Apple PDA?

[bensisko]

Apple didn't want the Palm...

When Apple was in talks to buy Palm, the reason nothing happened is because Apple (read: Steve) wasn't the least bit interested in the Palm OS or the Palm handheld. Had Apple bought Palm, they would be but a memory, just like the Newton. What Apple wanted, and wanted exclusively, was the HotSync technology (iSync anyone???). How would one touch sync between a Powerbook and a desktop sound? Or a Mac and a phone? Hotsync was what Apple was after. (I imagine they would grab other technologies as well, such as the BeOS components and the Palm VII wireless radio technology).

Another PDA? Unlikely. There's just no room in Apple's line up. A PocketPC type device would compete with both the iPod and the iBook. Anything like a Zire would just disappoint Apple PDA fans, and probably would only sell to Apple people and not scratch the PC market. it would be more likly that a future version of iSync would be compatable with Pocket PC than Apple releasing it's own PDA (even a rebranded Palm).

No mobile Apple fans, I think we'll have to do with the current Apple branded iPod and laptops (perhaps an eBook[laptop for education and extreme low-end]?).

 

[yamabushi]

Are we ever going to see the return of the ultralight Mac laptop? I would like to see a modern replacement for the Powerbook 2400 that has even less weight and bulk than that model.

 

[bensisko]

The Powerbook 12" is 0.2lbs heavier than the 2400 and has a smaller footprint. I guess your wish has been granted. In relation, the Powerbook 12" is the modern 2400. A lighter laptop? Because of Apple's infatuation with metal, I doubt you'll see one with less weight, but it's comparable.

 

[Dreadnought]

For any thirdparty hardware supplier:
Develop a touchscreen that you can plug into the ports of a ipod. Develop the software that you can edit the existing Apple programs on it (addressbook, Ical) and some other stuff (maybe Appleworks?!) And voila, your very own Apple PDA!

What do you guys think? I have been saying it ever since I got my 2g 20Gb Ipod and was hoping somebody developed it, but unfortunately.....

 

[mentalcelerity]

Well, this would be awesome. But if their is no substantial evidence. . . we shouldnt' even be posting this stuff.
I'm thinking if apple does come out with a pda soon, it should be now because i am about ready to get one. . . i'm sure if they do decide to come out with one it'll be in 2003. . . hec, everything else came out this year, it's been one big year from them . . . . if they do make the iPod into a pda, well i bought mine 1 month b4 the new ones came out so that reallly got to me. . .hope it comes out soon

 

[sambouka]

A researcher at Sprint told me that Spring is working with Apple to see how they can combine the iPod with their phone system. Apparently, a lot of R&D is being done from both sides.

 

[bensisko]

That would be the dumbest thing they could do. The iPod's batteries suffer enough without adding yet another power-hungary device onto it. If Apple wants to come out with a Phone, fine. But I hope Steve sticks with his message about no convergence devices.

 

[brainless]

Originally posted by bensisko
The Powerbook 12" is 0.2lbs heavier than the 2400 and has a smaller footprint. I guess your wish has been granted. In relation, the Powerbook 12" is the modern 2400. A lighter laptop? Because of Apple's infatuation with metal, I doubt you'll see one with less weight, but it's comparable.

I think 12'' PB is no longer the leader in the small notebook arena. Check the latest Sony Vaio models : smaller, way lighter with more features (I wouldn't judge the performance). 12'' PB is fine, but Apple can do much better than that. I really want to see a PB without the internal drive and weight around 2 pounds, but this won't be possible with Steve at helm so the only chance to see ultralight from Apple is via iPod route.

 

[brainless]

Originally posted by clonenode
Why will Apple never produce a handheld: you said it above, "It was ideal as a laptop replacement..." Too much profit in selling iBooks.

And with the strength of the iPod as a platform, there is no way they'd release anything that could erode those sales either.

This is bad argument. They have profit selling iBooks and iPod which would be to some extend erode with introduction of iNewton, but now they have zero profit at PDA arena, where mosto of the money go to Palm and PocketPC makers and Apple see no money from it. I believe money from iNewton + less money form iBook and iPod will be still more than money from iBook and iPod alone, even if they have to pay for R&D of iNewton

 

[brainless]

Re: Re: Sony prototype

Originally posted by bensisko
Well, that's not true. There are plenty of people out there who will prefer to stick to a dedicated music device. I think Steve was right on when he said convergence devices are not the way to go. More than likely, the only thing that would really take down the iPod is a iPaq-sized device running Windows XP and 30 hour battery that comes in at under $500, and then only on the Windows side.

That's kinda like saying that the Segway is going to kill car sales.

Well if you may choose from music device and music device of the same quality which is cheaper and have extra phone in it why to choose the first one. I think the optical drive in Sony device might be great advantage, but it has to be seen how it is with battery life etc.

If they can put that tiny optical drive into current P900 phone to serve as cheap mass storage (for instance for music playback among other things), and the price stays around $500, there will be no reason to buy iPod, imho.

 

[Squire]

Re: Re: Re: Sony prototype

Originally posted by brainless
If they can put that tiny optical drive into current P900 phone to serve as cheap mass storage (for instance for music playback among other things), and the price stays around $500, there will be no reason to buy iPod, imho.

Optical drive? Do you mean hard drive? I always thought optical drives were CD/DVD drives.

Squire

 

[bensisko]

Originally posted by brainless
I think 12'' PB is no longer the leader in the small notebook arena. Check the latest Sony Vaio models : smaller, way lighter with more features (I wouldn't judge the performance).

Apple was NEVER the leader with the 12" powerbook. Sony has always had smaller notebooks that were "full-featured."

As for profit taking from a potential device: the iNewton (or whatever) would have to be something truly special for a good majority of people to put down their Palms and Pocket PCs. I think that most people have the handheld OS they like, and it would be really hard to break that. Could Apple do it? Absolutely. I have no doubt they could come up with a device (or devices) that would make PPC and Palm users dump their PDAs in the junk drawer. Is it worth it for Apple to do it? Probably not. It would take an enormous amount of money to make a cheap device that would please enough people to make money at to.

If we see a new device (a BIG if), it won't be a convergence device, it will be simple, yet amazing, but won't be a swiss army knife.

 

[brainless]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Sony prototype

Originally posted by Squire
Optical drive? Do you mean hard drive? I always thought optical drives were CD/DVD drives.

Squire

No when I say optical drive I don't mean hard drive, I mean optical drive. Sony is working on small (1'' or similar) optical removable revritable drive with more than 1 GB of capacity - it was in same article as the info about their new device - sorry I don't have the link right now. Looked like ioMega Click, but it was optical rather than magnetic.

 

[brainless]

Originally posted by bensisko
Apple was NEVER the leader with the 12" powerbook. Sony has always had smaller notebooks that were "full-featured."

As for profit taking from a potential device: the iNewton (or whatever) would have to be something truly special for a good majority of people to put down their Palms and Pocket PCs. I think that most people have the handheld OS they like, and it would be really hard to break that. Could Apple do it? Absolutely. I have no doubt they could come up with a device (or devices) that would make PPC and Palm users dump their PDAs in the junk drawer. Is it worth it for Apple to do it? Probably not. It would take an enormous amount of money to make a cheap device that would please enough people to make money at to.

If we see a new device (a BIG if), it won't be a convergence device, it will be simple, yet amazing, but won't be a swiss army knife.

Well, Steve Jobs said that when he introduced 12'' PowerBook, lightest full featured notebook.
I don't think it will be that difficult for Apple to create better device than either Palm or PocketPC - they already had a superior system in Newton ! I still don't get why they killed the whole thing. If I remember that right, Jobs said the reason for it was current technology (at the time of the Newton kill) can't produce devices that are powerfull enough to provide the services Newton was planned for. So they left the market empty and Palm and PocketPC filled the void with way inferior products. Just reimplementing Newton to current hw would be huge.
While it is nothing more than a rumor now, I am pretty sure Apple will have to enter the arena sooner or later. Thanks to anvances in hw the PDA will become more and more capable to do the chores now typically done on the notebook and substantially reduce the sales of the notebooks. I think once a major HW manufacturer such as IBM, Toshiba or Sony comes with mature product such as OQO (www.oqo.com) or Tiqit (www.tiqit.com), Apple will have to react, even if Jobs will still scream "no apple branded PDA in my life".

 

[bensisko]

Originally posted by brainless
Well, Steve Jobs said that when he introduced 12'' PowerBook, lightest full featured notebook.... I still don't get why they killed the whole thing. If I remember that right, Jobs said the reason for it was current technology ..

Yeah, i'd like to see Steve's reasons for 12" being the smallest.

Anywho, Apple killed the Newton off because they couldn't maintain three platforms (Mac, Server[Rapsody I think], and Newton). Plus, Apple only recouped about 1/4 the cash they put into the Newton. True they probably killed it before it's time, and would have done better with a Pilot sized Newton, however, I just don't think Apple would have kept the Newton up. Anytime there was a buget crunch, Newton would have always been on the chopping block. Personally, I would have liked to see a version of the 2100 with the same size screen, but the device itself isn't much bigger and about a half an inch thin.

 

[Squire]

Originally posted by bensisko
Yeah, i'd like to see Steve's reasons for 12" being the smallest.

The way I understood it, all the smaller notebooks had a removeable optical drive or battery pack. This, in Steve's mind, didn't count as full-featured.

I don't know...makes sense to me.

Which notebooks on the market are smaller but come with everything (optical drives, battery, etc.) in one case?

Squire

 

[bensisko]

Originally posted by Squire
The way I understood it, all the smaller notebooks had a removeable optical drive or battery pack. This, in Steve's mind, didn't count as full-featured.

I don't know...makes sense to me.

Which notebooks on the market are smaller but come with everything (optical drives, battery, etc.) in one case?

Squire

Sony has a Vaio that is super thin, and includes an optical drive and battery, but external floppy. I don't know, I think Apple kinda fudged on this one.

 

[brainless]

Originally posted by bensisko
Sony has a Vaio that is super thin, and includes an optical drive and battery, but external floppy. I don't know, I think Apple kinda fudged on this one.

Agree. There are others, not only Sony, such as Fujitsu P2000 with DVD/CD-RW combo and widescreen for ~3 lb. weight
and a long list of other producers has similar offer. Apple definitely have room for improvement there.

 

[brainless]

Originally posted by bensisko

Anywho, Apple killed the Newton off because they couldn't maintain three platforms (Mac, Server[Rapsody I think], and Newton). Plus, Apple only recouped about 1/4 the cash they put into the Newton. True they probably killed it before it's time, and would have done better with a Pilot sized Newton, however, I just don't think Apple would have kept the Newton up. Anytime there was a buget crunch, Newton would have always been on the chopping block. Personally, I would have liked to see a version of the 2100 with the same size screen, but the device itself isn't much bigger and about a half an inch thin.

I agree they had finacial (and maybe other) reasons to kill the Newton at that time, but the way Jobs presented the reasons was straightforward dumb - technology is not there, market is not ready....
In short time Palm took the vacant market by storm.
I consider Jobs whines about PDA market irrelevant. There is a room for improvements and Apple already has the superior technology in hand - they don't have to invent the Newton again ! Just build it again using the lastest PDA HW and it will be a market hit.