Apple Should be Embarrassed About Mac Pricing

[suneohair]

Funny, for the previlege of having a big ugly box-like thing Apple charges you $2999 for it. I don't see the AIO design of the iMac as a boon, I see it as a curse.

This is in response to your first post on this page too.

You are not the typical computer buying person. Frankly Apple doesn't care about you and you not buying doesn't hurt their bottom line. People simply don't know. If they want a Mac they buy a mac, if they want a Dell they buy a Dell.

There are people buying Dells right now with a Pentium Dual core T2080, simply because it is $699. In the 1505, the fastest C2D is a 1.83ghz. Even if you go to the top end 1505, you get 2Gb @ 533mhz bus. The same crappy T2080, and still no choice for something faster than a 1.83 C2D.

I can't defend the Mini, but I think we will be seeing some big changes with it soon. I am sure there are people still buying them though. Right now as I type this, do you think they know about Merom? maybe, most likely not though. But they don't care they want a Mini.

Apple is winning over because of the software, regardless of hardware because MOST people have no idea whats going on.

 

[Denmac1]

Interesting

I've always bought a computer for the functions I needed it for. I'm amazed at this craving for the latest & greatest. I'm still using my G5 that I bought two years ago. When I updated to Tiger, it was like having a new computer again. Leopard, although slightly delayed (unlike Vista), will agin take me to the next level. I have been an Apple user for some time, using only PC'S at work and actually still have my Apple IIe ( and my Perfoma 475, Power PC 6500 & iMac Graphite).


Price? Let's talk price. For my buck, Apple has always been a better value. My first IIe cost me $2500, with twin floppy drive (ooooHH!), dot matrix printer and green screen. When I got my Performa 475 and went to COLOR. WOWEE! My iMac was my first with the newer G processor and I though it had EVERYTHING! My G5 and ACD cost me 3K and it's worth every penny to have the machine match the software and vice versa. I probably won't need to purchase anything new for another 3 years or later when Apple possibly won't support the chip anymore.

You can keep your Dell's and their "let's oudate something next week' attitude. So keep in perspective that everyone likes what they like, however I don't buy into the Microsoft machine unless it's absolutely necessary.

Buy who and what you think you have to have, but it seems, in my opinion, that Apple still comes out best in the long run.

My 2 cents.

 

[Abstract]

More crap threads. The only thing that needs an update right now is a the Mini.

Everything IMO is fine. The lack of Mini updates might hint toward something though, like a slightly larger faster mini with faster merom/penryn with the new iMac getting Conroe/Quad chip. Mac Pro moving to 8-core only at some point.

So you all defend Apple for not upgrading their hardware because they want to make more money? I know Apple has OS X, but I think that's a lame point to bring up because obviously Apple is the only one who offers it. We're talking about hardware updates, which has become more transparent now because people know Intel's technology. It doesn't mean that everyone has to defend Apple because they're selling a machine with specs that don't match up to any of the competition out there, not even the low-end machines from other manufacturers.

I'm going to give the OP a break and agree with him about the Mini. Before the update 8 months ago, it was in dire need of an update. After the update, it was still behind the competition because everything was moving to C2D. The Mini has always been the ONE machine that I felt was lagging behind ---- ever since the move from Intel. Anyone remember the Core Solo it first used?!?!?!

The iMac is OK value, the MacBook is good value (although I'm sure someone will come on and say they can find a similar (Windows) machine for cheaper), and the Mac Pros were just updated, and look fantastic.

 

[Turkish]

I see your point. They hold value longer like mercedes and BMW..

I guess it is that I went to configure a comparable Dell to an IMac recently. I was shocked how much more the Imac cost. About 900 more....
I was very dis-heartened as I didn't think the difference was so much anymore...

What, exactly, is Dell making that is comparable?

 

[SMM]

If that is not a troll indicator, then I haven't seen one yet

No kidding. This is MS Troll 101. They ought to make these folk go to something like Troll Bootcamp. It should improve the trolling to at least entertainment. It has become so bloody predictable and just keeps following the same worn-out patterns. Maybe we could build them a template and they could just pick out the complaint, format, threat and even title suggestions.

Trolling template 101 - Please fill in the blanks and circle the options.

Hi, my name is ___________. I have/have not previously owned a Mac, but I Love/want to love them. The problem/issue is the Macs (make a choice):

1) Are too expensive
2) Take too long to update
3) Are no longer safe

Apple should be (make a choice):

1) Ashamed
2) Embarrassed
3) Publically flogged

I know (make a choice):

1) Many people
2) Hundreds of people
3) Entire continents

would buy Macs if they did not have these (make a choice):

1) Constant
2) Historical
3) Anticipated
4) Historical, Constant and Anticipated

Issues. Apple does not see/will never see what users want.

 

[aristobrat]

First, let me preface this by saying I am a big Mac fan!! I don't own one yet, but I am thinking of getting a Mac Mini.

Agreed 110%. I recommend Macs now just because of Applecare to be honest. I can't believe the level of questions they will answer with patience and courtesy. Best $250 I ever spent...

You don't own an Apple yet, but the best $250 you've ever spent was on AppleCare?

If Apple is going to win people over on the merit of their software, fine. But make sure their hardware is up to scratch.

I use the weakest mini that Apple sells (1.66 CD) as a multimedia PC hooked up to one of my TVs. Its hardware handles the software Apple sold it with effortlessly, as well as the other stuff I use it for (re-encoding, EyeTV, torrenting, etc). IMO, that makes it up to scratch.

I'd also like to see the mini get an update, but I don't think it's fair to paint it in the light that it doesn't deliver when it comes to being able to run the "digitial life" and "Now showing" software that Apple uses to sell stuff.

 

[johnee]

So you all defend Apple for not upgrading their hardware because they want to make more money? I know Apple has OS X, but I think that's a lame point to bring up because obviously Apple is the only one who offers it. We're talking about hardware updates, which has become more transparent now because people know Intel's technology. It doesn't mean that everyone has to defend Apple because they're selling a machine with specs that don't match up to any of the competition out there, not even the low-end machines from other manufacturers.

I'm going to give the OP a break and agree with him about the Mini. Before the update 8 months ago, it was in dire need of an update. After the update, it was still behind the competition because everything was moving to C2D. The Mini has always been the ONE machine that I felt was lagging behind ---- ever since the move from Intel. Anyone remember the Core Solo it first used?!?!?!

The iMac is OK value, the MacBook is good value (although I'm sure someone will come on and say they can find a similar (Windows) machine for cheaper), and the Mac Pros were just updated, and look fantastic.

I like the way you put that!

It bugs me that people are 100% apologetic for ANYTHING. Apple is a company, not the creator of the universe. They need to be questioned and questioned hard. read my lips:

NEVER HAVE BLIND FAITH IN ANYTHING

 

[WannaGoMac]

This is in response to your first post on this page too.

You are not the typical computer buying person. Frankly Apple doesn't care about you and you not buying doesn't hurt their bottom line. People simply don't know. If they want a Mac they buy a mac, if they want a Dell they buy a Dell.

There are people buying Dells right now with a Pentium Dual core T2080, simply because it is $699. In the 1505, the fastest C2D is a 1.83ghz. Even if you go to the top end 1505, you get 2Gb @ 533mhz bus. The same crappy T2080, and still no choice for something faster than a 1.83 C2D.

I can't defend the Mini, but I think we will be seeing some big changes with it soon. I am sure there are people still buying them though. Right now as I type this, do you think they know about Merom? maybe, most likely not though. But they don't care they want a Mini.

Apple is winning over because of the software, regardless of hardware because MOST people have no idea whats going on.

Yes, but people can tell the difference in an ad saying Core Duo and Core 2 Duo. Apple should have lowered the Mini price for the current configuration by now, or bump the ram to 2gb or something to compensate. It's not like intel hasn't lowered the CPU cost for the Core Duo....

 

[synth3tik]

Apple does not update their product line as much, well because it doesn't need it. Apple builds their products to run longer then others before needing a upgrade. This is reflected in the price. So lets say you have a Dell (can't think of the model) and a Mac Mini, both have the same spec etc. etc. From what I have seen the Mini would be about $100-200 more then the Dell. Now the Dell will be replaced in about a year, as it is a lower end PC and is going to be plagued with problems and the hardware will just get old. The Mini will be working hard or at least another year. $500 every 12 months or $750 every 24-36 months.

 

[WannaGoMac]

So you all defend Apple for not upgrading their hardware because they want to make more money? I know Apple has OS X, but I think that's a lame point to bring up because obviously Apple is the only one who offers it. We're talking about hardware updates, which has become more transparent now because people know Intel's technology. It doesn't mean that everyone has to defend Apple because they're selling a machine with specs that don't match up to any of the competition out there, not even the low-end machines from other manufacturers.

I'm going to give the OP a break and agree with him about the Mini. Before the update 8 months ago, it was in dire need of an update. After the update, it was still behind the competition because everything was moving to C2D. The Mini has always been the ONE machine that I felt was lagging behind ---- ever since the move from Intel. Anyone remember the Core Solo it first used?!?!?!

The iMac is OK value, the MacBook is good value (although I'm sure someone will come on and say they can find a similar (Windows) machine for cheaper), and the Mac Pros were just updated, and look fantastic.

Thanks. However, price an Imac to a Dell.. it's a huge price premium that just gets larger as Dell lowers the system price due to decrease costs from intel. Yes, I know you get Ilife OSX etc, but you also got those 6 months ago when Apple last updated the line.

Cmon apple, pass on those savings to your customers. Premiums of $800-1000 are not going to help shake the image that Apple are "expensive" computers...

You don't own an Apple yet, but the best $250 you've ever spent was on AppleCare?


I use the weakest mini that Apple sells (1.66 CD) as a multimedia PC hooked up to one of my TVs. Its hardware handles the software Apple sold it with effortlessly, as well as the other stuff I use it for (re-encoding, EyeTV, torrenting, etc). IMO, that makes it up to scratch.

I'd also like to see the mini get an update, but I don't think it's fair to paint it in the light that it doesn't deliver when it comes to being able to run the "digitial life" and "Now showing" software that Apple uses to sell stuff.

Look up a couple posts, you will see that I BOUGHT A MACBOOK C2D in November for someone. That's why i also bought them AppleCare and have loved it...

No kidding. This is MS Troll 101. They ought to make these folk go to something like Troll Bootcamp. It should improve the trolling to at least entertainment. It has become so bloody predictable and just keeps following the same worn-out patterns. Maybe we could build them a template and they could just pick out the complaint, format, threat and even title suggestions.

Trolling template 101 - Please fill in the blanks and circle the options.

Hi, my name is ___________. I have/have not previously owned a Mac, but I Love/want to love them. The problem/issue is the Macs (make a choice):

1) Are too expensive
2) Take too long to update
3) Are no longer safe

Apple should be (make a choice):

1) Ashamed
2) Embarrassed
3) Publically flogged

I know (make a choice):

1) Many people
2) Hundreds of people
3) Entire continents

would buy Macs if they did not have these (make a choice):

1) Constant
2) Historical
3) Anticipated
4) Historical, Constant and Anticipated

Issues. Apple does not see/will never see what users want.

Nope, not a troll. Just some fun discussion. I just want to discuss why:

1) Apple does not keep the Mac hardware specs to maintain the same level of premium?

2) Or, pass on the savings to the buyer as Intel lowers it's prices for CPUs. Is apple saying the $599 Mac Mini is not cheaper to build now as compared to September 2006??

 

[aristobrat]

It bugs me that people are 100% apologetic for ANYTHING. Apple is a company, not the creator of the universe. They need to be questioned and questioned hard.

Apple is a publicly traded company, so it has only one responsibility -- make money for the stock holders.

There's no need to question them.

When they feel they can financially benefit from a Mac mini hardware refresh, they'll do it.

 

[PCtoMac-change]

I don't know if anyone else has noticed, but Intel doesn't update their product line like they used to. They are basically updating their processor lines once a year or so.

They will once AMD gets back in the game. Why update when you are already pwning the competition? The only reason to get a AMD now is a low low budget system(700 or less), or if you are a AMD fanboy hoping their new line will actually be competition.

 

[JAT]

So, the point of this thread is what? The Mini is overpriced? Ok.

It is the only Apple that is overpriced. It may not be fair, you may not like it. Buy refurb to get the price in the right place, that's what I did. Or don't, always an option.

 

[Shotgun OS]

Thanks. However, price an Imac to a Dell.. it's a huge price premium that just gets larger as Dell lowers the system price due to decrease costs from intel. Yes, I know you get Ilife OSX etc, but you also got those 6 months ago when Apple last updated the line.

Cmon apple, pass on those savings to your customers. Premiums of $800-1000 are not going to help shake the image that Apple are "expensive" computers...

You keep repeating the same thing. You keep getting the same answers.

1) Apple doesnt need to update.
2) You cannot compare a Dell or HP to a Mac. PCs are not made as well as Macs, and do not last as long. No Mac setup can be configured in an HP/Dell.

What is the point of this thread?
Seems like a trollish thread.

 

[JAT]

Nope, not a troll. Just some fun discussion. I just want to discuss why:

1) Apple does not keep the Mac hardware specs to maintain the same level of premium?

2) Or, pass on the savings to the buyer as Intel lowers it's prices for CPUs. Is apple saying the $599 Mac Mini is not cheaper to build now as compared to September 2006??

Good lord. Fine.
1. What is supposed to be updated? Someone pointed out the very recent update to 8 cores, and people trashed the comment. What, it didn't happen? All the other computers in the industry are also 8 core, and under $1000? Not. Are not the iMac, MP, and MBP all running top of the line Intel chips? Are you mad at Apple or Intel? Or is this just another one of those, "I want a $15000 computer for $500, I hate Apple" threads?

2. See my above post. Try a refurb or give up on the Mini. It is a fairly unique computer with its small footprint and it is not real cheap.

 

[dmelgar]

If that is not a troll indicator, then I haven't seen one yet

Chill. Its not helpful when people are so in love of Apple that any complaint about Apple's real issues must be from a troll.

 

[aristobrat]

Chill. Its not helpful when people are so in love of Apple that any complaint about Apple's real issues must be from a troll.

Agreed, but as already pointed out, when there's only a limited number of guesses for why Apple does what it does -- and they've all been pretty much discussed in this thread -- what's the point of the OP continuing?

 

[Lancetx]

I guess it is that I went to configure a comparable Dell to an IMac recently. I was shocked how much more the Imac cost. About 900 more....

By all means, please show us the $599 Dell that is "comparable" to the $1,499 20" iMac, or the $299 Dell that is "comparable" to the $1,199 17" iMac. I must have completely missed finding those on Dell's website somehow....

 

[dmelgar]

I just want to discuss why:

1) Apple does not keep the Mac hardware specs to maintain the same level of premium?

2) Apple doesn't pass on the savings to the buyer as Intel lowers it's prices for CPUs. Is apple saying the $599 Mac Mini is not cheaper to build now as compared to September 2006??

I agree. Apple is in the Intel world now and its easy to compare prices. When the systems were announced they were an ok to good deal. Many months later, they haven't dropped prices, they haven't updated the systems, its embarrassing.

My theory is simple. Apple is again short handed. They don't have the resources to keep updating prices and configurations no matter how trivial it is. They've lazy rolling around in money because they are accustomed to a Mac community which will buy anything Apple puts out no matter how overpriced it is.

More concerning to me, this shows that they're not serious about gaining market share. Bad signals include:
- Removing "computer" from their name. Makes it sound like they don't care about their computer line.
- The reason given for delaying Leopard... because they're short handed and need to get the phone out the door. Again sounds like they don't care about computers. This also missed the opportunity to capture switchers unhappy with Vista.
- Maintaining ridiculously high prices on systems and upgrades. Upgrade the Macbook 60GB harddrive to 160GB costs you $300. Yet the 160GB drive in quantity of one only costs $100!!


Apple obviously cares about marketing low prices. Look at SJ's keynotes where he announced the new Intel machines. Each time he did a price compare with an equivalent Dell box and Apple came out CHEAPER! Woohoo! The days of paying a premium for Apple were over, best of both worlds. They get lots of press, lots of people, myself included start evangelizing the new doctrine that Apple computers are NOT more expensive yet you get much more.

That was true when the systems came out, but now Apple is trying to stretch people's memory. Hoping they'll remember the lines from the keynote and not price check.

I've been waiting to buy a Mini, but have kept assuming a C2D update was going to happen any day. I'm losing faith after the Leopard delay. I wouldn't be surprised if Santa Rosa update doesn't happen until October, Apple hasn't been speedy of late.

 

[YoYoMa]

Everything the OP has said is absolutely true. It's amazing the kind of logic you guys will use to defend Apple no matter what. We ALL know that Apple has the ability to pass on the savings from that out of date chip in the Mini. Apple is FAMOUS for charging too much for out of date hardware. Have you all forgotten how much they were charging for that G4 Powerbook before the intel switch?? $2500 ring a bell?? The OP has a very legitimate point and that Mini should not cost what it does.

PS- The next person to call the OP a troll will officially be named Steve Jobs new pet sheep.

 

[pseudobrit]

If Apple updated specs or pricing every time new supplies became available you'd see twice as many people whining about how they just bought product xMac for $999 because it was just released a week before and here we are barely a month later and it's got a faster/bigger x and only costs $799 and that'll be the last time they ever buy an Apple.

Some people are never happy with Apple. We sometimes call them trolls. baaaaaaa

 

[WannaGoMac]

. Again sounds like they don't care about computers.

I sometimes think that Apple now views the Mac as just the hub to the "Apple Electronic Life" they are trying to create. Sort of the "Sony Style" copy, where you had/have Sony touching all aspects of your electronic world.

Maybe because they couldn't beat MS head-on in computers they are trying an end run by doing it on the electronics battlefront because of the Ipod success... just a thought

Everything the OP has said is absolutely true. It's amazing the kind of logic you guys will use to defend Apple no matter what. We ALL know that Apple has the ability to pass on the savings from that out of date chip in the Mini. Apple is FAMOUS for charging too much for out of date hardware. Have you all forgotten how much they were charging for that G4 Powerbook before the intel switch?? $2500 ring a bell?? The OP has a very legitimate point and that Mini should not cost what it does.

PS- The next person to call the OP a troll will officially be named Steve Jobs new pet sheep.

Thanks for the kind words.

Can you imagine how many Mac Mini's they would sell if the lowered the $599 to $399 to reflect the cheaper Core Duo prices?! As an earlier poster stated, perhaps Apple really doesn't want the Mac to get larger in the market.

If Apple updated specs or pricing every time new supplies became available you'd see twice as many people whining about how they just bought product xMac for $999 because it was just released a week before and here we are barely a month later and it's got a faster/bigger x and only costs $799 and that'll be the last time they ever buy an Apple.

Doubt it as this model is EXACTLY what is in place at Dell/HP/etc. Buyers are well aware that whatever they buy today will definitely be cheaper in a week. This is why the vendors have (or used to last I checked) a 30 day price guarantee on the computers.

 

[wildthing1994]

No kidding. This is MS Troll 101. They ought to make these folk go to something like Troll Bootcamp. It should improve the trolling to at least entertainment. It has become so bloody predictable and just keeps following the same worn-out patterns. Maybe we could build them a template and they could just pick out the complaint, format, threat and even title suggestions.

Trolling template 101 - Please fill in the blanks and circle the options.

Hi, my name is ___________. I have/have not previously owned a Mac, but I Love/want to love them. The problem/issue is the Macs (make a choice):

1) Are too expensive
2) Take too long to update
3) Are no longer safe

Apple should be (make a choice):

1) Ashamed
2) Embarrassed
3) Publically flogged

I know (make a choice):

1) Many people
2) Hundreds of people
3) Entire continents

would buy Macs if they did not have these (make a choice):

1) Constant
2) Historical
3) Anticipated
4) Historical, Constant and Anticipated

Issues. Apple does not see/will never see what users want.

Trolling template 101 - Please fill in the blanks and circle the options.

Hi, my name is _____Dik______. I have/have not previously owned a Mac, but I Love/want to love them. The problem/issue is the Macs (make a choice):

1) Are too expensive
2) Take too long to update
(3) Are no longer safe)
Comments:
I'm told if I get a mac that 'I'm gay' by the kids at school, and that they'll beat me up.

Apple should be (make a choice):

1) Ashamed
2) Embarrassed
(3) Publically flogged)

Comments:
As I am.

I know (make a choice):

(1) Many people)
2) Hundreds of people
3) Entire continents
Comments:
The kids at school

would buy Macs if they did not have these (make a choice):

1) Constant
2) Historical
3) Anticipated
4) Historical, Constant and Anticipated
Comments:
I don't understand the question...

Issues. Apple does not see/will never see what users want.

 

[WannaGoMac]

Trolling template 101 - Please fill in the blanks and circle the options.

Hi, my name is _____Dik______. I have/have not previously owned a Mac, but I Love/want to love them. The problem/issue is the Macs (make a choice):

1) Are too expensive
2) Take too long to update
(3) Are no longer safe)
Comments:
I'm told if I get a mac that 'I'm gay' by the kids at school, and that they'll beat me up.

Apple should be (make a choice):

1) Ashamed
2) Embarrassed
(3) Publically flogged)

Comments:
As I am.

I know (make a choice):

(1) Many people)
2) Hundreds of people
3) Entire continents
Comments:
The kids at school

would buy Macs if they did not have these (make a choice):

1) Constant
2) Historical
3) Anticipated
4) Historical, Constant and Anticipated
Comments:
I don't understand the question...

Issues. Apple does not see/will never see what users want.

Wow, thanks for posting this again otherwise we all would have missed it. I especially liked the quote of the prior duplicate posting....
Very helpful and informative contribution to the thread!

Hmm, perhaps there should be a concept of Thread Troll -- someone who trolls threads calling the people trolls? lol Or SJPS -- Steve Jobs Pet Sheep

 

[KurtangleTN]

He's got a good point, and please if Apple started offering consumer, mid-range desktops I'd be all over them before I would get an iMac, even if it was as ugly as a Dell. It's funny because the Mac Pro is close in price to the high end Dells.

I guess I'm one of the rare people here who like performance over style. If you can do both then great.

The worst parts about AIO is you pay extra (according to most in this thread) and get notebook parts, and with notebook parts your getting older desktop technology.

Anything that goes against Apple isn't trolling. He's bringing up something that's been around Apple for ages, if you think it's true or not. The base cost of a Mac looks to be on average more. Now most people think of today, but like many people said you get a computer that last longer, holds it's value more, and is nicer design in the long run, and maybe in the long run is a better buy.