To add to your car analogy -
They then told lots of customers in some instances that they needed new cars.
Apple Starts Sending 'Batterygate' Settlement Payments to iPhone Users
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They then told lots of customers in some instances that they needed new cars.
Throttling only occurred in the situations below that could have shut the phone off.
A. Operating the phone with a battery that is below 80% capacity (i.e., the battery is at end of life).
B. Operating the phone with a charge that is below 20% (happens with any battery age/capacity).
C. Operating the phone in cold temperatures (happens with any battery age/capacity).
Apple didn't remove "horsepower". Apple removed the shut downs that would have occurred from a system voltage demand that was too high for the battery to provide. It was all related to the normal limitations of lithium-ion batteries. All three of those ABCs would occur with any smartphone regardless of brand.
How. Many. Times?????
Apple WERE SELLING PHONES TO PEOPLE THAT DIDN't NEED THEM.
Look back on this forum you'll see multiple instances. Heck I even know people that were told their phone was knackered.
One guy I know, what did they do, bought a new phone. Old one went into a drawer. Came out a year later when a child wanted one. Went to a third party for an opinion, they replaced the battery. Problem solved.
Going to also link this;
Batterygate - Wikipedia
I remember all this. I also remember that the 3rd party testers said it went beyond just a shutdown issues. They have also been accused and somewhat verified of throttling the older phones for other unspecified reasons to encourage people to buy new phones.
Anecdotally we also know phone often get slower and have battery issues after every other update to the OS so we know they are playing funky funky with things. I used an iPhone 4 longer than any iPhone, almost 5 years (two battery replacement) and towards the end it was slow as hell and had no battery life. I don’t believe it’s all nefarious, but they should be transparent about how they are managing things.
Hell my 1 year iPhone 15 pro is down to 85% capacity after 1 year. My 12 mini was down below 80% after two years. On my 12 and now 14 I’ve seen the battery life dwindle over time WAY more than my other iPhones. Maybe they are reaching some limitations in battery technology that’s going to wear batteries out really fast until they are solved. Anecdotally I’ve noticed more battery and general “throttling” issues on my newer phones, and because of it I upgrade more often. I typically haven’t master more than 2 years on one whereas previous phones I’d have for at least 3-4. I don’t think that’s all in my head.
Anecdotally we also know phone often get slower and have battery issues after every other update to the OS so we know they are playing funky funky with things. I used an iPhone 4 longer than any iPhone, almost 5 years (two battery replacement) and towards the end it was slow as hell and had no battery life. I don’t believe it’s all nefarious, but they should be transparent about how they are managing things.
Hell my 1 year iPhone 15 pro is down to 85% capacity after 1 year. My 12 mini was down below 80% after two years. On my 12 and now 14 I’ve seen the battery life dwindle over time WAY more than my other iPhones. Maybe they are reaching some limitations in battery technology that’s going to wear batteries out really fast until they are solved. Anecdotally I’ve noticed more battery and general “throttling” issues on my newer phones, and because of it I upgrade more often. I typically haven’t master more than 2 years on one whereas previous phones I’d have for at least 3-4. I don’t think that’s all in my head.
Irrelevant. Apple and cellular companies routinely sell products to people that don't need them. There's no legal requirement for a company to wait until the customers battery is dead to try and sell them a newer phone. Marketing the latest model phones to people who only have year old models is standard practice in the industry.
The claim is that Apple added the throttling feature to make people think their phone needed replacement. The reality is that their phone only slowed down in situations where the phone could have shut off due to voltage demands that the battery couldn't supply. And shut offs were not something that was unique to Apple. Every mobile phone being sold by every brand was susceptible to the same voltage issues that were specific to phone sized lithium ion batteries.
The proof? Apple's throttling method was never removed from the software. It's still in there. And lithium ion batteries in 2024 still have the same voltage supply limitations as the batteries being sold at the time of the iPhone 6.
You're funny.
No listen, Nothing wrong with upselling lots of companies do it. Question which would you say is disingenuous;
1. Hi Mr. Customer your phone needs replacement, (when it doesn't as it's just the battery). This is the model you can upgrade to.
2. Hi Mr. Customer your phone does not need replacement, it's just the battery. However, this is the model you can upgrade to.
Text in blue is the, spoken to client part.
The claim is a lot more than you are allowing yourself to believe. As I said earlier there are plenty of forum members that can attest to that. I personally know of people that did too.
This is the nasty taste that is left in the mouth and it takes a lot of Kool Aid to mask it - the OASF will prove that.
Oh and by the way;
Soon afterward, Apple issued a formal apology, admitting that it initially believed that the issues were caused by iOS bugs and "normal, temporary" performance decreases following an update, BUT THAT "CONTINUED CHEMICAL AGING" OF BATTERIES IN OLDER IPHONE DEVICES WAS ALSO A FACTOR. Apple stated that replacing the device's battery would restore full performance, and also announced that it would offer a US$50 discount (from $79 to $29) on battery replacements for iPhone 6 and 6S from January through December 2018, and that it would include more prominent battery health information in later versions of iOS.[13][14] In January 2019, Apple CEO Tim Cook stated in a shareholder letter that over 11 million battery replacements had been made under the discount program.[15] The company stated that it had never, nor would ever "do anything to intentionally shorten the life of any Apple product, or degrade the user experience to drive customer upgrades."[14]
It's more than you are suggesting. Fact.
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oliverades
macrumors member
Do you know what the subject/sender for the email was? I’m trying to find my email but am struggling
WarmWinterHat
macrumors 601
My brother went into the Apple Store with an appointment because his 3GS was shutting down when he would take a photo. The genius told him he needed a new phone, and that there wasn't anything they could do. It just needed a battery.
The proof that this is an issue is that Apple now shows you all this information in plain language.
I will say it again, Apple is not paying out these damages because they were throttling phones, they are paying out because they didn't tell the people they were doing it. The reasons why they did it are irrelevant.
They knew they were guilty, that's why they paid out quickly and apologized.
It's a 'who you gonna believe, Apple or your lying eyes' kind of response you'll get sometimes.
LOL…replacing the battery is only a solution for voltage issues related to capacity being below 80% OR for batteries that had known manufacturing defects. You had provided a link that showed Apple had announced a run of iPhones that did have a known manufacturing defect for the battery.
Throttling/shutdowns could still occur with operating the phone below 20% charge or with operating the phone in cold temps.
So 2/3 of the potential “slow downs” due to throttling had nothing to do with whether the battery was new or not.
Didn't answer the question tells me all I need to know.
We're done here.
ElectricPotato
macrumors 6502a
You're welcome!
My 6s had pathetic battery life in general. I took them up on the discounted battery replacement. It did not help much. It was a challenged design and that contributed to people having a bad attitude about the software "fix". Fortunately, Apple seems to be moving past the "sacrifice usability for slimness" phase.
GhostRaider
macrumors 6502
So Samsung throttles as well? If 80% capacity is already enough to have your iphone not reaching its potential than Apple made a ( deliberate?) design choice. Very convenient to then throttle the phone without letting your users know. Who will then buy a new phone, while replacing its battery would have been enough.
Oblivious.Robot
macrumors 6502a
Apple probably knew of this outcome and the mere fact that affected customers more than likely upgraded to a newer iPhone than to have simply paid for a new battery making significantly more money than they’d lose in a lawsuit probably enticed this secrecy, and nothing can change my mind otherwise.
To think the smartest people working at Apple did not have this calculation at the back of their mind and instead made a silly decision with good intentions is laughable.
To think the smartest people working at Apple did not have this calculation at the back of their mind and instead made a silly decision with good intentions is laughable.
Apple didn't probably know about this, they definitely knew about this.
What question? You didn't ask one. You posted a lot of information that was related to battery replacement. As I said, 2/3 of the voltage situations that could cause throttling/shutdowns weren't related to battery age, capacity or defects. A brand new battery with zero defects could have voltage issues when operating below 20% charge or in cold temperatures.
Oblivious.Robot
macrumors 6502a
I fully agree, but I did not want to label and rile up the apple defence force users. As some of them are relentless lol.
80% capacity is considered EOD (end of life) for any smartphone sized lithium ion battery. That's the point where the battery begins to lose the ability to provide the constant voltage levels that would prevent unexpected shutdowns. That's going to be true regardless of the phone manufacturer.
However, capacity is only 1/3 of the equation. Shutdowns/throttling could occur with brand new batteries operating below 20% charge or in cold temperatures. That's why focusing on battery replacement shows a lack of understanding about the feature that Apple added to the OS to prevent shutdowns.
Yep. Apple lost the court case, need to pay up, caught red handed but people still keep defending the throttling of the iPhone (without user knowledge). Sometimes I think that these people will keep defending Apple even if Apple would use shredded new born puppies to make the next iPhone. It is simple to see if you are biased: imagine if it was Samsung (or Google, Dell, whatever topic) doing exactly the same, would your response be the same?
Apple didn't lose in court. They made an out-of-court settlement. That means both parties agreed to end the matter without Apple admitting they did anything wrong. And they didn't. Lithium-ion batteries have known limitations when it comes to voltage supply. Apple got sued for trying to provide an alternative to the phone shutting off unexpectedly.
WarmWinterHat
macrumors 601
Incorrect. They got sued because they didn't tell the end-users what they were doing.
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WannaGoMac
macrumors 68030
Settlement is higher because they had this BS requirement to make a claim. Many of us couldnt make a claim because we no longer had the device. At that point number of folks with the phone still or for that matter the packaging?? I had traded mine in years earlier.
"*** You can find your Serial Number on your iPhone in Settings > General > About. If you no longer have your
iPhone, you can check the barcode on your device’s original packaging or refer to the original receipt or invoice.
"*** You can find your Serial Number on your iPhone in Settings > General > About. If you no longer have your
iPhone, you can check the barcode on your device’s original packaging or refer to the original receipt or invoice.
On February 7, 2020, French consumer authorities fined Apple €25 million following a formal investigation into the decision.[21][22] On February 28, 2020, Apple agreed to a $500 million settlement IN A CALIFORNIA COURT, under which it plans to pay at least $25 to all U.S. residents who had purchased an iPhone 6, 6 Plus, 6S, 6S Plus, SE, 7 or 7 Plus device .[23]
So it seems they lost something in court.?