Apple Says iPad Pro's XDR Display Designed to Minimize Blooming, but Some Users Still Notice the Effect

[ikramerica]

Most people aren't aware that even seeing a bright white element on a black background in a dark room, on OLED, looks like its blooming. Its the way our eyes work in the dark. I dare someone to tell me that they don't see a glow on bright elements while in a dark room on an OLED, such as the boot logo on an iPhone with OLED in a pitch black room.

That being said, this iPad issue appears to be a software/local dimming algorithm mess up. Notice that the blooming is carrying over the distance of 1-2 local dimming zones. It makes no sense, it can't bloom that hard. There's also the fact that the human eye wouldn't see this much of an exaggerated glow around things. OLED still struggles with black crush, where colors just above barely above black get suppressed and saturation issues too, depending on panel and calibration.

To reiterate, OLED does not have blooming, anyone telling you that OLED display tech has blooming shouldn't be talking because they know nothing. Its literally impossible for an OLED to bloom, self-emissive display tech cannot bloom. What I'm talking about is what the human eye sees, the human eye will always see a glow around a very bright element surrounded by a dark background while in a dark environment, regardless of the display tech, even on OLED.

Correct. But correct calibration of the display for the human eye means to turn down the display output until visible blooming is minimized. That means that there shouldn’t be “very bright” objects in the first place because the human eye does not want to see that.

This is always an issue with properly calibrated TVs because if you calibrate it for a darkened room, it will seem dim in lit room. Calibrate it for a lit room and it’s unwatchable at night. And most dynamic brightness controls are garbage.

So it’s best to calibrate a TV during the day using the custom preset, and then using the Cinema preset in a darkened room, as that is often close to correct for that environment.

 

[falainber]

That’s BS. You can buy a 55 inch 4K OLED TV with Android on it for the same price as a 12 inch iPad.

OLED TVs and OLED phone/tablet/laptop panels use totally different technologies so the price comparisons between those are pointless.

 

[davidjytang]

Blooming = MiniLED
OR
PWM = OLED.

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Holy~ wow, I didn't know the fact that OLED uses PWM!

PWM has always been a HUGE deal breaker for me as I could see flicker very easily on LED monitors that uses PWM.
Albeit I never owned OLED device. Now I'm interested to experience larger OLED panels. Maybe it's time for me to walk into TV shops.

 

[sledgehammer89]

iPP 12.9" is bloomed.

 

[iSayuSay]

LOL I wouldn’t put my money off for a $1200 product that is using a mere half-baked display tech.

This topic has been reappearing for a few times on MacRumors and there are always people who swear by miniLED on 12.9” iPad Pro as opposed to OLED.

I’m a simple man, if it’s not a self-lit display, I wouldn’t buy it. End of story. I keep 2x 65” 10 y.o plasmas and a 55” CX OLED for the house. Along with a few OLED iPhones and a 10.5” iPad Pro. You see 90% of my gadgets use self-lit display tech except for the iPad. As long as Apple keep denying it, I’d still keep the 10.5” around.

 

[patent10021]

People in the know knew Mini-LED was a scam from the beginning.

 

[jonstatt1]

People in the know knew Mini-LED was a scam from the beginning.

Hardly! Mini LED is likely more expensive to produce than OLED at iPad size. Samsung's own mini LED TV is more expensive by a long way than OLED equivalent.

Let's remember the problems with OLED

1) Screen burn which is much harder to mitigate on computer displays
2) colour temperature shifts as the panel ages
3) terrible uniformity at very low shades of grey
4) limited light output as more of the panel is lit up. APL

The complexity behind mini LED is far higher and actually more of a technology achievement.

But all this proves is that there is no perfect display tech yet. One compromise or another!

Finally I will say that for HDR this iPad really hits the mark , able to hit more nits than my 55 inch OLED can even when only 10% of the 55incher is illuminated due to APL. It's stunning!

 

[Zorori]

For those folks new to this phenomenon... it doesn't look even remotely as pronounced in real life as it does in these photos. Cameras tend to greatly exaggerate the effect; it's the same with black uniformity in backlights. When looked at with human eyes, it's much less noticeable, and always most pronounced when small bright elements are displayed on a black background.

Nice to know. I need to try one of these in a store once they're available. I wondered if these pictures are taken with max brightness on the device? I rarely seem to go above 50% on my 2020 iPad Pro...

 

[fenjen]

I don't know why Apple just didn't use OLED in the first place for the iPads..

Because OLED burns in over time? I don't understand why so few people seem to know this, or at least talk about it.

 

[chucker23n1]

It might be a plausible explanation but it also could be the cost

I imagine mini-LED is pricier.

or the fact that they can't get their hands on enough panels from Samsung

But the iPhone dwarves any iPad in volume, and they would've had years of lead time for this.

No, I don't buy that. There had to be a conscious decision against OLED in iPads and MacBooks, and the most plausible explanation to me is: they weren't happy with some of the parameters. Whether that's picture output, longevity, battery life, etc., I don't know. But given that they are happy with it for the iPhone and Apple Watch and aren't for the iPad Pro and MacBook Pro, I think "they don't like the color accuracy issues, and they think those matter more on those devices, because they are more likely to be used in workflows where color accuracy is important" is the best explanation so far.

. Apple had their reasons for sticking with LCD on iPhones for many years too until they eventually got the panels from Samsung.

Yes. Same thing, I think.

Only they got color accuracy to a level they were happy with on an iPhone, but not on a device used in photo/video workflows.

I am not a video/photo pro. For my amateur photo editing (even having a "calibrateable" NEC monitor and a proper sensor - just because I could afford it) I came to conclusion that calibration was a waste of time. I understand that its different for pros so there might be some people who can benefit from these mini-LED screens.

Right.

 

[Serban55]

those people who post those imagine...are recorded/taken with a smartphone camera...come on...really? is this thread for real?
No oled , lcd or even micro_led can pass this test....this effect is the imagine speed/barrier
micro-led has this too if you take a photo into the mirror in which that mirror is projecting your micro-led/oled/miniled display

 

[Serban55]

First taken with prof camera and second with smartphone camera
Prof camera are the most close to your real life view of course

 

[Steve121178]

Non-issue confirmed

Yeah, watched this last night and it put a lot of this nonsense to bed.

Just proves it pays to wait for some facts rather than listening to hysterical nonsense on forums.

Max Tech produce some amazing content.

 

[Steve121178]

People in the know knew Mini-LED was a scam from the beginning.

Why's it a scam?

 

[mazz0]

That still isnt static.

 

[JonGarrett]

Are you people sure this isn't BS from android fanboys and girls? The tiny backlights are very tiny. To bleed like these pictures show into the blackness is strange.

Nah, it's not us. Everytime there's a flaw in an Apple device it's because you're holding it wrong 🙄🙄🙄.

I mean seriously, Android fanboy's are spending thousands on apple products just so they can leave bad reviews????

 

[lorsl]

OLED tech in TVs and phone/tablet screens are two completely different animals. For example, we know from DisplayMate reviews that SAMOLED screens in iPhone and Samsung phones are perfectly color accurate. I also question the need for high brightness for the tablets (as opposed to TVs). Tablet screen is right before your eyes. Who wants to burn their eyes? I have a Galaxy Tab S7 and for indoor use I keep the brightness level at around 25%. It is very rare (usually outside on a sunny day) that I raise the level.

Good points. I think that's just a matter of taste. I like to use my iPad also in the garden, extra brightness is definitely welcome there.

 

[jameswilby]

First taken with prof camera and second with smartphone camera
Prof camera are the most close to your real life view of course

Just to add another example of this likely being exaggerated by a camera. Bit late to the thread but I took these photos just now to demonstrate how photos can be deceiving. Brand new iPad. iPhone 11 Pro camera for both photos, just a different touch focus point. Both taken in a dark room. The new display is incredible, I'd guess most here don't have the iPad in hand. Off-axis is another discussion, as it is with any display tech.

 

[twistedpixel8]

That’s BS. You can buy a 55 inch 4K OLED TV with Android on it for the same price as a 12 inch iPad.

🤦‍♂️ you can’t compare the two. They are not even the same category of product.

 

[twistedpixel8]

Just to add another example of this likely being exaggerated by a camera. Bit late to the thread but I took these photos just now to demonstrate how photos can be deceiving. Brand new iPad. iPhone 11 Pro camera for both photos, just a different touch focus point. Both taken in a dark room. The new display is incredible, I'd guess most here don't have the iPad in hand. Off-axis is another discussion, as it is with any display tech.
View attachment 1781209
View attachment 1781210

I do understand what you’re showing here but if I’m honest, what my eyes see is closer to the first picture. So I really don’t know what to think. Is my iPad faulty? Are my eyes faulty?

 

[jameswilby]

I do understand what you’re showing here but if I’m honest, what my eyes see is closer to the first picture. So I really don’t know what to think. Is my iPad faulty? Are my eyes faulty?

Well might be a case of YMMV when it comes to eyes but if that is genuinely the case, I’d get the iPad checked out. We’re strangers over the internet of course, so assuming we’re both telling the truth we clearly have got different results. The results I’ve got are genuinely very impressive compared with another family members 2020 iPad Pro.

 

[iSayuSay]

Because OLED burns in over time? I don't understand why so few people seem to know this, or at least talk about it.

And what makes it different than iPhones? Static UI, images, and screen-on time.. You just can't imagine how treacherous the usage scenario of a smartphone for an OLED display. But then again it's been years since Apple keep making excellent OLED iPhones, and no significant burn-in effect so far.

 

[cpnotebook80]

Just putting my 2 cents - coming from a 1st gen ipad pro 12.9, I am indeed blown away by the display and speed of my new ipad pro. Consider me a regular user, i do not pixel peep nor expect life changing miracles from any product. If the device enhances my productivity, images and workflow, which it has since i'm doing online schooling, I'm all in. I do not watch HDR movies etc since i watch my movies on smart tv etc. The reason I upgraded is the limited 32gb space on my first ipad, the slow down of the apps and I held out for while. Many ppl were selling used 2018/2019 or the previous years ipads for close to the price of getting the new one anyways. So i was like for extra 100$ and my student discount, what the heck.

What I did do this long weekend here in Canada, was take a raw picture from my iphone 12 pro of a sunset and upload it to my M1 mbp and ipad pro m1. I looked at the pic side by side and i could see the deeper colors instantly without any color correction on these raw files more so on the ipad. It was beautiful. The M1 mbp looked a bit faded obviously but still good if I did not have a comparison.

I tried to take a pic to showcase it here but it is hard due to how the iPhone captures exposure and couldn't catch the affect, but if i can see the difference, I am happy. I don't really care for any blooming nor have i seen it affect anything while watching youtube etc since most of my media consumption is done on my smart tv.

Best part is how bright it is outside as i could see the icons clearly. Just have to get a proper case because the one i have is hard to handle and ordered one from amazon.

 

[Darth Tulhu]

I have a Galaxy Tab S2 (2015 model) which has been used almost daily for many years. I do not see any burn in on it Overall, I had (and have) five Samsung tablets. All with OLED screens. None had any burn in issues. iPhone X has been around for almost 4 years. Do we have any specific burn in complains about it here on MR? I have not seen any. As this article reported, it takes 17 hours of displaying a static picture at max brightness on iPhone X to get a burn in. And it's not a cumulative time. If you switch the picture before you get a burn in, the clock resets.

 

[MVMNT]

This is the Karen of tech complaints.

This goes some way to debunking that extreme. Camera phone lens optics will cause that in such a controlled environment. Then the stupid train rolls out with the hyperbole.