Apple Staff Complain About Plans for Return to Office Work in Letter to Tim Cook

[Silverstring]

In this situation the letter has leaked to the press and that is where it becomes messy and a possible legal issue.

Would you agree that Apple—if not companies generally—would value creative, innovative, solution-oriented thinking in their employees?

In the letter, the workers make specific reference to feeling “unheard”. I can’t be sure, but it stands to reason that this letter was not the first and only attempt by these employees to raise these concerns. Other avenues were likely attempted. You can only feel “unheard” if you’ve already spoken out—not if you’ve been silent.

Well, they found a creative way to be heard.

 

[Silverstring]

And feel their own experience of working on their own applies to every business where people could technically work remotely.

Not at all. Where was this “100% remote all the time, everywhere for every employee in every company” argued?

A distinct distrust of management types due to reasons we’ll never know being applied to a company that have offered staff a very nice hybrid working offer IMO.

What makes it “very nice”? How did you determine your value judgement?

 

[The-Real-Deal82]

Would you agree that Apple—if not companies generally—would value creative, innovative, solution-oriented thinking in their employees?

In the letter, the workers make specific reference to feeling “unheard”. I can’t be sure, but it stands to reason that this letter was not the first and only attempt by these employees to raise these concerns. Other avenues were likely attempted. You can only feel “unheard” if you’ve already spoken out—not if you’ve been silent.

Well, they found a creative way to be heard.

Apple is a creative company so of course. The unheard part probably describes the feeling in individuals in every successful company in the developed world. Not sure what the options are in the US but in my country you can go to outside parties for advice if your employer is mistreating you. Feeling undervalued is not against the law though and in that circumstance it’s often better to seek new challenges. The reaction to the articles I have read though are as sympathetic on social media as some in this thread though so not sure what it has achieved from a PR point of view? We’ll see.

 

[The-Real-Deal82]

What makes it “very nice”? How did you determine your value judgement?

My personal opinion on the matter and my knowledge of companies I work with who have introduced a return to the office full time, let alone in a hybrid sense. Wrong or right it’s my view

 

[Silverstring]

That sentence you’ve written to summarise what you think my opinion is, is rather misleading. It’s not what I implied and the reference to any Internet links was not something I even thought about when I voiced my views. Your comment applies to you but I don’t accept it applies to me at all, so I respectfully disagree with you

I was specifically trying not to pin it to you personally or summarizing your opinion individually by literally pointing out you didn’t say something using abstract terms like “concept” as in “the concept of thinking in this type of manner”, I apologize that I didn’t make that distinction clear enough.

You had written previously that some decision makers in your career—not you specifically—had believed that open plan encourages/improves productivity…even though there have been many studies, across many companies that have conclusively shown otherwise.

So it isn’t just a “matter of opinion” or what someone (again, not you specifically) “believes”, there are many, many ways to literally quantify the effects on productivity, in either direction.

Continuing to hold on to beliefs in the face of conclusive evidence to the contrary is a poor thought pattern in general (not you).

 

[Silverstring]

What surprises me is there seems to be a certain amount of MR posters know better than the CEO of Apple.

We’re not saying we know better. That’s a total misrepresentation of the argument.

We’re saying that the CEO of Apple has the potential of being flawed in his thinking, especially if his own employees are saying so.

There’s a difference.

 

[The-Real-Deal82]

I was specifically trying not to pin it to you personally or summarizing your opinion individually by literally pointing out you didn’t say something using abstract terms like “concept” as in “the concept of thinking in this type of manner”, I apologize that I didn’t make that distinction clear enough.

You had written previously that some decision makers in your career—not you specifically—had believed that open plan encourages/improves productivity…even though there have been many studies, across many companies that have conclusively shown otherwise.

So it isn’t just a “matter of opinion” or what someone (again, not you specifically) “believes”, there are many, many ways to literally quantify the effects on productivity, in either direction.

Continuing to hold on to beliefs in the face of conclusive evidence to the contrary is a poor thought pattern in general (not you).

We had a cultural issue in my current company where departments were in different offices and a blame culture was rampant. Back in 2019 we employed a consultancy to come in and assess this issue and we were advised to have a more open plan environment. Everybody on departments that collaborate and were shown data that suggests it improves communication and productivity. Whether that is completely contradicted by a study that is shared here is neither fortunate or unfortunate. We take advice and work the best we can and each company will adapt to a way of working that best suits the business.

This will have to be my last post on this today, got an early start in the morning and I’ve probably spent far too much time on here today lol. Be determined, stick to your guns and don’t let anybody belittle your views and beat you down! Good night chaps

 

[I7guy]

We’re not saying we know better. That’s a total misrepresentation of the argument.

We’re saying that the CEO of Apple has the potential of being flawed in his thinking, especially if his own employees are saying so.

There’s a difference.

Ostensibly it amounts to the same thing. The CEO thinking is wrong. Sure there is that potential, and Tim Coo may have a blind spot. But IMO, in reality not likely.

 

[Silverstring]

My personal opinion on the matter and my knowledge of companies I work with who have introduced a return to the office full time, let alone in a hybrid sense. Wrong or right it’s my view

It’s fine for it to be your view in your personal experience/circumstances.

The difference comes in when you project that value judgement onto others—like Apple employees—who’s experience you have no insight into.

Looking at it as a “right/wrong” binary is too restrictive. All of us have not spent these many comments discussing such a simple distinction.

I’ve already clarified in previous comments that I don’t think Tim Cook is “wrong”…just that he isn’t right by default because he’s in the power position.

All the letter writers are asking for is a reconsideration of the decision, a closer look at the factors involved.

 

[ipponrg]

Company leaders are often not “best placed to judge” what decision makes the most sense for their company—otherwise bad, unprofitable business decisions would never be made by any company. “The company” has the power, sure, but not necessarily the best judgement. The company has blind spots, misinterpreted data, sometimes no data at all, just “gut feelings”…all things that can be judged incorrectly, and lead to a flawed decision.

On the flip side, the employees themselves may also not be in the best place to judge their contributions because they don’t have that eagle eye view. It is a slippery slope

 

[Silverstring]

Ostensibly it amounts to the same thing. The CEO thinking is wrong. Sure there is that potential, and Tim Coo may have a blind spot. But IMO, in reality not likely.

It really doesn’t amount to the same thing, and to suggest otherwise is overly reductive.

By you allowing for “sure that is that potential”, you’re already allowing for the vast shades of grey in between such black/white binary thinking.

 

[peter108]

I think Apple is out of step with the times. I spent the last five years of my IT management career working from home full-time (2008-2013, mind you, not yesterday) and did just fine. Shoot, we didn't even use video-conferencing then; it was all phone, e-mail, and IM. Also, commuting to and within the Santa Clara valley is a full-on b*stard. You're damn right people will be more productive if they don't have to start their days with an hour or so of gridlock.

 

[I7guy]

It really doesn’t amount to the same thing, and to suggest otherwise is overly reductive.

By you allowing for “sure that is that potential”, you’re already allowing for the vast shades of grey in between such black/white binary thinking.

Yep, there is a lot of shades of grey design with this topic. However, imo, the boss is never wrong, except when he/she/they are.

On the flip side, the employees themselves may also not be in the best place to judge their contributions because they don’t have that eagle eye view. It is a slippery slope

This is the most enlightening observation in the thread.

 

[Silverstring]

On the flip side, the employees themselves may also not be in the best place to judge their contributions because they don’t have that eagle eye view. It is a slippery slope

I don’t dispute that. That’s why you have two way communication, and why the letter writers literally ask for a more transparent process.

Perhaps with that transparency, they’ll understand that eagle-eye view better, and have more appreciation for why Apple wants them coming in as they have asked.

That’s worlds apart from the view on employees that many here seem to espouse:

Sit down, shut up, do what you’re told, and never question things or be fired.

 

[I7guy]

I don’t dispute that. That’s why you have two way communication, and why the letter writers literally ask for a more transparent process.

Perhaps with that transparency, they’ll understand that eagle-eye view better, and have more appreciation for why Apple wants them coming in as they have asked.

That’s worlds apart from the view on employees that many here seem to espouse:

Sit down, shut up, do what you’re told, and never question things or be fired.

Tom Cook already stated the reason why employees are being recalled to the office. There is no further obligation to divulge any more information. Apple employees who can’t adapt to this, unless case by case exceptions are granted, will have to return as I understand this.

Apple is well within its rights to say “sit down, shut up and do your job.” Employees are well within their rights to move on.

Thats very different than employees providing feedback on processes, design etc.

 

[JBGoode]

Are you guys just going to keep going back and forth until someone stops replying or how does this work?

This all seems like a waste of a nice day. Who the hell really cares what these people are doing?

 

[daveathall]

The company cannot judge anything. It's still employees - fallible humans who have to "judge" things.



The Company does judge everything. You don't see that? You are blind if you think employees have more power than the company who employs them. Go to work and say to your boss, "I am not doing that because you are wrong" and see how long you will last.

 

[daveathall]

Who claimed the company doesn’t make the choice? Obviously they do.

…but if you’re suggesting that a company shouldn’t take the perspectives and opinions and input of it’s workers as a significant factor to shape—not solely determine—how your policies are structured, then you’d be a terrible company leader.

You will be able to show me where I "suggested" that? Your extensive post does not reflect mine in anyway. My post does not suggest anything at all, you just tried to twist it that way.

I ask you once again, show me in my post where I suggested that.

 

[dba415]

Innovation comes in different ways. Companies like Google and Facebook are innovating with different ways to work while Apple is stuck in the past same as those financial companies that are forcing people back to the office.

one example, due to necessity Facebook and Google will be the ones pioneering augmented reality / hologram tech to allow you to meet with others without physically being there. This is the future. Apple will be falling behind and likely do nothing in this space.

 

[daveathall]

Deleted.

 

[Silverstring]

Tom Cook already stated the reason why employees are being recalled to the office. There is no further obligation to divulge any more information. Apple employees who can’t adapt to this, unless case by case exceptions are granted, will have to return as I understand this.

Apple is well within its rights to say “sit down, shut up and do your job.” Employees are well within their rights to move on.

Thats very different than employees providing feedback on processes, design etc.

Again, everyone knows that companies can do this. Doesn’t mean they should, and that’s the discussion.

 

[Silverstring]

You will be able to show me where I "suggested" that? Your extensive post does not reflect mine in anyway. My post does not suggest anything at all, you just tried to twist it that way.

I ask you once again, show me in my post where I suggested that.

You know what, you’re right.

You, specifically, as an individual, did not suggest that, and I was lumping your perspective in along with others. Sorry.

I went back and edited the original, to make more clear that it is not pointed to you specifically. Apologies.

 

[I7guy]

Again, everyone knows that companies can do this. Doesn’t mean they should, and that’s the discussion.

True, but it doesn’t mean they shouldn’t either….which is what we are discussing as well.

 

[triptolemus]

The new Work From Home policy is almost certainly coming...

 

[Silverstring]

True, but it doesn’t mean they shouldn’t either….which is what we are discussing as well.

Also true.