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Apple Patent Provides Peek at Snow Leopard Technologies

pmw said:
Anyone care to explain for us mortals what the hell that wall of text means?
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this ideia is old as my shoes. I remember one great coder tell me about it in 99 to improve brute force algos. What means? That apple want to patent every aspect of what is already been done by institutions and universities...They will modify the kernel to allow the scheduler of the os run simultanepus pieces of code on gpus and cpus.since gpus allow fast data array manipulation you can count that every app who needs to concorrently alocate or process data will benefit from this tech
 
I would imagine they would build in backwards compatibility? They've done it before, so I could see them doing it so as not to "break" old apps.
 
minijon said:
I would imagine they would build in backwards compatibility? They've done it before, so I could see them doing it so as not to "break" old apps.
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I think you'll see a drop of PPC support, it has to happen sooner of later. Current universal and Intel-specific apps should be unaffected.
 
I'm kind of surprised the article didn't mention Grand Central since this patent seems to describe the basis on how Grand Central will operate.

As suspected, Grand Central doesn't seem to miraculously enable all current programs to be multi-threaded and GPU compatible. Programs will likely need to be recompiled and probably optimized to operate under Grand Central. The most important component of the recompilation seems to be to take advantage of Just-in-Time compilation so code can be optimized at runtime depending on the number of cores or GPUs available. JIT compilation through LLVM-GCC has already be introduced in XCode 3.1. Hopefully Apple has been strongly pressuring developers to start moving their code over to LLVM-GCC now before Snow Leopard is released, otherwise we'll have another event like Carbon64 where developers complain that it's too late in their development cycle to make big changes.

It's kind of interesting that Microsoft is trying to move developers over from the Win32 API to the .NET Framework which I believe is more Cocoa like then Win32. Now Apple is moving toward JIT compilation which is a feature of .NET. It's nice to know people are feeding off each other.
 
All right, that's what I meant. I was referring to previous posts that had complained that 10.6 would "break" current apps. The thing is, this seems like a much bigger switch-over than previous versions, but if they build in backwards compatibility, I don't think we'll see the bugs like Tiger>Leopard, because the new stuff will be on a new framework/architecture (ie, "optimized"). I just wonder how long it will take for developers to actually optimize the software for SL -- Will it be the "two weeks" or whatever it was for "carbonization" or will it be longer?
 
BornAgainMac said:
I wonder if Windows 7 users will have anything like this? Windows 7 going to be Snow Vista or just a name change and some minor new icon / color tweaks?
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And a lot of advertising ... don't forget the advertising.

"Buy Microsoft's new SnowJob OS and we'll promise that Bill Gates won't make any more epic commercials, ever."
 
Great news!

Maybe Logic will finally be able to take full advantage of both my MBP cores. As it stands now, it almost always craps out with one core maxed while the other is sitting idle.
 
Ade-iMac-177 said:
Is Snow Leopard basically a complete rewrite of the whole thing?? if so i find it amazing that people are saying they won't pay full price when it is released
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Snow Leopard is not a complete rewrite of Mac OS X. If it was, it'd be marketed as Mac OS 11. It's just doing some low-level rewrites with the kernel to introduce technologies such as hardware accelerated graphics, for example. And of course Snow Leopard will cost money, most likely the usual $129.

Collin973 said:
agreed. i will NEVER use vista on a laptop. I have it running on a decent desktop at home and it's doing fine. there are some settings and stuff that are hard to find but it's fairly stable and run office 2007.

i love my macbook pro and i have vista via bootcamp. it's ok, but no two finger scrolling in vista on any laptop means i will buy macs for the rest of my life.
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I don't know why you'll never use Vista on a laptop, it works just fine. Just like Mac OS X, you can completely configure various battery power schemes whether you prefer more performance or bettery battery life.

Also, Apple is not the only laptop manufacturer to have two-finger scrolling. There are a few Sony Vaio models that can do this, as well.

kjs862 said:
Sounds like Snow Leopard is going to be a big deal to me.
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I think it is. It may not have any major end-user features, but hardware optimization is far more important, at least to me.

BornAgainMac said:
I wonder if Windows 7 users will have anything like this? Windows 7 going to be Snow Vista or just a name change and some minor new icon / color tweaks?
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Windows 7 is going to be an improved build of Vista, very similar to Windows 98. Remember how Windows 98 had the look and feel of Windows 95 but fixed those annoying bugs and quirks? That's what Windows 7 will be like.

Also, Windows Vista already introduced hardware accelerated graphics, for example, with DWM, or the Desktop Window Manager, into the Aero Glass user interface. So, actually, Windows is already ahead of Mac OS X in this area, and Apple will again be playing catch-up.

demiphonic said:
does anyone remember the amazing stuff that was SUPPOSED to go into Vista? Now it's just a shell of what it should have been & even the stuff we're left with doesn't work right. Took them 10 years to make that crap. Now 'Windoze 7' / ("Snow Vista" lol) supposed to be out soon? Honestly I don't think they will do anything good with that. & even if it is as stable as XP with some eye candy, it will not be close to Snow Leopard.

The new version of Windows should be "Eyesore" :p

but Honestly... wouldn't it blow your mind if they made something better than XP this time around? :eek: Good thing apple is always working so I have faith they will still beat the pants of em' even if MS makes a decent OS ;)
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You are comparing Windows 7 and Snow Leopard, neither of which have yet to be released, nor have any major feature sets been announced.

As for Vista, development started in 2001, so it's only been seven year, not the ten years you imply. And due to an over-ambitious roadmap and to make Vista more secure, development was re-started in 2004 to build the kernel on Windows Server 2003 instead of Windows XP. So, technically speaking, Windows Vista started development in late 2004.

And again, Snow Leopard is to Leopard what Windows 7 will be to Windows Vista. Both are evolutionary releases that will fix all those little quirks that are in both current OS.

illian said:
Honestly, what is "wrong" with vista..did you ever use it? I really like os x but i use vista as well and i never had any problems..never!
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There isn't, and never has been, anything wrong with Vista. Like XP, it suffered from some compatibility issues at launch, but then again, so did Leopard. Since SP1, Vista has worked even better, as more applications have been written to work with Vista. The difference between XP and Vista's launch is that in the six year time frame, a large vocal minority of misinformed morons with blogs suddenly became IT professionals at a time when bashing Vista was a trendy thing to do. And it still is, apparently.
 
Quillz said:
Also, Windows Vista already introduced hardware accelerated graphics, for example, with DWM, or the Desktop Window Manager, into the Aero Glass user interface. So, actually, Windows is already ahead of Mac OS X in this area, and Apple will again be playing catch-up.
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I'd put Quartz Compositor and Quartz Extreme ahead of Desktop Window Manager. Vista is a step in the right direct for actually using the GPU for desktop/window rendering.

OS X needs to desperately catch up with using GPU hardware acceleration. Apple was pushing h.264 just after Tiger came out but we're still brute force decoding on our Mac CPUs. :rolleyes:
 
Quillz said:
Also, Windows Vista already introduced hardware accelerated graphics, for example, with DWM, or the Desktop Window Manager, into the Aero Glass user interface. So, actually, Windows is already ahead of Mac OS X in this area, and Apple will again be playing catch-up.
Click to expand...
I'm pretty sure hardware accelerated display manager on GPU allowing for various windowing and transition effects was done by Apple first. With Quartz Extreme being added in 10.2 which was released before XP SP1 was released. Support was expanded with Core Image in 10.4 before Vista came out. I'm pretty sure Core Image is more flexible than Vista's implementation too, since any program can use Core Image and Core Video for hardware accelerated visual processing to manipulate images and video. This is how Aperture and Motion are already GPU accelerated. Adobe CS4 is actually copying Apple since the GPU acceleration used is actually the same way that Apple does it, namely converting images to OpenGL surfaces so that the GPU can process it. This is why the requirements for Adobe GPU acceleration only call for OpenGL 2.0 graphics cards instead of say an nVidia 8xxx series. CUDA is only being used for third-party plug-ins for things such as encoding instead of for Photoshop to say apply filters which is done using the OpenGL method.
 
I wonder if Windows 7 users will have anything like this? Windows 7 going to be Snow Vista or just a name change and some minor new icon / color tweaks?
Click to expand...
Erm no, its just going to be called Windows 7, currently people are debating why MS is calling it as Windows 7 when its going to have a similar UI to Vista, Vista is Windows 6.0 something like dat, so since Win 7 is just like Win Vista SE, it should be like Windows 6.1 or 6.5 rather then a whole new number.

Erm, even though the Aero interface is GPU accelerated, its still freaking slow compared to Apple fancy animations.
 
wheelhot said:
Erm no, its just going to be called Windows 7, currently people are debating why MS is calling it as Windows 7 when its going to have a similar UI to Vista, Vista is Windows 6.0 something like dat, so since Win 7 is just like Win Vista SE, it should be like Windows 6.1 or 6.5 rather then a whole new number.

Erm, even though the Aero interface is GPU accelerated, its still freaking slow compared to Apple fancy animations.
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Again, think of it like Windows 98. Windows 98 looked just like Windows 95, and had more or less the same look and feel, it just fixed some annoying bugs and quirks with Windows 95. That's how Windows 7 will look and feel. Since it's (technically) using kernel revision 6.1/7, that's why it's "Windows 7." As it's going to be an evolutionary release, it will continue to look like Vista. Windows looked the same from 95 -> ME.

As for the hardware acceleration comments, it's your opinion and experience. I've used Aero Glass on very good hardware and it's amazingly fluid and quick, far more so than on my iMac.
 
illian said:
Honestly, what is "wrong" with vista..did you ever use it? I really like os x but i use vista as well and i never had any problems..never!
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He used the term 'Windoze'.

That's web shorthand for 'please ignore my post'

Never had a problem with Vista, but looking forward to Snow Leopard and Windows7 ...

Can't help it; I'm a sucker for anything new and shiny!
 
Quillz said:
Snow Leopard is not a complete rewrite of Mac OS X. If it was, it'd be marketed as Mac OS 11. It's just doing some low-level rewrites with the kernel to introduce technologies such as hardware accelerated graphics, for example. And of course Snow Leopard will cost money, most likely the usual $129.


I don't know why you'll never use Vista on a laptop, it works just fine. Just like Mac OS X, you can completely configure various battery power schemes whether you prefer more performance or bettery battery life.

Also, Apple is not the only laptop manufacturer to have two-finger scrolling. There are a few Sony Vaio models that can do this, as well.


I think it is. It may not have any major end-user features, but hardware optimization is far more important, at least to me.


Windows 7 is going to be an improved build of Vista, very similar to Windows 98. Remember how Windows 98 had the look and feel of Windows 95 but fixed those annoying bugs and quirks? That's what Windows 7 will be like.

Also, Windows Vista already introduced hardware accelerated graphics, for example, with DWM, or the Desktop Window Manager, into the Aero Glass user interface. So, actually, Windows is already ahead of Mac OS X in this area, and Apple will again be playing catch-up.


You are comparing Windows 7 and Snow Leopard, neither of which have yet to be released, nor have any major feature sets been announced.

As for Vista, development started in 2001, so it's only been seven year, not the ten years you imply. And due to an over-ambitious roadmap and to make Vista more secure, development was re-started in 2004 to build the kernel on Windows Server 2003 instead of Windows XP. So, technically speaking, Windows Vista started development in late 2004.

And again, Snow Leopard is to Leopard what Windows 7 will be to Windows Vista. Both are evolutionary releases that will fix all those little quirks that are in both current OS.


There isn't, and never has been, anything wrong with Vista. Like XP, it suffered from some compatibility issues at launch, but then again, so did Leopard. Since SP1, Vista has worked even better, as more applications have been written to work with Vista. The difference between XP and Vista's launch is that in the six year time frame, a large vocal minority of misinformed morons with blogs suddenly became IT professionals at a time when bashing Vista was a trendy thing to do. And it still is, apparently.
Click to expand...

I do get the feeling that folk are getting a little bit weary of the Vista bashing. The more people use it, the more people will discover that its not as bad as they've been lead to believe.

Blog writers will slant their articles in the direction that will get them the most hits. If you slate Microsoft, then thousands of Mac/Linux folk will jump in to agree with you.
If you praise Microsoft, then Windows users will not jump in to agree with you, because to them, a computer is just a tool; not an expression of self-worth. It is just an object to get a job done. But Apple users need to beware; this could so easily shift back to the bad old days of uninformed Mac bashing. What if a blogger discovers that he can get more readers to comment when he bashes Macs, than he does if he praises them? At the end of the day, that is all that matters to these so-called journalists.

As you say, Vista is more or less the 'stepping stone' release. All the pain of change is being carried out here. By the time Windows7 is released, then folk will either have updated their stuff to the new way of doing things, or they will just fall away by the wayside. This will allow MS to focus on tightening up the UI (and it does need it) and getting it all set to support Cloud computing or whatever.

But I think the mistake that MS makes, is not cleaning out enough of the cruft. They do need to worry about backwards compatibility more than Apple, but still ...


An informative post by the way. Thanks for taking the time.
 
can't wait for snow leopard! i think they are making the right decision in not worrying so much on new features, but refining what features they already have
 
Michael73 said:
My impression is OS X is a fairly lightweight OS...more so than Vista certainly.
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In no way, shape, or form, is OS X "lightweight". Certainly no more than Vista - both require multiple CPUs, gigabytes of RAM and decent video cards to perform "well".

I've used just about every Mac, with just about every version of OS X, over the last 8-9 years. The first time I ever thought "this is (finally) fast enough" was with the first multicore Intel machines.
 
openCU - same project name

hello cybercitizens,

after some google-ing, i found out that apple using the name openCU
i choosed for my project for its own "technologie"
would this be a problem for me ?

thanks
 
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