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The Phazer

macrumors 68040
Oct 31, 2007
3,000
956
London, UK
You're actually criticizing Apple for a safe and secure app store?

Which safe and secure App Store is this?

It certainly isn't the iOS one.

And yes, this filing is a huge blunder by Apple, because Apple has fairly obviously deliberately crippled PWAs compared to literally every other browser in the world for years, and it will definitely come up in discovery that they did this intentionally to protect App Store revenue. Stupid.
 

The Phazer

macrumors 68040
Oct 31, 2007
3,000
956
London, UK
For those of you who think you should be able to install anything you want on ‘your’ iOS device... why do you continue to do business with Apple when you have another choice that does allow you to install anything you want? Really, why are you still in the ecosystem? If you think Android offers you the freedom you desire then move there. I don't get your logic on this matter. It sounds like cognitive dissonance or Stockholm Syndrome. Get help.

I actively minimise my financial interactions with Apple, but Apple's censorship still has global effects - Instagram as a service still censors content everywhere, primarily because of concerns about the App Store as an example (https://petapixel.com/2015/10/05/instagrams-strict-anti-nudity-policy-is-due-to-apple/).
 

edgonzalez32

Suspended
Jul 21, 2011
673
1,256
They are so tone-deaf.

I would agree with them if they didn't completely cripple PWAs, which is just a bookmark on the iPhone home screen at this point.
 
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mzeb

macrumors 6502
Jan 30, 2007
358
612
Hah, then I'd like to see Fortnite running in Safari. :rolleyes:
This one is oddly possible. Between Unity and WebGL it could actually happen. Definitely some tweaks required but possible. Agree with your sentiment tho :D
 

genovelle

macrumors 68020
May 8, 2008
2,104
2,681
You buy a Ford car.

You then learn that others can’t sell you parts. There’s e.g. some sort of authentication chip requiring a digital signature from Ford.

However, the nice and friendly Ford will gladly supply this IC and a digital signature to anyone. All they need to do is pay a teeny, tiny markup of 30% on the cost of the part.

But sure, you can buy GM. That’s little relief to those who already sunk a fortune on a Ford car though.

By the way, when it’s put this way, it sure sounds like the Mafia, no? “Here, just pay 30% of your revenue. It’s for your... erm... protection”.
Companies don’t exist to make money for other companies. They build products that appeal to their target audience. When they design it to add accessories, allowing others access it a gift. In the end they will have to deal with any mistakes you make with an add on that breaks the car in some way. The customer is not going to want to hear their car computer fried because of a poorly designed aftermarket accessory. That $3000 grand will create and wedge between the automaker, dealer, and customers.
they are never coming back.
 

JKAussieSkater

macrumors 6502
Mar 13, 2009
263
392
Tokyo, Japan
I don't like that this MacRumors topic has been allocated to the "Political" thread.
Everybody should be able to comment on this, it's not the damaging kind of controversy.
 
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I7guy

macrumors Nehalem
Nov 30, 2013
34,313
24,051
Gotta be in it to win it
Which safe and secure App Store is this?

It certainly isn't the iOS one.
Sure it is. You're not gonna point to one or two examples out of millions of apps and say "see this app has malware", the app store isn't safe and secure. Really? You are going to do that?
And yes, this filing is a huge blunder by Apple, because Apple has fairly obviously deliberately crippled PWAs compared to literally every other browser in the world for years, and it will definitely come up in discovery that they did this intentionally to protect App Store revenue. Stupid.
Okay. It will come up in discovery, or not.
 

topdrawer

macrumors 65816
Oct 1, 2012
1,142
1,756

mazz0

macrumors 68040
Mar 23, 2011
3,141
3,584
Leeds, UK
Apple has a Complete & Total Stranglehold on App Discovery !
That's not true. The App Store has a monopoly on being the point you download apps from, it doesn't have a monopoly on the front end. There are plenty of websites that list apps and link directly to those apps in the App Store for downloading them. Those websites can arrange discoverability however they like.
 

mazz0

macrumors 68040
Mar 23, 2011
3,141
3,584
Leeds, UK
The App Store should have two tiers: the Apple-Approved, politically-correct apps curated by their department of henpecking minions and another tier that just hosts apps without the mommy brigade deciding for you what apps are acceptable. Drop the fees and let developers pay for placement, and advertising.
The problem with that solution is that as soon as an alternative App Store exists big players like Google, Microsoft, Epic, Adobe etc will make their apps exclusive to that store, and we'll all have to use it or go without key apps. Then when all the customer's are on that store already all the other developers might as well move their apps there as well, and we've essentially completely lost the benefit of the App Store.

I was trying to uninstall an app from my Mac the other day which had been one installed with an install wizard (as opposed to a just-drop-the-app-in-Applications kind). I had to DuckDuckGo how to uninstall it, and I still don't know if I've fully removed everything it put in my system. It's even worse on Windows. That's the alternative to the Walled Garden approach.
 

jonnyb098

macrumors 601
Nov 16, 2010
4,039
5,679
Michigan
Gotta love Apple's solution. Use web apps........you mean those things from 12 years ago that were an epic failure until Steve Jobs was finally pushed to open an App Store? GREAT IDEA APPLE!!!

Between this and women with beards emoji, they sure are firing on all cylinders for 2021!!
 
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bobmans

macrumors 6502a
Feb 7, 2020
596
1,750
The question is not so much if smartphone user have good options, but if digital services have good options supporting their customers on the device of their choice beyond the App Store, case in case PWA. By good, meaning, comparable to other OSs.

PWA support in iOS is limited to a Link in the Home Screen.
Oh, please.
There's PWA Spotify clones made by 3rd party devs that are literally better than Spotify's own native app. You're really overexaggerating here.
Netflix and Spotify could both offer a PWA easily, they're just not doing it because they rather complain about Apple's app store policies and they're too lazy to distribute it themself or too lazy to hire a couple interns to make them a PWA.

PWAs aren't what they were 10 years ago. They might not be a replacement for every app but there's a lot of native apps that could easily be replaced by a PWA. There's some PWA's out there that when using you literally wouldn't notice any difference between the PWA/Native version.
 

bsolar

macrumors 68000
Jun 20, 2011
1,535
1,751
The problem with that solution is that as soon as an alternative App Store exists big players like Google, Microsoft, Epic, Adobe etc will make their apps exclusive to that store, and we'll all have to use it or go without key apps.

I understand what you mean and I think your argument has some merits, but the logical consequence of your argument is that Apple's App Store requires Apple's ability to prevent competition to be successful, which is not how the market is supposed to work.
 

acidblood

macrumors regular
Oct 6, 2006
119
250
For those of you who think you should be able to install anything you want on ‘your’ iOS device... why do you continue to do business with Apple when you have another choice that does allow you to install anything you want? Really, why are you still in the ecosystem? If you think Android offers you the freedom you desire then move there. I don't get your logic on this matter. It sounds like cognitive dissonance or Stockholm Syndrome. Get help.
There are many possible reasons.

You have a Mac (which, despite the quality going downhill very quickly since Jobs died, still allows you to run the apps you please on the hardware you bought and paid for), the iPhone works better with it. There’s some integration that you just don’t find on the Windows side. You bought a lot of apps and you can’t take their licenses to Android. You need the performance that only Apple’s chips can deliver. You hate that you need a football stadium-sized screen to get a halfway decent performance phone.

Apple is not all bad — admittedly, though, they’re much worse than when Jobs was alive — back then, if you made ****, Jobs would have you fired. With Cook, you can make ****, so long as it’s a penny cheaper, you’re a hero.

Still, they’re completely on the wrong side with their 30% App Store racket scheme though. The real Stockholm Syndrome comes from those that pay a lot extra for their apps and come here to tell us how much they love it.
 
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Nuno Lopes

macrumors 65816
Sep 6, 2011
1,268
1,133
Lisbon, Portugal
iOS for most intents and pur
Oh, please.
There's PWA Spotify clones made by 3rd party devs that are literally better than Spotify's own native app. You're really overexaggerating here.
Netflix and Spotify could both offer a PWA easily, they're just not doing it because they rather complain about Apple's app store policies and they're too lazy to distribute it themself or too lazy to hire a couple interns to make them a PWA.

PWAs aren't what they were 10 years ago. They might not be a replacement for every app but there's a lot of native apps that could easily be replaced by a PWA. There's some PWA's out there that when using you literally wouldn't notice any difference between the PWA/Native version.

iOS for most intents and purposes does not support PWAs. I know that because I’ve built one taking advantage of the available tech. Is full of road stops.
This is not over exaggerating, it’s a fact.

Over exaggerating is stating that iOS:Safari supports PWAs. It’s nothing but the most basic support, case in case opening a web page full screen / stand alone. The buck stops there.

Now in other OS the support is good and it’s getting better every month. With iOS ... people with know how, know very well what Apple is doing and why ... lets not full ourselves here.
 
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mazz0

macrumors 68040
Mar 23, 2011
3,141
3,584
Leeds, UK
I understand what you mean and I think your argument has some merits, but the logical consequence of your argument is that Apple's App Store requires Apple's ability to prevent competition to be successful, which is not how the market is supposed to work.
Yeah, I do have sympathy for that argument, though I would have more if Apple devices were more dominant. As it is there are plenty of alternatives to Apple devices, but if that were to change, if Apple were to become more dominant, then it would be a bit of a conundrum. On the one hand Apple would have monopoly power, on the other hand obliging them to allow alternative app stores could drastically spoil the user experience for everybody. It's tricky stuff.
 

dk001

macrumors demi-god
Oct 3, 2014
10,691
15,039
Sage, Lightning, and Mountains
Plenty of adults would get burned by this. Apple prides itself on creating technology that is safe and accessible to the masses. Folks who prefer the Wild West have other platforms and device makers to go to, there’s no reason for Apple to risk their customers’ safety in this scenario.

True if safety was their only concern.
 

nt5672

macrumors 68040
Jun 30, 2007
3,380
7,220
Midwest USA
For those of you who think you should be able to install anything you want on ‘your’ iOS device... why do you continue to do business with Apple when you have another choice that does allow you to install anything you want? Really, why are you still in the ecosystem? If you think Android offers you the freedom you desire then move there. I don't get your logic on this matter. It sounds like cognitive dissonance or Stockholm Syndrome. Get help.
Because Apple's OS is better. But it is NOT better because of Apple's nanny rules about the App Store, it is better because of better code in the OS. It has better UI and better security. And I should not have to be subject to Apple's nanny rules just to use a superior OS.
 
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