Apple Tested Blood Sugar App for Preventing Diabetes

[drsox]

You can file a "claim" through Dexcom, to try and get some compensation for a failed sensor. So far I've tried 3 times, when they've died very quickly, within 4 days or so. And I was never given any replacement or refund, so go figure.


They do have a consumer OTC version coming out sometime soon, or may already be out? That doesn't require a prescription and may have something "less" than the prescription ones. I'm not sure on the details. But I'm again going to assume that these won't be very affordable.

I think your "consumer OTC version" might be the Dexcom One+ that's available in the UK. I've tried it but prefer the Freestyle Libre 2+ for ease and accuracy.

I share your views about the need for a CGM as it's very useful for monitoring eating decisions about what, when and how much to eat. They gave me the info to enable big changes to diet that finger pricks would not.

Good luck with your search for a good one.

 

[drsox]

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[T'hain Esh Kelch]

Curious and excited to see where this goes. Tim has been doing a lot of good work like this lately, I'm sure this is a priority.

I seem to recall that he stated during an interview some years ago, that he would like the health part of Apple to be his legacy, so that is likely true.

 

[drsox]

Yes. It's called eating less carbs than 100g a day and you won't need a blood sample to know that your blood sugar will be fine and stable.

Nope

 

[dgdosen]

They've been working on blood sugar and blood pressure sensors for a long time. A difficult (impossible?) job for a "wrist" sensor?

Why doesn't Apple have a companion wearable device or two - to pair with the watch/phone and increase the accuracy of these measurements?

 

[drsox]

There are a few varieties of the sensors as well... Dexcom One+, lacking integration with the API I believe, and Dexcom Stelo for type 2, as opposed the pricier G6/7. The Abbott Lingo, again marketed at Type 2, and I think athletes, as opposed the more expensive Libre/2/3 varieties.

Link below... I didn't have the Rio mentioned from Abbott.

Abbott and Dexcom are launching the first over-the-counter CGMs. Here are 7 questions on the new tech.

Experts expect the release of new over-the-counter glucose monitors in the U.S. to fuel more widespread use of the devices.

www.medtechdive.com

The Lingo looks like it is the Libre 2 with a cut down app for the iPhone. Box in plain white (same size). Price just less than the Libre 2 without the Libre 2 VAT. Single Libre 2 - £51.74; Single Lingo - £59.00 6x Libre 2 - £310.44; 6x Lingo - £289.00. Undefined VAT costs. (20% for non-diabetics; 0% for diabetics). I might buy a Lingo to test it out. (Done)

I was right about the VAT. Lingo prices include VAT. Libre prices exclude VAT but for a diabetic it is 0% anyway. So a Libre six-pack is 7% cheaper for a UK diabetic.

 

[parameter]

I think your "consumer OTC version" might be the Dexcom One+ that's available in the UK. I've tried it but prefer the Freestyle Libre 2+ for ease and accuracy.

Oh interesting about the Dexcom One+. I saw that in the comments, but I hadn't heard of it before, so you're probably right.

The reason I went with the Dexcom G7 instead of the (cheaper, here at least) Libre systems, at least at the time, the Libre site (at the time I started using these, which I think was an older Libre model) said that it wouldn't be accurate if you take over a certain amount of acetaminophen (Tylenol / Paracetamol), which I do take over the amount it specified at that the time.

Quick search pulls up at least this page for Libre now, so maybe the issue is fixed?
https://www.freestyle.abbott/eg-en/...?q=the-freestyle-libre-system-tab-question-17

Also found reddit thread mentioning the same, but for Dexcom G7:

https://www.reddit.com/r/dexcom/comments/1cd2tmc

(that's annoying, I just want to post a normal text link)

So, maybe it's a moot point now. But, when I chose a CGM, the Libre site did say that it wasn't accurate if you took a decent amount of acetaminophen, which I have to take daily.

If you do take lots of it (NOT over the recommended daily max, I'm still under it), and use a CGM it might be worth looking a bit more into this just to make sure your readings are good. Especially I'd say if you still use an older CGM. So for new ones, I really hope this issue is a non-issue now?

 

[drsox]

Oh interesting about the Dexcom One+. I saw that in the comments, but I hadn't heard of it before, so you're probably right.

I just bought a Lingo to test. I was using Dexcom One + but had issues with accuracy etc so I'm going back to Libre 2 plus.

 

[avkills]

Well, both Abbott and Dexcom have small sensors that stick to a skin and stay for 10-14 days, continuously measuring glucose levels in the interstitial fluid. They still require an initial insertion prick with a needle, but once every 14 days is still way better than 4-5 finger-pricks a day.

The Abbott ones do not even hurt at all when you put them in. Happy to say I am keeping my type 2 under control without meds, with diet and exercise.

But having this on a watch would be super huge.

 

[drsox]

The Abbott ones do not even hurt at all when you put them in. Happy to say I am keeping my type 2 under control without meds, with diet and exercise.

But having this on a watch would be super huge.

Well done you. The Dexcom ones have a smaller needle but use a button/spring mechanism for actuation. Being right-handed I had difficulty using my left hand in applying it to the right arm. No issues with Libre 2+.

 

[avkills]

Well done you. The Dexcom ones have a smaller needle but use a button/spring mechanism for actuation. Being right-handed I had difficulty using my left hand in applying it to the right arm. No issues with Libre 2+.

Thank you. It was not easy; but I am doing walk challenges to keep me motivated. You should look into the Libre3, it is the same price (at least for me) and it is a lot smaller and thinner than the Libre2, and the app always monitors so you do not need to continually use your phone or the separate reader to scan data.

 

[parameter]

Being right-handed I had difficulty using my left hand in applying it to the right arm.

I'm the same, I have to get someone to help put it in most of the time. The applicator tool thing is tough because it has to first be pushed against the skin hard enough to unlock the trigger, which is step 2 and is also hard to push. I think it could use some adjustments on how things are positioned on it.
I can do it most of the time, but sometimes the angle and the 2-trigger mechanism is a bit hard to do.

I thought I was the only one having trouble. People with arthritis and similar things would have a very hard time I think using the Dexcom, at least G7 tool to insert them in.

 

[drsox]

Thank you. It was not easy; but I am doing walk challenges to keep me motivated. You should look into the Libre3, it is the same price (at least for me) and it is a lot smaller and thinner than the Libre2, and the app always monitors so you do not need to continually use your phone or the separate reader to scan data.

Would that I could but the 3 is only available for public not private purchase. Next year maybe it will change.

I'm the same, I have to get someone to help put it in most of the time. The applicator tool thing is tough because it has to first be pushed against the skin hard enough to unlock the trigger, which is step 2 and is also hard to push. I think it could use some adjustments on how things are positioned on it.
I can do it most of the time, but sometimes the angle and the 2-trigger mechanism is a bit hard to do.

I thought I was the only one having trouble. People with arthritis and similar things would have a very hard time I think using the Dexcom, at least G7 tool to insert them in.

Absolutely. Another reason to junk Dexcom.

 

[parameter]

Absolutely. Another reason to junk Dexcom

Honestly, I am thinking of trying the Libre system out. Dexcom G7 worked great when I first started it about a year ago. Since then though each refill I get, the quality seems to degrade in many ways.

I don't know what's happening, but definitely something because this goes way past just a bad batch or a single bad unit. But they definitely do not last as long and don't have the signal range that they used to. They disconnect much more often from my phone, even when I'm right next to it.

Also, I notice that I need to re-calibrate it using a blood finger stick many more times to keep it accurate than it used to take. No idea what that's about, but it's been necessary and increasing over the past 3 months or so.

And last, the adhesive on the last 2 refills, so 6 total sensors has been much more sticky. But in a weird way. It just isn't as good. It still stays stuck on for the 10 days usually, with the overpatch, but it all is just kind of gummy and not as good as it was originally.

I have no idea if others have noticed this? Again with the G7 for me. But their quality control or some intended change has definitely been making things worse in my opinion.

I do like many things about it, but haven't looked at the Libre offerings since I started with Dexcom. I'm going to have a look. I'm not saying the Dexcom ones are horrible or anything like that, they are still very useful and a great tool for diabetics. I just don't like paying the high price for a deteriorating product, whatever the reason is.

 

[bmark]

Apple couldn’t even release a blood oxygenation monitor but they are going to prevent diabetes? This will be about as successful as Siri!

 

[Momof2.1107]

I'm in this camp. I am type 2 and have to buy Dexcom G7 out of pocket. I have some reasons why I need this, and my doctor attempted to get it through insurance multiple times. However they will not approve it unless I was on insulin, which I am not at this time. But I do get dangerous lows, which is why the sensors are still a medical necessity (Especially during the night. It gets very dangerous and the Dexcoms have quite literally saved my life multiple times now.)

So I have to pay it each month, 3 sensors for around $170. They each last, usually 10 days. However Dexcom's quality seems to have been getting worse over the past few months and don't last as long, not sure why. I'm also getting failures more often, which requires replacing the sensor entirely - which is a big cost.

You can file a "claim" through Dexcom, to try and get some compensation for a failed sensor. So far I've tried 3 times, when they've died very quickly, within 4 days or so. And I was never given any replacement or refund, so go figure.


They do have a consumer OTC version coming out sometime soon, or may already be out? That doesn't require a prescription and may have something "less" than the prescription ones. I'm not sure on the details. But I'm again going to assume that these won't be very affordable.

So if Apple could get a watch type device, or even skip that for now like a few others have mentioned - IF they have a non-invasive sensor, that is definitely a worldwide game changer. I know it isn't the Apple way, but if they just packaged it up into something relatively small, it'd still most likely be very usable and useful for SO many people.

Then, shrink it and put it in the Watch. Even better. I'd buy one just for that alone in a heartbeat. But in the meantime, if they have something that could pass all regulatory rules, etc. then that would still be a huge win if it was released in some other form. But, I'd love and can't wait to hopefully see it in the Watch as soon as they can possibly get it there.

Are you talking about Stelo? If so, I have a monthly subscription of $89 for 2 sensors that last 15 days. So far I have used 3 sensors that have lasted all 15 days. I use my FSA dollars to pay for the sensors every other month, to not deplete my account so quickly.

 

[delsoul]

Gurman…again - sigh -

Can we stop paying any attention to him and Kuo. They’re continuously giving bad information from their ‘anonymous’ sources

 

[Tagbert]

Apple couldn’t even release a blood oxygenation monitor but they are going to prevent diabetes? This will be about as successful as Siri!

My Watch has a blood oxygen sensor and can show the data. Of course for legal/contractual reasons, Apple does not expose that in newer phones but that just a question of abilities. Hopefully, now that the CEO of Masimo has been forced out of the company, there might be a way to work out a new licensing deal and turn that feature back on.

 

[Tagbert]

Gurman…again - sigh -

Can we stop paying any attention to him and Kuo. They’re continuously giving bad information from their ‘anonymous’ sources

Gurman has been pretty accurate lately. Usually when he gets it wrong is in the timing of long range plan or where he starts doing his own analysis and interpretation.

 

[wilderkun]

Just curious, does anyone have a glucose measuring device of any size that does not require a blood sample?

If Apple has developed new medical technology the world needs, are they saving it until they can fit it in a watch?

Yes. Multiple devices have glucose monitoring sensors that you wear got a week that don’t require blood. They use a micro needle to monitor interstitial fluid in you body. Not quite blood free. But close!

 

[drsox]

Honestly, I am thinking of trying the Libre system out.

Good for you. You might get a free trial (definitely available in the UK). The Libre 2+ is better than the 2 (less disconnects)

 

[drsox]

Also, I notice that I need to re-calibrate it using a blood finger stick many more times to keep it accurate than it used to take. No idea what that's about, but it's been necessary and increasing over the past 3 months or so.

Had to recalibrate my Dexcom One+ this AM. Thought it was high for an overnight reading - and it was. Was reading 7.5 and finger prick says 6.4. Sometimes I've had to recalibrate twice in 2 hours - one low and one high.

 

[rbbloom99]

I'm in this camp. I am type 2 and have to buy Dexcom G7 out of pocket. I have some reasons why I need this, and my doctor attempted to get it through insurance multiple times. However they will not approve it unless I was on insulin, which I am not at this time. But I do get dangerous lows, which is why the sensors are still a medical necessity (Especially during the night. It gets very dangerous and the Dexcoms have quite literally saved my life multiple times now.)

So I have to pay it each month, 3 sensors for around $170. They each last, usually 10 days. However Dexcom's quality seems to have been getting worse over the past few months and don't last as long, not sure why. I'm also getting failures more often, which requires replacing the sensor entirely - which is a big cost.

I'm in the same boat, having to pay out of pocket for CGMs. I was using the Libra Freestyle 14-Day CGM but just switched over to the Stelo at $99 per month (2 x 14-day sensors). I had one Libra be defective and they sent me a replacement FOC. So far, I'm getting a full 14 days on my Stelos monitors. Also, Stelo is Bluetooth, so I don't have to hold my iphone to the sensor to collect the data all of the time

 

[rbbloom99]

Yes, those are available via prescription for type 1 (to the best of my knowledge) patients and are “patches” that go into your skin and actually require blood, and are good for I think 5-7 days or so. They’re great for type 1

Those 'patches' are actually monitors with a ⅛" "sensor' that penetrates into the subcutaneous fat (arm or stomach area, depending on the manufacturer). This sensor and the 'patches' are monitoring the glucose level in the fat, which is the same level as the blood glucose level, just 30 - 60 minutes delayed. The 'patch' sends the glucose readings to the phone app. Prescriptions are needed for type 2 diabetes and only if one is taking insulin. I have type two diabetes, but I have to pay out-of-pocket for my CGMs. I've been wearing one for 9 months to control my blood glucose levels with diet and have been able to reverse my type 2 diabetes with my diet so far.

 

[parameter]

Are you talking about Stelo?

Yes! I think I must be. I didn't realize it was out, but haven't really been checking. Thanks for bringing it up. It looks similar to the Dexcom G7, but I'm not sure if it has things like the ability to share in realtime, the readings with your doctor (On the G7, it uses an app called Clarity to sync with external connections like your doctor and look at insights more)?

Also, one thing I think that would rule it out for just me specifically because I really deal with low, and high blood sugars, even when eating and doing everything I can correctly. But the lows are the dangerous parts. I get frequent lows, very very low especially in the night. It doesn't matter what I eat/drink, it just happens.

But it gets dangerously low, it has gone down into the high 40s, but the G7 will give audible alerts and on the Apple watch (haptics and beeps) when a low downtrend is detected ahead of time so I can wake up and deal with it to bring it back up. It isn't every night, but it is frequent enough to be scary and my doctor has put me on these for that reason.

However, my insurance will only cover them if I was on insulin, which I don't require at this time. So I have to pay out of pocket.

It looks like with the Stelo, you get 30 days or so for around $100. For the G7, it's just a bit more it looks like, but instead each sensor only lasts 10 days so 3 are required for a month. I'd have to look at my last pharmacy bill to remember how much each unit costs, but I think if there was a 3rd in the Stelo, it would bring it to about the same cost.

So clearly Dexcom has found a way to maximize battery much longer on those devices. So I'm just wondering what it's either missing vs G7 or if they are just waiting for the G8 and are milking as much money out of the G7 for now.

And, another failed G7 sensor this morning!. It was on day 8/10. Not acceptable at all, because this as I was saying has now become the norm, across multiple batches. Something is wrong with the newer G7 sensors they're putting out.

On the Stelo site it mentions "Adults (18+ years) not on insulin who have been diagnosed with type 2 diabetes or prediabetes and are not at risk for hypoglycemia, and those interested in tracking their glucose."
Which is where I think it excludes me unfortunately. But thanks for the info. Good to read about it and it should help a lot of people being OTC and also covered under certain health programs.