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"I am sure you will be on right as preorders open to pay higher prices for lower quality though."

Please stop with the juvenile insults.

Curious, whose laptop are you going to purchase instead?
Just get a used one. Apple doesn't realize the sales and gets none of my money. I haven't bought a new Apple product in over a decade. I'm a drop in a bucket but enough drops fills the whole thing.
 
Too bad they don't use something that is nearly free, like sand, to make computer chips. Oh wait, they do use silicon from sand. Why are chips so expensive then? Someone is making a lot of money off the increased price of chips.
I think the best way to answer this question is to go to the beach, grab some sand on the ground, and try to make a chip out of it.
 
wow. with a recession coming and Apple raising their prices on Macs due to increase costs that means Intel and PC's will get added sales.
 
Just get a used one. Apple doesn't realize the sales and gets none of my money. I haven't bought a new Apple product in over a decade. I'm a drop in a bucket but enough drops fills the whole thing.
Yeah but if you follow this logic to its conclusion, where are those used phones going to come from if literally no one buys a new one? This doesn't solve the problem for everyone.
 
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Yeah but if you follow this logic to its conclusion, where are those used phones going to come from if literally no one buys a new one? This doesn't solve the problem for everyone.
Eventually people would keep their phones longer (which is my other big recommendation). Like 4–6 years, instead of just 2 or 3.

I'm not proposing a solution that'll fix all our problems. I'm saying there are intentional choices people can make (but usually don't) that will make bad situations less bad, and that will work toward a more sustainable future with less materialism.

If everyone bought a used phone until all the used phones were gone, sure, some people would eventually need to buy new phones, but that'd put a huge dent in smartphone companies' profits, which would result in them creating fewer phones (lower supply if demand lowers). And if people kept those phones they bought for longer, same result. So my plan really does help in the long run, even if it doesn't 100% eliminate all new phone purchases for all time.
 
Too bad they don't use something that is nearly free, like sand, to make computer chips. Oh wait, they do use silicon from sand. Why are chips so expensive then? Someone is making a lot of money off the increased price of chips.
I don't like sand. It's coarse, rough, irritating, and it gets everywhere.
 
Eventually people would keep their phones longer (which is my other big recommendation). Like 4–6 years, instead of just 2 or 3.
Average for iPhones is already 2.5-5 years depending on who you read.

Polls suggest users usually plan keeping their phones 3-5 years on average, although other factors can decrease that time in real life.

I personally keep my phones 4 years, meaning between my wife and I, we alternate getting new phones every 2 years.
 
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Average is already 3-5 years.
Then we're going in the right direction. If phone companies made batteries easier to replace, we could repair one component that usually degrades and keep chugging along. We do that with computers by and large, and phones are just smaller computers.

We still need to get that number bumped up higher.
 
Too bad they don't use something that is nearly free, like sand, to make computer chips. Oh wait, they do use silicon from sand. Why are chips so expensive then? Someone is making a lot of money off the increased price of chips.
Feel free to go to the beach, build an iPhone and let me know when you successfully use it to surf the Internet…we’ll all be waiting here for the results.
 
Too bad they don't use something that is nearly free, like sand, to make computer chips. Oh wait, they do use silicon from sand. Why are chips so expensive then? Someone is making a lot of money off the increased price of chips.
to build one of those new 3nm chip plants you have to spend ~ $15B, that's Billion ...
 
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Too bad they don't use something that is nearly free, like sand, to make computer chips. Oh wait, they do use silicon from sand. Why are chips so expensive then? Someone is making a lot of money off the increased price of chips.
Those California designers should make iPhones from pixy dust.
 
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Fact is that we're in for some tougher times ahead. I'm no economist, but I am old enough to know that things go in cycles, and, well, we've enjoyed a pretty good run for many years now.

Remember, businesses exist to serve shareholders not customers. They will not squeeze profits for the benefit of the customer unless that directly benefits the shareholders (e.g. more overall profit, greater market share etc). We should anticipate higher prices and that things will become less affordable for a time - inflation and higher interest rates will see to that.
 
Do you think Apple will be able to afford this? Should we start a GoFundMe?
The question is, if the customers will be able to afford this. For example let's see, how the recent 25% price hike for Apple products in Japan will affect sales there.
 
It's not a want, it's a need.

People need to be paid more because cost of living is going up and employers by and large don't make efforts to match inflation and keep up with costs of living, because their top priority is making money, which is driven by wealthy people wanting to become even more wealthy by owning shares of publicly traded companies and demanding as much from those companies, who in turn cut costs at every corner.
You can increase the minimum wage to a $100 dollars per hour and it is still going to be the minimum wage. The price of goods and other people’s wages will just increase accordingly. If a person wants to increase their relative wealth in the economy requires developing skills and doing work that have higher market demand than whatever they currently do. Whether you think it is unfair or not people invest their money to make more money. Do you purposely invest your personal resources, whether money or work product, into activities that return less than you put in?
 
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Do you think Apple will be able to afford this? Should we start a GoFundMe?

It's not a want, it's a need.

People need to be paid more because cost of living is going up and employers by and large don't make efforts to match inflation and keep up with costs of living, because their top priority is making money, which is driven by wealthy people wanting to become even more wealthy by owning shares of publicly traded companies and demanding as much from those companies, who in turn cut costs at every corner.

easy, apple would simply pass the cost onto the consumer.

when people keep telling apple "pay your genius employees more", "apple should unionize!", and "bring the cost down of Apple parts", who is going to pay for all of that? consumers.

and when people say "iPhone is too expensive", they'll simply cut it from the workforce in some way and/or quality of the product to make the product cheaper.

until consumers actually stop buying the product for XYZ reasons, Apple is going to continue keeping their fat margins.
 
You can increase the minimum wage to a $100 dollars per hour and it is still going to be the minimum wage. The price of goods and other people’s wages will just increase accordingly. If a person wants to increase their relative wealth in the economy requires developing skills and doing work that have higher market demand than whatever they currently do. Whether you think it is unfair or not people invest their money to make more money. Do you purposely invest your personal resources, whether money or work product, into activities that return less than you put in?
Minimum wage increases don't automatically cause inflation or cause everything to increase in cost. They certainly can, but part of the reason for that is because profit margins are so high when they don't necessarily need to be.

You're using a straw man and false dilemma fallacies; I didn't say making any money (vs your false alternative of losing money as the only other choice) is the problem. The problem is making money at the expense of fairness and the wellbeing of others. I run businesses that don't make absolutely as much money as I could because I believe that the value of my products isn't exclusively their monetary value, but the benefit they have for buyers, some of whom couldn't benefit if I raised prices by a substantial amount.

But my business is privately owned and operated. If it was publicly owned, I'd be obligated to make the most money possible, even if that means compromising on the non-monetary values of my enterprise.

I'm criticizing that business model.
 
easy, apple would simply pass the cost onto the consumer.

when people keep telling apple "pay your genius employees more", "apple should unionize!", and "bring the cost down of Apple parts", who is going to pay for all of that? consumers
They could, but they don't have to — unless making the most possible money is the most important thing. Apple can absolutely pay better and promote more repairability AND still make a substantial profit. It just wouldn't be as much of a profit as they are now.
 
They could, but they don't have to — unless making the most possible money is the most important thing. Apple can absolutely pay better and promote more repairability AND still make a substantial profit. It just wouldn't be as much of a profit as they are now.

they have to answer to shareholders. otherwise the board will replace Tim cook with someone who will answer to shareholders, so Tim Cook has to. until Apple goes private, this is just how it's going to be.

the only other way to get these demands is to stop buying Apple products until they fix these problems.
 
they have to answer to shareholders. otherwise the board will replace Tim cook with someone who will answer to shareholders, so Tim Cook has to. until Apple goes private, this is just how it's going to be.
Right. And (as mentioned in a different comment of mine) I'm basically complaining about that business model.

If shareholders (largely wealthy people trying to get wealthier) had other values besides pure profit, things would look very different.

In the meantime, we can still complain about all these things in the hope that it'll force shareholders (of Apple and in general) to realize that consumers care about more than just money (by criticizing anti-union stances, etc), while also not being satisfied with outrageous prices (by buying more used stuff), they'll have to accept lower profit margins if they want to make any profit at all.

not saying that'll happen any time soon but it's not outside the realm of possibilities if enough people stick to their principles.
 
In the meantime, we can still complain about all these things in the hope that it'll force shareholders (of Apple and in general) to realize that consumers care about more than just money (by criticizing anti-union stances, etc), while also not being satisfied with outrageous prices (by buying more used stuff), they'll have to accept lower profit margins if they want to make any profit at all.

you can complain, but shareholders aren't going to care. they just care about their returns. the only way to force shareholders to care is to stop buying apple products. shareholders will have no choice but to care then.
 
you can complain, but shareholders aren't going to care. they just care about their returns. the only way to force shareholders to care is to stop buying apple products. shareholders will have no choice but to care then.
Or we can stop buying new Apple products. It's still a step in the right direction. Part of why I encourage people to buy used more often.
 
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