Apple Offers Sneak Peek of Completely Redesigned Mac Pro

[milo]

I agree, calling it overpriced is just declaring an opinion, it is indeed a subjective term.

It's not even an opinion, it's a knee jerk reaction. Having the opinion that it's overpriced requires knowing the specs and the cost. Declaring that without knowing either is like saying your food is too salty before the waiter even brings it to the table.

It would be trivial to simply not install the second GPU board.

We have no idea what will be standard

The announcement made it sound like dual GPU is standard. Which models of GPU and CPU sounds like there will be user options.

 

[Digital Skunk]

It's not even an opinion, it's a knee jerk reaction. Having the opinion that it's overpriced requires knowing the specs and the cost. Declaring that without knowing either is like saying your food is too salty before the waiter even brings it to the table.

Well, even as a knee jerk reaction, it's still an opinion. Them needing to know the price won't matter. Some will call it overpriced. While some will think the price is right (also an opinion).

Sorry, I am taking the convo off topic. I'll stop splitting hairs.

In the end, I am all too eager to see what Apple prices this thing at. I have my fingers crossed for some really competitive base model pricing.

 

[AidenShaw]

The announcement made it sound like dual GPU is standard. Which models of GPU and CPU sounds like there will be user options.

What do the spec sheets say?



As the title says, this wasn't an "announcement" but instead a "sneak peek".

Apple can do anything.

Apple could even initially only sell 12-core dual FirePro system to drain money from the early adopters, then offer a quad core single Radeon version when sales slow down.

 

[Wicked1]

So you're assuming it's overpriced based on numbers you pulled out of your ass. Thanks for clearing that up.

No based on current model pricing, the base units start a tab bit high for most users.

 

[DeepIn2U]

What do the spec sheets say?



As the title says, this wasn't an "announcement" but instead a "sneak peek".

Apple can do anything.

Apple could even initially only sell 12-core dual FirePro system to drain money from the early adopters, then offer a quad core single Radeon version when sales slow down.

Dude, common man! Stop given Apple bean counters ideas ... please!!!

 

[Arcady]

I suppose you complained when the power mac G3 replaced ADB and other serial ports with USB. Where would we be now if Apple had never made that change?

The Power Mac G3 included an ADB port along with the USB ports. And one of the most popular accessories at the time was a module that turned the modem socket into a serial port. Keyspan also made a lot of money selling USB to serial adapters.

Anyway, now that Apple no longer sells a desktop computer (the mini, imac, and this rounded cube-re-do are not desktops) I think there will be a nice market for third parties to make cases again, just like Marathon did in the G3 and G4 days, and what others are doing for the mini now.

And this is why I will probably continue with a Hackintosh, as much of a pain as it is, because I want drive bays, PCIe slots, and the ability to build a useful computer that is not made up of 3-5 external boxes. Or I'll buy a mac pro and hide it inside a standard tower case, using thunderbolt to PCIe.

 

[MiddleB]

I like the idea of linking them together and retaining the Prosumer cool factor

Something where I don't need to throw my old one out and can distribute some of the processing.
Also, how about a more mainstream version with i7 and Titan/Equivalent graphics?

 

[AidenShaw]

Something where I don't need to throw my old one out and can distribute some of the processing.

Also, how about a more mainstream version with i7 and Titan/Equivalent graphics?

The Itube does have some interesting possibilities for optional configurations - but Apple only highlighted the top-of-the-line at MacWorld SF Summer '13.

Certainly one should expect models with fewer than 12 cores - that's just obvious.

It's also obvious that dual GPUs should be optional - lesser models with a single GPU, and less than FirePro 9000 CPUs for certain. (The single GPU models might only have a pair of T-Bolt ports - OK.)

The single GPU model could even route PCIe 3.0 x16 out via a "PCIe External" port - the people who want high bandwidth I/O might be very happy with that option.

And Nvidia graphics options would definitely be a good thing.

I like the idea of linking them together and retaining the Prosumer cool factor

But they have nothing better than Gigabit Ethernet for linking together. Why bother with a special rig when a Cat6 cable gives you all the same advantages - and is cheaper and more flexible (double entendre intended).




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Apple could even initially only sell 12-core dual FirePro system to drain money from the early adopters, then offer a quad core single Radeon version when sales slow down.

Dude, common man! Stop given Apple bean counters ideas ... please!!!

The bean counters had that idea long ago - why do you think that a system that's probably a minimum of $6K to $10K was the only one shown at MacWorld SF Summer '13?

 

[Digital Skunk]

The Itube does have some interesting possibilities for optional configurations - but Apple only highlighted the top-of-the-line at MacWorld SF Summer '13.

Certainly one should expect models with fewer than 12 cores - that's just obvious.

It's also obvious that dual GPUs should be optional - lesser models with a single GPU, and less than FirePro 9000 CPUs for certain. (The single GPU models might only have a pair of T-Bolt ports - OK.)

The single GPU model could even route PCIe 3.0 x16 out via a "PCIe External" port - the people who want high bandwidth I/O might be very happy with that option.

And Nvidia graphics options would definitely be a good thing.

That all sounds good, but are you really suggesting that Apple is going to give folks options?

I see them giving users a dual GPU option with less cards or a decreased amount of GFX RAM, but not a single card BTO. Definitely not if that means a decrease in the amount of TBolt ports. If Apple has to refab a MacPro tube to remove four ports, then it won't happen.

Now, a quad care dual GPU model, sure. A model with Nvidia cards? Very welcomed. A model with dual CPUs and a single GPU, or a single GPU/CPU case . . . . . I have a feeling it won't be so.

 

[AidenShaw]

That all sounds good, but are you really suggesting that Apple is going to give folks options?

I see them giving users a dual GPU option with less cards or a decreased amount of GFX RAM, but not a single card BTO. Definitely not if that means a decrease in the amount of TBolt ports. If Apple has to refab a MacPro tube to remove four ports, then it won't happen.

Now, a quad care dual GPU model, sure. A model with Nvidia cards? Very welcomed. A model with dual CPUs and a single GPU, or a single GPU/CPU case . . . . . I have a feeling it won't be so.

The port connectors are on the power supply / port part that is screwed into the gap between the memory cards.

Trivial to screw a two port assembly into that space.

That all sounds good, but are you really suggesting that Apple is going to give folks options?

I'm surprised that they didn't invent a pento-octolobular screw to make it impossible for users to remove the "can".

 

[Digital Skunk]

The port connectors are on the power supply / port part that is screwed into the gap between the memory cards.

Trivial to screw a two port assembly into that space.
I'm surprised that they didn't invent a pento-octolobular screw to make it impossible for users to remove the "can".

That's why I love you Aiden, you spot the fine details.

And I am REALLY surprised they let us upgrade the RAM. When I saw the size, I though Apple went totally bonkers and made a MacMini Air Pro that had to be totally configured at order.

 

[milo]

I'd be shocked if they shipped a version with only two TB ports (assuming that that's the real reason they have to have dual GPU on the box). The TB ports are the whole selling point and the whole justification of removing PCI slots.

While anything is possible in theory, I'll eat my hat if they release a version with fewer TB (unless it's a really cheap low end version added in a future update). They are sure making it sound like dual GPU is standard as well (again, at least in the first generation of models).

 

[MagnusVonMagnum]

I'd be shocked if they shipped a version with only two TB ports (assuming that that's the real reason they have to have dual GPU on the box). The TB ports are the whole selling point and the whole justification of removing PCI slots.

While anything is possible in theory, I'll eat my hat if they release a version with fewer TB (unless it's a really cheap low end version added in a future update). They are sure making it sound like dual GPU is standard as well (again, at least in the first generation of models).

Make TB about 8x faster and you'll have a winner. Otherwise, they should have kept a PCI backplane option, IMO for those that need REAL speed. This is something that should have been the next Mac Mini instead (minus a few high-end options like the GPU, etc.)

 

[milo]

That's nice, but completely unrelated to my post.

 

[AidenShaw]

I'd be shocked if they shipped a version with only two TB ports (assuming that that's the real reason they have to have dual GPU on the box). The TB ports are the whole selling point and the whole justification of removing PCI slots.

While anything is possible in theory, I'll eat my hat if they release a version with fewer TB (unless it's a really cheap low end version added in a future update). They are sure making it sound like dual GPU is standard as well (again, at least in the first generation of models).

Not if you're upgrading from a MiniMac - which is what this system really is.

It's a huge enhancement to the Mini - but in almost all respects a huge downgrade from a Mac Pro.

And a quad core, single GPU, dual T-Bolt 2 system would still be a big enhancement from a MiniMac.

 

[narbalek]

I'll eat my hat if they release a version with fewer TB.

If it does work out that way make sure you've got a really tasty variety of tomato sauce in the fridge.

 

[whooleytoo]

Hmmm, I don't know. A single GPU option would (could/should) be cheaper, and run cooler, and probably is trivial to engineer.

But I think now dual GPUs have become a 'banner feature' of the new Pro. I think Apple likes the idea of Macs as fixed-feature appliances that developers can code for in confidence, rather than having optional features that users might not go for, leaving developers with the decision of whether it's worth the cost to develop/optimise for.

 

[Digital Skunk]

Hmmm, I don't know. A single GPU option would (could/should) be cheaper, and run cooler, and probably is trivial to engineer.

But I think now dual GPUs have become a 'banner feature' of the new Pro. I think Apple likes the idea of Macs as fixed-feature appliances that developers can code for in confidence, rather than having optional features that users might not go for, leaving developers with the decision of whether it's worth the cost to develop/optimise for.

I think you're right. It seems Apple wants to make more of it's pro-level devices similar to it's iDevices then. Where they build the machines to ease developer issues, rather than easing end user issues.

 

[milo]

It's a huge enhancement to the Mini - but in almost all respects a huge downgrade from a Mac Pro.

My point is that they wouldn't sell one with only two TB ports. And I'm saying that for Apple, the ports are a big selling point and a justification for not including PCIe busses - whether customers agree with that or not is another story.

And it is an upgrade in some respects and a downgrade in others. It really depends on the user and what they need. Right now there are certainly some users who have been buying the current MP because they need speed that none of the other machines offer, and leave most or all of the internal expansion unused. We don't know how many users take advantage of internal expansion, if Apple has reason to believe that relatively few did, that's their reasoning for the design. In short, for a given user, it's not a downgrade if they remove a feature you would never use. And of course, price is always an issue - if they manage to make these new ones cheap enough for what they offer, some of those complaining the loudest now will hold their noses and buy one.

I think Apple likes the idea of Macs as fixed-feature appliances that developers can code for in confidence, rather than having optional features that users might not go for, leaving developers with the decision of whether it's worth the cost to develop/optimise for.

Excellent point, I can totally see a scenario in which they offer more machines with beefed up GPU power at the same time they try and push developers to use more openGL and openCL. I'm hoping the long delay for Logic 10 is because they had the team recode to do audio processing on the GPUs.

 

[H2SO4]

Where do I plug in my iDevice?

 

[Digital Skunk]

Where do I plug in my iDevice?

You have to reach around the back, or spend $999 on a hub/display combo.

 

[milo]

You have to reach around the back, or spend $999 on a hub/display combo.

Or plug into the open USB port on a wired keyboard. Or sync wirelessly.

 

[narbalek]

I think Apple likes the idea of Macs as fixed-feature appliances

If people consider the original Mac through the Mac 128K, the Mac Plus, the SE, the SE/30 -- then jump to the fruit-coloured iMacs and so forth it becomes apparent they've held this view for as long as SJ was in charge of the company and while his design legacy holds.

 

[Digital Skunk]

Or plug into the open USB port on a wired keyboard. Or sync wirelessly.

Don't worry, I said it in jest.

Besides, the keyboard's USB ports are low power, and don't always work with iDevices or thumb drives.

 

[clibinarius]

No, but many professionals move their machines around and even travel with them. Look online and you'll see many banged up mac pro's. I hope it's not plastic but it looks it.

Depending on the grade, plastic can be much sturdier than metal. Most of us are accustomed to cheap plastic, but some of us have used very high quality stuff in bikes, or even airplanes to know better.

If it is really going to cost $3000 and contains plastic, if it is the same stuff a bike is made out of, that'll be far superior to metal for many applications.