Apple Reports $1.67 Billion Profit for Q4 2009, Most Profitable Quarter Ever

[LagunaSol]

You're clearly correct - 95% market share proves their incompetence.

Not sure why I have to point this out, but you weren't commenting on their market share (though that's always a safe (if tired) position to retreat to, eh?) - you were commenting on the use of their cash. And the use of their cash has been pitiful at best, as any shareholder can tell you, burning boatloads of it in a desperate attempt at cool. The Xbox and Zune debacles weren't enough, now they're paying people to use their search engine. Now there's confidence in your product! Not to mention their sure-to-be-doomed wannabe Apple Stores. It would all be funny if it weren't so sad.

You may want to check out the graph of their stock price over the last 5+ years. Can you say flatline? Not a ringing endorsement of their reinvestment strategy. Not that logic will appeal to you if it's to Microsoft's discredit.

I'll take Apple's cash management over Microsoft's any day of the week.

So, 95% market share means that the rule of the average is true and nothing else. Go figure.

The WinBots love to trumpet their massive market share while proclaiming Apple users to be sheep. Yep, go figure.

 

[Eidorian]

this begs the question, why is the MBP 17" $600 more than the 24" iMac 3.06Ghz? Because it has a hinge?

Hardware disparity is much slower on notebooks due to volume. It's glaring on the desktop front for anything a consumer can afford. A desktop using notebook processors? Well a Core 2 is still a Core 2 today as it was in 2006.

 

[sn00pie]

Apples stock is soaring once again. Great news for shareholders

 

[cumanzor]

Not sure why I have to point this out, but you weren't commenting on their market share (though that's always a safe (if tired) position to retreat to, eh?) - you were commenting on the use of their cash. And the use of their cash has been pitiful at best, as any shareholder can tell you, burning boatloads of it in a desperate attempt at cool. The Xbox and Zune debacles weren't enough, now they're paying people to use their search engine. Now there's confidence in your product! Not to mention their sure-to-be-doomed wannabe Apple Stores. It would all be funny if it weren't so sad.

You may want to check out the graph of their stock price over the last 5+ years. Can you say flatline? Not a ringing endorsement of their reinvestment strategy. Not that logic will appeal to you if it's to Microsoft's discredit.

I'll take Apple's cash management over Microsoft's any day of the week.



The WinBots love to trumpet their massive market share while proclaiming Apple users to be sheep. Yep, go figure.

All I will say, like it has been said many times, and only shortsighted people would disagree, is that the Xbox is probably among the best investments MS has done. You are just being antiMS, but I understand. (I also understand the ridiculous failure rates of the Xbox 360, but the fact that people come back 3 and 4 times just proves how important brand recognition is in this segment).

MS is not going anywhere any time soon, Dell/HP/Sony/whatever are not going anywhere either. Apple naturally will keep gaining market share, but as I'm sure you agree, they are a niche market (premium) and they won't get a significant marketshare. I would also like to point, once again, that this has turned into a MS/Bill Gates/Steve Ballmer bash fest, as usual....

 

[charlituna]

"We've got a very strong lineup for the holiday season and some really great new products in the pipeline for 2010."

Does that mean no new macs until after the holidays?

the Mac is not a 'great new product'. it would be a revised product.

a GNP would be like when the first iphone went out. something new and fresh and unseen.,

which means that at some point in the next year there will be something Apple has never had before. like a media server computer, or the rumored tablet. something like that.

OR, as my roommate pointed out, the earnings report clearly shows that Apple's fiscal year ain't Jan-Dec. more like perhaps Oct-Sept/Sept-Aug. so what if they mean Fiscal 2010 which we are already in. so at any point they could have a GNP (though I doubt they would do it with just a press release so we'll know a week or two ahead of time that something is up cause they will announce the announcement)

Too bad no one wants to buy a >$1K computer anymore.

oh yeah. you do know that only one mac computer is under $1k and only by $1.

i'd say these numbers show that folks are more than willing to buy said computers

New iMacs with Win7 pre-installed would be the ultimate middle-finger salute.

never happen. ever. but go ahead and hold your breath

1. Apple makes its own OS
2. Apple doesn't want to support Windows
3. Microsoft will charge them a small fortune to license it, even if they allowed it.

3 Million Macs in a recession? Hmmmm, seems someone will get an extra bonus paycheck.... and back at Redmond you can hear the sound of baboons crying...

that's not a baboon, that's Ballmer.

as for the bonus, perhaps everyone that was working at a retail store from the start of said quarter will get a free iTablet when it comes out tomorrow.

and by the end of the month, they will be on Ebay. lol

 

[LagunaSol]

All I will say, like it has been said many times, and only shortsighted people would disagree, is that the Xbox is probably among the best investments MS has done.

Ludicrous, no matter how many times it's said. Billions in the hole yet Nintendo is cleaning their clock with the lowly Wii. And Sony will stomp them this holiday season (same price console with Blu-Ray, wireless and free online gaming makes it a no-brainer choice for PS3).

How many copies of Marathon, er, Halo does Microsoft have to sell to make this project anything but a fiasco? Hint: exponentially more than they have sold.

And that people are willing to have their hardware replaced 3, 4, 5 times without a massive uprising is not a testament to the brand appeal of Xbox but a testament to consumer gullibility. I had a friend who praised the quality of his Chevy van despite the fact it had been in the shop a dozen times and the transmission failed at 80k miles. That's not customer loyalty, that's customer stupidity.

MS is not going anywhere any time soon

Of course they aren't. There are always plenty of people willing to buy mediocre crap. (Though eventually the gravy train of idiocy starts to lose steam - see my Chevy example above.)

Apple naturally will keep gaining market share, but as I'm sure you agree, they are a niche market (premium) and they won't get a significant marketshare.

I certainly hope you're right - I don't need the malware worries.

I would also like to point, once again, that this has turned into a MS/Bill Gates/Steve Ballmer bash fest, as usual....

And once again there is plenty of Apple-bashing commentary in this thread too. Despite this being...MacRumors. Odd how that happens.

 

[inkswamp]

Don't get too excited, folks. Make sure you've read this sobering piece from Business Week that tells us why Apple is going to fail. And just think: this prescient piece of... prognostication was written way back in 2001. The writer is clearly the modern-day Nostradamus.



Gees, seriously, you'd think some sites would quietly remove embarrassing articles like that.

I certainly hope you're right - I don't need the malware worries.

There's no evidence that a higher market share brings more viruses. We have only one model upon which to base that assumption: Windows. And there are multiple examples that show the opposite. Read the article in my sig for a thorough summary. If OS X were going to have virus problems on the same scale as Windows, we'd have already seen it by now.

 

[Goona]

Damn the Apple haters must be having sleepless nights.

 

[BuddyTronic]

I really wanted someone to ask if Apple plans to continue investment in the Apple TV.

Oh they will for sure - no doubt about it.

Apple TV is already the best way to look at photo's on the big LCD TV screen, and the movie rental thing is pretty good - I just wish they would make a better selection of flicks.

As for YouTube on TV - Apple TV also rocks.

How far they take it remains to be seen, but it can make money for Apple if more people start to appreciate what it really delivers rather than how it compares on pricing and feature list with a PVR tivo type device. It does what it does right now, and I must have rented 30 movies off of it in the last year, so that's revenue for Apple.

 

[BuddyTronic]

More importantly users care about value and there is simply no way for a iMac to look good when it is sporting two anemic laptop processors. Look at the numbers and then try to repeat your statement with a straight face. Bet you can't.

The fact is users do go about trying to select a good buy for their PC dollar. Quad cores are a feature that can separate the older technology form the newer in the users mind. I'm not saying this is right or always yields the best machine for the user but it is simple. More importantly a quad core machine running Windows is very fast and responsive, the obvious conclusion there is that if more hardware helps Windows then it will help Mac OS.

So again look at the crappy sales numbers as related to Apples consumer desktop lineup. Now tell me what is a common factor that these machine have. Well one factor is crappy hardware built on a grossly outdated desktop line up. A close second is a set of machines that are well known for being bitches to service, something that is extremely important during a recession. Just as close is the reality they don't meet the needs of modern users in the digital hub age, an age that Apple identified and promoted.

Personally if I was a stock holder I'd be really pissed and be leaning hard on the board to wake up the leadership team at Apple and get with the program or face replacement. Unfortunately I don't have that influence, nor frankly do I want to own Apple stock. Part of the reluctance comes from Apples lack of backbone when dealing with fringe elements like Green Peace.


Dave

Naw - most people don't care about all that stuff you are talking about dude.

Most of them are just pleased that if they use OS X they won't have their screen taken over by happy face zombie virii.

If you are a mega mac geek and want more processing power, you must be stuck in 1999. Back then it was more of an issue, but I don't hear any video or animation or photoshop guys on Mac really crying about it. Most of them are happy to use their 4 year old towers and couldn't stomach paying another 7 grand for a killer setup again.

As for Greenpeace - what are you saying - lack of backbone? What? Do you want them to pull a George W on Greenpeace or something? How would that be a good thing for them to do. Apple cleaned up some chemicals in their production line, and Greenpeace thinks that's good, and the consumer pays a little more perhaps for this, but overall it makes Apple more competitive. Nobody really seeks out or wants a computer that results in more bad chemicals in the environment. So what "lack of backbone" are you talking about I wonder?

 

[BuddyTronic]

Damn the Apple haters must be having sleepless nights.

lol - true that!

Just wait until tommorrow, and we'll have all of Steve Balmers paid flunkies writing their version of the quarterly report - listing off how Apple as a computer company is toast, etc. etc etc. More propoganda suitable for CNN "investigative journalism" fans ONLY. Just wait and see.

 

[philbeeney]

Anyone else notice the part about new carrier in Canada?

That's been known since the beginning of October. It's more Rogers losing their exclusivity of the iPhone as Bell and Telus will be launching a 3G GSM network in Canada in November.

https://www.macrumors.com/2009/10/05/rogers-iphone-exclusivity-in-canada-to-end-next-month/

 

[BongoBanger]

Ludicrous, no matter how many times it's said. Billions in the hole yet Nintendo is cleaning their clock with the lowly Wii. And Sony will stomp them this holiday season (same price console with Blu-Ray, wireless and free online gaming makes it a no-brainer choice for PS3).

Actually it's not - I did some calcs after a similar discussion. Never got round to finishing them but the gist of it is that MS didn't lose as much money as was claimed on development (there are quotes of $20 Billion but these are overstated as these costs include Search and other initiatives). If you assume an ASP of $200, return and repair costs, a 80% take of on Gold Live memberships and, say, a $2 return on games sold plus a percentage of other service revenue coupled with current sales rate it breaks even in about 10-15 years.

Not great and the quality issues were laughable - Apple have some issues but nothing on that scale - but it's a success if it maintains sales. Of course, 10 years is a long time.

The Xbox is a great console managed in a cack handed way.

 

[MorphingDragon]

Actually it's not - I did some calcs after a similar discussion. Never got round to finishing them but the gist of it is that MS didn't lose as much money as was claimed on development (there are quotes of $20 Billion but these are overstated as these costs include Search and other initiatives). If you assume an ASP of $200, return and repair costs, a 80% take of on Gold Live memberships and, say, a $2 return on games sold plus a percentage of other service revenue coupled with current sales rate it breaks even in about 10-15 years.

Not great and the quality issues were laughable - Apple have some issues but nothing on that scale - but it's a success if it maintains sales. Of course, 10 years is a long time.

The Xbox is a great console managed in a cack handed way.

A product only fails if it breaks even or you lose money form it.

LagunaSol, Good Job for making Aiden squirm.

 

[BongoBanger]

A product only fails if it breaks even or you lose money form it.

LagunaSol, Good Job for making Aiden squirm.

Sure. But since the project makes money in year 11 to 16 depending on how optimistic you are it's not a failure. Badly managed yes - this should have been break even by 10 years maximum, failure no.

 

[winmacuser]

"Apple Reports $1.67 Billion Profit for Q4 2009, Most Profitable Quarter Ever"

Judging from the prices and the "buy-a-product-to-buy-more"-philosophy (App Store, iTunes, Genius), this isn't exciting news.

 

[gnasher729]

uh, excuse me? You didn't hear about Microsoft and T-Mobile dumping all their customer's data in the MS cloud that evaporated? PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE DO NOT MOVE TO A CLOUD Solution Apple!

From what I am hearing, the failure was due to a bone-headed decision by nobody else but Roz Ho, who used to run Microsoft's Macintosh software division. A combination of three problems:

1. Their data centre only had enough storage for one complete backup.
2. Because of (1), making a new backup had to erase the previous one.
3. Before a hardware upgrade, they started a new backup.
4. That backup was supposed to take six days. After two days, Roz Ho had enough and ordered to do the hardware upgrade without a backup.
5. After the hardware upgrade, things went wrong and everything got messed up.

(1)+(2) is unacceptable. You must have enough hardware to make sure that you _always_ have a backup.

(4) is more than unacceptable. Doing a hardware upgrade without having _any_ backup, that is completely unbelievable.

(5) is something that you expect to happen. That is what backups are for.

There's a saying that clever people learn from their mistakes, wise people learn from other people's mistake. We can hope that Apple learns from this event.

 

[inkswamp]

"Apple Reports $1.67 Billion Profit for Q4 2009, Most Profitable Quarter Ever"

Judging from the prices and the "buy-a-product-to-buy-more"-philosophy (App Store, iTunes, Genius), this isn't exciting news.

What an empty, pointless critique. I'd have more respect for you Apple-bashers if you'd just come right out and acknowledge the irrational hatred for a computer company rather than trying to couch it in pseudo-intellectual rationales.

Name something--anything--computer-related that isn't based on the buy-a-product-to-buy-more philosophy. Or do you just buy your computer and use it out-of-the-box as is without buying any software or peripherals? Do you not pay for an Internet connection for the computer? Or do you never buy toner and paper for your printer? Or do you never buy CD-Rs or external storage? Even games thrive on subscription and after-market content sales models. What about websites? You ever paid for additional services on an otherwise free website?

But, yeah, I know... iTunes... App Store. It's all about Big Bad Apple and Steve Jobs' insatiable greed.

 

[gnasher729]

Many financial advisors would consider it foolish to have huge piles of cash, vs investing (that is, "spending") that money on improving the product lines.

So, with Apples' smaller market cap and larger "cash" position than Microsoft, those analysts would say that Microsoft is the better managed company.

There were also analysts who cried how incompetently Apple was run when the company repaid the last of its debt...

One reason why Microsoft right now has less cash than Apple is because the company is poorly managed and wastes hundreds of millions at a time on different adventures. They have Windows and Office that make money, but they sell X-Boxes that keep on catching fire, they threw away T-Mobile's data, they have a search engine where they have to pay people to use it, all cases of bad management.

 

[MorphingDragon]

There were also analysts who cried how incompetently Apple was run when the company repaid the last of its debt....

So the analysts are judging the new Management because they paid of the previous managent's debt?

Go Team Retard!

One reason why Microsoft right now has less cash than Apple is because the company is poorly managed and wastes hundreds of millions at a time on different adventures. They have Windows and Office that make money, but they sell X-Boxes that keep on catching fire, they threw away T-Mobile's data, they have a search engine where they have to pay people to use it, all cases of bad management.

I said it before and i'll say it again. Ballmer needs to be shot.

I still wonder why Vodafone (T-Mobile) went with Microsoft for the cloud.

 

[OllyW]

I still wonder why Vodafone (T-Mobile) went with Microsoft for the cloud.

What do you mean by Vodafone (T-Mobile)?

They are two completely different companies.

 

[MorphingDragon]

What do you mean by Vodafone (T-Mobile)?

They are two completely different companies.

Oot, NVM. I'm at home sick and trying to kill time. I'm juggling convos with MSN. Not the first time I've done it.

 

[johnnyjibbs]

- Looking forward to new products in 2010

No new hardware tomorrow? Or just confirmation that the iTablet isn't coming this year?

Glad I've got shares in Apple!!!

 

[Winni]

The Xbox and Zune debacles weren't enough,

What Xbox debacle? Did I miss something? The 360 is the best console on the market and has sold more units than the PS3. But what's even more important, the 360 is the only console that has the games that _I_ want to play. And it's got a lot of those titles.

By the way, Google is also paying people to use their search and ad services. Ballmer wants to be #2 in the Internet search market quickly, so he's pulling some strings to get there.

The Zune. Let's talk about this thing again once Microsoft begins to sell it outside the United States. I wouldn't be surprised if the Zune would be a success in Europe -- the European market is very different to the one in the US, and especially here in Germany people watch the prices and compare products by actual feature lists. And that's usually stuff where Microsoft does a much better job than Apple.

 

[MorphingDragon]

What Xbox debacle? Did I miss something? The 360 is the best console on the market and has sold more units than the PS3. But what's even more important, the 360 is the only console that has the games that _I_ want to play. And it's got a lot of those titles.

Now thats what we call an opinion, Boys and Girls.

Now my opinion is that most 360 games are a cavalcade of mediocrisy. Apart from Mass Effect .