Apple Reportedly Using Chinese Server Supplier to Migrate iCloud Service

[Gasu E.]

I agree with Ben Thompson who thinks the cloud is NOT something Apple should bring in house. I understand wanting to own the whole widget from a device standpoint but the cloud is not Apple's strength and rather than spending all this time bringing it in house they should either acquire Dropbox and run it as a subsidiary or let someone like Microsoft run the backend. Then Apple can focus its energy on best in class services that sit on top of the cloud.

Dropbox is just a service that runs on top of Amazon's cloud. Why would Apple want to offer that particular service? Apple is trying to develop its own infrastructure for it's own iCloud, iTunes, and other services because a. it's cheaper and b. why give so much money to your competitors (Amazon, Microsoft), who are the ones from whom they are currently buying infrastructure?

 

[PinkyMacGodess]

Why China? You can't tell me no company in this country was incapable of helping them.

Given China's penchant for spying, they better be damn focused on making sure that the Chinese firm doesn't vacuum all the data to sift through it later. And if Apple says 'Relax, we have a contract', China has been bound by many treaties and contracts, and has violated many of them...

 

[AFEPPL]

When all those data centers are done, will that be enough capacity to provide full in-house cloud services?

Plenty of space already.
Apple are just not good at offering cloud like application hence why they rely on others (MS, Google and AWS) to provide it for them.

 

[petsounds]

Why China? You can't tell me no company in this country was incapable of helping them.

Given China's penchant for spying, they better be damn focused on making sure that the Chinese firm doesn't vacuum all the data to sift through it later. And if Apple says 'Relax, we have a contract', China has been bound by many treaties and contracts, and has violated many of them...

It is strange, and a bit worrying, but then again so is the use of any Chinese-manufactured component, which is almost all electronics these days. But if the rumors of Apple looking at encrypting everything on iCloud are true, the Chinese wouldn't be able to do anything with the data stored on those servers.

 

[eas]

Why China? You can't tell me no company in this country was incapable of helping them.

Given China's penchant for spying, they better be damn focused on making sure that the Chinese firm doesn't vacuum all the data to sift through it later. And if Apple says 'Relax, we have a contract', China has been bound by many treaties and contracts, and has violated many of them...

If you didn't already know, China is the center of electronics manufacturing. So, any "US company" they turned to would have a good chance of manufacturing in China (just as US company Apple does).

Second, Apple earlier news suggests Apple is designing the servers. One might imagine that they would draw on expertise of their partner to help with the design of datacenter servers, but these are probably better understood as an Apple product for their internal use.

Third, Apple already gets a lot of revenue from China, and expects China to be a major part of future revenue growth. It's good business to cultivate partners/supporters in countries where you do business, even when those countries are western "democracies."

 

[prince_isaac]

Hard to say what involvement Inspur would have, but it's hard to imagine Apple working with a vendor who's website who calls it the "Smart Could". http://www.inspurglobal.com/articles-aboutinspur.html

 

[997440]

Why China? You can't tell me no company in this country was incapable of helping them.

Given China's penchant for spying, they better be damn focused on making sure that the Chinese firm doesn't vacuum all the data to sift through it later. And if Apple says 'Relax, we have a contract', China has been bound by many treaties and contracts, and has violated many of them...

$$$$$ from the Chinese market.

....
Amid the furor, Apple announced it was shifting local user data onto China-based servers.

The move was seen by some analysts as a concession to calm fears that Apple's infrastructure was compromised by U.S. intelligence. It came four years after Google pulled its search engine out of China in an unprecedented stand against the Chinese government over censorship.

Apple, one of only a handful of U.S. tech giants that have flourished in China, said the move was necessary to improve services for its growing Chinese user base. It added that all data on the servers were encrypted and inaccessible to China Telecom.

Even so, some security experts say the servers could be vulnerable.

Whatever data is on Chinese servers is susceptible to confiscation or even cryptanalysis," a sort of code cracking, said Jonathan Zdziarski, a leading expert in iPhone security.

The same could be said about access to data in servers in the U.S., Zdziarski said, the only difference being you need a subpoena.

But it's not just the servers that pose a risk. Apple's source codes could be stolen from one of its Chinese factories or during government security audits.

"Most of the hardware tools that have hacked iPhones in the past all came out of China, and that's probably for a reason," Zdziarski said. "It'd be foolish to think that Apple could form a safe and healthy relationship with the Chinese government that didn't put the U.S. at some level of higher risk."
.....

http://www.latimes.com/business/technology/la-fi-apple-china-20160226-story.html

 

[PinkyMacGodess]

$$$$$ from the Chinese market.

http://www.latimes.com/business/technology/la-fi-apple-china-20160226-story.html

So instead of being compromised by US 'intelligence', it will be compromised by Chinese government hackers.

Sure, I feel loads more comfortable. But what options do we have.

So, when does Apple's HQ move to China?

 

[997440]

So instead of being compromised by US 'intelligence', it will be compromised by Chinese government hackers.

Sure, I feel loads more comfortable. But what options do we have.

So, when does Apple's HQ move to China?

As far as the options, at this point it's still a rumor. I've never been enamored with the cloud so I use it sparingly. If/when Apple makes a move towards this, people will have to decide. Is cloud convenience greater than new security concerns? For me, no.

 

[Michaelgtrusa]

It is strange, and a bit worrying, but then again so is the use of any Chinese-manufactured component, which is almost all electronics these days. But if the rumors of Apple looking at encrypting everything on iCloud are true, the Chinese wouldn't be able to do anything with the data stored on those servers.

They will try to break it.
[doublepost=1460422989][/doublepost]

If you didn't already know, China is the center of electronics manufacturing. So, any "US company" they turned to would have a good chance of manufacturing in China (just as US company Apple does).

Second, Apple earlier news suggests Apple is designing the servers. One might imagine that they would draw on expertise of their partner to help with the design of datacenter servers, but these are probably better understood as an Apple product for their internal use.

Third, Apple already gets a lot of revenue from China, and expects China to be a major part of future revenue growth. It's good business to cultivate partners/supporters in countries where you do business, even when those countries are western "democracies."

The center because everyone, the U.S moved the jobs to them, they didn't invent a thing the way of electronics.
[doublepost=1460423080][/doublepost]

So instead of being compromised by US 'intelligence', it will be compromised by Chinese government hackers.

Sure, I feel loads more comfortable. But what options do we have.

So, when does Apple's HQ move to China?

IBM and other American companies that invented the server.

 

[peterdevries]

Since china couldn't invent a damn thing they had to buy into/ask for tech transfers and then this

I visited the 10.000 fte Huawei innovation and R&D facility two years ago in Shanghai. You should see their wall of patents. You are so incredibly wrong.

 

[Cheffy Dave]

Well there goes our data...

NOT ME, I'M OUT

 

[phrehdd]

Might just be me, but often when I see your posts for a maybe split second at least words like, racist and bigot pop into my head. Anyhow, that’s just my opinion.
Wikipedia has a different view of things, (below is a small snippet);
China has been the source of many innovations, scientificdiscoveries and inventions.[1] This includes the Four Great Inventions: papermaking, the compass, gunpowder, and printing (both woodblock and movable type). The list below contains these and other inventions in China attested by archaeology or history.

For ease, I’ve included a hyperlink for you HERE.

What comes to mind is those that take long past accomplishments and try to marry them to today's world. China got its technology from the West. - Live with it.

As for Wiki - saying "China" with respect to the days of those inventions is silly given that the borders were very different. Talk about ethnocentric references. Sigh.

I always advocate that we look at history and know the truth and facts about events, inventions and the like but I don't equate it to entire nations but rather, individuals. Also inventions may show up in more than one area of the globe at similar times or generations apart. Both are discoveries/inventions tied to a locale and individual.

Last - when we talk about China today, it would be wise if we are on the same page in discussion, have proper working definitions to reference economies and the like THEN set forth in a reasonable adult conversation. Leave the race card for the lackluster thinking and those that remain with dolt offerings.

 

[H2SO4]

What comes to mind is those that take long past accomplishments and try to marry them to today's world. China got its technology from the West. - Live with it.

As for Wiki - saying "China" with respect to the days of those inventions is silly given that the borders were very different. Talk about ethnocentric references. Sigh.

I always advocate that we look at history and know the truth and facts about events, inventions and the like but I don't equate it to entire nations but rather, individuals. Also inventions may show up in more than one area of the globe at similar times or generations apart. Both are discoveries/inventions tied to a locale and individual.

Last - when we talk about China today, it would be wise if we are on the same page in discussion, have proper working definitions to reference economies and the like THEN set forth in a reasonable adult conversation. Leave the race card for the lackluster thinking and those that remain with dolt offerings.

I didn’t say that particular post alone. Have a look through if you want. It was a collection of posts that made my mind come lean that way. Ignore the fact that this thread is about China in isolation.
Also we wouldn’t be where we are today without those that were here before. iCloud didn’t just magically come to be like some mystical being.

 

[nick42983]

You do realize the US's space program succeeded in the 50s and 60s in large part because of German scientists they came here after the war, or the guns that protect our freedom are here because of the Chinese inventing gun powder.

While the US has created many great wonders, and invented a lot of awesome technology, China has a history that spans millennia and it includes great achievements that are not easily swept under the rug.

Gunpowder was invented a thousand years ago, I think "what have you invented lately?" applies here. I don't think anyone is trying to sweep Chinese achievements under the rug. What the Chinese government has done though is sweep it's history of genocide against its own people under the rug. China is a totalitarian state. It's shameful that the U.S. decided to open up relations with them under Nixon. In return we've gotten industrial espionage on an unprecedented scale and a gutted manufacturing base. China hasn't gotten a fraction of the criticism it deserves.

 

[JamesPDX]

The matter in question has to do with a track record of hacking and piracy, and nothing else.

I would prefer that the iCloud data centers be in Prineville -or the like. I've downgraded my iCloud storage plan back to 5GB. -The fact that it's unencrypted is risky enough. Is the US-side storage for apps, OS, iOS and such? Until iCloud is encrypted and the servers and drives are on US soil, I will seek an alternative. Better safe than sorry.

Oh, and just one more thing...

http://www.oregonlive.com/silicon-forest/index.ssf/2015/09/apple_buys_another_200_acres_i.html

 

[winston1236]

I supported Apple's efforts to protect privacy in the FBI case until now. Total, complete fail Apple. Using a Chinese vendor for cloud services? If true, you have lost all credibility in your claim you care about privacy.

There is zero chance a Chinese vendor isn't, eventually, going to be subject to the whims of the Chinese government. Tim Cook - you are a fraud ( if this is true).

Seriously - Apple couldn't find an American company? How about Canadian? British... ??

Apple has definitely lost the chance of any government contracts to use their services, these servers will never meet the criteria due to the China influence.
[doublepost=1460468225][/doublepost]

You do realize the US's space program succeeded in the 50s and 60s in large part because of German scientists they came here after the war, or the guns that protect our freedom are here because of the Chinese inventing gun powder.

While the US has created many great wonders, and invented a lot of awesome technology, China has a history that spans millennia and it includes great achievements that are not easily swept under the rug.

It was more of a stalk and kidnap vs them 'coming here.' But you are right, without a German scientist we would not have made it to the moon when we did.

 

[997440]

They will try to break it.
[doublepost=1460422989][/doublepost]
The center because everyone, the U.S moved the jobs to them, they didn't invent a thing the way of electronics.
[doublepost=1460423080][/doublepost]
IBM and other American companies that invented the server.

Story on Inspur's presence in the server business :

.....
Years of struggle
The success of Inspur, founded in the 1960s as Shandong Electronic Equipment Factory, is generating its own legend. According to accounts in state media featured on the company's website, Sun, then vice chief engineer, led a team a researchers to Singapore, Hong Kong and other cities in a quest to get around Western controls on technology exports to communist countries. There they reverse engineered discarded foreign equipment, and after two years of struggle, produced China's first server in 1993.

After building a strong presence in the domestic market for low-end servers, Inspur began work on high-end machines in 2003, finally producing the Tiansuo K1 after a decade's effort with direct government support. An account by state-run Xinhua news agency called it a "historic moment ... signifying that China had become the third country to master the core technology of servers in the world after the U.S. and Japan."

.....

http://asia.nikkei.com/Business/Companies/Inspur-seizes-ground-from-US-tech-rivals

I visited the 10.000 fte Huawei innovation and R&D facility two years ago in Shanghai. You should see their wall of patents. You are so incredibly wrong.

It's possible that the wall of patents were legitimate and significant. Should any appearances presented by them be trusted? A 2012 US House Investigative Report on the U.S. National Security Issues Posed by Chinese Telecommunications Companies Huawei and ZTE :

.....
A. The Committee finds that Huawei did not fully cooperate with the investigation and was unwilling to explain its relationship with the Chinese government or Chinese Communist Party, while credible evidence exists that it fails to comply with U.S. laws.

Throughout this investigation, Huawei officials sought to portray the company as transparent. Huawei consistently refused, however, to provide detailed answers in written form or provide internal documentation to support their answers to questions at the heart of the investigation. Specifically, Huawei would not fully describe the history, structure, and management of Huawei and its subsidiaries to the Committee’s satisfaction. The Committee received almost no information on the role of Chinese Communist Party Committee within Huawei or specifics about how Huawei interacts in formal channels with the Chinese government. Huawei refused to provide details about its business operations in the United States, failed to disclose details of its dealings with the Chinese military or intelligence services, and would not provide clear answers on the firm’s decision-making processes. Huawei also failed to provide any internal documents in response to the Committee’s written document requests, thus impeding the Committee’s ability to evaluate fully the company’s answers or claims.

In addition to discussions with Huawei officials, the Committee has interviewed several current and former employees of Huawei USA, whose employees describe a company that is managed almost completely by the Huawei parent company in China, thus undermining Huawei’s claims that its United States operations are largely independent of parent company. The testimony and evidence of individuals who currently or formerly worked for Huawei in the United States or who have done business with Huawei also brought to light several very serious allegations of illegal behavior that require additional investigation. The Committee will refer these matters to the Executive Branch for potential investigation.
.....

http://intelligence.house.gov/sites...s/Huawei-ZTE Investigative Report (FINAL).pdf

 

[Michaelgtrusa]

I visited the 10.000 fte Huawei innovation and R&D facility two years ago in Shanghai. You should see their wall of patents. You are so incredibly wrong.

Did they buy them? You should look into that!

 

[Parasprite]

I don't think folks are being Xenophobic, I think many are commenting on the fact that China is one of the biggest threats to our national security these days due to the enormous amount of hacking. This information is provided by the media and government or in some cases people's own experiences.

I'm not trying to be contradictory or antagonistic here, but where does NSA/PRISM place in this?

 

[PinkyMacGodess]

As far as the options, at this point it's still a rumor. I've never been enamored with the cloud so I use it sparingly. If/when Apple makes a move towards this, people will have to decide. Is cloud convenience greater than new security concerns? For me, no.

It does make me wonder if some of Apple's 'everything is encrypted' isn't smoke and mirrors, and a challenge for Chinese hackers...

 

[Black Magic]

I'm not trying to be contradictory or antagonistic here, but where does NSA/PRISM place in this?

Those are issues as well. In fairness, the article was referencing a Chinese company not NSA or Prism.

 

[Osty]

Well say bye bye to privacy and security then.

Lol, you think the other providers are any better.
[doublepost=1460523475][/doublepost]

Comment templates for any other option:

1. Microsoft = Sell outs that joined Prism day 1
2. Google = In bed with govt. and joined Prism
3. Any other US mfg. = They're sell outs or too stupid to protect our data
4. European mfg. = This makes it even easier for NSA spying, dam you Timmy!
5. Russia = In soviet Russia, server spies on you...
6. China = Of course the Chinese government is gonna hack us, dam you Timmy for selling out!
7. Shut down the whole dam program = Apple sucks and is way behind the rest of the technology world, Steve wouldn't let this happen!

Damned if you do, Damned if you don't....

Now let's hear a serious decision by people in detail if they were in Tim's shoes!

1. Stop using proprietary software and services
2. Install Linux on your desktop
3. Install CM or Ubuntu Touch on your mobile device
4. Spin up your own server (or VPS) running Linux or BSD
5. Install OwnCloud or Syncthing on your server
6. Ditch Gmail/Hotmail/Yahoo and set up your own Dovecot/Postfix email server
7. Polish your tinfoil hat and try to convince others to do so.

Otherwise, stop whinging. No vendor of proprietary software has *your* interests at heart unless you are a major shareholder.

 

[ChrisA]

I supported Apple's efforts to protect privacy in the FBI case until now. Total, complete fail Apple. Using a Chinese vendor for cloud services? If true, you have lost all credibility in your claim you care about privacy....

Did you READ the article. The Chinese company only builds the hardware server boxes. They build computers. Apple buys these servers and installs then inside Apple data centers in Reno NV and other places around the world.

Said another way. Apple is doing exactly the opposite of what you think, they are moving iCloud service into their own facilities.

Kind of the same with MacBooks, made in China but does not stay in China.

 

[bergert]

guys - they are not out-sourcing the cloud servers:

they are buying hardware from a chinese company to in-source (bring in house) - iCLOUD (which is on Amazon and Google right now). You need racks of custom-designed server hardware for that. So the only thing coming from China is the hardware.