Apple Quietly Updates Entry-Level White MacBook

[NT1440]

I guess I should've been more clear. I was talking about to the Unibook. I should think things through better before I speak

Well thats just silly.

Thats like saying "Well now apple doesnt have an option for those who want to spend more money on the aluminum" Do you need the aluminum? no.

 

[Eric S.]

As for your point #1, I keep raising that point, but the demographic on this forum are generally people that actually use FW. So telling these people that they're the minority in the real world doesn't really work well.

As the risk of having you call me rude again, I think you're the one with the snarky attitude here. "I just can't get through to these peons that they're in the minority and they should shut up and eat whatever Apple dishes out without complaint." Well, most people tend to view these things through the prism of how it affects them, not how it affects Apple's bottom line. I suspect you'd think differently if Apple were axing a technology important to you.

I would guess that a minority of customers use the audio input port on their laptop. I would also guess a minority use the external monitor connection, the ethernet port, both USB ports simultaneously, or for that matter over 75% of the software that comes with OS X. By your argument Apple could just drop all of that stuff, purely for the reason of maximizing their profits, and no one should complain about it.

 

[polaris20]

I guess I should've been more clear. I was talking about to the Unibook. I should think things through better before I speak



What is this demographic? Is it the same one the iBook was target toward?

Yeah the same one. How many people in the real world (i.e. not this forum) used fw a lot on their iBooks, and continue to need it on their MB's? And I mean besides the original iPods that were FW only.

Obviously I don't have numbers any more than you do, but judging on the people I've encountered with Macs in the past that don't even know what FW is, I'd say the number is pretty high. Just a guess.

 

[polaris20]

As the risk of having you call me rude again, I think you're the one with the snarky attitude here. "I just can't get through to these peons that they're in the minority and they should shut up and eat whatever Apple dishes out without complaint." Well, most people tend to view these things through the prism of how it affects them, not how it affects Apple's bottom line. I suspect you'd think differently if Apple were axing a technology important to you.

I would guess that a minority of customers use the audio input port on their laptop. I would also guess a minority use the external monitor connection, the ethernet port, both USB ports simultaneously, or for that matter over 75% of the software that comes with OS X. By your argument Apple could just drop all of that stuff, purely for the reason of maximizing their profits, and no one should complain about it.

I think you're really misunderstanding what people are trying to say here. No one's (at least not me) saying it was the right thing to do to get rid of FW, but merely hypothesizing why Apple did it.

Do you really think that Apple looked at their MacBook user base, and saw that 95% used FW on a daily basis, and then axed it to save money?

Or do you think that they possibly saw a much, much lower percentage and decided to do it for design/cost saving?

Do you think Apple does stuff without any market study whatsoever?

 

[gwangung]

Yeah the same one. How many people in the real world (i.e. not this forum) used fw a lot on their iBooks, and continue to need it on their MB's? And I mean besides the original iPods that were FW only.

Obviously I don't have numbers any more than you do, but judging on the people I've encountered with Macs in the past that don't even know what FW is, I'd say the number is pretty high. Just a guess.

I'd have to agree...and this is from someone who HATES the fact that Firewire got dropped from the Macbook.

The folks who need Firewire are folks with more pro/prosumer needs, and that's not necessarily the Macbook.

 

[polaris20]

I'd have to agree...and this is from someone who HATES the fact that Firewire got dropped from the Macbook.

The folks who need Firewire are folks with more pro/prosumer needs, and that's not necessarily the Macbook.

I hate it too, but it is what it is. It's certainly not the reason I bought the MBP, but I can see why it's irritating to those with a lot of FW peripherals that otherwise like the MB form factor for size or cost issues. They need to either bother Apple directly, or vote with their wallet.

But whining about it constantly on a non-Apple forum 3+ months after the fact really does no one any good.

 

[Eric S.]

Do you really think that Apple looked at their MacBook user base, and saw that 95% used FW on a daily basis, and then axed it to save money?

Or do you think that they possibly saw a much, much lower percentage and decided to do it for design/cost saving?

I don't care what percentage of people use FW. FW is a technology that has been on every entry-level Apple laptop for over eight years, and is still a viable technology not at the end of its life. What I'm saying is that people who use it have a right to complain when its dropped and they're told they need to spend ~$700 more for a laptop that does what they need (regardless of what percentage of the market they are).

Do you think Apple does stuff without any market study whatsoever?

Of course they did a market study. Their market study told them they could make more profit if they forced a certain segment of their customers onto a higher-margin product. They may even have taken into consideration the fact that by doing so they would lose some customers, maybe even some long-time loyal ones.

But whining about it constantly on a non-Apple forum 3+ months after the fact really does no one any good.

Calling people "whiners" is pejorative. Complaining about the decision to drop Firewire is one thing. But the bigger issue is Apple's attitude toward its customers.

 

[Undo Redo]

The beauty of the newest white MacBook is that for once, Apple is giving users a reasonable choice. This model is as good in nearly all respects as the shiny happy aluminum model and it includes Firewire, for $300 less. Choice is good. Firewire is available in a portable for $999. Right now, there's no other Macintosh computer that appeals to me like the white MacBook. Hopefully the Mac mini will follow suit soon.

 

[iMacmatician]

Also interestingly there is only a £15 price increase for a much better laptop than before!

How they can give you a nVidia graphics card which is much better than those old Intel chips and an extra 1GB of RAM for that little?

Weird...

My thought is that Apple will not update the white MacBook when the other notebooks are updated in the spring.

 

[iMacmatician]

Any spring update would only be a speed bump. Apple isn't going to do a case redesign so soon. IMO the next opportunity for a revision like that will be when they go to the Nehalem mobile CPU, around the end of this year at the earliest.

Since the first MacBook Pro (and MacBook), the updates have alternated between largely technical (like X1600 » 8600M GT) and largely specification (like 256 MB VRAM » 512 MB VRAM). The upcoming update would be specification, and the Nehalem update after that would be technical, which might mean a minor case redesign or something like that then.

 

[butterfly0fdoom]

As the risk of having you call me rude again, I think you're the one with the snarky attitude here. "I just can't get through to these peons that they're in the minority and they should shut up and eat whatever Apple dishes out without complaint." Well, most people tend to view these things through the prism of how it affects them, not how it affects Apple's bottom line. I suspect you'd think differently if Apple were axing a technology important to you.

I would guess that a minority of customers use the audio input port on their laptop. I would also guess a minority use the external monitor connection, the ethernet port, both USB ports simultaneously, or for that matter over 75% of the software that comes with OS X. By your argument Apple could just drop all of that stuff, purely for the reason of maximizing their profits, and no one should complain about it.

Oh, I'm not trying to be snarky here. I'm just noting that most of the people that use MacBooks, myself being in the minority, don't need or use FireWire. I have a FireWire-based audio interface that I bought last June. So Apple dropping FireWire does affect me. It irked me tremendously for about 10 minutes after that announcement. But oh well. When the time comes that either my interface or my computer needs replacing, I'll figure something out.

Your second paragraph just goes too far, though. I do concede the point about the audio input jack, though, seeing as the headphone port now supports the headphones with built-in microphones. IIRC the iBook didn't have an input port anyway. However, Wi-Fi isn't adopted nearly as widely as straight-up ethernet is. USB ports are used for nearly everything (whereas FireWire is only used for some things) from mice and tablets to flash drives and random accessories that end up overloading the power flow. In the education market, the display connector is absolutely vital. The software that comes with OS X are aimed at the consumer space (I mean, the system pretty much only comes with iLife).

 

[polaris20]

Can someone explain how whining about the lack of FW on a non-Apple web forum is productive? What's the goal here, 3+ months after the fact? There are 2 models out of the lot of notebooks that don't fit your needs. So buy a whitebook, buy an MBP, or go to Windows. Or better yet, post about it on discussions.apple.com.
Yes, it frigging sucks for some people. 1 to 10 topics here about it made sense. But now that it invades every 4th thread here, it's getting old.

Yes, you have a right to complain about it. I also have a right to call it "beating a dead horse".

 

[Chappers]

Not wishing to beat the horse (even if it is dead) some more but has anyone done a survey of this and taken the issue up with Apple.

No point in complaining if you don't do something about it.

 

[MagnusVonMagnum]

The more expensive aluminum-clad MacBook features faster memory—1,066MHz DDR3 SDRAM, compared to 667MHz DDR2 SDRAM. It also has a hard disk drive that’s one-third larger than the drive on the $999 model—160GB, versus 120GB. You also have the option of getting a Solid State Disk (SSD) drive on the aluminum MacBook, something you can’t buy for the $999 model.

According to Maccentral

Ok, I'll give you that (although I'd replace the internal drives with Hitachi 7200 RPM 500GB drives anyway for about $120), but none of those reasons are MORE compelling than LOSING Firewire, getting a more reflective screen and costing me $300 more that I could put towards that bigger drive plus an external (firewire!) backup drive for it. But then, I bought the previous MBP instead for slightly more than a uni-body MB and it's got a lot more going for it (larger 15" matte screen, 200GB hard drive standard, FW800 AND FW400 ports included and a considerably faster GPU).

 

[polaris20]

Not wishing to beat the horse (even if it is dead) some more but has anyone done a survey of this and taken the issue up with Apple.

No point in complaining if you don't do something about it.

Over 17,000 people so far.

http://www.petitiononline.com/mod_perl/signed.cgi?MB1394

Also, anyone can go here and voice concerns.

http://www.apple.com/feedback/macbook.html

Posting on MacRumors? Useless. While I'm sure there are Apple employees visit here from time to time, I doubt they use this site as a major source of market research.

Ok, I'll give you that (although I'd replace the internal drives with Hitachi 7200 RPM 500GB drives anyway for about $120), but none of those reasons are MORE compelling than LOSING Firewire, getting a more reflective screen and costing me $300 more that I could put towards that bigger drive plus an external (firewire!) backup drive for it. But then, I bought the previous MBP instead for slightly more than a uni-body MB and it's got a lot more going for it (larger 15" matte screen, 200GB hard drive standard, FW800 AND FW400 ports included and a considerably faster GPU).

There are such numerous issues with previous MBP's it would really deter me from getting one instead of a Unibody MB, if that were my price range. The failure-prone GPU, the inferior chassis, and the general hassle to replace the hard drive are just not worth it. Plus the glass trackpad on the new MB's and MBP's is wonderful, IMO. The glossy screen doesn't bother me either, but then again I don't use it in broad daylight; usually in the shade, inside in a brightly lit room, or in a dark IT office.

 

[mark165]

Changing the subject back onto the white book upgraded, some of you may have seen i asked apple if they would swap my less than 2 week old previous white mac book, for the newer enhanced one, i've just recieved it now! I am amazed at Apples service and customer support. My old one got picked up last monday afternoon, then got the new one wednesday afternoon, for no extra costs, thats very quick service which i did not expect at all!

As a new Apple customer, i'm very pleased to be an owner of the newer enhanced white mac book! Hopefully the extra gig of ram, and superior graphics card will make it alot better to run the likes of the adobe suite.

 

[polaris20]

Changing the subject back onto the white book upgraded, some of you may have seen i asked apple if they would swap my less than 2 week old previous white mac book, for the newer enhanced one, i've just recieved it now! I am amazed at Apples service and customer support. My old one got picked up last monday afternoon, then got the new one wednesday afternoon, for no extra costs, thats very quick service which i did not expect at all!

As a new Apple customer, i'm very pleased to be an owner of the newer enhanced white mac book! Hopefully the extra gig of ram, and superior graphics card will make it alot better to run the likes of the adobe suite.

It should definitely make a difference for Adobe. Congrats on the new(er) machine!

 

[Chappers]

Changing the subject back onto the white book upgraded, some of you may have seen i asked apple if they would swap my less than 2 week old previous white mac book, for the newer enhanced one, i've just recieved it now! I am amazed at Apples service and customer support.

That's why Apple continue to top league tables on these matters year in year out and still improving. Well done for asking for and getting a new machine.

 

[earthandtone]

maybe they will quietly update the macpro.

So maybe they will quietly update the mac book pros to quadcores???

 

[MagnusVonMagnum]

There are such numerous issues with previous MBP's it would really deter me from getting one instead of a Unibody MB, if that were my price range. The failure-prone GPU, the inferior chassis, and the general hassle to replace the hard drive are just not worth it. Plus the glass trackpad on the new MB's and MBP's is wonderful, IMO. The glossy screen doesn't bother me either, but then again I don't use it in broad daylight; usually in the shade, inside in a brightly lit room, or in a dark IT office.

I don't know what's supposed to be inferior about the chassis other than not being one piece (big deal). The glass trackpad is meaningless either way. Changing the hard drive is a one time thing IF you feel the need. But getting a smaller glossy screen and slower graphics are another thing altogether (plus I not only have firewire 400, I have 800 also). I'm aware of the failure issue with the GPU the warranty is extended and it's a small chance either way.

 

[Eric S.]

So maybe they will quietly update the mac book pros to quadcores???

Apple would not do that quietly.

 

[polaris20]

I don't know what's supposed to be inferior about the chassis other than not being one piece (big deal). The glass trackpad is meaningless either way. Changing the hard drive is a one time thing IF you feel the need. But getting a smaller glossy screen and slower graphics are another thing altogether (plus I not only have firewire 400, I have 800 also). I'm aware of the failure issue with the GPU the warranty is extended and it's a small chance either way.

Looks pretty solid to me!

And I guess HD replacement is a personal issue, as I've already replaced mine once (for larger capacity and higher speed than stock) and will do so again when the 512GB SSD's become more common and cheaper. So having easy access to the HD is more than just a convenience.

 

[butterfly0fdoom]

Changing the hard drive is a one time thing IF you feel the need.

Completely not the case, at least for me (and I know I'm not alone). I've gone through 3 hard drives already. Back when I had an iBook, replacing the hard drive was such a pain that the easy-access hard drive was one major reason I opted for a MacBook instead of a MacBook Pro two years ago.

 

[Eric S.]

I've gone through 3 hard drives already.

Do you mean that they failed or that you've opted to get new ones for some reason?

 

[butterfly0fdoom]

Do you mean that they failed or that you've opted to get new ones for some reason?

Ran out of space on two, one of them died (although it's more user error/abuse than it is hard drive malfunction; sudden motion sensor can only do so much).