powerful graphics cards but not care so much about non-video RAM and processing. Someone into CUDA/GPGPU will want to have several well cooled co-processors. Video editors want a bit of everything and lots of disk drive space and might not want to clutter up their desks with cables.
The cooling tower approach means you have to have 3 cards to form the shape and they have decreed that two of these are graphics, and non-CUDA graphics at that.
On the positive side it will presumably be quiet and nicely made though rather ugly in my personal opinion.
This is designed to fit in with the rest of the Apple line, unnecessarily small/slim, non-upgradable/expandable but well constructed and expensive. Though I'm surprised they made it black rather than the normal silver aluminium look.
Steve or Tim?
So was this (new Mac Pro) the product of Steve's last testament, or Tim's new wave?
I can completely understand why people are bitching about the new form factor. Pretty as a button, but paradigm shifting, which means - extra expenses...
My current desktop is a G5 PowerMac. Whenever I've considered upgrading, I've only really seen 2 choices: an iMac + multi bay hard drive enclosure for all my hard drives (ie not just the 2 that currently reside in the tower; there's 2 more externals as well), or a Mac Pro + new screen (as my 17" Studio Display could use an update)...
Now... either way, I'm looking at having to get an external multi bay hard drive enclosure... And unless the new Mac Pro's price is massively slashed from the previous models, there's really no choice - it's an iMac. (and I don't like the new iMac either...)
IMO... The only thing that would save this, would be if Apple themselves offered a matching tower for your hard drives etc... as an optional extra... at a descent price.
Apple obviously want to push their Thunder, so they should offer the extras themselves - not wait for 3rd parties.
So was this (new Mac Pro) the product of Steve's last testament, or Tim's new wave?
I can completely understand why people are bitching about the new form factor. Pretty as a button, but paradigm shifting, which means - extra expenses...
My current desktop is a G5 PowerMac. Whenever I've considered upgrading, I've only really seen 2 choices: an iMac + multi bay hard drive enclosure for all my hard drives (ie not just the 2 that currently reside in the tower; there's 2 more externals as well), or a Mac Pro + new screen (as my 17" Studio Display could use an update)...
Now... either way, I'm looking at having to get an external multi bay hard drive enclosure... And unless the new Mac Pro's price is massively slashed from the previous models, there's really no choice - it's an iMac. (and I don't like the new iMac either...)
IMO... The only thing that would save this, would be if Apple themselves offered a matching tower for your hard drives etc... as an optional extra... at a descent price.
Apple obviously want to push their Thunder, so they should offer the extras themselves - not wait for 3rd parties.
He is looking for a new jub with Dyson when apple figure out HE is the problem with apples "stagnation" going forward... People are sick of the "thinner, smaller, lighter, less functional" kick he is on, its now at the point where its starting to lose apple customers, i mean a non-internally, expandable PRO workstation, Really >???
You could probably find a USB3 drive enclosure at a descent price, if you are talking about regular HDDs then that should be enough for 3-4 drives.
Im sure APple will offer a good amount of costumization. If you need more ram you should be able to swith to a cheaper GPU. There are external thunderbold chasis for all your PCIe 3.0 cards for 300$. I like the new Mac Pro alot. It has everything the basic pro user may need and as I said before, if you need external GPU encoding card or audio adapter for your work, you go external. Apple offers you the core of the system and a great conectivity. The numbers they showed are insane. If the cooling core do its work properly, the new Mac Pro should be a monster.
they preach that to do you with all their machines especially the imac yet release a machine that if properly utilized will look like an old telephone switchboard
Cant really comment on what Pros like, not one, bit of an interloper here in that sense.
Nevertheless..
The nice thing about a big tower is that you can hide it away under and leave your desk top free of clutter
I don't know, I reckon it could be a good place to prove bread dough.
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Absolutely. This is just the standard Apple way of being an early adopter. No HDD! Shock and despair - I'll agree it seems unfortunate right now, but in 3 years, we'll realise they were just skating to where the puck will be.
My wife brought a laptop home the other day, some Dell thing. It still had a VGA port, I was pretty amazed. In their defence though it didn't have a parallel port anymore, so I figured they were probably only 10 years behind now and not 15. Are there still people out there complaining about VGA ports on their MBP or MacBook Air?
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I'm gonna wait til Rev 2 at least, my 2009 MP has life in it yet, but I'm with you there.
My Price Guess Is Minimum $2999. But I gotta own one. Historically Awesome!
Ha ha, add a couple of $1,000.
The GPU's are $3,200 each retail, so say Apple get a 50% discount buying in mass orders, that's your $3,000 already, then there are the RAM modules, CPU, all the other little extras. Let alone the cost of it being made in the US.
USB 3, 4 bay, kinda looks like it would "belong"...
$130
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Hornette...028&pid=100033&prg=1011&rk=1&sd=200927225525&
(Am actually surprised to see that so cheap - whenever I've looked before, there's not been much for under $400)
But if we're talking Thunderbolt... you wont get change from $600...
I'm not up to date to know how USB3 compares with Thunderbolt when it comes to such devices...???
I just don't really understand all this complaining..
"Nobody wants cables and external stuff around their places....."
What's the real difference from a drive to 4?
You most certainly would still buy some external drives to keep your stuff safe.
And if you didn't really know it: You can connect up to tens of external thunderbolt HDD (or SSD)-cases - just to one thunderbolt connection. What it means? If you like your place nice looking and clean, but together for example, 6 of Lacie's 20Tb Thunderbolt systems, but them in row of three (and the other 3 on top of the others), connect them to each other with 0,5m thunderbolt cables, and then with like 5 meters cable to your computer, and voíla, you can see just one cable going around, and you have faster connections than sata3, and nicer looking than USB 3.0. Yes it's possible, and those 20tb drives costs like $2000-4000 each (and if you can afford the new Mac Pro, you can afford atleast one of those.)If you didn't read it yet - You can connect up to 6 different devices to one thunderbolt cable.
It's small, but more powerful than Mac mini. Exactly it's like a tower version of Mac mini - except - with Mac Pro's power. And when you think about it really hard, Everything made for Apple devices, works with them.
Lack of PCIe card slots? The ones who really needs them today, are maybe the ones, who doesn't have enough power to handle .r3d -files and the Pro Tools HD/HDX users. Well, that computer has enough power for the .r3d -files, and I'm pretty sure that the Pro Tools HD/HDX PCIe cards are coming to change to some thunderbolt stuff later this year. But and again, if you can really afford Pro Tools HD -, Red camera - or this Mac Pro, you can really afford to buy some thunderbolt PCIe closure. And always you can run with the HD Native system until they release something better and new. (You know, so many of them who needs raw power for editing and stuff uses the last year's or older iMacs? And most certainly this is more cooler and powerful.)
Then we come to the RAM. "Just 4 slots." Right. It's a Pro system, and even the Mac Pro before supported 16Gb RAM sticks, even thought Apple didn't sell them. That means, you might get up to 64Gb's of RAM, and it's enough, if the last Mac Pros have been enough for you. And now it's faster and with 2x bandwidth - I think you can work with it really well.
"No DVD/CD/Blu-ray -drive." If you work with them or your clients wants the stuff on them, you can easily afford an usb 3.0 blu-ray drive. It's just one cable, which you can easily tape to your desk that you can't see it. You can still burn the discs, even thought the drives ain't internal. How does the iMac users work? With external drives. And todays, it's better, faster and sometimes even cheaper to buy usb 3.0 Blu-ray drive for the new Mac Pro, than a Sata II drive for the older Mac Pro.
This is like, if you are really going to buy it, you most certainly have enough money to buy an external TB HDD system, you most certainly have enough money to buy external PCIe cases. And if you really need more graphic power, you really can afford some extra cash for external PCIe place.
You talk about the price too high, but if you can't afford it, buy something else. If you have no enough money for it or/and the externals, think really, do you need it - was it then external or internal, it still costs almost the same.
"Nobody wants cables and external stuff around their places....."
What's the real difference from a drive to 4?
You most certainly would still buy some external drives to keep your stuff safe.
And if you didn't really know it: You can connect up to tens of external thunderbolt HDD (or SSD)-cases - just to one thunderbolt connection. What it means? If you like your place nice looking and clean, but together for example, 6 of Lacie's 20Tb Thunderbolt systems, but them in row of three (and the other 3 on top of the others), connect them to each other with 0,5m thunderbolt cables, and then with like 5 meters cable to your computer, and voíla, you can see just one cable going around, and you have faster connections than sata3, and nicer looking than USB 3.0. Yes it's possible, and those 20tb drives costs like $2000-4000 each (and if you can afford the new Mac Pro, you can afford atleast one of those.)If you didn't read it yet - You can connect up to 6 different devices to one thunderbolt cable.
It's small, but more powerful than Mac mini. Exactly it's like a tower version of Mac mini - except - with Mac Pro's power. And when you think about it really hard, Everything made for Apple devices, works with them.
Lack of PCIe card slots? The ones who really needs them today, are maybe the ones, who doesn't have enough power to handle .r3d -files and the Pro Tools HD/HDX users. Well, that computer has enough power for the .r3d -files, and I'm pretty sure that the Pro Tools HD/HDX PCIe cards are coming to change to some thunderbolt stuff later this year. But and again, if you can really afford Pro Tools HD -, Red camera - or this Mac Pro, you can really afford to buy some thunderbolt PCIe closure. And always you can run with the HD Native system until they release something better and new. (You know, so many of them who needs raw power for editing and stuff uses the last year's or older iMacs? And most certainly this is more cooler and powerful.)
Then we come to the RAM. "Just 4 slots." Right. It's a Pro system, and even the Mac Pro before supported 16Gb RAM sticks, even thought Apple didn't sell them. That means, you might get up to 64Gb's of RAM, and it's enough, if the last Mac Pros have been enough for you. And now it's faster and with 2x bandwidth - I think you can work with it really well.
"No DVD/CD/Blu-ray -drive." If you work with them or your clients wants the stuff on them, you can easily afford an usb 3.0 blu-ray drive. It's just one cable, which you can easily tape to your desk that you can't see it. You can still burn the discs, even thought the drives ain't internal. How does the iMac users work? With external drives. And todays, it's better, faster and sometimes even cheaper to buy usb 3.0 Blu-ray drive for the new Mac Pro, than a Sata II drive for the older Mac Pro.
This is like, if you are really going to buy it, you most certainly have enough money to buy an external TB HDD system, you most certainly have enough money to buy external PCIe cases. And if you really need more graphic power, you really can afford some extra cash for external PCIe place.
You talk about the price too high, but if you can't afford it, buy something else. If you have no enough money for it or/and the externals, think really, do you need it - was it then external or internal, it still costs almost the same.
