Apple Releases macOS Ventura With FaceTime Handoff, Continuity Camera, Stage Manager, New Apps and More

[ProfessionalFan]

If I wipe my whole HD and my MBP downloads macOS from the Internet, will it be Ventura already? I'm neurotic and this is the preferred way for me...

Yes, it'd be Ventura.

 

[dandeco]

I now have Ventura installed on my M1 MacBook Air, and it works pretty well. Stage Manager I'd only find useful if I'm using the built-in display and its' 1440x900 resolution and I have a bunch of windows open.
I also just installed it on my 2017 iMac at work!

 

[rm5]

Anyone else experiencing somewhat weird behavior of the cursor after the update? (Macbook Air M1). It sometimes feels laggy, or spongy, I also noticed it when dragging around signatures in PDF documents...

No, the cursor is fine for me. I'm experiencing other bugs though:

• Discord sometimes doesn't launch and gets stuck on the updating splash screen. I have to force quit and restart it.
• Noticeably shorter battery life compared to Monterey, even on my M1 MacBook Air
• Weird dynamic desktop bug specifically on the Ventura wallpaper, where I switch from dark to light mode and the dynamic desktop doesn't switch. THEN, when I change it to another wallpaper and back to the Ventura wallpaper again, the issue goes away... temporarily. Monterey seemed to have the opposite problem.

Those are all the bugs I've encountered so far, so not an extensive list.

 

[Alwis]

I wonder what the explanation is for that? Both my M1 Mac Mini and my 2019 iMac were 12.15 GB, both upgrading from the latest version of Monterey as well. And your "large" one wasn't even the same size as my "large" one (yours was 0.35 GB larger). I don't get it.

In my 2019 MacBook Pro it was the "small" installer with 3.92GB. Interestingly on my Mini the full installer (the one, where you can select a drive to install to) was downloaded and executed, not so in the other Macs.

 

[cubbie5150]

Why are different users seeing such drastically different download sizes? Mine is 12.15 GB, upgrading from the latest Monterrey release. Are the users getting half or less size downloads running the beta already (so it doesn't have to install as much)?

View attachment 2101691

Huh, I upgraded from latest version of Monterrey on my 16" M1 Pro MBP and my download was 6.37GB.

 

[HoneyRyder]

Docker Desktop is working on my M1 Mac mini running Ventura.

I think the issue I'm having is related to VPN. Looks like Ventura changed something in this area.

 

[GuruZac]

Huh, I upgraded from latest version of Monterrey on my 16" M1 Pro MBP and my download was 6.37GB.

Yeah just updated my M1 MBA and it was 6.37GB, also coming from latest Monterrey.

 

[GuruZac]

this sure did take ages to download but happy with it overall. stage manager I think is far more useful than on iPad but I plan to use both.

Yeah, I have been pleasantly surprised already with how much more I like Stage Manger on my MBA. With the swipe features of the trackpad on Mac it's much less clumsy on my end than on the iPad, where I hardly use SM.

 

[Morac]

I have no idea why, but I can only turn stage manager on and off through the control panel. Doing so through the settings does nothing.

 

[The Game 161]

Yeah, I have been pleasantly surprised already with how much more I like Stage Manger on my MBA. With the swipe features of the trackpad on Mac it's much less clumsy on my end than on the iPad, where I hardly use SM.

With how I use my mac it’s ideal to be honest and resizing is better than it is on iPad.

 

[manofthematch]

It's too painful. But here's a few examples:
New in Ventura (or perhaps Monterey), if you shift-click on the left edge, instead of extending selection, it just moves the cursor.
And ancient (bad for at least five years): When you're in threaded view, if you delete a message from the middle of the thread, the selection will randomly jump to some other message in the thread (instead of just moving to the next, or previous, message, like it does outside of threads). This one bug makes me tear out my hair on a daily basis.

How about the message compose window?
- As of a few years ago, when you reply to a message, the message attribution line ("On <date>, x@y.z wrote:") suddenly went inside the quote level. That's bizarrely stupid, violating both common sense and 40 years of precedent.
- Whitespace handling has been broken for years, but now it's broken worse. Quoting of messages with leading tabs or spaces in lines of text is mangled in all sorts of ways, including stripping them out entirely in some cases.

And then there are the not-quite-bugs, like changing fonts and interline spacing so it's far less informationally dense in a really user-hostile way.

I could go on but I'd start to vomit. I can't believe I'm still using this pos. I keep meaning to try Thunderbird again, and somehow never get around to it. It was ugly as hell - more than Mail (at least a few years ago) - but not so weirdly flaky.

Thanks for the details. I did not notice most of those bugs yet. Maybe because I always write plain text mails which reduces formatting clutter a lot.

 

[Kottu]

As I was away for a couple of days so, I had time to install only today. It was showing under 4GB first and all of a sudden it became 5.52GB Why? I have a 16" M1Pro.

 

[Confused-User]

[about the missing network locations feature]
I am missing that feature too. I did not need it every day but when I needed it it was very handy. I read somewhere, that there is still a possibility to define locations via the cli, have to lock into this.

The command you're looking for is "networksetup". It has a reasonable man page and builtin help. The commands you'd need are:
networksetup -getcurrentlocation
networksetup -listlocations
networksetup -createlocation <location name> [populate]
networksetup -deletelocation <location name>
networksetup -switchtolocation <location name>

Though actually, since the location menu still exists, all you really need is "networksetup -createlocation <name> populate". Once that's done, you can switch to it, and then manipulate it in the sys settings as usual.

 

[Confused-User]

"The Mail app has been overhauled in ‌macOS Ventura‌..."

I don't suppose Apple has added the ability to NOT MARK EMAILS AS READ when you simply click on them?

Why do I highly doubt this "advanced" function is still missing from Ventura?

You can always mark them as unread afterwards.

 

[gank41]

Still no Smart Folder in the Mail app that shows only Unread Email.

(I know you can make your own Smart Folder for this, it just seems like an 'email app' default to have it already)

 

[Confused-User]

Thanks for the details. I did not notice most of those bugs yet. Maybe because I always write plain text mails which reduces formatting clutter a lot.

No, all those Mail.app bugs are with plain text email. I never use HTML.

...oh wait, not exactly. I have Mail settings configured to always send plain-text email. And yet... when I reply to certain messages, the reply always starts in "rich text" format and I have to "Make Plain Text" it (at least there's a cmd-key or that). So yeah, that's another of the ~100 Mail bugs I deal with daily.

Some of them are downright comical. Here, for your amusement, is FB11636336, filed by me Oct. 2, still broken in 13.0:
Name: In Mail.app, pasting or dropping text from Terminal.app sometimes replaces CRs with spaces

Problem:
In Mail, pasting text copied from Terminal.app sometimes causes newlines (hex 0x0a) to be replaced by spaces, completely destroying correct formatting. Notably, this does not happen when sourcing text from other apps. In fact, if I paste problem text from Terminal into TextEdit, then recopy it and paste it into Mail, the problem does not appear.

The issue requires there to be at least two characters typed into the composed message already. Then, for any text containing lines ending with spaces, the NL for that line will be replaced with another space.

How to reproduce:
1) Open a terminal window
2) Type:
echo "zz\nz \nz"
and hit return. This will produce three lines of output.
2a) If only one line of output was produced, you're in /bin/csh or some other unusual shell. Use the default shell, /bin/zsh, or other sh-like shells.
3) Triple-click the first line, and drag through the third line, so you have all three lines selected, including their NLs (end-of-line chars)
4) Copy, then switch to Mail, compose a new message, and paste into the body panel.

** Note that the text pasted is only two lines, instead of three. The second NL has been replaced by another space char.
Almost any text will fail in this way, as long as you have lines ending with spaces. Oddly, the minimum plausible test case DOES NOT actually fail: 'echo "z \nz"'. Apparently, you need at least two chars and a newline BEFORE the line with the failing pattern of text-space-NL.
That text can be part of the pasted/dragged text (as above) or it can already exist in the message window.

Expected results:
Text pasted in Mail is identical to text copied from Terminal.

Actual results:
Text pasted is altered, as described above.

 

[GuruZac]

With how I use my mac it’s ideal to be honest and resizing is better than it is on iPad.

Yes, this is one of the big misses with Stage Manager on iPadOS. The fact the windows are predetermined sizes really diminishes the utility of the feature. It's still on the tired old grid system iOS/iPadOS has had forever. Time to move on Apple.

 

[Alwis]

Though actually, since the location menu still exists, all you really need is "networksetup -createlocation <name> populate". Once that's done, you can switch to it, and then manipulate it in the sys settings as usual.

Thanks for your help, I will try this out. I think, this will work for me, even if I would prefer an option in the settings!

 

[Brachaci]

Still no Smart Folder in the Mail app that shows only Unread Email.

(I know you can make your own Smart Folder for this, it just seems like an 'email app' default to have it already)

You can use the filter button instead. It will do the same as an extra folder with only unread mails.

 

[gank41]

You can use the filter button instead. It will do the same as an extra folder with only unread mails.

I guess, but I’m used to the macOS keyboard shortcut Command+1 or 2, setting Unread for 1 and All Inboxes for 2.

 

[Brachaci]

I guess, but I’m used to the macOS keyboard shortcut Command+1 or 2, setting Unread for 1 and All Inboxes for 2.

Got your point. At some point it is always a bit of pain to deal with such inconveniences on a daily basis...no matter how small they are.

 

[Mac_tech]

No, all those Mail.app bugs are with plain text email. I never use HTML.

...oh wait, not exactly. I have Mail settings configured to always send plain-text email. And yet... when I reply to certain messages, the reply always starts in "rich text" format and I have to "Make Plain Text" it (at least there's a cmd-key or that). So yeah, that's another of the ~100 Mail bugs I deal with daily.

Some of them are downright comical. Here, for your amusement, is FB11636336, filed by me Oct. 2, still broken in 13.0:
Name: In Mail.app, pasting or dropping text from Terminal.app sometimes replaces CRs with spaces

Problem:
In Mail, pasting text copied from Terminal.app sometimes causes newlines (hex 0x0a) to be replaced by spaces, completely destroying correct formatting. Notably, this does not happen when sourcing text from other apps. In fact, if I paste problem text from Terminal into TextEdit, then recopy it and paste it into Mail, the problem does not appear.

The issue requires there to be at least two characters typed into the composed message already. Then, for any text containing lines ending with spaces, the NL for that line will be replaced with another space.

How to reproduce:
1) Open a terminal window
2) Type:
echo "zz\nz \nz"
and hit return. This will produce three lines of output.
2a) If only one line of output was produced, you're in /bin/csh or some other unusual shell. Use the default shell, /bin/zsh, or other sh-like shells.
3) Triple-click the first line, and drag through the third line, so you have all three lines selected, including their NLs (end-of-line chars)
4) Copy, then switch to Mail, compose a new message, and paste into the body panel.

** Note that the text pasted is only two lines, instead of three. The second NL has been replaced by another space char.
Almost any text will fail in this way, as long as you have lines ending with spaces. Oddly, the minimum plausible test case DOES NOT actually fail: 'echo "z \nz"'. Apparently, you need at least two chars and a newline BEFORE the line with the failing pattern of text-space-NL.
That text can be part of the pasted/dragged text (as above) or it can already exist in the message window.

Expected results:
Text pasted in Mail is identical to text copied from Terminal.

Actual results:
Text pasted is altered, as described above.

Did you file this as a bug report with Apple?

 

[Confused-User]

Did you file this as a bug report with Apple?

L2read? "Here, for your amusement, is FB11636336, filed by me Oct. 2"

 

[Mac_tech]

L2read? "Here, for your amusement, is FB11636336, filed by me Oct. 2"

Ok, I did read but but good you filed one. I hope Apple addresses it as I've read that there have been bugs submitted by people in the past that have been open for months if not longer with no resolution on Apple's part.

 

[DaveMcM76]

Haven't had that much time to play with it properly on my M1 Mac Mini, but it does appear to have fixed one of my biggest annoyances with Monterey around screen resolutions when waking from sleep. I've got a 4K capable HDMI KVM switch, but only a 1080 monitor and whenever Monterey woke from sleep it would try and set the resolution to (I assume) 4K and give me "Unsupported Resolution" messages on my monitor. I always had to either escape the login screen or use the display sleep hot corner to get it to sleep the display again and then re-wake it to get back to 1080 and a screen I could actually view.

So far Ventura seems to always wake the screen at the correct resolution