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I have the Pencil waiting to be opened too. I fancied the Smart Keyboard but it really did feel like junk when I looked at it the other day.

I agree with you on the Smart Keyboard. Appalling quality, and not inline with Apple’s own design ethos. I also declined to buy it as well, because like you said ... it’s junk.

Got the pencil though, and despite its cost, it really does add value. Mainly use it for taking notes and outlining ideas rather than art work but makes my pro 11” so much more usable.
 
iPad is not a computer. iPad is not a computer replacement. iOS is not an appropriate OS for large iPads.

The iPad's touch interface is one of its biggest strong points. iOS needs to be expanded to include more pro features for sure, but putting any OS other iOS would be a huge step backward for usability and ergonomics. Personally, I could see iOS being the primary computer for many people not looking for niche pro features like photography or software development.
 
iPad is not a computer. iPad is not a computer replacement. iOS is not an appropriate OS for large iPads.

I'm reminded of this each time I want to exclusively use my iPad Pro for photography. Apple limits photo import only to the Photos app, their Photos app can not do manual metadata editing, importing and exporting photos in and out of the Photos app causes reduction in quality. Etcetera.

The iPad Pro's true potential can never be realized due to it's crippling OS.

But, profits. So, anyway.
Depends on the person. For some people the iPad can replace their computer and for others it can’t. It all depends on what you need to use a computer for.
 
iPad is not a computer. iPad is not a computer replacement. iOS is not an appropriate OS for large iPads.

I'm reminded of this each time I want to exclusively use my iPad Pro for photography. Apple limits photo import only to the Photos app, their Photos app can not do manual metadata editing, importing and exporting photos in and out of the Photos app causes reduction in quality. Etcetera.

The iPad Pro's true potential can never be realized due to it's crippling OS.

But, profits. So, anyway.

I’m a working photographer and I’m quoting you because you mentioned being a photographer. I realise you’re talking about using the iPad exclusively, but I still think my point will be valid.

I use my iPad Pro to edit all of my photos, the only limiting factor so far is the lack of round tripping to photoshop, where necessary.
I use affinity photo as a substitute - it’s a little convoluted when round tripping, but works ok as long as you don’t need massive final photographs. The reason for this is you edit a preview on lightroom, and affinity photo can’t edit this preview, and instead Lightroom create a render from this. This issue should disappear when photoshop is finally released as it should be able to attach xml to the preview the same as lightroom does, or use PSD in the cloud. Not much to do with iOS i don’t think.

I haven’t replaced my main mac, nor do I want to. But to say the iPad can’t be used as a professional photographers computer is nonsense. In everything except importing, exporting and storage, it’s replaced my computer. These are necessary but mundane tasks that will never be suited well to a machine like an iPad, unless you have a robust and fast cloud system. I’m a pro photographer and I process thousands of images per week - the iPad has made this a very much more pleasurable experience.
ios is not particularly limiting if you realise that it’s just a different way of working.

FYI- My work flow is:
Import from cards to lightroom classic on my Mac.
Sort and rate the photos.
Put the rated photos in a folder and sync with lightroom CC.
Edit on my iPad, with the pencil. It’s completely immersive and an amazing way to edit photos. I just haven’t enjoyed editing this much since I very first started and it was all ‘new’ to me.
I then upload stuff to clients for review from the iPad, and for instagram etc.
All edits are synced back to lightroom on my desktop straight away.
I export from the desktop to upload the finals to the client.
Then also from the desktop I archive my libraries.

This workflow is getting better and better all the time, and for now, the issue with me is Adobe not releasing photoshop for the iPad yet, not iOS and not the hardware.

That’s not to say iOS can’t get better, because it can, it’s just for me it’s the 3rd party apps that need to buck up more.
 
It certainly is.
I fancied the Smart Keyboard but it really did feel like junk when I looked at it the other day.
Its garbage. Surface pro kickstand is a great form factor innovation that apple users
will never see. Good luck origami lovers!
[doublepost=1556710514][/doublepost]
Guess ipads can be used as computers after all.
Get back to me when ios supports a reasonable cut and paste workflow
 
Its garbage. Surface pro kickstand is a great form factor innovation that apple users
will never see. Good luck origami lovers!
[doublepost=1556710514][/doublepost]
Get back to me when ios supports a reasonable cut and paste workflow

Don’t need to.

As more and more consumers transition to an iPad as a computer replacement, your use case or workflow will become more and more niche.

Given the choice between a 9mm tablet with a Kickstand and a 5.9mm IPad Pro, more people choose the iPad Pro.

It also weighs less.
 
The new mini and Air were released late in March, so next quarter will better reflect the impact of these products on iPad sales. Nevertheless, it is good to see increasing iPad sales. Hopefully, this will encourage Apple to further develop their tablet platform, including much needed OS improvements.
 
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As more and more consumers transition to an iPad as a computer replacement, your use case or workflow will become more and more niche.
So in the post pc future, no one will need to cut and paste? Users will not need a keyboard attached to a tablet for productivity?

My assertion was that surface keyboard was much better than ipad smartcover.
 
So in the post pc future, no one will need to cut and paste? Users will not need a keyboard attached to a tablet for productivity?

My assertion was that surface keyboard was much better than ipad smartcover.

Keyboards are such an individual preference. Some people like to have a keyboard fixed to their tablet for convenience. Other people don’t like to have a keyboard flopping around when they hold their tablet, so they use a separate BT keyboard when the need for serious typing arises. There really is no right or wrong answer.

I have tried both, and right now I use a Smart Cover plus a separate BT keyboard. When mobile, I primarily use my iPad without a physical keyboard.....just leave the KB at home. When at home or at my desk, I’ll occasionally use the BT keyboard. For my use, it just seemed like a waste for me to carry it around all of the time (attached or separate). Of course, YMMV.
 
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Yesterday in Apple's Earnings Call Tim Cook mentioned how powerful the new 2019 iPad Air and iPad mini were, and I believe him! I had been waiting to see some Geekbench data on the iPad mini, but I needed the extra space in the 256 GB model now, so I bought one. Love it! On April 15th I tested my new 5th Generation 256 GB iPad mini (wi-fi + cellular) on GeekBench and was surprised at how strong its results were. Since Geekbench hasn't put anything up for this device yet, here are MY results, if any of you are thinking about buying one:

CPU Benchmark - Single-Core: 4819
CPU Benchmark - Multi-Core: 11467
Compute Score - Metal: 20960
Battery Score - Discharge 100% to 1%: 5640
(Battery Discharge Time: 9 hours 24 minutes)

Against other iOS device models:

3rd in CPU Single Core, behind the 2018 iPad Pro 11" (5007) and the 2018 iPad Pro 12.9" (5005), and AHEAD of the iPhone XS Max (4797)!

3rd in CPU Multi-Core, behind the 2018 iPad Pro 12.9" (17941) and the 2018 iPad Pro 11" (17898), and AHEAD of the iPhone XS (11265).

Only 8th in Compute graphics (Metal) score, behind the 2018 iPad Pro 11" (42600), 2018 iPad Pro 12.9" 3rd Gen (42450), 2017 iPad Pro 12.9" 2nd Gen (29607), 2017 iPad Pro 10.5" (29591), 2018 iPhone XS Max (21768), 2018 iPhone XR (21267), and the 2018 iPhone XS (21215), and AHEAD of the 2016 iPad Pro 9.7" (16058).

3rd again in Battery score, behind the 2017 iPad Pro 12.9" 2nd Gen (8292) and the 2018 iPad Pro 11" (6255), and AHEAD of the 2017 iPad 9.7" 5th Gen (5526).

-----

Perhaps not so surprising, the 5th Gen iPad mini beat EVERY ANDROID device in EVERY Geekbench category except Battery Score, where it came in 3rd, behind the Asus Zenfone Max Pro (M1) (6442) and Xiaomi Mi Max 2 (6059)! The Samsung Galaxy Note 9 (5154) was 3rd there, BEHIND the new 5th Generation iPad mini!

And I had 813 apps on this iPad mini and only 134 GB available, out of 256 GB, when I tested it.

A pretty impressive performance by the new iPad mini, and WAY more powerful than anyone here in the MacRumors Forums was speculating! I'm sure that the new 3rd Generation iPad Air will be just as impressive, if not more so.
 
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Too crappy a screen for the price. Hopefully Apple can improve it next time. Then there’s the bend gate. This one was easy to ignore.
 
Perhaps not so surprising, the 5th Gen iPad mini beat EVERY ANDROID device in EVERY Geekbench category except Battery Score, where it came in 3rd, behind the Asus Zenfone Max Pro (M1) (6442) and Xiaomi Mi Max 2 (6059)! The Samsung Galaxy Note 9 (5154) was 3rd there, BEHIND the new 5th Generation iPad mini!

Ahem, typo. you mean "Samsung Galaxy Note 9 (5154) was 4th there" ;)

Thank you for the incredible concise summary and testing! Much appreciated! Solid performance!!

Now ... these scores match incredibly well with iOS 12 ... but if we get huge real classic computing abilities and workflows, how well will these performance numbers work when applied to a much more powerful OS? I feel with the godfather of Mac OS X long gone (7yrs now) ... "maintenance, branding, and UI display features" is all that's really been done to macOS on the uppermost layer vs the kernel improvements ... I'm not THAT technical to really know, just what I've seen. Sure AFS was a great improvement and we're all thankful for it's implementation and that was MUCH needed. But if the kernel is improved heavily, then we'll see real push for iOS to improve and iPad Pro (2018) can really shine and evolve into an efficient modern world computer replacement vs alternative/workaround.
[doublepost=1556776740][/doublepost]Two great use cases for iPad Pro users - whom I'm sure participated within the large iPad as full computer replacement thread(s) on these boards.

iPad is not a computer. iPad is not a computer replacement. iOS is not an appropriate OS for large iPads.

I'm reminded of this each time I want to exclusively use my iPad Pro for photography. Apple limits photo import only to the Photos app, their Photos app can not do manual metadata editing, importing and exporting photos in and out of the Photos app causes reduction in quality. Etcetera.

The iPad Pro's true potential can never be realized due to it's crippling OS.

But, profits. So, anyway.

CPU, GPU, Storage, an OS, internet connectivity ... by all definitions it IS a computer. How you use a computer traditionally vs iOS on iPad ... will heavily differ in this perception, but it is a computer, OS limitations aside it's a computer.

I fully understand and agree with you on these limitations and I could rebuttal back and forth on the 'concept' of file system vs no file system (if implemented correctly without such limitations) ... but as a non-photographer myself ... I'm all ears and eyes and learning. can't debate here.

I’m a working photographer and I’m quoting you because you mentioned being a photographer. I realise you’re talking about using the iPad exclusively, but I still think my point will be valid.

I use my iPad Pro to edit all of my photos, the only limiting factor so far is the lack of round tripping to photoshop, where necessary.
I use affinity photo as a substitute - it’s a little convoluted when round tripping, but works ok as long as you don’t need massive final photographs. The reason for this is you edit a preview on lightroom, and affinity photo can’t edit this preview, and instead Lightroom create a render from this. This issue should disappear when photoshop is finally released as it should be able to attach xml to the preview the same as lightroom does, or use PSD in the cloud. Not much to do with iOS i don’t think.

I haven’t replaced my main mac, nor do I want to. But to say the iPad can’t be used as a professional photographers computer is nonsense. In everything except importing, exporting and storage, it’s replaced my computer. These are necessary but mundane tasks that will never be suited well to a machine like an iPad, unless you have a robust and fast cloud system. I’m a pro photographer and I process thousands of images per week - the iPad has made this a very much more pleasurable experience.
ios is not particularly limiting if you realise that it’s just a different way of working.

FYI- My work flow is:
Import from cards to lightroom classic on my Mac.
Sort and rate the photos.
Put the rated photos in a folder and sync with lightroom CC.
Edit on my iPad, with the pencil. It’s completely immersive and an amazing way to edit photos. I just haven’t enjoyed editing this much since I very first started and it was all ‘new’ to me.
I then upload stuff to clients for review from the iPad, and for instagram etc.
All edits are synced back to lightroom on my desktop straight away.
I export from the desktop to upload the finals to the client.
Then also from the desktop I archive my libraries.

This workflow is getting better and better all the time, and for now, the issue with me is Adobe not releasing photoshop for the iPad yet, not iOS and not the hardware.

That’s not to say iOS can’t get better, because it can, it’s just for me it’s the 3rd party apps that need to buck up more.

I'm curious ... with the iPad's performance, and if you have decent mobile data or readily accessible public Wi-Fi access points that are not so limiting ... could a more efficient workflow be used?

You have a Mac, iPad Pro, and need Lightroom or Photoshop to get what you need/want right?
Can macOS, maybe with a free version of VMware Horizon running allow you to ... import photos from camera onto iPad and into the iOS Files app (storage within iCloud), then connect over the VMWare Horizon ciient on the iPad Pro and fully engage, edit/manipulate photos and XML data therein, export to iCloud (Box.net, GoogleCloud, Mega.nz, etc) storage and then distribute Thereafter? Less use for extra app licenses on iOS, making this a cheaper workaround/solution potentially - I haven't tried just thinking aloud here - and more of a seamless workflow?

Not sure if you've looked into this, I'm sure someone mentioned this workflow in the large iPad as computer replacement thread.
 
So in the post pc future, no one will need to cut and paste? Users will not need a keyboard attached to a tablet for productivity?

My assertion was that surface keyboard was much better than ipad smartcover.

Apparently not, judging from Ipad sales.

iOS can cut and paste, it also works over iCloud so you can cut or copy from one device and paste it on another device. Welcome to the future.

If you look at sales of iPads versus surface devices, consumers don’t seem to care about kickstands or surface keyboards when it comes to a tablet. Perhaps the iPad keyboard is good enough or perhaps people like to type on glass or use dictation.

Your assertion could be true, but consumers don’t seem to care, if they did surface sales would eclipse iPad sales. They don’t.
 
I'm curious ... with the iPad's performance, and if you have decent mobile data or readily accessible public Wi-Fi access points that are not so limiting ... could a more efficient workflow be used?

You have a Mac, iPad Pro, and need Lightroom or Photoshop to get what you need/want right?
Can macOS, maybe with a free version of VMware Horizon running allow you to ... import photos from camera onto iPad and into the iOS Files app (storage within iCloud), then connect over the VMWare Horizon ciient on the iPad Pro and fully engage, edit/manipulate photos and XML data therein, export to iCloud (Box.net, GoogleCloud, Mega.nz, etc) storage and then distribute Thereafter? Less use for extra app licenses on iOS, making this a cheaper workaround/solution potentially - I haven't tried just thinking aloud here - and more of a seamless workflow?

Not sure if you've looked into this, I'm sure someone mentioned this workflow in the large iPad as computer replacement thread.

Interesting idea. I’m not sure I understand fully what you mean but...

I have never looked in to VMWare Horizon, but as it stands at the moment I’m not sure this would help in my case. The main reason my first step is to import and sort on my Mac Rather than to my iPad, is because I have so many photos coming off of a shoot.
After sorting I will only edit around a quarter of them.
I wouldn’t want to upload them all to the cloud, it’s to time consuming for 1000’s of huge raw files. Not to mention pricey for all the storage.
I do use a NAS, so it’s a thought that I’ll keep to the back of my head and investigate the possibilities.
 
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iOS can cut and paste, it also works over iCloud so you can cut or copy from one device and paste it on another device. Welcome to the future.
To cut and paste in ios: 1) grasp to side buttons to take screen shot, 2) expand screen shot 3)lasso on screen shot 4)long press to cut 5) close screen shot 7) long press in app to paste. Welcome to the future!
 
To cut and paste in ios: 1) grasp to side buttons to take screen shot, 2) expand screen shot 3)lasso on screen shot 4)long press to cut 5) close screen shot 7) long press in app to paste. Welcome to the future!

Your talking about taking a screenshot and editing it all in one go. Yup it really is the future.

Much easier and faster than doing it on a Mac.

Could be why so many people are replacing their computers with iPads.
 
Interesting idea. I’m not sure I understand fully what you mean but...

I have never looked in to VMWare Horizon, but as it stands at the moment I’m not sure this would help in my case. The main reason my first step is to import and sort on my Mac Rather than to my iPad, is because I have so many photos coming off of a shoot.
After sorting I will only edit around a quarter of them.
I wouldn’t want to upload them all to the cloud, it’s to time consuming for 1000’s of huge raw files. Not to mention pricey for all the storage.
I do use a NAS, so it’s a thought that I’ll keep to the back of my head and investigate the possibilities.


Video Editing on iOS:

2016 thread using IPP (OG model) with Remote Desktop
https://forums.macrumors.com/thread...ix-x1-mouse-no-need-for-laptop.1959404/page-2

There's more but you'll need a bit of time to find the right thread and to go through it all.
 
Ahem, typo. you mean "Samsung Galaxy Note 9 (5154) was 4th there" ;)

Thank you for the incredible concise summary and testing! Much appreciated! Solid performance!!

Now ... these scores match incredibly well with iOS 12 ... but if we get huge real classic computing abilities and workflows, how well will these performance numbers work when applied to a much more powerful OS? I feel with the godfather of Mac OS X long gone (7yrs now) ... "maintenance, branding, and UI display features" is all that's really been done to macOS on the uppermost layer vs the kernel improvements

Well, the iPad mini 5 would be in third place ahead of the Note 9 if it were an Android device, but luckily for us it isn't.

Primate Labs has done an amazing job developing Geekbench, which does all the work here, and in ranking all of the results. Go to their website at:

http://www.geekbench.com/

and click on "BROWSER", then under "Benchmark Charts" click on the "iOS" button and you'll see results going back to the iPhone 4S and the 5th Gen iPod touch. Older devices cannot run the latest Geekbench. My 4th Gen iPod touch, which I still use, only runs up to iOS 9, while Geekbench 4 requires iOS 11 or later.

I'm guessing that Primate Labs puts up results for new devices only after they pass some threshold of a certain number of results. I encourage everyone to download the free Geekbench from the App Store and to test your iOS or macOS devices, so that the new iPads will get listed in the Geekbench Browser. The only test that takes a long time is the Battery test. My full 100% to 1% Battery test took 9 1/2 hours -- I've always heard that it's a good idea to run your battery all the way down once a month, anyway. Because the A12 Bionic processor in the iPad mini 5 and the iPad Air 3 is so fast, the other tests don't take very long.

Or maybe Primate Labs only shows the results if you use Geekbench Pro, which costs $9.99 US. I'll buy the iOS Pro version to find out. And to support Primate Labs. From the description, the Pro version has extra tweaks which I probably won't use. I've been buying Macintosh versions for a long time.

I remember that there was a benchmark test that started with the original Macintosh, or maybe the Apple 1, scoring "1". Pretty sure it wasn't Geekbench, though.

-----

I also miss Steve Jobs. He really cared about the users of his devices, you could see that in his Keynote addresses. I even used a friend's NeXT workstation a few times -- no way I could afford one, but it was a nice, friendly machine, as everyone who has used its OS X descendants can attest. I think I read that iOS was built from the same Kernel and that it's a subset of OS X/macOS. Maybe we'll hear more about that at WWDC in San Jose on June 3rd. There'll be thousands of brilliant Apple employees there who keep all of our machines working, almost perfectly, decade after decade. How many companies can claim that?
 
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iPad is not a computer. iPad is not a computer replacement. iOS is not an appropriate OS for large iPads.

I'm reminded of this each time I want to exclusively use my iPad Pro for photography. Apple limits photo import only to the Photos app, their Photos app can not do manual metadata editing, importing and exporting photos in and out of the Photos app causes reduction in quality. Etcetera.

The iPad Pro's true potential can never be realized due to it's crippling OS.

But, profits. So, anyway.

Completely agree, and will add iOS Apple Photos inability for adding a title to an image. For adding titles I use our nine year old MBP. But WAIT FOR IT, though iOS Apple Photos have titles one cannot search by photo title, nor EXIF data and the like; extremely frustrating.

Absolutely, iOS is quite good for many projects, it is why iPad is my daily driver, sadly for photographers iOS Apple Photos is “Not Ready for Prime Time”. For many years my iPad have been my daily driver, still I must use a nine year old MBP, or our old Chromebook, for things iOS years ago should have built in; frustrating.
 
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Well they redesigned it and jacked the price way up. What did they expect? People want new stuff. Imagine if they did this more often (minus the jacking the price way up part).

When it comes to iPads, I don't know about the jacked up pricing part. I updated my iPad recently because the base model was a lot more iPad than the iPad 4 it was replacing and cost much less than what I paid for that old iPad 4.
 
The long term trend seems to have been dropping for the iPad from the initial years after its release.

Interestingly Mac revenue seem to be holding steady for the past decade and is currently higher than iPad.

Image.jpg


Image 2.jpg
 
I'm confused. Why is Mac way lower than iPad sales in the graph, but larger in the pie chart?

The stacked area chart represents each revenue area by the width of its band, not its topmost line position. So iPhone red band represents 54% of the total revenue of all colored bands on the left axis. The iPad purple band represents 8% of that total number. The color band widths in the stacked area chart are proportional to the slice size represented in the pie chart.
 
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