Multinational company with 147000 staff around the globe apparently needs 12000 of them to be in one spot because otherwise they can’t communicate effectively? Ok sure that makes sense
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Apple Staff Complain About Plans for Return to Office Work in Letter to Tim Cook
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In the places I’ve worked I’ve found open plan workspaces encourages collaborative working and reduces barriers between departments. The company I work for now are in the process of merging departments into that sort of working as our business behavioural consultants believe it improves productivity. I suppose again it boils down to opinions differing and different methods of working.
One thing is for sure, nobody in this thread is qualified beyond our own experiences to determine whether Apple are right or wrong here.
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It offers the worst of both for those who want to work remotely.
They still need to be geographically close to the workplace;
they likely need to take work back and forth;
There’s no guarantee an employer will cover costs for duplicated equipment;
they’re unlikely to be able to afford/justify a dedicated working space at home given the cost of living in close proximity to the office
Apples plan of the same fixed office days for everyone doesn’t even help with the unmitigated ******** of working in an open plan workspace. At least if they had people alternating they’d get less average congestion in their stupid “let’s pretend we all work in a cafeteria” building.
Exactly, which is why people need to give these apple employees benefit of the doubt and not “ugh why aren’t they accepting glorious apple’s generous offer”In the places I’ve worked I’ve found open plan workspaces encourages collaborative working and reduces barriers between departments. The company I work for now are in the process of merging departments into that sort of working as our business behavioural consultants believe it improves productivity. I suppose again it boils down to opinions differing and different methods of working.
One thing is for sure, nobody in this thread is qualified beyond our own experiences to determine whether Apple are right or wrong here.
Multinational company with 147000 staff around the globe apparently needs 12000 of them to be in one spot because otherwise they can’t communicate effectively? Ok sure that makes sense
Or multinational company has 135k employees that are capable and willing to come into the workplace, but the remaining 12k are incapable of accepting a generous hybrid working proposal
There’s a ‘makes sense’ answer whichever way we look at this.
40,000 employees from 300+ companies disagree with youIn the places I’ve worked I’ve found open plan workspaces encourages collaborative working and reduces barriers between departments. The company I work for now are in the process of merging departments into that sort of working as our business behavioural consultants believe it improves productivity. I suppose again it boils down to opinions differing and different methods of working.
One thing is for sure, nobody in this thread is qualified beyond our own experiences to determine whether Apple are right or wrong here.
i guess it’s hardly surprising that you think it works in spite of all the evidence to the contrary given everything else you’ve said in this thread.
You think those people never communicate with anyone outside their own physical office? Is that what you’re saying?Or multinational company has 135k employees that are capable and willing to come into the workplace, but the remaining 12k are incapable of accepting a generous hybrid working proposal
There’s a ‘makes sense’ answer whichever way we look at this.
You guess indeed. Downplaying my opinions and talking to me in a condescending tone doesn’t change my views you’ll be pleased to know
Nope, I don’t believe I’ve given any hint whatsoever that this was what I was saying.
Forget this particular thread for a second.
Isn’t the entire premise of MacRumors having forums for discussion to comment with a “take” on stories? If not, what else are they for?
The point of discussion is not simply re-stating the facts or rules of any given subject at hand, is it?
You don’t seem to give any hints about anything except embracing tired unproven management fads and myths as being “what’s best”.
let me make it simple for you: communication does not require physical presence.
Who is asserting that conclusively, let alone “without a shadow of a doubt”?!?
Even the employees who wrote the letter are allowing that that isn’t true in all cases. Did you read the letter in full? They’re asking for more discussion, that the factors that went into the decision deserve a closer look.
Claiming that the new policy is “more than generous” implies they are out of bounds to even ask.
A few posters even stated that being involved in the creation this letter was a fireable offense in and of itself, or claimed these people were “cancers” to the company.
I respectfully disagree with you on that. I think in some situations communicating in person trumps any messaging app, Teams video call, or email chain. Those technologies have improved communications massively and bridged the gap when people were suddenly faced with WFH where they were not used to that situation. However, I do feel face too face communication still has its place, even for those people who work solely in IT roles. That’s my view and experience and not saying it applies to everybody or workplace, but it my input here
You’re taking issue with one person “downplaying” your opinions…but dismissingly hand-wave away the feedback of 40,000+ when their experiences conflict with your own?You guess indeed. Downplaying my opinions and talking to me in a condescending tone doesn’t change my views you’ll be pleased to know
You don’t see…a bit of a contradiction there?
CEO’s having blindspots that large is exactly what leads them to flawed—even fatal—decisions.
I don’t see an issue writing a letter of concern, I’ve done this a few times during my career and submitted these confidentially through the appropriate HR channels. In this situation the letter has leaked to the press and that is where it becomes messy and a possible legal issue. I wouldn’t want to see anybody lose there jobs and wouldn’t suggest they should either.
I think my point was I was acknowledging my opinions were being downplayed but it wasn’t bothering me, hence my last sentence
so you agree that physical presence is not always required to communicate?
My comment still applies.I think my point was I was acknowledging my opinions were being downplayed but it wasn’t bothering me, hence my last sentence
The concept/approach—not what you literally said in this instance, obviously—of:
“I think what I think and that isn’t changing…even when the evidence contradicts that (and on a very large scale).”
Would not a good way to lead a company, or be a manager.
Well yeah. We are all used to working remotely and using other methods to communicate and this is something that has been heavily discussed throughout the entirety of this thread. It’s not a complete replacement in every scenario though hence my point you’ve quoted here, and one I have made at least 4 times previously.
It’s the ****** management 101 playbook.
Hear about some thing that sounds vaguely like a “productivity boost”; ignore any inconvenient research that shows negative aspects; sell the idea to exec team and enjoy much back patting; implement said idea; proceed to find the next new management fad to sell to the higher ups when productivity mysteriously doesn’t increase.
so you both agree with and respectfully disagree with this statement?
normally people here don’t contradict themselves in such quick succession
That sentence you’ve written to summarise what you think my opinion is, is rather misleading. It’s not what I implied and the reference to any Internet links was not something I even thought about when I voiced my views. Your comment applies to you but I don’t accept it applies to me at all, so I respectfully disagree with you
Contradict themselves? Where have I done that? I don’t agree with that statement unless the word ‘some’ is added to the start. It’s funny how I was accused of misconstruing your point of view yet here you are attempting to do it with mine. Sorry but that’s disingenuous in the extreme
What surprises me is there seems to be a certain amount of MR posters know better than the CEO of Apple.
And feel their own experience of working on their own applies to every business where people could technically work remotely. A distinct distrust of management types due to reasons we’ll never know being applied to a company that have offered staff a very nice hybrid working offer IMO.