Proof that such a brain drain ever occurred?...
Anything can sound dramatic when you are allowed to just make **** up.
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Apple Orders Entire Supply of TSMC's 3nm Chips for iPhone 15 Pro and M3 Macs
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Anything can sound dramatic when you are allowed to just make **** up.
Tim Cook's Apple delivers us the best technology and all you can do is dish up hate and complaints.
Thank you Tim Cook's Apple for working your apple off for us! And TSMC for being an industry leader! I wonder how much Apple's own engineers contributes to TSMC's success rate?
I don't hear much about AMD. Where do they stand with this nanometer downscaling?
It's also great news for the environment. Less energy needed to power our devices.
They're secured the ENTIRE supply? That's nuts. I was about to say, "So, this means that AMD isn't going to get in on the action?" But then I remembered they just launched their 7000 series which I believe is on 5nm, so that makes sense.
Can someone enlighten me on this: I recall seeing someone say something along the lines of TSMC's N3 process not being a "true" 3nm process. Am I taking crazy pills or is there an explanation to that?
Can someone enlighten me on this: I recall seeing someone say something along the lines of TSMC's N3 process not being a "true" 3nm process. Am I taking crazy pills or is there an explanation to that?
Lol for profit companies can still absorb costs if they want to. Microsoft lose money on every Xbox and the first one was a net loss.
Apple moving the 3nm might be at a loss at first and they’ll absorb the cost until manufacturing prices come down.
Yes, I didn't want to get into the FinFlex stuff, it seems like almost nobody is taking the time to understand the basics, and FF confuses matters even more. FF2-1 is effectively extremely close to N3B, and somewhat cheaper, which is why nobody is going to N3B except Apple - they're willing to wait another 6-9 months to get better pricing for roughly equivalent characteristics, plus the option of making tradeoffs between P, P & A due to FF.
Note that your "prices will be lower" is true so far as it goes. However, if I remember this right, if you're doing FF3-2, your area advantage over N5 is down to <20%, at which point your costs are *higher* per transistor than N5 as the price is about +1/3 per wafer. And that's assuming your yield is as good as on N5.
One thing I don't know - how hard is it to port a design from N3 to N3E using FF2-1? One generation of A processors was made on both TSMC and Samsung; if they were willing to do that, then they might be willing to port A17 from N3 to N3E midstream... maybe. I have no insight into how this would compare.
I forget who told me, but TSMC outcompeted Intel and AMD, not Apple. Apple is winning by buying up all the supply of TSMC's latest, most advanced chips.
Same here. I ain’t looking at Macs no more. These M2 Max systems are zippy. And I mean there are zero hiccups.
I can’t wait for the M3 macs so I can pick up a used M2 Mac! Good times we live in!
So you’re complaining that they are in the catbird seat vs their biggest competitor due to extremely good planning and also that they turn a profit for the goods and services they bring to market? Did you take classes at the Packard Bell School of Business at Zenith Data Systems University?
Jony Ive would have done that. Not the new guard. They would never give up the chance to say “the phone now lasts two days” or whatever it ends up being.
Apple to announce (and possibly release) the ASi Mac Pro with M3 Ultra & M3 Extreme SoCs (using the N3B process) at WWDC 2023...
I hope they don't waste the first batch of 3nm chips on something like VR goggles... Not something I see myself using anytime soon.
Most recent reports state that TSMC's N3 wafer production is 45,000 per month till end of 2023. With Mac sales at approximately 25 million units per year, I highly doubt Mac sales till the end of year can absorb that much wafer capacity. I actually wouldn't be surprised if this year's entire N3 production will go to the iPhone 15 Pro series and we see the first M3 Macs beginning Spring 2024.
its a pretty significant update, both in terms of performance and battery, m2 series is pretty incremental compare to the m1 since it uses the same 5nm node.
new recruits also need to be trained up and brought up to speed, i got the short end of the stick and had to train up 2 new recruits beginning of this year, the time and effort taken away from my regular schedule so much so, that my tasks got delayed.
What estimates are using for the number of chips/wafer for the various M3 Mac chips and the iPhone 15 chips?
If they're really hitting 45k right now, or any time in the next six months, then you're right. All the Macs and all the VR units (and even, all the pure-GPU chips they might be making) wouldn't soak up all that capacity.
It doesn't really matter... if you got 50 dice off a wafer, that would be more than enough. They're definitely getting more than that.
Even assuming a Mac Pro uses 4-8 dies, total consumption is too small.There is still one wildcard here... if they make A17s on *both* N3 and N3E, my scenario still has legs. As I mentioned earlier, though, I don't know how reasonable that is. They did dual designs at least once or twice before (for TSMC and Samsung, for at least the A9 I think), but I'm not sure if the situation is at all analogous.
My M1 Max will probably still be way more than "adequate" (and by that I mean still super fast) when the M3 comes to the MBP but I look forward to splurging on an M3 Max anyway because I have no self control 😆
Honestly though, if you want the "big increase" this is probably going to be it.
Honestly though, if you want the "big increase" this is probably going to be it.
They said production would started late Dec, and would gradually ramp up to 45k/mo in March. So (assuming DigiTimes is right, which it's usually not) let's do a back-of-the-envelope calculation and say 5k Dec., 15k Jan, 30k Feb, 45k thereafter. Further suppose that it takes 1 month between when a chip is produced and it appears in a sold product (no idea, just guessing). At 50 chips/wafer, that's 23M chips available for products sold through the end of 2023. If we assume 250 chips/wafer at 75% yield, that's 85M chips. The number of chips/wafer for the iPhone 15 chip is probably significantly higher.If they're really hitting 45k right now, or any time in the next six months, then you're right. All the Macs and all the VR units (and even, all the pure-GPU chips they might be making) wouldn't soak up all that capacity.
It doesn't really matter... if you got 50 dice off a wafer, that would be more than enough. They're definitely getting more than that.
There is still one wildcard here... if they make A17s on *both* N3 and N3E, my scenario still has legs. As I mentioned earlier, though, I don't know how reasonable that is. They did dual designs at least once or twice before (for TSMC and Samsung, for at least the A9 I think), but I'm not sure if the situation is at all analogous.
I don't know the actual sales volume, but expected sales figures for the iPhone 14 Pro/Max's in Q4 2022 was 85M. Let's assume it's roughly 100M for the iPhone 15 Pro/Max's in Q4 2023, since it goes up every year.
Given this, it seems you'd need a much more specific calculation that accounts for the expected iPhone 15 Pro/Max die size, as well as the die sizes for the M3 chips, to determine this volume of wafers would be enough to cover both the iPhone and the Macs.
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Wouldn’t the most urgent use for this be in the VR headset?!? I mean, isn’t this like, pivotal for minimizing some of the issues inherent in that device? And they wouldn’t need as many for that as they would for their other offerings. I would think that would be destination numero uno for the chip.
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