Right - but I don't want to lose the access to that 200+ GB of backup (turning off iCloud photos) just so Apple won't use this system on my phone. That's what I did a poor job of saying the first time.
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Apple Remains Committed to Launching New Child Safety Features Later This Year
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Right - but I don't want to lose the access to that 200+ GB of backup (turning off iCloud photos) just so Apple won't use this system on my phone. That's what I did a poor job of saying the first time.
You've distilled it perfectly.
Instead of Apple continuing to fight the good fight and hopefully push these debates about privacy and surveillance back up to where they should be had (in the open, public arena, political debate...)
They are punting to a way that's good for them
This change will allow them to comply with surveillance agencies and state entities who want to "see everything" (or at least whatever they are looking for at the minimum) while Apple gets to go fully out of the loop and say "we can't see any of it! What you send to us is fully E2EE"
This is the huge thing everyone.
Apple is getting out of the way and clearing the path to do what surveillance agencies want.
This is the start of them fully punting on the original "Privacy" schtick.
Apple has had photo scanning in iOS for many years now. Why no reaction when that happened?
The scanning was done on iCloud servers not on the customer device. That is the difference.
I meant photo scanning spyware. Maybe the used ML to identify photos on device, but it wasn’t a program meant to spy on users.
They could to this today with the iCloud backup software which is on your iPhone today. Its purpose is to copy all your data files. It's just one boolean value from backup up your phone to iCloud with an encryption key Apple has access to.
How you stop Apple from misusing this software?
You can't. You just have to trust Apple.
I'm too naive and would like to think they're doing it on principle alone - but it does feel like a step in this direction.
And if Apple wanted to access that backup, they would need a warrant to do it (legally speaking). I mean, if we're trusting Apple here, we have to trust they would also follow the proper processes to access that iCloud backup.
With the CSAM system, they're just doing it. Yes, it's different than them accessing the iCloud backup where they can see everything. But it's an access issues, moreso than a visibility issue.
Sometimes people, and especially organizations, can very easily end up doing the wrong things for what seem like the right reasons.
Apple however are too well versed and intelligent here for me to give them the benefit of the doubt.
They've been fighting the US Gov requests for too long to not know - fully - the implications here.
I think they are taking the first step to just getting themselves out of the loop.
Once this type of tooling is built into the OS, they can quietly do what intelligence agencies want them to do...
...and there will be no press releases folks.
It's going to be happening --- on your devices --- and you won't know.
There is a background task which scans every photo in your photo library and analyse every photo. It is so resource intensive that most of it is done while connected to power.
"Using on‑device machine learning, the Photos tab hides similar photos and reduces clutter by removing screenshots and receipts, so you can easily enjoy your best shots. Photos also uses intelligence to find and focus on only the best part of your photo for better previews."
"You’ll get intelligent suggestions about which photos could look even better with effects. Memories intelligently searches and curates your photos and videos"
"Intelligent face recognition and location identification make it easy to find the exact photos you’re looking for, based on who you were with or where you were when you took them. You can even search for general categories, like “Japanese restaurant,” or get more specific, like “Aspen Ideas Festival.”"
"Using advanced machine learning, scene and object recognition"
Photos - Official Apple Support
Learn more about taking pictures and videos with your iPhone, iPad, or iPod touch. Get help editing, organizing and sharing with these Photos resources.
www.apple.com
Maybe. But then again - why the sudden urge to spy on their users? I doubt its anti-trust, because they have no dominant market position anywhere. And they could fight it using their well oiled marketing machine and legal help with good chances to prevail.
If there were anti-trust considerations I‘d assume Facebook, Google and/or Microsoft would be much better candidates for each of them has a dominant position (or even several).
As you've seen me posting (just above this in fact) -- I think this is to get Apple out of the business of having to fight the surveillance state apparatus while simultaneously probably going over to E2EE eventually and thus being able to say:
As long as you don't mind being surveilled, on your device, by your local government -- you are fully secure with E2EE!
Note: they will only say the "you are fully secure with E2EE part"
I agree with this. This is such an about face from Apple, (and has an “off switch” on the phone itself) that it makes me think there’s something behind the scenes here.
We know that currently it’s limited in scope, and only done with iCloud photos turned on. That and the hashing comparison is done so that Apple specifically cannot see the flagged photo, unless there’s many matches. And on top of this it’s only rolling out in the U.S.
It reeks of malicious compliance to me.
An easier route than the current implementation would just to check every photo on device with ML, or send it for manual review. The hashing system is Apple’s way of making it closer to being private.
On top of that, if this were 100% about “protecting children” then why not roll it out worldwide?
And on top of that, I don’t think the EUs recent announcement is a coincidence either. I can believe it’s the three-letter agencies leveraging these surveillance tools.
But people here are against CSAM detection just being installed on the device even if its dormant. They are afraid it can be misused or extended.
You have the exact same problem with the iCloud backup software.
If the government can get images into the CSAM database, they also have the power to get the warrant.
Also think about China. Wouldn't China have the power to force every iPhone in China to have iCloud backup always turned on with no possibility of turning it off?
My arguments is that there are much worse technology already in iOS which with small changes is much better tools for oppressive governments than the CSAM Detection tool.
Also, Apple isn't doing any scanning if iCloud Photo Library is turned off.
Antitrust law is subject to political considerations, like all laws in the United States. Legislating from the bench is a big deal.
I’m guessing that the other companies have been more compliant. The FBI in particular is probably salivating at the thought of breaking up Apple, divide and conquer if you will.
I think it would have been discovered ... just the initial change of operation probably needed to be talked about once (with a nice friendly cover story "about the kids")..
Once the secret bridge is built, nobody will know or have to publicly talk about what's actually going over it.
In some ways its' better to have a cover story to "explain the whole thing"
Plus, don't forget - Apple WANTS to talk about this..
A key part here is keeping up their "Privacy" schtick. They need to have the infrastructure built to do what Governments want and then go full E2EE and be able to hold up the E2EE part as "most secure phone you can get!"
If they do it all in private, they don't get to market it how they want (at least not as clearly)
Overall, WHAT PRICE DO WE PAY FOR FREEDOM?????
Clearly this is an invasion of privacy and many will not buy a new Iphone because of this, my company included. This could be construed to be illegal, because the government IS working with apple on this one.
And if this happens, what's the next freedom will they take?
Clearly this is an invasion of privacy and many will not buy a new Iphone because of this, my company included. This could be construed to be illegal, because the government IS working with apple on this one.
And if this happens, what's the next freedom will they take?
Tim Cook has overstayed his welcome. Time for him to go.
The CSAM scanning thing was leaked out early and then Apple announced it.
I didn't even realize this part -- so they actually really didn't want to talk about it, perhaps until after iOS 15 was already fully out and installed and many millions had already upgraded?
Nothing is illegal for the United States government. The alphabet agencies have run roughshod over the rights of citizens for nearly a century now with little to no oversight.
And when congress gets on their asses, all they get is a wag of a finger.
As to what freedoms you may lose? Pick any of them. You’ve already lost them.