Apple Removes Five of Six Infowars Podcast Series From iTunes Directory

[Sora]

I did. I agreed with you, it was a dumb analogy with no application to the conversation. Simultaneously backing away from your own point and insisting it needs to be answered isn't doing you any favors.

You just keep shouting that this is a censorship issue, regardless of context or fact. That you now have to shoehorn your own NK references while also stating it's not a good 1:1 should probably give you an idea that you're backing a losing horse.

What's worse is that this isn't even a censorship issue. Censorship requires regulation. Regulation is enacted by the government.
No private company can enact governmental regulations.

Most often, people with a tenuous (the bold was for effect only) grasp of the first amendment, anti-discrimination laws, and censorship regulation frequently confuse and conflate them in open discourse - to the amusement of those who have only a cursory understanding of them - but enough to parse the differences.

 

[Glockworkorange]

More like taking Mein Kempf off the shelves.

I wouldn't equate Alex Jones with Hitler, but even if you did, it's still book burning.

What a monstrous place we've come to when people gleefully shut down views they feel are offensive or even abhorrent. Principles of free speech are meant to protect the most abhorrent views, or else free speech is meaningless.

Very disappointing. Moving on.

 

[Frank Dalton]

If I invite you into my house, you have the right to say whatever you want, but I also have the right to throw you out.

True. But this is more like opening a huge stadium with thousands of stages with people speaking to whoever wanders in to listen and then throwing out a particular speaker because you don’t like what he has to say.

It’s still your right but this is perhaps a more accurate analogy than your house.

 

[turbineseaplane]

True. But this is more like opening a huge stadium with thousands of stages with people speaking to whoever wanders in to listen and then throwing out a particular speaker because you don’t like what he has to say.

It’s still your right but this is perhaps a more accurate analogy than your house.

Good call..

Now Alex can be that lunatic religious whacko out front of the stadium harassing everyone at point blank range with a sign and a megaphone

 

[BruiserBear]

I wouldn't equate Alex Jones with Hitler, but even if you did, it's still book burning.

What a monstrous place we've come to when people gleefully shut down views they feel are offensive or even abhorrent. Principles of free speech are meant to protect the most abhorrent views, or else free speech is meaningless.

Very disappointing. Moving on.

No one is stopping Alex Jones from expressing his views. He can stand on a street corner all of today and tell the world what he thinks about anything. He can use his website to say anything he wants.

The thing you seem incapable of understanding is that other businesses, like youtube, or Apple, do not have to help him express his views to the public in any way, and today they chose to stop him from using their platforms. It's really not that complicated, and despite your whining, his free speech is 100% intact.

 

[Frank Dalton]

What's worse is that this isn't even a censorship issue. Censorship requires regulation. Regulation is enacted by the government.
No private company can enact governmental regulations.

Censorship does not require regulation nor a government. The fact that it is often practiced by governments does not mean it is solely in the domain of government bureaucrats.

 

[Rogifan]

No one is stopping Alex Jones from expressing his views. He can stand on a street corner all of today and tell the world what he thinks about anything. He can use his website to say anything he wants.

The thing you seem incapable of understanding is that other businesses, like youtube, or Apple, do not have to help him express his views to the public in any way, and today they chose to stop him from using their platforms. It's really not that complicated, and despite your whining, his free speech is 100% intact.

It took Apple this long to figure out Jones was violating their TOS? It’s not like he just started saying nutty things recently.

 

[thisisnotmyname]

********, that is NOTHING like Pizzagate. This a freaking random pizza shop, they make freaking pizza. Family Research Council is at least vocally political and potentially offends the people it discredits. Compared to code words that could equal a child porn dungeon in a pizza shop run by wealthy world leaders? Are you serious right now?

I missed the fine print where the example being requested was limited to locally owned food establishments. The point that was (incorrectly) being made was that mislabeling for political purposes only results in violence on the right. That's what I responded to. And in doing so I also stated that the violent acts are acts of insanity from people on fringes and not representative of right or left.

 

[turbineseaplane]

Censorship does not require regulation nor a government. The fact that it is often practiced by governments does not mean it is solely in the domain of government bureaucrats.

Censorship feels like the wrong term here..

These companies are moderating hateful and harmful garbage off of their platforms.

That's their right and they are exercising it.

Anyone can still go pull up "info"wars.com if they'd like.

 

[phalseHUD]

More like taking Mein Kempf off the shelves.

You can still buy Mein Kampf on the iBookstore

 

[BruiserBear]

It took Apple this long to figure out Jones was violating their TOS? It’s not like he just started saying nutty things recently.

It doesn't matter when or how they decided it violated their TOS. They have the right to decide at any moment when someone has crossed a line for them and are no longer welcome.

 

[chagla]

Alex J is a true #deplorable. Well done Apple. Apple is a private business with its guidelines, if you don't like it, use your own platform.

You can't falsely scream FIRE at a crowded cinema. It is very dangerous. Alex J does nothing good for society but spread unfounded and fictitious rumors. Unfortunately there are people who believe such things and as a result, we get pizzagate incidents. Some people are easily manipulated. So these kinds of false preaching should be stopped.

 

[Iconoclysm]

But I perceive you as being hateful. I call for you to be banned from the internet. Your logic, not mine.

So take him to court over it, see where it gets you. Jones on the other hand...

 

[neliason]

AJ makes videos and podcasts. Providing video evidence to fulfill your challenge is sufficient. I'm not going to transcribe his videos into text just because you can't be bothered to click the link I provided.

I didn’t ask you to transcribe his videos. I asked for a quote. That should be easy enough. A quote would take less time to type than your reply. Saying the evidence is ‘in there’ isn’t providing evidence. You have to identify the specific text.

When people won’t actually defend their claims it makes the claims suspect.

Again, I don’t believe that reverse racism is a real or concerning thing. She was a victim of racism and fought back in a stupid way. That’s all.

There isn’t reverse racism. There is just racism.

 

[saxman211]

True. But this is more like opening a huge stadium with thousands of stages with people speaking to whoever wanders in to listen and then throwing out a particular speaker because you don’t like what he has to say.

It’s still your right but this is perhaps a more accurate analogy than your house.

I understand... But the loudest person in that stadium.. and the one that's drawing the most attention with his/her rhetoric is probably going to be the first to get thrown out... imo

 

[turbineseaplane]

I understand... But the loudest person in that stadium.. and the one that's drawing the most attention with his/her rhetoric is probably going to be the first to get thrown out... imo

Especially if that guy violates the rules and runs onto the field with his shirt off...

 

[Sora]

I’m just trying to understand how far to take something. If some say it’s a good thing Apple removed Jones’s podcasts from its search directory then why aren’t these same people demanding Google adjust their algorithms so Jones doesn’t show up in searches? Why don’t they demand Twitter shadow ban him? Right now if I type Alex Jones in Twitter’s search his official Twitter account is the first thing that shows up.

Now we are talking!

Lets discuss the first issue - "how far to take something".
That statement is actually very deep. Capitalism has no ceiling. So a simple answer would be "as far as it can go". Limiting the actions of a private company is only done when it steps on the toes of government. See Facebook and Congress. We still have not seen what actions congress will take to regulate (censor) Facebook and how it interfaces with election advertisements that are purchased on their platform.

Your second "some say it's a good thing Apple removed Jones' podcasts from it's search directory - why aren't these people demanding Google adjust their algorithms......Why don't they demand Twitter shadow ban him?

This is a lot easier question to answer.
What "some people" say is anecdotal. What moves the needle is the people with whom a company does business. This is no shot in the dark. Apple is a liberal company. With strong liberal agendas (ie: equality for all, LGBTQ, #metoo, equal pay, equal employment, minority equity etc. etc. etc.). Apple....correction...all companies have a simple goal. Sell more ****. It does not bode well if the goals of the company (sell more ****), does not align with the people who they are selling to (people who believe in the mission statement of Apple). So, in order for Apple to sell more ****....they align their mission statement with the people whom they sell more **** to...in order to sell more ****.

Twitter and Google have an entirely different business model. Banning Jones may not align with the goals of their company to selling more **** - where **** = advertisement. Or, the people whom Twitter/Google does business with may not care that Google aligns itself (business wise) with Alex Jones.

Competing stake holders are a part of the formula that moves the needle for these companies. To actually find out why a company decides to take a stand in either direction - most often than not - just look at how they make their money, or look at what makes them more money. A company is not in the business of losing money. That company won't be around for long.

 

[Frank Dalton]

You're not really arguing anything, or at least not arguing it well.

The same could be said of you.

You're just repeating the same bad definition of censorship,

You can call it “bad” if you wish but it is correct. Merriam Webster includes under “censorship”: “1a : the institution, system, or practice of censoring.”

And the verb “to censor” includes: “to examine books, movies, letters, etc., in order to remove things that are considered to be offensive, immoral, harmful to society, etc.”

Apple is clearly engaging in the practice of censoring. Therefore, this is censorship.

only now with terrible analogies that you even agreed were bad thus the reason you admitted you needed to deflect criticism you expected due to said dumb analogies.

Absolutely wrong. I agreed with no such thing. I did not “admit” to “needing” to “deflect” anything. These are things I simply never said.

You are either being deliberately obtuse or you are something far less charitable. I will assume the former.

Don't get angry that your arguments are picked apart so easily. Make better arguments.

My arguments are fine. You are being disingenuous and intellectually dishonest. I’m not sure why but it makes you look silly.

 

[EightyTwenty]

Liberals are deeply authoritarian and love their censorship. It's what they are and have always been.

We all knew this was coming before the midterm elections. They are shook and need every advantage possible. There will be more purging of conservatives within the next few weeks and months.

Of course anti-white racism and hate speech is perfectly acceptable. Hell, it is promoted as a cultural good by the left. You have an unalloyed virulent racist just promoted to the New York Times editorial board with full privileges on Twitter, Facebook and YouTube (if she chooses).

We are entering dark times, folks. I hope liberals don't regret it too quickly, because it's coming.

 

[Frank Dalton]

Censorship feels like the wrong term here..

These companies are moderating hateful and harmful garbage off of their platforms.

That's their right and they are exercising it.

Anyone can still go pull up "info"wars.com if they'd like.

Moderation is a form of censorship. We can split hairs on whether that’s good or bad (or how far it should go), but I wish people on here would reframe this debate to where it belongs. Of course it’s their right to do so. But that doesn’t mean there can’t be a discussion on whether or not it’s a good idea or not.

 

[A.Goldberg]

Alex Jones is a vile individual.

I’m a proponent of free speech. In this case though I don’t see how Apple is obligated to provide him a platform, especially when there are other podcast platforms. I think things get a little more dicey with things like YouTube that essentially have a monopoly.

Jones has said a lot of nasty stuff. Apple doesn’t have to put up with it. Jones has made tens of millions peddling his conspiracy theories and snake oils. He can afford to create his own method of distribution.

 

[turbineseaplane]

He can afford to create his own method of distribution.

It's a great point...

I'm surprised they haven't all banded together and created "ConspiracyTube.com" to cater to Fox"news" viewers when the TV is off but the computer is on.

Have at it guys..
Flat Earth, fake news, truther bombshells.....just a nice deep rabbit hole of complete "awful"

 

[EightyTwenty]

Competing stake holders are a part of the formula that moves the needle for these companies. To actually find out why a company decides to take a stand in either direction - most often than not - just look at how they make their money, or look at what makes them more money. A company is not in the business of losing money. That company won't be around for long.

This decision had nothing to do with business. It was coordinated between the tech giants. All banned him within a 12 hour span not based on any new content... just because.

It's political and follows political pressure from CNN and other MSM outlets to ban Jones.

It is entirely political and has nothing to do with Jones and sure as hell has nothing to do with "hate speech" or violating TOS.

Linda Sarsour
Shawn King
Louis Farrakham
Antifa
Sara Jeong

All have free and open access to every tech giant platform. Things are about to pop off in a way they haven't since the 1960s. I sincerely hope people are prepared for what they are unleashing.

 

[A.Goldberg]

It's a great point...

I'm surprised they haven't all banded together and created "ConspiracyTube.com" to cater to Fox"news" viewers when the TV is off but the computer is on.

He can join up with Stormfront who as I recall in the not so distant past got dropped by their web host.

 

[Frank Dalton]

He can afford to create his own method of distribution.

What about someone who can’t?