Again, the irony from someone advocating for a nanny state.Yeah because Apple is parenting them to be one, and that over years, this doesn't mean they are unable to learn.
It's about time to end this and enforce sideloading.
Again, the irony from someone advocating for a nanny state.Yeah because Apple is parenting them to be one, and that over years, this doesn't mean they are unable to learn.
It's about time to end this and enforce sideloading.
The App Store and Google Play Store are not analogus. They have very different purposes. To the consumer they seem like a store front but the different philosophy and business model of Apple vs Google shows they can’t be the same. (If these philosophies and models were the same, google wouldn’t have allowed side loading. But they do because it helps them to spy on their users.)
Google is set up for maximum intrusion into one’s private sphere.
I would imagine that the play store wouldn’t want to emphasize privacy in the apps because it would be pretty bad for their business model.
I don’t understand why this isn’t obvious to everyone but it’s extremely disappointing that it’s lost on our legislators.
@Orange BatThat’s what advertising is for. Take the savings you get by not needing to pay Apple’s huge cut and put some of it into advertising for your own product. Currently you pay Apple money that they can use at their sole discretion to advertise your competitor’s app if they want to.
iOS was created as an intentionally closed system right? And was then slightly opened through the App Store, a single doorway to the closed system which was heavily monitored by Apple, and explicitly so from day one.
Why now, that outside options exist, do people feel the need to say "things have changed" just because their closed system became such a popular option? Nothing's changed, just the size of the user base, and everyone involved is getting a piece of the action. No two pieces are identical, but as the old saying goes, life isn't fair. If you want a bigger piece, work for it; don't cry about something being unfair because someone got there first and laid the groundwork for you to make your fortune.
Feel that's the core problem nowadays. Everyone wants to make a buck, but few actually want to invest the time and resources into infrastructure. So when someone does that legwork, they immediately want to mooch off it as soon as it gets big enough and cry monopoly if they don't get their way.
Never even heard of GSuite, (I have now though). Since I've been in employment, my view is that I've always advocated that a company should provide you with a phone if it's necessary for your work. Or failing that pay you extra and you can choose to buy phone number two.If your company uses gsuite you won’t find your company going through that effort. More likely is they’d require your phone to be connected to their system and load it there. The downside is they can manage and monitor and control your device without your knowledge.
Exactly, Apple sees the writing on the wall. It knows that, due to its high-handed behavior with some developers, they might be disinclined to continue with Appstore, provided a good alternative appears that values the developers more. In such a scenario, Apple might have to beg or incentivize the developers to publish their apps on the Appstore. How the tables have turned.Some people are incapable of forward thinking and can't imagine the inevitable path on which side loading goes from a choice to virtually mandatory once apps used by the masses like Instagram, Tik Tok or Google stop making their apps available in the App Store and make their apps only available to install via sideloading.
You can only resist for so long until an app comes around that you need for work or to fit in your social circle. Then the whole privacy and security deck of cards Apple built with the App Store comes crashing down. Why would any major app offer their app in the App Store with privacy and security protections if they have the chance to acquire all of your data?
Apple collects the same data as Google.You mean the Play Store that allows apps to collect data from their users and that is natively owned by Google, the world's largest data collector whose entire business relies on data collection?
Jesus... people here just keep confirming that walled gardens with curated experiences and built in protections need to exist to protect some folks from themselves. ??♂️
Don't want a walled garden? Go to Android. That's the choice.
Disallowing APIs to third-party apps is not allowed by the DMA act of the EU (as far as I know). If Apple can access an API, it should be allowed for third-parties also. No more shenanigans. Apple brought it upon themselves due to their greed.Just do like the Mac and warn before side loading an app. You could even double secure it with a switch in settings to disallow side loaded apps at all. So you’d have to disable the switch, then you also get a warning when side loading. This puts it 100% into the consumer’s hands and takes Apple out of the picture. Apple could also disable certain APIs fro side loaded apps to keep it secure. Disallow a side loaded app from accessing Messages or Music or Contacts. That allows side loading while still maintaining a level of security. Could someone find a way to bypass that security? Sure. But that’s on the user, not Apple.
Or make Apple do the right thing by forcing it to give the choice to the users, by legislation and hefty fines since that is the only language Apple understands. It is also a very simple concept, I guess.Mmhm, smart comment. It’s that simple.
Apple does not have a choice here. It is being forced to do what is right. You will see Facebook store, Google Store, Epic store, Steam store, and so on on iOS. I would rather download my bank app from the bank website than the Appstore which has 2% of their top 1000 apps that are scams.They should make an official "alt store" and name it "Dirt Mall". It can be the wild west version of the app store, completely uncurated and allowed to run amuck, except it will actually be part of a larger App Store sandbox so that it doesn't create unnecessary security risks to users who choose not to use it. Publishers in the "Dirt Mall" will be charged hosting and download fees a la other cloud services.
They (Google, Facebook, etc.,) are the ones that are most affected by this bill.I thought about it for 1 second…it is about maintaining privacy and security, the user having control over ones data.
This bill for side-loading is probably spurred by Google, Facebook, et al lobbyists. They need your data. Mark Zuckerberg needs more cash to buy the rest of the Hawaiian island he has a compound on.
For Apple users, apps should go through Apple. Say ?? or ??to side-loading.
My comment was sarcastic and not at all in defense of Apple. Edited for clarity.Or make Apple do the right thing by forcing it to give the choice to the users, by legislation and hefty fines since that is the only language Apple understands. It is also a very simple concept, I guess.
But would you publish your app if, let us say hypothetically, Google (or Elon Musk) put an Appstore and tell you that they would host your App for free and also make it more discoverable if you give them exclusivity. Would you pull out of Appstore in such a case?I’m a small app developed. I won’t leave the App Store if Apple allows side loading. I may put out a version of my app for side loading, but I imagine that my app will still get a vast majority of its downloads from the App Store. The largest developers may leave the App Store, but smaller developers will stay. The benefit of the App Store is that it allows an easy way for users to discover my app. Without it, my app would probably get zero downloads. Just like the Play Store, the App Store would stay relevant, even with side loading.
Well, it’s a bit more complicated than that. Sure, Apple raises awareness but how many percent of users actually curb their behavior as a result? I can tell you with certainty not many. I say this as someone who works in research and consumer behavior analysis field. People aren’t very good at doing anything that causes inconvenience to them. Clicking “ask apps not to track” button has been effective due to its minimal impact on user’s experience. Do people take additional steps to further protect their privacy? The answer is no. Facebook deals with scandals in daily basis but yet, their business is booming. That wouldn’t be the case if people stopped the engagement with the app.It is a choice.
With the articles, advertising, and other avenues Apple is pursuing, people are being educated like it or not.
To your point people don’t know. Until it is thrust on them.
In the end, this has not become a major Android issue so I really don’t see it being an iOS issue either.
JMO
just like Windows where nothing goes without antivirus and such? really want something similar?Yeah because Apple is parenting them to be one, and that over years, this doesn't mean they are unable to learn.
It's about time to end this and enforce sideloading.
That’s a lot of hypotheticals that won’t ever happen. First of all, nobody does anything for free. Second, Google already has a store and they call it Google Play Store. They take cut out of every transaction since nothing runs for free. If Elon Musk said such thing, I would laugh and add it to the list of things that he said and never delivered. What happened to his Tesla ventilators, solar roofs and countless other things??? Yes, exactly.But would you publish your app if, let us say hypothetically, Google (or Elon Musk) put an Appstore and tell you that they would host your App for free and also make it more discoverable if you give them exclusivity. Would you pull out of Appstore in such a case?
Talking about Antivirus, you know that macOS and probably iOS too scans for malware behind the scenes. Meanwhile the build-in Windows AV is good enough and very resource friendly. But yes freedom includes installing an alternative AV if you wish so, freedom also includes getting a Virus on purpose if you wish so.just like Windows where nothing goes without antivirus and such? really want something similar?
My concern is that once "side loading" were to become open, the Facebooks, TikTok and such will remove their apps from the App Store and offer "better" features y just clicking on this button, and boom, privacy gone, ads left and right and so on. While I am capable of that decision - 95+% of users can't ...
"It's about time to end this and enforce sideloading" - for who's benefit? someone "pro-side loading" here on MR stated that <1% of Android users actually use side loading today. So, who's the beneficiary of side loading? The average consumer? hardly ... give me some reasons why the average consumer needs side loading.
I don’t give ? for Apples AppStore, it exists solely for gatekeeping and to secure the money flow filling Apples pocket by doing nothing fancy. The world worked fine for many years without any enforced AppStores. Anyway, AppStores can coexist wonderfully, look at Windows, Steam, GOG, WinStore, EpicStore.Your M1 experience proves my thesis. It’s crap because of sideloading. Because of sideloading the Mac App Store is empty.
Apple would have to abandon fees and privacy rules for devs to offer apps there.
It may differ by slight degree but to get high participation from devs in the App Store once sideloading becomes possible means the App Store will more or less mirror the sideloading stores by dropping fees and standards.
To be sincere on Android, which enables side-loading, those apps are available on the Play Store.Some people are incapable of forward thinking and can't imagine the inevitable path on which side loading goes from a choice to virtually mandatory once apps used by the masses like Instagram, Tik Tok or Google stop making their apps available in the App Store and make their apps only available to install via sideloading.
Well, Apple will have to take the common denominator route of all these international laws.I have a feeling the revised bill will have far less impact than side-loading supports would like to achieve. Also, Apple can always make side-loading functionally useless without banning side-loading. And side-loading on Google doesn’t stop companies publishing apps on play store anyways, so what’s the point? At the end of the day, bottom line is what matters for Apple no matter how hard they try to hide from the public.