Apple Outlines New Ban on Bonded Labor at Supplier Factories in 2015 Progress Report

[H2SO4]

You'd also be paying 5x the $$ you do now for your Apple products.

Well maybe after supplier responsibility comes buyer responsibility?
We could choose to buy goods that we can for the most part verify were ethically produced, I suspect we won’t. I’m no different by the way but I don’t make a song and dance about it like Apple do.

 

[DanGoh]

My biggest critique of Apple is them not opening factories here in the US. Yes, it would cost more, but it would be the right thing to do. Morals > Money.

 

[the8thark]

Well maybe after supplier responsibility comes buyer responsibility?
We could choose to buy goods that we can for the most part verify were ethically produced, I suspect we won’t. I’m no different by the way but I don’t make a song and dance about it like Apple do.

I agree. But for many people it's at the current prices or no Apple product for them. Many people can not afford to buy local (or ethically produced) in this example we are using. What you say is very admirable but not possible for many people.

I do buy Australian where I can (as I am Australian). But that's not always possible if the local product is much too expensive.

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My biggest critique of Apple is them not opening factories here in the US. Yes, it would cost more, but it would be the right thing to do. Morals > Money.

Cost more = a lot less Apple products sold as many people can't afford that price increase.

 

[Jsameds]

Wow so many people here that can't seem to grasp the concept of 'cultural differences'

 

[Keirasplace]

My biggest critique of Apple is them not opening factories here in the US. Yes, it would cost more, but it would be the right thing to do. Morals > Money.

Because depriving 300-500K people of decent jobs abroad IS off course the moral thing to do... (sic). Let the others be immoral and give jobs to those "furiniers" (sic) and let Apple sell more expensive products and make less money...

We'll applaud them of course... And then buy the $200 less expensive product from the competition, while Apple collects its 10% profit (instead of 40%) and slowly is strangled into oblivion because its incapable to get the labor it needs in the places it wants at a decent cost and can't invest in new products because it lacks money.

Or, are you "saving" those poor Chinese workers, by giving american workers proportionally worse wages to American workers! Mighty good of you there.

Cultural and global myopia. Apple is no longer just a US company BTW.

 

[Mr Fusion]

You don't see Microsoft, Amazon or Sony, who are current and past customers of Foxconn, actively working to make these contractors lift their game.

I don't see Microsoft, Amazon or Sony on a high horse about supplier responsibility. Apple on the other hand can't seem to laud themselves enough over how they're the best thing to happen to third-world suppliers since the invention of the cotton gin.

Apple got burned for using shady suppliers, in some cases because those are the only ways to obtain certain commodities. It might be unfair, but it's also not untrue. If they want to change the world for the better, do it through the deafening silence of your actions. Not by screaming from the mountain top that I am better than the rest of you.

 

[Keirasplace]

I don't see Microsoft, Amazon or Sony on a high horse about supplier responsibility. Apple on the other hand can't seem to laud themselves enough over how they're the best thing to happen to third-world suppliers since the invention of the cotton gin.

Apple got burned for using shady suppliers, in some cases because those are the only ways to obtain certain commodities. It might be unfair, but it's also not untrue. If they want to change the world for the better, do it through the deafening silence of your actions. Not by screaming from the mountain top that I am better than the rest of you.

So, transparency, which is what they are doing, is screaming? You do realize that when they issue this report, they are then held to account about what they say, unlike well all others, who say nothing at all. How can a tech company be accountable if it doesn't promise anything?

 

[sickducker]

I don't see Microsoft, Amazon or Sony on a high horse about supplier responsibility. Apple on the other hand can't seem to laud themselves enough over how they're the best thing to happen to third-world suppliers since the invention of the cotton gin.

Apple got burned for using shady suppliers, in some cases because those are the only ways to obtain certain commodities. It might be unfair, but it's also not untrue. If they want to change the world for the better, do it through the deafening silence of your actions. Not by screaming from the mountain top that I am better than the rest of you.

If Microsoft, Amazon or Sony did something similar as Apple, wouldn't they scream it off the roofs too? Buy any organic product and good working conditions are one the first things they market and I think that is a good thing, because fair products have become more popular.

I'm not saying Apple is there yet, but at least they're pushing the industrie in the right direction and hopefully other companies will follow and go further.

 

[A.Goldberg]

I have a legitimate question. I don't want to sound insensitive because that is not my intention. In general, do child laborers work because someone forces them into working or do they get the job to earn an income considering they don't have many other future opportunities? Are there currently laws regarding underage employment in China? Or are ineligible workers able to manipulate their age and employers turn a blind eye?

I'm glad to see Apple is doing what they can to mandate the better working conditions for their manufacturers' employees. It's quite a world we live in when the customer (Apple), must dictate the companies (manufactures- separate entities) how to hire and manage their employees. The standard the world has set for these people is quite unfortunate.

 

[numlock]

Yeah, they can dictate a bit. But they can only do it so much, and the wages that most people here would want them to dictate are likely to get ä laugh com Foxconn.

please explain the limitations of the influence of the worlds most valuable company (or even a ms, google, amazon etc) on suppliers?

ive gone through most of these threads and cant recall many mentions of specific wages.

a company that plans to change the way we live our lives through a watch is limited in its power. its amazing

Because news outlets like the BBC, New York Times etc. are just relaying the facts and have no agenda. BS.

you are bordering on troll like with these comments (same with your repetitive "did apple say photos would be a aperture replacement"). you are corrected multiple times and you persist. seriously whats the deal?

 

[Menopause]

Yep. Guy armed with AK47 off-camera... "smile for the camera!"

AHAHAHA good one!

 

[Michaelgtrusa]

These are just words, but we'll never see action.

 

[FieldingMellish]

Apple has become a government in its own right when you read about the resources it has and can spend on.

 

[MonkeySee....]

This thread is hilarious and not in a good way.

Bravo everyone.

 

[Jsameds]

These are just words, but we'll never see action.

We've already seen action taken akin to the words stated here, when Apple forced suppliers to improve working conditions and increase pay back in 2010.

 

[SPUY767]

As all companies should be doing, bravo Apple. Obviously there is still much to be done, but I'm glad they are stepping up.

Don't worry, we will still only hear Apple referenced when new stories about poor working conditions come across the wire.

 

[gnasher729]

Apple spends many billions on ridiculous solar farms but can't pay the workers a living wage in other countries.

Excuse me, but could you give an example where Apple doesn't pay Apple employees a living wage in other countries? Or an example where contractors supplying Apple don't pay a living wage?

And when I say "an example", I'd want to be told what people working for Apple make, and what the average worker in that part of the world makes.

These are just words, but we'll never see action.

What about $20 million paid back to 30,000 foreign workers who were forced to pay excessive charges to agencies to get a job? Is that no action? Or every single underage worker found in the last year being sent back to school, with the employer paying both for the school _and_ the wages _and_ having to offer them a job when they leave school?

I have a legitimate question. I don't want to sound insensitive because that is not my intention. In general, do child laborers work because someone forces them into working or do they get the job to earn an income considering they don't have many other future opportunities? Are there currently laws regarding underage employment in China? Or are ineligible workers able to manipulate their age and employers turn a blind eye?

You could read the PDF file that the article links to. It turns out that hiring someone under 16 is not good business for the company. It is expensive when it's found and Apple usually finds out. In the past, the numbers were often something like 20 underage kids found distributed over a dozen places, and one place with 50 underage employees, so a dozen places where honest mistakes were made, and one place where they intentionally turned a blind eye. The obvious result was that the one company changed from "contractor" to "ex-contractor".

If you haven't been following the new on Apple's suppliers.....

https://www.macrumors.com/2014/12/15/bbc-one-apples-broken-promises/

I watched it and yes, Apple is hypocritical. So it will be very interesting to see if things change.

And if you actually read Apple's report, you would see that for example what they are doing in Indonesia is actually _helping_ the people there. The BBC reported about ****** working and living conditions in Indonesia. Apple says: We could stop reports like that BBC report by buying somewhere else (and letting people in Indonesia starve; they don't say that but that's the implication). That's simple, stops the bad press, and is awful for the people affected. Instead, we do it the hard way and try to improve conditions for the people there.

Well this is hypocritical IMO... I await to see what the documentary makers secretly film in the factories later in the year.

It's not as if American journalists (or actors) haven't been found blatantly lying and making up stores about people working for Apple in the past. Like one guy who _swore_ that he saw hundreds of underage factory workers at Foxconn, including 12 year olds, and interviewed many of them - and had to admit it was all made up.

"Bonded labor" sure is a nice euphemism for what the United Nations calls "slave labor", and one of the reasons people should be careful about where they purchase chocolate from too.

No, it's not "slave labor". It is about people having to pay money to an employment agency to get a job, usually going into debt, and having to pay that money off before they can leave. In the USA, employment agencies will try to make you sign contracts that prevent you from working somewhere else, that's the same kind of "bonded labor". So really what you are doing when Apple says "we stop bonded labor", you make a claim that Apple has been using slave labour and show how awful it is - even though Apple hasn't done anything like that. Very dishonest.

 

[ephemeralreason]

If we didn't have a minimum wage in the USA and more open markets such as deregulated health care, these units would be built by American high school and college kids getting great industry experience.

If we didn't have a minimum wage, many more families would live in abject poverty and college, even high school wouldn't be an option for many kids: they'd have to work 60 hours per week over 6 days simply to ensure their family's survival.

 

[Rogifan]

you are bordering on troll like with these comments (same with your repetitive "did apple say photos would be a aperture replacement"). you are corrected multiple times and you persist. seriously whats the deal?

Sorry I would never trust BBC or New York Times to do honest reporting here. if you want to call me a troll for says that, fine I couldn't care less.

 

[cocky jeremy]

Apple spends many billions on ridiculous solar farms but can't pay the workers a living wage in other countries.

One thing Apple is not is a humanitarian company which is why they spend a lot of time trying to tell everything they are.

You would think that Apple could use that money they spend on solar farms to help pay better wages and provide EXCEPTIONAL working conditions. After all, it is these folks that are the bread and butter of Apple.

I am sure I will get bashed, but unfortunately as much as I love Apple products, this is the sad truth.

Apple doesn't pay the workers that make their products. It isn't their job to pay them. They pay their own workers well, so you have no argument.

 

[kdarling]

My biggest critique of Apple is them not opening factories here in the US. Yes, it would cost more, but it would be the right thing to do. Morals > Money.

Isn't the Mac Pro made in Austin now?

You'd also be paying 5x the $$ you do now for your Apple products.

Motorola said it only cost them an extra $4 a unit to assemble the Moto X in their US factory. And a lot of those were custom builds.

I have a legitimate question. I don't want to sound insensitive because that is not my intention. In general, do child laborers work because someone forces them into working or do they get the job to earn an income considering they don't have many other future opportunities?

Underage workers are there on their own. And not just in China.

One of the problems Samsung had with their own local suppliers was that many teenage Korean girls pay to get fake ids in order to work at factories over the summer months. To the girls, it's highly desirable and gives them a leg up for jobs when they graduate.

If Microsoft, Amazon or Sony did something similar as Apple, wouldn't they scream it off the roofs too?

It'd probably be similar to the way Apple brags about Red products, while other companies like Samsung are doing so much more: supplying solar powered schools in Africa, giving to local United Ways all over the US, working with other companies to provide training and materials for the underprivileged, etc.

Heck, I just read that Samsung has a factory in Korea that was totally built around, and manned by, wheelchair bound employees. That's pretty cool.

I think Apple would brag loudly about those things. Other companies just quietly do them.

I'm not saying Apple is there yet, but at least they're pushing the industrie in the right direction and hopefully other companies will follow and go further.

Other companies already do.

For instance, instead of just trying ban underage employees at their suppliers, and using occasional audits that are hardly a surprise, Samsung paid to install facial recognition devices at the entrances to those non-Samsung factories, to try to stop kids from sneaking in.

Another big example is the Conflict Minerals reports. First off, they're mandated in the US, not voluntary. And companies belong to a group:

The Conflict Free Sourcing Initiative (CFSI) is sponsored by a group of 150+ major companies (including Apple, Samsung, Motorola, HTC, LG, even AT&T, Sprint and Verizon).

Apple writes their press releases to make it sound like they did all the checking themselves, but CFSI is the "third party" that audits all the smelters, comes up with the lists, etc... and they do so for all their members.

 

[cocky jeremy]

My biggest critique of Apple is them not opening factories here in the US. Yes, it would cost more, but it would be the right thing to do. Morals > Money.

How is it "moral" to bring the jobs here? Whatever jobs are gained here are lost somewhere else.

 

[JHankwitz]

Ehhhhh.
These poor souls are being exploited.

This is far better than the norm in China, and it's these contractors that manage and control the norm. Contractors are driven by the market, and the market is driven by consumers like you and me. Every time you buy something from Walmart, you're voting for contractors to exploit their people more.

 

[JHankwitz]

And unreasonably high wages, particularly in the more advanced skilled trades, such as doctors, dentists and lawyers.

So, why didn't you choose to become a doctor, dentist, or lawyer? BTW, I have several lawyer and doctor friends, and most of them are having problems trying to make a living at it. A close relative (doctor) recently had to cshut down his practice and get a desk job because he could no longer support his practice on what Obama Care pays. He's now able to support himself and family with his new desk job.

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Well maybe after supplier responsibility comes buyer responsibility?
We could choose to buy goods that we can for the most part verify were ethically produced, I suspect we won’t. I’m no different by the way but I don’t make a song and dance about it like Apple do.

Walmart is the biggest store in the USA because we, the customer, have voted with our wallets for them to purchase their products from sweatshops.

 

[linuxcooldude]

It's not as if American journalists (or actors) haven't been found blatantly lying and making up stores about people working for Apple in the past. Like one guy who _swore_ that he saw hundreds of underage factory workers at Foxconn, including 12 year olds, and interviewed many of them - and had to admit it was all made up.

Ah, I remember that well. Mike Daisy was his name. A lot of his story was made up, a fabrication. Another journalist checked his sources that proved to be false. In fact he did go to China to Foxconn factories. In one instance he made up the story where an old man whos mangled hand ( Supposedly from an industrial accident inside Foxconn ) who never touched a working iPad.