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Apple 'Questioning' the Future of its Mac Pro Line?
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I'm not sure why any professionals would be surprised by this rumor. This has been speculated on for some time. Apple has made it clear that their focus is no longer on the pro market. The FCPX mess made many people realize just how true that is. That comes on the heals of Apple discontinuing Shake. Discontinuing the Mac Pro logically falls in line with their current strategy.
I've seen a few comments here that remind me of the comments made by those who couldn't understand why professionals didn't like FCPX. Although the iMac has seen a lot of usage in certain fields, it's not a replacement for the Mac Pro. It never has been. Expandability and upgradability are key. Perhaps thunderbolt will fill some of that need, but it is one of those "remains to be seen" situations. If any company could find a solution, it's Apple, but it goes right back to a resources thing. How much time are they going to devote to creating a new solution for professionals if resources are already an issue to begin with?
I've seen a few comments here that remind me of the comments made by those who couldn't understand why professionals didn't like FCPX. Although the iMac has seen a lot of usage in certain fields, it's not a replacement for the Mac Pro. It never has been. Expandability and upgradability are key. Perhaps thunderbolt will fill some of that need, but it is one of those "remains to be seen" situations. If any company could find a solution, it's Apple, but it goes right back to a resources thing. How much time are they going to devote to creating a new solution for professionals if resources are already an issue to begin with?
i actually don't buy any mac desktop, laptops like macbook air yes, but desktop i just make my own pc with parts I buy
I have a 2007 Mac Pro 1,1 with 3880 graphics, 6TB drive storage space and 16GB memory. I bought it when the first Aluminum iMacs appeared but were short on stock, and I had a major book project coming up that was too much for my aging Powerbook. I wanted the iMac, but couldn't wait six weeks for them to ship. My wife told me to just get the Mac Pro, that it would probably last much longer. Boy was she right.
It's still a current, modern machine, and workhorse, a beast, what have you. It runs Lion without a hitch. Photoshop, InDesign, Aperture and Final Cut like a champ. My wife, meanwhile, is limping along with an Aluminum iMac, which beach balls constantly just running Photoshop on Lion. It wasn't so happy with 10.6 either. My Mac Pro will easily last another three years before showing its age. And I've still only half filled its memory slots and could go to 18GB internal storage. It can run three huge displays and dance circles around my friends' brand new MacbookPros.
So tell me, was it overpriced? Is it a dinosaur or boat anchor? I think not. No other configuration will allow that kind of storage, graphics, PCI and memory expansion and look so good doing it. If anything, Apple is under pricing them (provided you don't BTO the RAM, heh heh). If they raise the price, I'll still buy one when I need to replace mine. And if they do discontinue one, I'll sell mine for 1500 bucks and buy a new one as soon as they announce the end of the line. Then I'll still have another 6 years to figure out what's next.
A ramped up Mini? No way the graphics will be good enough. Sure external thunderbolt is ok, and an sad system disk will do internally. But unless they can pack 32GB of memory in there, it'll never run what pros need.
An iMac? ok, as long as I can get to the internals quickly, and without any assistance. My wife's iMac, while expandable, needs complete disassembly of the housing and display just to swap hard drives or upgrade the video card. And the glossy screen is a definite show stopper.
Maybe the Pros will have to pay more to work, while the consumer lines continue to get Apple's love, but if that's what it takes, so be it. I'll just have to charge my clients a few dollars more.
oh, and as for its 8 year old case, it's still the most beautiful tower out there. Have you seen the competition? nasty.
It's still a current, modern machine, and workhorse, a beast, what have you. It runs Lion without a hitch. Photoshop, InDesign, Aperture and Final Cut like a champ. My wife, meanwhile, is limping along with an Aluminum iMac, which beach balls constantly just running Photoshop on Lion. It wasn't so happy with 10.6 either. My Mac Pro will easily last another three years before showing its age. And I've still only half filled its memory slots and could go to 18GB internal storage. It can run three huge displays and dance circles around my friends' brand new MacbookPros.
So tell me, was it overpriced? Is it a dinosaur or boat anchor? I think not. No other configuration will allow that kind of storage, graphics, PCI and memory expansion and look so good doing it. If anything, Apple is under pricing them (provided you don't BTO the RAM, heh heh). If they raise the price, I'll still buy one when I need to replace mine. And if they do discontinue one, I'll sell mine for 1500 bucks and buy a new one as soon as they announce the end of the line. Then I'll still have another 6 years to figure out what's next.
A ramped up Mini? No way the graphics will be good enough. Sure external thunderbolt is ok, and an sad system disk will do internally. But unless they can pack 32GB of memory in there, it'll never run what pros need.
An iMac? ok, as long as I can get to the internals quickly, and without any assistance. My wife's iMac, while expandable, needs complete disassembly of the housing and display just to swap hard drives or upgrade the video card. And the glossy screen is a definite show stopper.
Maybe the Pros will have to pay more to work, while the consumer lines continue to get Apple's love, but if that's what it takes, so be it. I'll just have to charge my clients a few dollars more.
oh, and as for its 8 year old case, it's still the most beautiful tower out there. Have you seen the competition? nasty.
Oh god No! Don't discontinue your only user-upgradeable computer! Jeez. 
The Mac Pro is the only Mac you can buy that can last you easily 6+ years. I bought my Mac Pro five years ago, and it's still faster than some of the new Macs Apple sells. Within the next few years, if I have to I'll upgrade Ram, Video card, hard drives, etc, keeping it even more up to date. The cost of the tower is well worth it.
The Mac Pro is the only Mac you can buy that can last you easily 6+ years. I bought my Mac Pro five years ago, and it's still faster than some of the new Macs Apple sells. Within the next few years, if I have to I'll upgrade Ram, Video card, hard drives, etc, keeping it even more up to date. The cost of the tower is well worth it.
Discontinue the only Mac that can actually have any of its hardware upgraded by the user?
No matter how good Thunderbolt is, it's still nothing compared to having drives physically within the machine, having a high-end graphics card, and having two high-end processors and a heap of RAM.
They may as well just slap iOS on all their notebooks and be done with serious computing entirely, while waving the white flag as all professionals are forced to switch to Windows.
No matter how good Thunderbolt is, it's still nothing compared to having drives physically within the machine, having a high-end graphics card, and having two high-end processors and a heap of RAM.
They may as well just slap iOS on all their notebooks and be done with serious computing entirely, while waving the white flag as all professionals are forced to switch to Windows.
First of all, that was just an example of a company that might buy in bulk.
Second, Pixar does use Macs, but prefer Linux servers instead.
iBug2, you greatly underestimate the market that the Mac Pro lies on.
I believe this is mainly due to the extremely staggered refresh of the Mac Pro (currently due in part to Intel). Apple needs to move away from the Xeon line and just start offering Intel's highest offering in the 130W TDP desktop range. It also wouldn't hurt for a redesign given that it's been the same since 2003. A move away from the Xeon line would allow Apple to sell the Mac Pro at a lower price which would be beneficial for the low-end model which is likely getting cannibalized by the high-end iMac.
Nope .... no way ....
One of the main benefits to a Mac Pro is the ability to buy a high-end machine that doesn't tie you to using whatever LCD display panel happens to be integrated into it.
I've reconfigured the displays on my 2006 and 2008 Mac Pros multiple times over the years, as my needs changed. (For example, the trusty '06 Mac Pro is now running a single 28" Hannspree LCD monitor and the second video port goes to a DLP projector, so I can watch movies on it as a home theater using Plex. A while back though, I had the system upstairs in my computer room, running dual 22" Acer displays.)
I've also had more than one friend with an iMac that developed LCD display problems. Outside the warranty period, that practically means you may as well trash the whole machine. (Yeah, you could still use a dongle adapter off the side of one and attach a second display -- but the machine looks really pathetic if you run it like that, with a big unused screen across the front of it.) That was another consideration of mine when opting for Mac Pros instead of iMacs.
Regardless, even if I was ok with the LCD included in a new iMac, I have the video card issue to contend with. Would Apple redesign the iMac so it takes standard, upgradable video boards? If they don't, that's a major negative too.... I've upgraded the video boards in my '06 Mac Pro *3* times now since I've owned it. Without that ability, it would have already felt really outdated and "old" by now and I would have had to look at replacing it. I don't want a machine where just the video chipset winds up making it due for replacement prematurely. And what about the people who actually need 3 or 4 displays? On a Mac Pro, you just add a second video board. On the iMac, I guess you just say "Sorry.... not an option!"
Oh, and another big plus for a Mac Pro? Cooling! The iMacs always run really hot, to the point where I believe it shortens the life of components in them like the hard drives. The Mac Pro has plenty of ventilation, by contrast, and doesn't have to contend with heat being given off by the display either. That means potential for better, faster video cards than can be crammed into an iMac.
One of the main benefits to a Mac Pro is the ability to buy a high-end machine that doesn't tie you to using whatever LCD display panel happens to be integrated into it.
I've reconfigured the displays on my 2006 and 2008 Mac Pros multiple times over the years, as my needs changed. (For example, the trusty '06 Mac Pro is now running a single 28" Hannspree LCD monitor and the second video port goes to a DLP projector, so I can watch movies on it as a home theater using Plex. A while back though, I had the system upstairs in my computer room, running dual 22" Acer displays.)
I've also had more than one friend with an iMac that developed LCD display problems. Outside the warranty period, that practically means you may as well trash the whole machine. (Yeah, you could still use a dongle adapter off the side of one and attach a second display -- but the machine looks really pathetic if you run it like that, with a big unused screen across the front of it.) That was another consideration of mine when opting for Mac Pros instead of iMacs.
Regardless, even if I was ok with the LCD included in a new iMac, I have the video card issue to contend with. Would Apple redesign the iMac so it takes standard, upgradable video boards? If they don't, that's a major negative too.... I've upgraded the video boards in my '06 Mac Pro *3* times now since I've owned it. Without that ability, it would have already felt really outdated and "old" by now and I would have had to look at replacing it. I don't want a machine where just the video chipset winds up making it due for replacement prematurely. And what about the people who actually need 3 or 4 displays? On a Mac Pro, you just add a second video board. On the iMac, I guess you just say "Sorry.... not an option!"
Oh, and another big plus for a Mac Pro? Cooling! The iMacs always run really hot, to the point where I believe it shortens the life of components in them like the hard drives. The Mac Pro has plenty of ventilation, by contrast, and doesn't have to contend with heat being given off by the display either. That means potential for better, faster video cards than can be crammed into an iMac.
If they use macs, that might be about editing-sound editing. Their modeling and rendering software doesn't run on macs. So their entire 3D workflow is done on Linux.
No
NOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!! Cuz if they do so you won't be able to get 8TB storage, 64GB RAM, Intel Xeons, and the biggest thing: the ACCESSIBILITY of the Mac Pro.
NOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!! Cuz if they do so you won't be able to get 8TB storage, 64GB RAM, Intel Xeons, and the biggest thing: the ACCESSIBILITY of the Mac Pro.
iMac's are hardly suitable as headless servers accessed remotely or from another Mac - the screen would make them unnecessarily bulky and expensive.
Also for specialist applications such as medical use (eg. radiologists need 10 bit greyscale displays in portrait orientation) people choose a display to meet their specific requirements.
Can you quote some sales numbers? I think you greatly overestimate it. And don't forget, I'm one of them. So I don't want Mac Pro to be canned either.
But I'm assuming annual Mac Pro sales are 4 figures nowadays. Basically less than 0.1% of all Mac sales.
I've been a MP user for years. Using them for mathematical simulation of all kinds of systems. I would be completely OK with this if it meant we'd get something like a headless iMac with discrete graphics and a couple of drive bays.
The reality is my heavy compute lifting is moving to a Linux grid anyway - Mac/OSX on the front end, Linux/GenericHW on the back end. And storage is moving out of the CPU housing and into a dedicated NAS enclosure of its own.
The reality is my heavy compute lifting is moving to a Linux grid anyway - Mac/OSX on the front end, Linux/GenericHW on the back end. And storage is moving out of the CPU housing and into a dedicated NAS enclosure of its own.
I'd say two expansion slots would be needed and a decently powered onboard video card going to two thunderbolt ports.
The onboard video card can go in the base configs. Those that need the highest powered graphic cards can add those if needed. Adding a Thunderbolt port on separate graphic cards could be a major problem, having onboard video would solve that issue.
Try again. http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115211
Also the memory and motherboards are much cheaper for the regular i7s. Not to mention the theres nothing wrong with the i5. Architecturally it the same as the i7. Its just lower clocked.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115072
Theres no reason this wouldn't work. Its faster than anything they put in anything but a mac pro.
Theres no reason the mac pro costs what it does. Apple needs a mid tower machine. This is actually a faster cpu than the current base level mac pro has.
http://configure.us.dell.com/dellst...s&l=en&s=soho&cs=ussoho1&model_id=vostro-460&
Dell can do it for 750.
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I see it going the way of the dinosaur,along with the 17" MBP.I see the Laptop line up as the 11",13" and 15" MBA, desktop line up being served by the Mini, and the iMac, and iMac Professional
Clustered Mini's?
I could definitely see the Mac Pro line being ditched in favor of some form of Clustered Mini Servers connected via Thunderbolt cables... So you have say three Mini Servers, each with 8GB and 2TB... gives you what 12 processors, 24GB memory and 6TB of storage... not bad... you need more processing power? throw in another Mini Server...
Possible??
I could definitely see the Mac Pro line being ditched in favor of some form of Clustered Mini Servers connected via Thunderbolt cables... So you have say three Mini Servers, each with 8GB and 2TB... gives you what 12 processors, 24GB memory and 6TB of storage... not bad... you need more processing power? throw in another Mini Server...
Possible??
And that's one of the main reasons why Apple will discontinue it.
Apple wants you to buy a new machine sooner. The Mac Pro is less profitable not only because of low sales volume, it's unprofitable because it doesn't force you to follow the planned obsolescence timetable our economy is based on.
Yeah, great idea. Try fitting in 4 drives in your iMac. Ever do any rendering? Want to use more than 16 GB of RAM? Oooops.
Don't worry, you are.
Exactly. This would be a pretty boneheaded move by Apple.
Correct. I believe it was Virginia Tech. They had built a super computer using G5 Power Macs linked together and I recall that they updated it with Mac Mini's recently.
Apple doesn't need to build a purpose designed Pro computer when the Mac Mini can satisfy most of the market. The niche that remains can be served by stacked Mac Minis. The more powerful your computing needs, the more Mac Mini stacks you add.
Need a new video card? OSX already supports multiple and even switching on the fly. Add a video card stack daisy chained into the Mac Mini stacks. Have a special interface for factories or other manufacturing devices? Build that card into a stack with Thunderbolt I/O instead of PCI.
If you're a traditionalist and you want a tower, buy enough Mac Minis and you'll have one
The point of a mac is SIMPLICITY! Who wants 4 TB drives sitting around daisy chained on their desk?! Who wants a bunch of mac minis stacked on top of each other? Ridiculous.
There is still a need for desktops
I am a desktop person, I work at my desk in my home office. I mainly work on HD video production as a hobby and from time to time for others that hire me. I have 4 HD's in my Mac Pro, in a RAID stripped, using a SATA RAID back up external. I really use the bandwidth this provides me in editing and realtime effects.
I left the PC back in 2008 for my first Mac Pro, it offered everything I needed, got my girl a mac mini as she only uses a computer for facebook and email. She raves about her mac, tells everyone she has never had an issue or a virus, and how great the difference was between her mac and when she had a PC. I bought another Mac Pro in 2009 and have been waiting for a new one. Not that I need a new one as I updated the graphics card to the $499 card offered now for the latest 2010 model. I just like to upgrade and benefit from the time shaved off from rendering edits and using compressor.
I went to the Apple store, I asked if they knew about a new Mac Pro coming out. The sales person said there is no need for a Mac Pro, not with Thunderbolt out. I explained there is a need as I use my HD's as a RAID and really do see a big performance jump, and I buy a lot of RAM. He said, "I am in the video business myself, and I don't need that, my iMac is more powerful than a Mac Pro". I realized where this was going so I smiled and left the store.
If Apple does discontinue the Mac Pro, with no relevant alternative not sold today. I believe I will very much consider going back to the PC. I like to game on the side, and I like to have a really good graphics card for that. I am not the only person out there that prefers having a desktop. Even if I had a laptop, I would use it at the same desk, but then I would lose the power, the HD throughput etc.
I would think, the Mac Pro will find more and more uses in business as more businesses are starting to warm up to using the Mac over a PC. THe Mac Pro is a great workstation and an excellent server. Seems like the wrong time to discontinue. I could be missing Apples larger view, perhaps they really only want focus on the consumer, not the prosumer or business. THis is fine, but not what I and many others are interested in, this is what the Mac mini are for.
I am a desktop person, I work at my desk in my home office. I mainly work on HD video production as a hobby and from time to time for others that hire me. I have 4 HD's in my Mac Pro, in a RAID stripped, using a SATA RAID back up external. I really use the bandwidth this provides me in editing and realtime effects.
I left the PC back in 2008 for my first Mac Pro, it offered everything I needed, got my girl a mac mini as she only uses a computer for facebook and email. She raves about her mac, tells everyone she has never had an issue or a virus, and how great the difference was between her mac and when she had a PC. I bought another Mac Pro in 2009 and have been waiting for a new one. Not that I need a new one as I updated the graphics card to the $499 card offered now for the latest 2010 model. I just like to upgrade and benefit from the time shaved off from rendering edits and using compressor.
I went to the Apple store, I asked if they knew about a new Mac Pro coming out. The sales person said there is no need for a Mac Pro, not with Thunderbolt out. I explained there is a need as I use my HD's as a RAID and really do see a big performance jump, and I buy a lot of RAM. He said, "I am in the video business myself, and I don't need that, my iMac is more powerful than a Mac Pro". I realized where this was going so I smiled and left the store.
If Apple does discontinue the Mac Pro, with no relevant alternative not sold today. I believe I will very much consider going back to the PC. I like to game on the side, and I like to have a really good graphics card for that. I am not the only person out there that prefers having a desktop. Even if I had a laptop, I would use it at the same desk, but then I would lose the power, the HD throughput etc.
I would think, the Mac Pro will find more and more uses in business as more businesses are starting to warm up to using the Mac over a PC. THe Mac Pro is a great workstation and an excellent server. Seems like the wrong time to discontinue. I could be missing Apples larger view, perhaps they really only want focus on the consumer, not the prosumer or business. THis is fine, but not what I and many others are interested in, this is what the Mac mini are for.
not too sad to see it go
It's not needed and archaic. To say you need it so you can upgrade it in the future? - ok perhaps but there are so many options out there especially with storage.
I've switched from my aging mac pro to a macbook air - that's right an air! It handles EVERYTHING I need it to do and does it well. This includes photoshop, flash and Avid Media Composer - that's right AVID!
I use these tools as my business. This is my life and getting the air has made my business portable. I'm much happier now.
I'll admit it can get sluggish if I'm opening multiple applications at once having one application on my air and the other on my Cintiq but it's not too often I work on multiple applications. I prefer to deal with one task at a time. And if I needed to use After Effects I may have gone with a macbook pro - still not a mac pro.
The mac pro line is becoming the niche market. Beefed up iMac's are totally capable of doing the job. The main expansion would be for hard drive space which can easily be done with external drives. Set up the external storage over a network so you won't have the clutter of all the cables - I'm doing that for my air to handle all of the media I need as I do my rough cuts for editing. Cloud computing is the wave of the future.
Gene Roddenberry was the visionary - Apple is making it happen!
It's not needed and archaic. To say you need it so you can upgrade it in the future? - ok perhaps but there are so many options out there especially with storage.
I've switched from my aging mac pro to a macbook air - that's right an air! It handles EVERYTHING I need it to do and does it well. This includes photoshop, flash and Avid Media Composer - that's right AVID!
I use these tools as my business. This is my life and getting the air has made my business portable. I'm much happier now.
I'll admit it can get sluggish if I'm opening multiple applications at once having one application on my air and the other on my Cintiq but it's not too often I work on multiple applications. I prefer to deal with one task at a time. And if I needed to use After Effects I may have gone with a macbook pro - still not a mac pro.
The mac pro line is becoming the niche market. Beefed up iMac's are totally capable of doing the job. The main expansion would be for hard drive space which can easily be done with external drives. Set up the external storage over a network so you won't have the clutter of all the cables - I'm doing that for my air to handle all of the media I need as I do my rough cuts for editing. Cloud computing is the wave of the future.
Gene Roddenberry was the visionary - Apple is making it happen!