Apple Seeds Snow Leopard 10A190 (Mac OX 10.6) to Developers

[curmi]

Given the leaked release notes here, Snow Leopard is a long, long, long way from being finished. I'm not sure how big the OS X development team is on this release, but there is an incredible amount of work and testing required just to complete all the Exchange integration they are going for and mention.

You would hope that Apple are also thinking of updates to Snow Leopard Server so that its services are as good, if not better, than Exchange. Because with all this Exchange support, Server is looking likely to be considered useless by the business community.

 

[cohibadad]

I still think "Snow Leopard" is a remarkably poor choice for a name.

Actually it is a brilliant name IMO. Snow Leopard isn't a standard OS X upgrade like Tiger to Leopard, it is a Leopard of a different flavor. Tells me Apple had this planned for quite some time.

 

[apexfork]

Without breaking the NDA, any thoughts on ZFS? Perhaps a prediction on the direction Apple will take with that technology in Snow Leopard, or does it really look like they will just copy features and add them to HFS+? Finally, do you think MacWorld will have any words on ZFS?

(sorry to be annoying, this is just a feature I really want and have no way of making informed observations. forums seem to be my only release.

I couldn't tell you, and I mean that in both ways that it could be taken.

I have no idea what's up with ZFS in OS X, but obviously it doesn't take much imagination to see how incredibly powerful something like Time Machine could be if paired with ZFS.

My guess is that they'd release something like that as part of SL at WWDC rather than at Macworld (where, presumably, they won't be introducing SL).

That's all just speculation of course, but it makes the most sense to me.

 

[econoline06]

No. Only registered developers.

There are ways of obtaining it, but they are not legal methods....

 

[Daniel78]

Mac Pro with Nehalem (Core i7) and Snow Leopard.....

Maybe about time to upgrade from my 2GHz G5 Power Mac, it is getting a bit slow.






____________
If I lived in CA I would vote NO on 8 ... and yes I think Palin is great!

 

[Maximillian]

Anyone know of any visual changes in 10.6? Enhanced looks? New dock look? Anything?

 

[HyperZboy]

Maybe about time to upgrade from my 2GHz G5 Power Mac, it is getting a bit slow.

Your 2GHz G5 is NOT getting slower.

The PowerPC version of LEOPARD is!

Stay out of Steve Jobs Reality Distortion Field!

 

[dohardthings]

Your 2GHz G5 is NOT getting slower.

The PowerPC version of LEOPARD is!

Stay out of Steve Jobs Reality Distortion Field!

you are both wrong the computers are getting faster and yours is staying the same

by the way all of you that say that say that panther is the best why don't you stick with panther than?

 

[HyperZboy]

Bottom line: You're wrong, but noone here can tell you exactly how or why because of the NDA.

Is that your best argument? You're wrong but I can't tell you why? LOL

Maybe you should work on Apple's Snow Leopard marketing team.

 

[apexfork]

Is that your best argument? You're wrong but I can't tell you why? LOL

Maybe you should work on Apple's Snow Leopard marketing team.

It wasn't an argument, it was a statement of fact. I'm not going to break my word (the NDA I signed) just to save you the trouble of gathering your own information.

Yes, you are wrong, yes, I am certain, and no, I won't share the reasons with you. Buy a WWDC ticket next year, or wait for the public announcements.

I'm sorry that isn't the answer you want to hear, but that's how it goes. If that really bothers you, then you're no better than the guy asking for a torrent.

Lastly, if upgrading your machines every three years to stay on the bleeding edge is too much, then you need a new hobby.

 

[Amdahl]

ATTENTION WHINERS:

if tiger works better than leopard for you, by all means KEEP ON USING IT.

no one is making you upgrade... either hardware *OR* software. you already own all the technology you originally paid for (and then some), and presumably you've gotten years' worth of value out of it by now.

Until Apple gets a serious security program going, I and anyone else who wants, shall continue to WHINE on.

FIVE YEARS of security updates after last date of retail sale is what ANY ONE should be able to expect. If Tiger users had that, and Leopard users had that, there would be very little reason to whine about PowerPC support being dropped prematurely.

 

[iBookG4user]

Your 2GHz G5 is NOT getting slower.

The PowerPC version of LEOPARD is!

Stay out of Steve Jobs Reality Distortion Field!

Or a better description would be that the computer speed is staying the same while the programs run on the computer are getting more demanding.

 

[junker]

ATTENTION WHINERS:

if tiger works better than leopard for you, by all means KEEP ON USING IT.

no one is making you upgrade... either hardware *OR* software. you already own all the technology you originally paid for (and then some), and presumably you've gotten years' worth of value out of it by now.

<sarcasm>

what?!?!? you mean apple is going to KEEP ADVANCING their products... and their newest tech may not work on my 20 year old mac se/30?!? HOW DARE THEY!?!?!?!? MADNESS! OUTRAGE! CLASS ACTION LAWSUIT!!!!! etc etc etc!!!!

</sarcasm>

i hope some of you realize how ridonkulous you sound.

oh, and by the way, snow leopard is a rad name

that is all.

My machine is not 20 years old... not even close. Built Oct. 2005. Wouldn't you be a little pissed off? Your right, no ones making me upgrade - but they are forcing me to "sit on an island" an watch the ships go by, from here on out.

I understand the argument of slimming down the rest of the OS's by not having to develop for PPC's, but for those of us who purchased a machine within 4 years of it being "effectively stranded", I say they should have a trade up policy. I know they give discounts if you purchased computers within a period of time to an OS release. I know this will never happen.

I guess I would like to see them include a PPC code a bit longer and let us use Xslimmer (or they can offer the option in the install) to weed out intel code bloat and vice versa.

And, I'm not sure how your sarcasm is really sarcasm... sounds like your mocking those of us who have valid concerns and complaints. If I was trying to do this on my old 266/533 upgrade beige gossamer desktop - I would definitely deserve your mocking.

 

[Digital Skunk]

Or a better description would be that the computer speed is staying the same while the programs run on the computer are getting more demanding.

This is the best way to break it to someone IMHO.

As for PPC macs running terribly under Leopard..

HA! or What are YOU doing wrong, since my PPC macs all run fine.

Panther was bested by Tiger hands down as the best OS release. I hold it higher than Leopard on stability and ease of use right now. Leopard is too gimmicky IMHO, stuffed with features that some may use, and some may not, but none of which were ever necessary.

 

[cyberakuma]

Is Mac OS X 10.6 going to be 64-bit-only? Eliminating PPC code is a no-brainer, but what about the x86 code? If we are just talking about the Mac then I would think the 32-bit code would also get removed, but the iPhone and iPod touch use the "same" OS X code so maybe not. Then again, Apple could develop 32-bit code solely for the iPhone/iPod touch and 64-bit code for the Mac so Mac OS X 10.6 and on will be 64-bit "clean".

Doubtful; there are many advantages to a 32 bit addressing space, and in some cases 64 bit addressing spaces will cause a performance loss as the immediate mode instructions and data structures have to double in size to handle the larger pointers, while the memory bandwidth stays the same.

What would be nice is if they supported a 32_64 mode where you could use the additional register space of the 64 bit processor (and additionally optimize function calls to use registers rather than stack space), but remain with 32 bit addressing. This would provide speedups for most 32 bit apps with just a recompile.

 

[Daniel78]

Love the replies...lol

Maybe about time to upgrade from my 2GHz G5 Power Mac, it is getting a bit slow.

But you're all missing the point a Mac Pro with Nehalem (Core i7) and Snow Leopard sounds like a good reason to start talking ones self into getting a new Mac.


____________
If I lived in CA I would vote NO on 8 ... and yes I think Palin is great!

 

[bobertoq]

Based on timing of Leopard my guess is Snow Leopard Release late January/Early February

If I remember correctly, WWDC 2008, Jobs said Snow Leopard will be released in about 12 months. That sounds like WWDC 2009 Or maybe he said something else...

 

[bobertoq]

But you're all missing the point a Mac Pro with Nehalem (Core i7) and Snow Leopard sounds like a good reason to start talking ones self into getting a new Mac.


____________
If I lived in CA I would vote

Yeah... Nehalem, Snow Leopard... New nVidia GPU's. New Mac Pro's I wonder how fast the Mac Pro will be in a year or so with all the new things listed above.

 

[cyberakuma]

A quote from Steve Jobs at WWDC 08

"will ship in about a year"

so we will expect to hear a little at MacWorld '09 and I think that at WWDC '09 Steve will say.. "It will be shipping this friday!"

Total guess!

Developers might get upset to be given so little leeway to test their products on the new system.

My guesswork prediction: earlier WWDC this year with a solid (feature-complete) seed given to developers. Two announcements:

1. Announce a timeline that will have it shipping on back-to-school computers (early august). Pitch to developers will be around three themes:
- future-ready for 16+ cpu systems, with greater GPU computation support
- enterprise feature-set (e.g. licensed Exchange and Cisco VPN support, server including some "MobileMe" functionality)
- greater platform parity with iphone (replace legacy components with iphone versions, along the lines of the QuickTime X announcement)

2. Announce iPhone OS 3.0 (I'll leave guesswork on the features of that for another time), and show off the new iPhone which is a apple-custom SoC design. I anticipate hardware will still be designed be like 'previous generations, but better', but for Apple to announce a strategy to deal with application compatibility with future generations.

 

[costabunny]

All I want to see in snow Leopard is a change to the annoying gripes. My biggest one is during large file copies (lots of files) if one fails then the copy teminates it took Microsoft until Vista to fix that and yet 10.5.5 still hasnt got it.

I welcome the improvements of speed and size - something all OS manufacturers should do periodically.

 

[cyberakuma]

Safari 4 is a free beta - you just have to have a developer account (which is free)

Just click on downloads and safari when you signup/login.

WebKit nightlies don't even require that.

 

[cyberakuma]

I doubt it. Fast OS switching means both OSes are booted - that means a virtual machine for one of them. Bootcamp is just a bootloader, not a virtual machine like Fusion or Parallels. Other than having to pay extra, why not just use one of those products?

The feature in question was briefly up in leopard's released information, then pulled 'frantically' because the feature was not ready. My understanding was that it used the hibernate functionality to have the machine fall asleep and wake up with a different identity, kinda like that new TV show 'My Own Worst Enemy'. Only in this case, your own worst enemy is Vista.

 

[shawnce]

Is that your best argument? You're wrong but I can't tell you why? LOL

No we are bound by an NDA so we cannot comment... I will echo what he said and state that your post was generally incorrect.

 

[netnothing]

My machine is not 20 years old... not even close. Built Oct. 2005. Wouldn't you be a little pissed off? Your right, no ones making me upgrade - but they are forcing me to "sit on an island" an watch the ships go by, from here on out.

I understand the argument of slimming down the rest of the OS's by not having to develop for PPC's, but for those of us who purchased a machine within 4 years of it being "effectively stranded", I say they should have a trade up policy. I know they give discounts if you purchased computers within a period of time to an OS release. I know this will never happen.

I guess I would like to see them include a PPC code a bit longer and let us use Xslimmer (or they can offer the option in the install) to weed out intel code bloat and vice versa.

And, I'm not sure how your sarcasm is really sarcasm... sounds like your mocking those of us who have valid concerns and complaints. If I was trying to do this on my old 266/533 upgrade beige gossamer desktop - I would definitely deserve your mocking.

One word.....Vista.

Ok....maybe a few more words.....You at least got 4 years out of your machine. My PC was a little over 2 years old, custom built, and cannot run Vista. This was my main reason to switching to the Mac.

So I guess you could always switch to Microsoft

-Kevin

edit: Let me add to what I said above......it's not that your machine will turn into mush when Snow Leopard is released....it just won't be able to use it. Similar to my XP machine, it's still chugging away to this day.

 

[t0mat0]

Yeah... Nehalem, Snow Leopard... New nVidia GPU's. New Mac Pro's I wonder how fast the Mac Pro will be in a year or so with all the new things listed above.

Well, the Core i7 CPUs won't be the only driver of that statistic, now that GPU will be given a seat at the power table.
The Nehalem speed bump is looking at ~25% or so, but this isn't on production chips and boards yet. Plus you've got the multi-core and multi-CPU optimised tuning that Snow Leopard could bring.
I'd imagine that if we get a preview at MWSF, there might be some benchmarks by then. Depends when they drop and start fine tuning the different SL components into the developer seeds.