Apple Surveying iMac Pro Buyers About Key Features

[ackmondual]

Hmm, amongst the Mac users I know, many are still clinging to their older hardware from 2015 or before. Perhaps this survey will point their next release into the right direction.

 

[Freida]

Why? Why must a “Pro” machine (whatever that means) be upgradable? Why is that the most important factor?

Woah-oh, dangerous foot to start on. I only ask because most “Pros” I know just want a powerful machine, with great support, great build quality, that they can buy customised with the hardware they want, and they use it until they need a new one.

They wouldn’t spend hours or more dicking about upgrading RAM, drives, installing OSs, replacing CPUs, just so they can save some money on components. If anything the time they spent on that and the money they saved would be less than if they just did their job in the first place.

Now again, these are just some Pros. Graphics designers, music producers, etc. I’m sure there are plenty who need upgradeable components too.

Lumping every single professional in the same brush and saying “the machine must be upgradeable, regardless if it comes with 128GB RAM, an 18 core Xeon, OR IT’S NOT PRO” is utterly ridiculous. It’s a dumb argument. When Apple release a decent modular machine, as they’ve stated on many occasions they have already, then hopefully all users will be satisfied.

In big companies, IT department upgrades those machines on continuous basis!
In small studios its the same except it might be done by on nerd guy
Techie artists want that as it gives them future proof and they can speed up their stuff when a new tech is available.
Those PROs you talk about are the group that are not technically minded and just wanna buy something and not worry about it at all. Those are PRO too but bigger group is those that want to upgrade it even if its just once or twice in its lifetime.

PRO machine MUST BE upgradeable regardless of what you think. There is no way Apple can release a machine that will fit everyones need and some artists/techies need to upgrade in order to save time/make more money. Those in 3D can confirm that how easy swap for faster GPU can save you minutes and a day if not more. If certain tasks take 10 mins vs 5mins in Maya with better GPU for example then that is a lot of time shaved off.
I get it, you are not in this group, but then understand that a lot of people are.

I had 2010 12core mac pro and i loved the upgradeability. Yeah, I upgraded it only 2x or so but it was significant to speed up my workflow. Thats what matters.
Glueing things together is not a definition of PRO machine - thats definition of a TOY

 

[keysofanxiety]

I am guessing it is because these pros don't work for companies with three-year replacement cycles so they want to "buy once" and "upgrade often" to maximize the usable life of their machines. Plenty of these people are on late 2000 / early 2010 "cheesegraters" that they have continuously upgraded over the past decade and they want that flexibility with the 2019 model to carry them into the 2030s.

Agreed. But many others are on the 3-year cycle too. All Pros can’t be lumped into one group is what I was trying to say. To imply “if it’s not upgradeable it’s not Pro” is ludicrous.

 

[johncarync]

It's nice to see a company that makes over 60% of its profits from the phone it produces also cares about improving its products geared toward the high end professional and constitutes less than 5% of its revenue.

 

[dabocx]

Honestly, with SSDs being the norm now you can totally take the old cheesegrater and shrink it down a bit. I have an old cheesegrater for fun but my main dell workstation supports 4 GPUs and 2 Xeons and is slightly smaller and runs pretty cool (though I don't have it maxed out on gpu).

Also please use nvidia.

 

[SimonTheSoundMa]

After three of three iMac Pro machines have died, Apple could not repair them after multiple parts replaced or could not source any parts, they finally swapped them for new ones.

One switched off mid use, never switched on again. Another had a no entry sign on boot then never switched on again. The third the screen failed but they couldn't get a replacement.

I'd love to have this survey.

 

[az431]

Read iMac forums?

Probably not a good idea to rely on inane rants from anonymous forum users who make up .000001% of all Mac users.

 

[citysnaps]

Read iMac forums?

I think Apple has little interest in forums where snappy juvenile comments reign. Much better to poll real users outside of that domain.

 

[jctevere]

I bought the iMac Pro because MicroCenter discounted it $1,000 a mere month after release. I was looking to spend $2k for a computer, but didn't have any peripherals (screen, keyboard, etc).

$4k seemed like a pretty good deal for everything I was getting (would have ended up probably spending $3-4k anyway). For the extra I paid, I ended up with a gorgeous Apple design and not having to deal with hassles of pre-built warranty, etc.

I'm not really a pro user, and I get it's entirely overkill. But it does everything I need better and faster than I would have ever imagined, will last me a fairly long time. Not to mention, 2013 Mac Pros are still selling used for $1,500. I'd be willing to bet that I can probably sell my iMac Pro for about half of what I paid for it in a few years from now.

 

[Labeno]

Share holders:
Continue removing things and increase the price.
Surveyed people:
Bring back the useful features and reduce the price to something a little more reasonable.
Steve Jobs from his grave: Apple has lost its way

 

[az431]

That's some wonderful intellectual gymnastics.

Apple shouldn't have removed things in the first place had they known what they were doing.

Reminds me of that quote by Henry Ford about innovation:

https://hbr.org/2011/08/henry-ford-never-said-the-fast

 

[Candykane75]

NO MORE FORM OVER FUNCTION!
You claim elegance but you just create frankinstein. you want to connect everything it becomes a laughing joke of the world .
I dont want a freaking Frankenstein monster with wires and dongles and external cases to connect all my stuff i need.
I want big stuff again with a ton of ports internally. 2 SSD 1 os one scrub one for mechanical storrage
I want to be able to drive 2 identical 5K displays with out maxing my usb c poorts
I want to easy acces to my poorts
No more thinking everything will be wireless soon. BT connections suck .
Internal storage 2 ssd's 1 OS SSD 1 project/SCRUB SSD and a large mechanical drive for storage would be nice to.
better software support , regular hardware updates to the pro lines !

 

[justiny]

That's some wonderful intellectual gymnastics.

Apple shouldn't have removed things in the first place had they known what they were doing.

Reminds me of that quote by Henry Ford about innovation:

“If I had asked people what they wanted, they would have said faster horses.”

There is zero evidence Henry Ford actually said this quote, and this particular quote first appeared on the internet in 2002. Furthermore, the Ford Motor Company’s vehicle production in the U.S. fell sharply in the mid 1920’s due to competition primarily from General Motors, and Henry Ford resisted efforts to innovate his production process with the Model T (in production for almost 20 years). Even after the Model A was released in 1927, Ford struggled and needed several years to regain the success they once had in the 1910’s. Henry Ford refused to innovate until he was forced to with the Model A.

I fail to understand the logic of trying to equate or relate misinformation regarding Henry Ford with Apple surveying it’s iMac Pro customers for feedback.

 

[pl1984]

I am guessing it is because these pros don't work for companies with three-year replacement cycles so they want to "buy once" and "upgrade often" to maximize the usable life of their machines. Plenty of these people are on late 2000 / early 2010 "cheesegraters" that they have continuously upgraded over the past decade and they want that flexibility with the 2019 model to carry them into the 2030s.

Here it is 2016 and I want to replace my 6,1 Mac Pro. So I go to Apple's website looking to replace it with the current model. And what do I find? The same thing I bought three years ago. Skip ahead to 2017 and what is available? The same thing I purchased four years ago. Let's move ahead another year to 2018. Time to replace my aging 6,1 Mac Pro. What do I replace it with? The same thing I currently have.

Meanwhile those cMP guys are staying, relatively speaking, current because they can...upgrade!

 

[PickUrPoison]

Agreed. But many others are on the 3-year cycle too. All Pros can’t be lumped into one group is what I was trying to say. To imply “if it’s not upgradeable it’s not Pro” is ludicrous.

Very true. Corporate/enterprise are also better about buying the correct configuration from the start. Individuals are more likely to fall into the false-economy thinking of, “well I could really use 128 GB but I’ll just buy 64 and upgrade in a year or two.”

Then they put up with a sub-optimal config, losing hours and hours of otherwise billable time. The lost productivity will cost them far more during that year or two than the upgrade would have, but they “saved money” on the initial purchase.

 

[Aldaris]

Apple didn't get to where it is by asking its customers what they want. This is worrying.

Not asking customers what they want have us the 2013 “trashcan” “timcook” macpro...

I’d welcome some input. But hey Apple is still selling that wonderful piece of kit.

 

[Dorje Sylas]

Stockholm syndrome drew me to the iMac Pro. Realizing that it was stockholm syndrome, and that it was overly glued together outdated hardwared with no aftermarket upgrade path, kept me away. Instead I built a better spec'd PC tower and had enough money left over for a work laptop.

Maybe someday Apple will again make a computer I care to buy. They now have until 2023 to figure it out, when I will again be in the market for a high end production machine. Although if they can not glue-up a low end MacMini (for MacOS port testing) they may still get some of my money.

I waited as long as I could, but my MacPro 2008 was just finally starting to truely fail. Although if I take CPU A out it may still limp along as a file server.

 

[pl1984]

Very true. Corporate/enterprise are also better about buying the correct configuration from the start. Individuals are more likely to fall into the false-economy thinking of, “well I could really use 128 GB but I’ll just buy 64 and upgrade in a year or two.”

Then they put up with a sub-optimal config, losing hours and hours of otherwise billable time. The lost productivity will cost them far more during that year or two than the upgrade would have, but they “saved money” on the initial purchase.

Sometimes 64GB is sufficient and then, as projects get larger, 128GB becomes necessary. Or were you the guy who said 640KB should be more than enough?

 

[JesterJJZ]

Why? Why must a “Pro” machine (whatever that means) be upgradable? Why is that the most important factor?

I think when most people say upgradable, they really mean customizable. However the nature of a easily upgradable machine means that it can be customized on purchase. Different drives, graphics cards, ram...more options than Apple currently offers on current machines. Also, not locked into your choices with things being soldered on.

 

[Porco]

I am not sure this necessarily has much to do with the next Mac Pro - I would assume that will have all the iMac Pro offers (sans screen and plus more expandability hopefully). It's just a good idea to survey customers who have put down the money for the product, they are asking people who have proven they are willing to spend that much on an existing product, and so are already on board to some degree - this is perhaps about customer retention as much as product improvement.

If they want to pro-actively get feedback about the next Mac Pro, they could no doubt send out surveys to their list of known Mac Pro owners, both the 2006-2012 cheesegraters (hi Apple! *waves*) and the cylindrical 2013+ models.

I have often sent feedback via their website, (whether they wanted it or not! ).

 

[mytdave]

Upgradeable storage (40+ TB), upgradeable RAM (768+ GB), support for multiple biggest, baddest NVidia GPUs. Duh.

 

[69Mustang]

Why? Why must a “Pro” machine (whatever that means) be upgradable? Why is that the most important factor?

Why must it? You seem to have made that claim just so you could argue against it. @centauratlas certainly didn't. His quote clearly states both "in general" and "should be" upgradeable. There's nuance in his words.

Woah-oh, dangerous foot to start on. I only ask because most “Pros” I know just want a powerful machine, with great support, great build quality, that they can buy customised with the hardware they want, and they use it until they need a new one.

An upgradeable machine does not preclude any of that. So I'm not sure what your argument is here. An upgradeable machine isn't required to be upgraded. It does offer the option though... which is what people are asking to have, an option.

They wouldn’t spend hours or more dicking about upgrading RAM, drives, installing OSs, replacing CPUs, just so they can save some money on components. If anything the time they spent on that and the money they saved would be less than if they just did their job in the first place.

This argument is weak, specious, and ignores realities that - as I said earlier - having the option to upgrade and easily repair does not mean that one has to do so.

Lumping every single professional in the same brush

Painting every single professional with the same brush or lumping every single professional together. Pick one. Your remix is not good. I'm not even really picking at you on this one. I've done it myself many a time.

...and saying “the machine must be upgradeable, regardless if it comes with 128GB RAM, an 18 core Xeon, OR IT’S NOT PRO” is utterly ridiculous. It’s a dumb argument.

You're right. It's a dumb argument. You're the one who made it. Go back and look at his quote.

 

[az431]

Share holders:
Continue removing things and increase the price.
Surveyed people:
Bring back the useful features and reduce the price to something a little more reasonable.
Steve Jobs from his grave: Apple has lost its way

Congratulations, you went 0 for 3.

Compared to when Steve Jobs was around, Macs are less expensive, faster, smaller, lighter, more functional and secure, and have far better displays.

In 2005, a plastic 13" MacBook from 2005 sold for nearly $1,700 in today's dollars. The same MacBook today is $1,300, has double the battery life, half the weight and size, triple the storage space, and is 1,000% faster. The base iPhone SE is nearly half the price as the original iPhone, and the base iPad is nearly 30% cheaper than it was in 2007.

And the comments about Apple losing its way became trite long ago. Since Jobs passed away, Apple has doubled in revenue. And it is because people are purchasing more Apple products and services, not because of price increases. Apple sold over 200 million phones last year compared to 20 million in 2009.

But keep on spewing that nonsense about Apple "losing its way"

 

[xgman]

Apple is finally realizing that they don't necessarily know whats best for at least the so called "pro users". We'll see...

 

[shareef777]

Yeah I figured there’d be some comment like this. Replacing RAM or an HDD doesn’t make a machine modular. Furthermore the drives weren’t deemed user upgradeable, even if you could replace them.

It’s an iMac. These were never marketed to be modular machines — modular meaning you could replace all components like a classic desktop computer. The fact you could replace the odd component was incidental. Thing is, you probably know that already, but you’re just looking to be pedantic.

Ironic you used the word pedantic, when it describes you exactly. The point (which you obviously understood, but decided to be exactly what you accused me of) is that Apple is making devices that don't fit what a majority of their user base needs. But go ahead and argue that "they're selling". You do realize many of us have no choice but to buy whatever product they sell. The last pro machine was introduced in 2013, then Apple admits they messed up by not making it upgradeable/modular, then come out with this POS iMac Pro. It's obviously going to sell well due to the long release since the 2013 Pro. Same for the crappy 2016 MBP release. I was on the original 2012 rMBP and after 4 years had to buy whatever they came out with.