Apple’s MacBook Pro: Rotting Core? What Apple Doesn't Want You To Realize.

[wikoogle]

http://www.tomsguide.com/us/macbookpro-apple-refresh-opinion,review-1513.html

Yikes!

At first, looking at the title, I thought it was a hit job, but once I read the article, and thought about it, I completely agree.

It's sad, and absolutely pathetic, that a top of the line, maxed out high end $3000+ Macbook Pro still has a GPU designed in 2007 and has no option for a 1080p or higher res screen capable of displaying HD content, no option for a blu ray drive, no option for an SSD, no option for a hdmi port, and no option for a core i processor.

When I think Apple, I think innovation. Innovation along these lines...

I posted earlier about apple putting a small ssd into the next mbp's in addition to a normal hdd. I don't mean a literal 1.8" or 2.5" ssd. I just looked up how much an 8 GB NAND memory IC costs. Bought in a reel of 1000, it costs a grand total of $10. Integrated into the spot where the old north bridge used to be, apple could not only have switchable graphics but also hybrid drives on each of its systems. By shutting down the harddrive and using the flash module for most activities could result in vastly faster performance and longer battery life. Put the OS on there and you could be enjoying what, 10 hours of battery life and (instantanous) boot times. I could wait another month for that.

Here's the link for the NAND IC I mentioned:
http://search.digikey.com/scripts/DkSearch/dksus.dll?Detail&name=557-1372-2-ND

Now, that's the kind of innovation that would be a dream come true and be a knock out killing blow to all other competing laptops. Because it would really make for blazing fast speeds, much lower power consumption and close to instantanous boot times...

Yet, when I look at the Macbook Pro line, I see something so far behind the competition in terms of the tech curve that it makes my head spin.

Right now, all the innovation in the laptop segment is coming from competitors.
http://www.sonystyle.com/webapp/wcs...gId=-1&categoryId=8198552921644570897#gallery

Sony Vaio Z
Design: Aluminium + Carbon Fiber Unibody
Weight: 3.07lbs
Screen: 13.1", 1920 x 1080 Resolution
CPU: Core i7-620M. 3.33GHz Turbo. 35W TDP. 4MB L2 Cache
RAM: 8GB DDR3
SDD: 512GB Solid State Harddrive (Configurable With Up to Four Solid State Raid 0 Drives)
Graphics: Nvidia 330M GT 1GB GDDR3 and Intel HD integrated - switchable
Battery: Sony: 6 Hours (8-10 hrs when used in the Stamina Mode)
Optical Drive: Blu-Ray Burner/DVD Burner/CD Burner
Other: x3 USB2.0, x1 HDMI Out, VGA Out, 802.11 a/b/g/n, GB Ethernet, 2.1 Bluetooth, webcam, mic, SD, Expresscard, Memstick

If you're wondering what's so innovative about that, or how Sony managed to pack in so much power into such a tiny shell, here is your answer...
http://translate.google.com/transla...ined-by-project-leader/&sl=zh-CN&tl=en&swap=1

Now THAT'S a premium laptop that is actually worth the premium price. Because it actually innovates so many aspects of the design, something Apple it seems has forgotten how to do..

Apple NEEDS to adopt blu ray, an i5, the ATI 5830 (or a current gen GPU), a higher resolution 1080p capable screen, and maybe even some different color options for the top of the laptop with their next update or their brand name should by all rights take a big hit atleast among the tech community and eventually the general population.

I would even be happy with some modest innovations like Built in HD Radio/HD TV tuner with QASM cable-in so you could pick up and watch HD channels OTA directly on your laptop, an improved HD resolution iSight Video Camera with Bigger Better Light Sensors, an Optional Matte Screen for those who want it, an Optional multitouch possibly detachable or flip screen, an oleophobic coating on the screen or maybe even the whole laptop, A Premium Carbon Fiber Unibody Case Option (Significantly Lighter, and if used as it is in sports equipment, damn near indestructable.), Either 120GB SSD Drives or the recent 750GB 7200 RPM Laptop HDDs, USB 3.0 or Light Peak. But I would be surprised if Apple innovated any of these things even.

For those who don't see the point of blu ray. Here's a comparison of an upconverted dvd on a 7 inch screen, versus a blu ray on a 7 inch screen.

Why is all this important?

Because whether you guys realize it or not, the opinion of the tech community filters out to the rest of the population pretty quickly. EVERYONE has some techie that they know and turn to for advice whenever they're buying something as expensive as a new laptop. An year or so ago, any techie could honestly say that the Macbook Pros perform just as well or better than any Windows computer. Hell, for the longest time, the G3, G4 and G5 PowerPC processors consistently outperformed the Intel offerings.

And yes, before I ask that question here, I fully realize that some people on this forum are Apple fanboys who will defend Apple no matter how far behind the competition they fall. And yes I realize that some people here regularly and adamantly insist that the majority of Macbook Users are stupid when it comes to computers and have no idea what components are in them and thus it doesn't matter how little their laptops offer. I surmise that this claim is not true, lots of Macbook PRO users are aware of what it's in their laptops.

Nevertheless, even if you naysayers are correct and Mac users are indeed ignorant regarding technology, it's still unfair of Apple to charge the exact same for a laptop with two to four year old components that are now far cheaper and outdated as it charged for them two years ago when they were still fairly new. Just as it would be wrong if Apple still used G4 processors, 1 gig of ram, and other technology from many years ago in their Macbook Pros and continued to charge $2000 for them.

 

[ayeying]

Honestly, many of the Apple customers don't know crap about specs or whats better and whats not.

Unless you're a techie, they don't care.

 

[wikoogle]

What is innovative about that? Its a computer with good specs and 3G built in, whats so innovative about that?

Here's just some of the reasons why the Sony Vaio Z is so innovative...
http://translate.google.com/transla...ined-by-project-leader/&sl=zh-CN&tl=en&swap=1

That just covers the innovative aspects of it's structural design. But there's a lot more ways that it's well ahead of the pack.

The fact that it has a quad SSD configuration (4 seperate 128 gb SSDs) to make it the first half terabyte SSD 13 inch laptop in existance.

It's carbon fiber alloy that's damn near indestructable and yet still weights in at 3 pounds.

The fact that it offers a slim line blu ray burner, built in 3G and just about every feature anyone could ask for in such a compact design.

The fact that it is comparable to the Macbook Air in terms of portability and size and yet outperforms 99% of the high end Desktops out there.

The innovative power saving features and the Stamina mode that give it ridiculously good battery life all while offering a 1080p resolution.

The switchability of Nvidia 330M GT 1GB GDDR3 and Intel HD integrated with the click of a button.

I haven't seen most of those features on any laptop ever designed. Sure a couple of them have been done before individually, but not quite like this. The fact that all those advancement were made in one and the same laptop, one with excellent build quality and construction, is pretty damn innovative.

If that's not an innovative laptop, then what the hell is?


Ayeying,

EVERYONE knows a techie that they turn to for advice when buying $1000+ electronics, be it HDTVs or Laptops. There's about two dozen people that asked me for laptop advice in just the past two years. And I'm sure the same is true for most people here.

Before, for those that could afford it, I could recommend Apple without hesistation. Apple's laptop line consistently stayed ahead of the competitors in the past.

The PowerPC 1st Gen, 2nd Gen, G3, G4 and G5 consistently outperformed the Intel Processors had to offer at the time of their release.

When Apple first switched to Intel a few years ago, they picked up a cutting edge processor and DDR3 ram before all other competitors.

So techies could honestly say that Apple could hang with or outperform the best Windows laptops.

That hasn't been true recently though. I've just adviced one of my friends to buy the Vaio instead, because I honestly can't recommend the current line of MBPs.

 

[ayeying]

If you work depends on using the Mac operating system, would you recommend them a PC also?

Honestly, think about it. My last workplace, we extremely relied on the OS X operating system. Sure we could've used a Windows Operating system but it would set us back due to the set up... then the constant updates and whatnot. Beyond that point, we had it working on OS X and we were sticking to it.

Some line of work relies of the OS X operating system. Current OS X software runs fine and very well on the MacBook Pros. Hell, Final Cut Pro even runs well on my first generation Core Duo MacBook Pro and this is 4 years old.

When your work depends on the OS X system, you could care less for specs and more about the software.

 

[theorchidchild]

most consumers will trust what a company with a strong customer service ranking tells them, no matter how many techies they know.

 

[wikoogle]

The main point that I think some people are missing is not just that apple is pushing outdated hardware, but that they are doing it for the same price as they did 8 months ago. I know it is not their style to drop prices, but at this point, with technology moving so rapidly, it is highway robbery not to do so. If they want to take 1 year to update their macbook pro (I know it has only been 8-9 months now), then that is fine by me. Just reduce the price of your current inventory.

Sony and Asus both have Customer Service Ranking and Satisfaction just as good or better than Apples.

The people who absolutely have to get a MBP for work is a very small minority of the population. Windows PCs are every bit as capable as MBPs for work tasks. And the vast majority of businesses use Windows, not OSX.

Most people who I've adviced to buy MBPs in the past didn't buy it because they're a video editors. They bought it for home use with the only work using being word processing or other innane tasks.

 

[ayeying]

The people who absolutely have to get a MBP for work is a very small minority of the population. Other than Video Editing, Windows PCs are every bit as capable as MBPs for every other task.

Most people who I've adviced to buy MBPs in the past didn't buy it because they're a video editors. They bought it for home use with the only work using being word processing or other innane tasks.

You completely ignored what I was saying.

In reality, a company or user would not switch something as big as an OS or their software (rebuying them for another operating system) and such just because Apple didn't out with the latest chips or if another computer has a better chip.

In fact, many would not use a MacBook Pro for those line of work either. They would use a Mac Pro which is far more powerful then a laptop. It's reasonably priced as well. If you configure a Dell Precision workstation desktop, it would come to approx the same price.

I don't believe only a small percentage of Mac users are professionals. I believe the entire user group has many professional in many fields (video, audio, etc.).

If you want specs, you shouldn't be buying a Mac in the first place. PCs have far more hardware available then what Apple offers.

The article is just the same as any other eager users. They want a new MacBook Pro.

 

[theorchidchild]

also, the article mistakenly says its been more than a year since the last update. The last update was in June.

 

[Watermonkey]

The article makes some valid points. I believe something must be happening over there making their next refresh delayed and I bet there are more than a few Apple engineers and staffers are sweating bullets to get this thing out the door and over to marketing. I imagine one of the hurtles they're having trouble overcoming is the GPU. I don't know anyone I could ask to confirm, but it does make me yearn for the heady days of hardware competition. Competition is a good thing. It's too bad Apple doesn't welcome it.

 

[wikoogle]

I don't believe only a small percentage of Mac users are professionals. I believe the entire user group has many professional in many fields (video, audio, etc.).

ayeying, even if you're right. Are you seriously saying that Professionals don't care about specs?

You don't think it matters to video editors and such whether the laptop offers an outdated weak performing processor, a horribly outdated GPU or a blu ray burner?

Most professionals ARE techies. They know about the i5 and i7 processors and the performance gains they offer. They know how outdated the GPU is. And they certainly know what blu ray is and how much data it is capable of storing.

 

[nikhsub1]

The PowerPC G1, G2, G3 and G4 consistently outperformed the Intel Processors.

You need to put down the crackpipe. This is entirely false.

 

[diabolic]

Sony and Asus both have Customer Service Ranking and Satisfaction just as good or better than Apples.

No they don't.

https://www.macrumors.com/2010/02/22/apple-ranks-third-in-businessweek-customer-service-rankings/

They don't even make the list.

And once they update the MacBook pro, all the concerns evaporate instantly.

 

[theorchidchild]

Most professionals ARE techies. They know about the i5 and i7 processors and the performance gains they offer. They know how outdated the GPU is. And they certainly know what blu ray is and how much data it is capable of storing.

WRONG. even expert photographers and film editors aren't always techies when it comes to OS's and machines. they have to know their way around, but when it comes to it, they still need to consult their tech departments or a stores staff before making a decision.

 

[wikoogle]

WRONG. even expert photographers and film editors aren't always techies when it comes to OS's and machines. they have to know their way around, but when it comes to it, they still need to consult their tech departments or a stores staff before making a decision.

What are you talking about? Unless you're refering to the 50 year old ones that are on the verge of retirement, you're completely wrong.

Photographers and Film Editors are among the biggest techies I know by far.

They spend hours on cnet and engadget every week reading up the very latest cameras, camera lenses and drolling over the latest tech.

And invariably they learn about processors and such while they're there.

No they don't.

https://www.macrumors.com/2010/02/22/apple-ranks-third-in-businessweek-customer-service-rankings/

They don't even make the list.

And once they update the MacBook pro, all the concerns evaporate instantly.

I'm talking about notebooks.

That data is for all products made by a company, not just notebooks. For apple that includes the iPhone and the iPod.

Obviously the iPhones and iPods rate very high. They have fantastic quality and tech inside them. Meanwhile Sony makes a variety of other products mp3 players, phones, PS3s, TVs, and tons of other stuff (some of them of rather poor quality) that pulls down their ratings.

The Sony Vaio series laptops however are excellent.

And as you point out, even Dell (who exclusively make PCs) rate very high.

 

[wikoogle]

You need to put down the crackpipe. This is entirely false.

You need to stop using crack altogether. Of course they don't match up to CURRENT Intel processors, considering in some cases you're talking about decade old processors.

But at the time of their release, yes the G1, G2, G3 and G4 consistently outperformed anything Intel had to offer at the time.

 

[mrsir2009]

"G1, G2, G3 and G4 processors are outdoing intel processors"

Lol, so if I put a G3 processor in my MBP it would run better than the intel one (if it was possible to do that)?

 

[twilightrose]

"G1, G2, G3 and G4 processors are outdoing intel processors"

Lol, so if I put a G3 processor in my MBP it would run better than the intel one (if it was possible to do that)?

They are stating in the past. like a G4 vs a Pentium 4

 

[wikoogle]

WRONG. even expert photographers and film editors aren't always techies when it comes to OS's and machines. they have to know their way around, but when it comes to it, they still need to consult their tech departments or a stores staff before making a decision.

What are you talking about? Unless you're refering to the 50 year old ones that are on the verge of retirement, you're completely wrong (and even there, there's plenty of older people that know about newer technology and even post here on Macrumors).

Photographers and Film Editors are among the biggest techies I know by far.

You may think that you know some Photographers and Film Editors (or some students or teachers in those industries) that don't know about computers. But I guarentee you that if you actually took the time to talk to them about technology, you would surprised at how much they know. Even if they don't make it a point to bring up with you personally, i7 processors and the advantages of blu ray and the benefits of the enormous storage it offers for their industry, they more likely than not know about it.

They spend hours on cnet and engadget every week reading up the very latest cameras, camera lenses and drolling over the latest tech.

And invariably they learn about processors and such while they're there. Try talking to them, before making assumptions about how much they know.

 

[iBunny]

Honestly, many of the Apple customers don't know crap about specs or whats better and whats not.

Unless you're a techie, they don't care.

I am a techie.

And I care.

New Hardware now.

 

[theorchidchild]

What are you talking about? Unless you're refering to the 50 year old ones that are on the verge of retirement, you're completely wrong.

Photographers and Film Editors are among the biggest techies I know by far.

They spend hours on cnet and engadget every week reading up the very latest cameras, camera lenses and drolling over the latest tech.

And invariably they learn about processors and such as well while they're there.

yea, they love the latest tech when it comes to their cameras, lenses, etc., but at the end of the day, they're not always experts on processors. and with the rate that things change, if you're an exceptionally busy artist, you're not going to have the time or the interest in trying to keep up with the latest specs and what they all mean. you just want to know that what you're getting is going to work for you for 3-4 yrs and will be a reliable solution.

yes, there are exceptions, but I think my point of view is the general case for most professionals, in or outside the art world.

 

[wikoogle]

yea, they love the latest tech when it comes to their cameras, lenses, etc., but at the end of the day, they're not always experts on processors. and with the rate that things change, if you're an exceptionally busy artist, you're not going to have the time or the interest in trying to keep up with the latest specs and what they all mean. you just want to know that what you're getting is going to work for you for 3-4 yrs and will be a reliable solution.

yes, there are exceptions, but I think my point of view is the general case for most professionals, in or outside the art world.

You're seriously deluding yourself.

Ask anyone of your video editing or professional photographer friends you know (under the age of 50) if they know about the i7 and blu rays.

They sure as hell know about the i5 and i7 processors and blu ray burners. Hell, they'll probably go off on some rant about how much raw video they can store with a blu ray burner.

This isn't some exclusive knowledge that you have read engadget daily to know about.

People have been writing about and talking about the i5 and i7 and blu rays for 2+ years now.

If you spend more than an hour on cnet and gadget blogs per month (even if you're just there to read up on the latest camera lenses), you will have heard about the i7 processors and blu ray drives and how big of a leap they are technologically.

 

[lcs101]

The main point that I think some people are missing is not just that apple is pushing outdated hardware, but that they are doing it for the same price as they did 8 months ago. I know it is not their style to drop prices, but at this point, with technology moving so rapidly, it is highway robbery not to do so. If they want to take 1 year to update their macbook pro (I know it has only been 8-9 months now), then that is fine by me. Just reduce the price of your current inventory.

 

[akm3]

EVERYONE knows a techie that they turn to for advice when buying $1000+ electronics, be it HDTVs or Laptops. There's about two dozen people that asked me for laptop advice in just the past two years. And I'm sure the same is true for most people here.

Before, for those that could afford it, I could recommend Apple without hesistation. Apple's laptop line consistently stayed ahead of the competitors in the past.

The PowerPC G1, G2, G3 and G4 consistently outperformed the Intel Processors had to offer at the time of their release.

When Apple first switched to Intel a few years ago, they picked up a cutting edge processor and DDR3 ram before all other competitors.

So techies could honestly say that Apple could hang with or outperform the best Windows laptops.

That hasn't been true recently though. I've just adviced one of my friends to buy the Vaio instead, because I honestly can't recommend the current line of MBPs.

Computers aren't about performance anymore. They are 'good enough'. It's a dying thing. The fastest core whatever doesn't mean squat to the average computer user.

Apple realizes this, so they are moving into new and different ways to interact with computers, like the iPhone and iPad.

 

[6-0 Prolene]

What are you talking about? Unless you're refering to the 50 year old ones that are on the verge of retirement, you're completely wrong.

Photographers and Film Editors are among the biggest techies I know by far.

They spend hours on cnet and engadget every week reading up the very latest cameras, camera lenses and drolling over the latest tech.

A beginner photographer worries about his camera (and, in the 21st century, computer).

A good photographer worries about his lens.

A great photographer worries about the light.

 

[iThinkergoiMac]

G1 and G2 PPC processors? I've never heard of them, and apparently Google and Wikipedia haven't either. The "G" name, as far as I know, wasn't used until the G3. If you want us to believe what you're saying, at least use the correct terminology. If the G1 and G2 processors did exist, under those names, I'd love to see a link... I'm quite interested in Apple history of this nature. That being said, your assertion that the G3 and G4 (you actually said nothing about the G5) processors is partially correct. In some aspects, they consistently outperformed their Intel counterparts. In other aspects, Intel consistently outperformed PPC.

Some graphic/video/photography professionals are techies, some aren't. My advisor at college is extremely knowledgeable about his field and uses Macs exclusively, but if I told him he needed a better video card than a Nvidia 9600GT he would have no clue what I'm talking about. He understands the concept of a video card well enough, but the nitty-gritty of it is beyond him. He's probably in his early 40s. The photography professor that my college recently hired is in his late 20s/early 30s and excels at what he teaches. He also uses Macs exclusively. He also would be confused once I started getting into the technical details. Many people use Macs because they're easy: you don't have to worry about comparing the specs, just figure out the tiers. Do you want the baseline, middle, or the best? Many people worry about the specs, and many don't. Seems many people here want to lump everyone together into one or the other.