Apple Seeks Bankruptcy Court's Blessing to Sue Kodak over Patents

[AidenShaw]

Apple has been suing for a long time actually, but they haven't been winning until recently (they had very good reason to sue MS in 1985, but they lost because MS was so big).

Funny that you say that, because according to the courts Apple lost because their contract language was poorly written (from a 2012 pro-Apple viewpoint, of course) and did in fact give Microsoft rights to use Apple UI concepts in Windows.

It wasn't because "MS was so big", it was because Microsoft was able to prove in a court of law that Microsoft acted within the contract, and that Apple's suit could not be supported.

 

[Hugh]

fact is when this camera was developed Kodak had more money than apple. They eventually used apple technology to sell their own products and that was one of the reasons apple was in such a bad financial position back then. Everyone just assumed apple was going to roll over and die and other companies were going to gobble up the pieces. The vultures were waiting.

Now that apple is in a great position they just want their intellectual rights affirmed on a product they helped invent. Was marketed with the apple name then used by every other digital camera manufacturer out there. Why should Apple allow Kodak to risk apple property to try and save a sinking ship? To put it simply. They are basically Pawning borrowed items to pay the rent.

People aren't going to look at the real reason Apple is suing. They are just get in the hating Apple banner because they see it as Apple is going after company that is going under. They are not going to understand the all about the company is protecting there IP. That if Kodak tries to sell the that IP, who buys it can go after Apple for them using that IP.

I have read tons of messages explaining this over and over, yet it doesn't sink in. They are using their emotions over Kodak to get in the way, and not see how the business work. Remember Kodak started this, and Apple has to protect it's self.

I know, I know that 2 or 3 people have already said they know people that work or worked for Kodak, but you have to look at the big picture here. :/

Hugh

 

[ixodes]

Kick them when they're down.

Apples such a class act.

They need AK47's to speed up Jobs burning desire to wipe em all out

 

[lilsoccakid74]

I like Kodak, I hope they are able to survive and those in Rochester keep their jobs

Unfortunately, not many Kodak employees here anymore. When my dad finally decided to relocate to Arnprior, he was one of ten employees left in a building that had employed thousands.

 

[Mr. Gates]

This is why people hate Apple.

Same crap I protested of the 2000 MS domination.

Let a corrupt company go un-checked and see what happens.

 

[Can't Stop]

This is why people hate Apple.

Same crap I protested of the 2000 MS domination.

Let a corrupt company go un-checked and see what happens.

Well not in court of law right?

 

[allmIne]

There are some incredibly naive views being expressed here. Kodak has indicated an intent to bring extraordinarily wide-ranging patent litigation, presumably as a last-ditch means of generating the cash needed to emerge from bankruptcy. To that end, it already has filed patents suits against Apple, among many others. To the extent Apple has counterclaims, it it legally obligated to assert them, or it risks waiving them forever. In addition, Apple may have other patent claims against Kodak that it believes are meritorious. If it believes Kodak's claims are not, then it makes strategic sense to bring those additional claims as a response to Kodak's. In short, doing anything other than this would amount to rolling over in the face of a threat.

As someone who owned and cherished Kodak cameras back in the day, I am as saddened as anyone to see what's happening to that company. But there are real indications that their final chapter will be as a patent troll. They certainly have that right, but Apple would be positively crazy to take it without a fight.

Two other points:

1. I'm not a patent lawyer and have no opinion as to the validity of the patents. My comments are strategic only.

2. I haven't read the pleadings, but it's not unheard of to ask a bankruptcy court for this type of permission, but to wait -- sometimes indefinitely -- to bring the claims themselves. Apple may simply be sending a message that it is not without recourse if Kodak goes too far.

This is my problem with the MacRumors system. Your post was very informative, well written and I found it very useful in gaining a better understanding of the problem. Enough to make me look at the issue from both sides, as it were. Nobody has bothered to rank your post, though.

Meanwhile, somebody writes a one line, virtually useless post, and people rank or downrank on the basis of whether it matches their own opinion or not. Evidence, again, that the MR ranking system should never have been introduced, so utterly ineffectual it's proved to be.

Anyway, thanks for that post

 

[vito]

It comes to the point where I wonder if the PR department at Apple is starting to ask for some of these Lawsuits to stop. I understand that protecting the IP is definitely important, however are they factoring in the potential cost to their public image?

Public image to the average consumer? The punter on the street couldn't care less who is suing who, it's business.

So many comments on why this is bad for Apple or how Apple are seen as the bully yet protecting IP is integral to any successful organisation.

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Apple is ******** on its own good reputation.

I left microsofts windows years ago for the same bad reputation apple is earning for itself nowadays.


Looks like the future is Linux or qnx

Yep, lets choose a platform based on company reputation, if that was the case then Apple will still be the front runner

 

[GermanyChris]

How many lawsuits is AAPL currently juggling??? This is absurd. Having been from Rochester, NY I can tell you that the effects of Kodak's closing is horrendous on an already depressed economy. It's business, certainly, but why didn't AAPL sue before if this was an issue? Why now? Why at all???

So whomever buys Kodak does not have the right to use the patient..why now? because it's cheap

 

[TheMacPotato]

Many jobs in the upstate, NY area alone. Aside from Bausch & Lomb and Xerox, Kodak was a big player in Rochester. Many people worked for the company, and many Kodak and other business exec's traveled bet NYC and ROC as Kodak brought in business to the area. As for products, they were a big player in the digital camera market until mobile devices took over as the fastest growing digital film source due to major improvements in camera's. Unfortunately Kodak was one of the few companies that dug their heels in by refusing to outsource all of its products to China and other nations. I guess this is what patriotism gets you these days, bankruptcy. Due to this, they had little money for R&D and have been staving off bankruptcy for over a decade.

Now the University of Rochester and RIT are bringing in business into Rochester, N.Y., with U of R and URMC employing many with new construction of buildings/wings/research facilities and the higher education workforce along with it.



I never stated that, I do not know the specifics with regards to the lawsuits between Kodak and Apple. However, it is safe to assume with over $90 billion in cash reserves and Kodak trying to keep patents they can sell in order to pay off the [now unemployed] pensions and such of its low term employees, it seems more like a pissing contest than legitimate litigation. Apple is countersuing patents it claims were theirs (and why now?), and if they win Apple will gain little monetarily while taking away the livelihood of many. It's business, yes, I get it. I'm not a bleeding heart, but I also don't agree with it. Apple could easily walk away, whatever Kodak would get (if anything) would be a tear in a salty sea for Apple.

Aside from Kodak, how many other companies is Apple currently in litigation? I've lost count.

Brilliant. Well said

 

[840quadra]

Public image to the average consumer? The punter on the street couldn't care less who is suing who, it's business.

So many comments on why this is bad for Apple or how Apple are seen as the bully yet protecting IP is integral to any successful organisation.

As I stated, I am well aware of how important it is for them to protect their IP.

 

[Doombringer]

You know, with Proview, I can see why they'd litigate against Apple... it's a last-ditch effort and they have everything to gain and nothing to lose going up against Apple.

But for Apple to kick Kodak while it is down... why? What will it gain? Do they want all the lightbulbs and staplers from Kodak's offices, before they shut down completely?

 

[bbeagle]

You know, with Proview, I can see why they'd litigate against Apple... it's a last-ditch effort and they have everything to gain and nothing to lose going up against Apple.

But for Apple to kick Kodak while it is down... why? What will it gain? Do they want all the lightbulbs and staplers from Kodak's offices, before they shut down completely?

Ah.... the facts don't seem to matter to you do they? Does your Apple hatred blind you?

Kodak, in a last ditch effort to save it's company, pulled out all it's old patents and sued many companies, including Apple, just to see if anything would stick. Nothing did.

Apple now needs to win the Kodak patent war when it's winnable. Apple can actually save Kodak in this process as well - they can either settle out of court, and Apple can get patents and pay Kodak for them to keep Kodak around (how would that help Kodak? I don't know - but it's working for Tivo). Or Apple can win the patents on merit and then some other company won't be able to sue Apple for the same patents.

Kodak's patents won't die - they will sell them to another company, for example, Samsung. And Samsung will have the cash to go after Apple regardless of the merit of the patents.

 

[chocolaterabbit]

Apple now needs to win the Kodak patent war when it's winnable. Apple can actually save Kodak in this process as well - they can either settle out of court, and Apple can get patents and pay Kodak for them to keep Kodak around (how would that help Kodak? I don't know - but it's working for Tivo). Or Apple can win the patents on merit and then some other company won't be able to sue Apple for the same patents.

As has been said above, apple cannot save Kodak. Kodak is in so much debt that nothing can be done for them now. This lawsuit is apple looking out for its own interests and pulling out before the mob sets itself in a frenzy over kodaks remains.

Some people think apple should throw Kodak a bone, some don't.

 

[Augure]

Can we change the name of this website to "AppleLawsuits.com"?

With all the litigation, I feel like it at least deserves its own sub-forum or tab at the top.

Sorry already patented by Apple

 

[ViPhone]

Kick them when they're down.

Exactly what I first thought. But funny.

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How many lawsuits is AAPL currently juggling??? This is absurd. Having been from Rochester, NY I can tell you that the effects of Kodak's closing is horrendous on an already depressed economy. It's business, certainly, but why didn't AAPL sue before if this was an issue? Why now? Why at all???

I'm confused as to why you chose to use the ticker-name for the company instead of just spelling out "Apple"? It's a one letter difference. You aren't even abbreviating anything.

 

[JerzeyLegend]

People aren't going to look at the real reason Apple is suing. They are just get in the hating Apple banner because they see it as Apple is going after company that is going under. They are not going to understand the all about the company is protecting there IP. That if Kodak tries to sell the that IP, who buys it can go after Apple for them using that IP.

I have read tons of messages explaining this over and over, yet it doesn't sink in. They are using their emotions over Kodak to get in the way, and not see how the business work. Remember Kodak started this, and Apple has to protect it's self.

I know, I know that 2 or 3 people have already said they know people that work or worked for Kodak, but you have to look at the big picture here. :/

Stop assuming that because people disagree with one of the many seemingly low-down moves by Apple, that they are all haters. Its cliche and rather annoying.

Even as a Apple fanboy (I do not speak as a fanboy, just using an instance), when you read this story from the outside, it seems like Apple is being a terrorist.

Instead of the two companies suing each other, Kodak should make some money by either being assimilated into Apple or sell all of its IPs. It's not like they are going to need them.

Suing is costly, paying lawyers hundred of dollars per hour, and long winded court battles over pieces of paper.

When is someone going to step up and be the bigger company?

 

[LarryC]

Is this all they have time for anymore, suing people? It seems that apple has become the new bully on the school yard.

 

[3282868]

I'm confused as to why you chose to use the ticker-name for the company instead of just spelling out "Apple"? It's a one letter difference. You aren't even abbreviating anything.

I'm confused why you care