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I completely disagree. We are about to hit massive growth in the folding market in addition to the folding iPhone arriving in roughly 3 years time.

I'm not sure where you are coming up with these failure stats. Is the Fold 3 failing for countless consumers? I would imagine it's not. And that durability will only get stronger as the technology matures at an accelerated rate in short time. Look at the massive difference between the Fold 1.0 and 3.0

The outer screen on the Fold 3 is gorilla glass victus and isn't any more fragile than what we have on the iPhone and other smartphones. Not an issue with items in your pocket.

AR glasses are a separate category. Smartphones will continue to thrive and grow in innovation for years to come.

It's really not, you can go out there and find torture tests of the Fold 1 being folded hundreds of thousands of times before failure, and the Fold 1 is ancient folding technology by now. I did the math once but I completely forget it, I think it was like 50-100 folds per day for like 10 years.

Certainly there is more risk than with a non-folding phone, I don't think anyone is saying any different, but it's been so massively overblown, typically by those who probably have never even used one, let alone used it as a daily driver for a long period of time.
 
A foldable iPhone will be great, much more screen real estate

Samsung already makes foldable phones so it may only be a few years before Apple releases this

This will be great for people who already carry both their iPhone and their iPad everywhere they go
Why, though? I get the 'people who carry iPad and iPhone' concept but a) how many people do this, b) in a foldable you're forced to 'carry' both (that is the device is always one that can fold out to be bigger, regardless of whether you want that in any given situation).

I wouldn't want the extra thickness all the time. and I alway carry my XS Max but rarely carry the iPad or Mini outside of the house.

In situations where I might (say I'm a student), I likely have a bag of some sort so it's not a huge deal to carry both. But I can see it in that kind of situation, perhaps.
 
A mechanical hinge is going to fail (I’m not talking specifics on phone hinges, but rather any kind of hinge, which also includes the screen itself, since a folded screen has a hinge too). Talk to any mechanical engineer about it. Between Samsung and the few Chinese brands selling hinged phones now are sold in such small numbers at high prices, so you’re not going to hear about failures for a couple of reasons. One, because people will purposely try to be more careful with them and the other is it’s just a smaller pool of users who may not even be using their folding devices as their only device.

And in regards to the screen being damaged, I wasn’t talking about the outer screen, I’m talking about the inner folded screen getting damaged from detritus in your pocket or bag getting between the two sections of the inside panel. The fact that the screen isn’t folding flat on itself (it can’t because you can’t fold glass or even the OLED panel itself with a crease), you have a variable distance between the folded pieces which allows stuff to get between the panel sides.

I believe we’ve hit peak smartphone. What we’re seeing already are iterative advancements year over year, which is why companies brought back folding devices, in an effort to expand the market beyond the current form factor. But doubling the screen size is still going to be limiting to someone who wants an ever bigger screen. With AR done through glasses, your perception of size has almost limitless potential, with no drawback for weight or being able to handle a device comfortably.

This is assuming a lot without actually having any experience to back it up, and I say that with no offense intended. Go look up the Fold 1 torture tests where they folded it for hundreds of thousands of time before failure. I'd also be curious to see any reports of widespread issues with the inner screen because of pocket gunk. From a physics pov I don't think it works like that, if gunk gets in there is nothing to move that gunk around forcefully on the screen. Conversely, a regular slab phone has many opportunities to move that gunk around on its screen forcefully, I say that with a sigh as I look at the 2 scratches on my 13 pro max screen.

AR is interesting, but it's still not a larger screen, and we haven't hit the point where everything we need to see on a screen can be depicted into AR. Maybe VR, but that's an entirely different beast. AR is definitely the future, but let's actually see a consumer oriented AR set of glasses get released, we're talking at least 3-5 years. And even then I'll complain about having a big bulky set of terrible looking glasses on my noggin all the time until the technology gets minituarized enough to be truly wearable, or until they put it into contacts or a neuralink, and then we are talking 10+ years if I had to guess.
 
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Why, though? I get the 'people who carry iPad and iPhone' concept but a) how many people do this, b) in a foldable you're forced to 'carry' both (that is the device is always one that can fold out to be bigger, regardless of whether you want that in any given situation).

I wouldn't want the extra thickness all the time. and I alway carry my XS Max but rarely carry the iPad or Mini outside of the house.

In situations where I might (say I'm a student), I likely have a bag of some sort so it's not a huge deal to carry both. But I can see it in that kind of situation, perhaps.

You say that without knowing what future iterations will bring. I think people need to figure out if they are saying they don't believe the Fold 1/2/3 will succeed, or if the entire concept of foldable phones will not succeed, or even if we are talking about foldable phones versus phones which get larger through different means such as rollable screens.

But my biggest difficulty with this is the simple fact that people want larger screens in smaller form factors. If you can do all your work on the go on your phone then more power to you, but having a tablet or even laptop along for the ride are just a really big deal in many consumers work flow. You rarely carry your iPad mini outside of the house, but if you could magically fold it, it seems you probably would if eventually technology offered the ability to make it thinner.
 
This is assuming a lot without actually having any experience to back it up, and I say that with no offense intended. Go look up the Fold 1 torture tests where they folded it for hundreds of thousands of time before failure. I'd also be curious to see any reports of widespread issues with the inner screen because of pocket gunk. From a physics pov I don't think it works like that, if gunk gets in there is nothing to move that gunk around forcefully on the screen. Conversely, a regular slab phone has many opportunities to move that gunk around on its screen forcefully, I say that with a sigh as I look at the 2 scratches on my 13 pro max.

AR is interesting, but it's still not a larger screen, and we haven't hit the point where everything we need to see on a screen can be depicted into AR. Maybe VR, but that's an entirely different beast. AR is definitely the future, but let's actually see a consumer oriented AR set of glasses get released, we're talking at least 3-5 years. And even then I'll complain about having a big bulky set of terrible looking glasses on my noggin all the time until the technology gets minituarized enough to be truly wearable, or until they put it into contacts or a neuralink.
Samsung actually did attempt to address this. It's absolutely not a solution given that the inner screen is more fragile and is not dust resistant, in addition to the exposed gap when closed. But they are aware of the potential weakness of the Flip/Fold 3 and I'm sure this does indeed help to some regard. Plus like I said it's only a matter of time when the Flip/Fold inner screen becomes dust resistant and there is no gap when closed. Problem solved.
 
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As I usually say in these threads: this is pathological technology. Just like autonomous cars (as in, those made for regular roadways).
 
You say that without knowing what future iterations will bring. I think people need to figure out if they are saying they don't believe the Fold 1/2/3 will succeed, or if the entire concept of foldable phones will not succeed, or even if we are talking about foldable phones versus phones which get larger through different means such as rollable screens.

But my biggest difficulty with this is the simple fact that people want larger screens in smaller form factors. If you can do all your work on the go on your phone then more power to you, but having a tablet or even laptop along for the ride are just a really big deal in many consumers work flow. You rarely carry your iPad mini outside of the house, but if you could magically fold it, it seems you probably would if eventually technology offered the ability to make it thinner.
Absolutely. I purchased a cellular iPad Mini yesterday because I want that sized screen with me on the go. And I'll be forced to use a crossbody bag outside my home because I can't fit it in my pocket. I would much rather have an iPhone that fits in my front pocket that folds out to 8". And it's coming in due time. It's fine for people to be skeptical. But to not believe/understand that there will be a market for these devices is comical.
 
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No thanks, I’m never returning to a phone with a plastic screen And the dent/crease on these displays is just god awful. My colleague got the new fold in November and has just used his free replacement from Samsung because it got a dent on it from something in his pocket.
 
Durability is still an issue, with many Samsung foldables screens broke (at the crease, obviously), within the year. It’s still an ongoing progress of the tech.
 
No thanks, I’m never returning to a phone with a plastic screen And the dent/crease on these displays is just god awful. My colleague got the new fold in November and has just used his free replacement from Samsung because it got a dent on it from something in his pocket.

EHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH the buzzer goes. The Fold doesn't have a plastic screen, and we don't yet know what Apples upcoming (if ever) foldable phone has.
 
Do you have those official stats that we can look at?
Only Samsung knows. That’s also why Samsung offers free replacements for Fold/Flip owners. They know it’s an issue. You can also find many youtubers wih their broken screens. The tech is still improving and in progress.

And lab test of durability may not say much. In real life, the screen will be faced with more particles and weathering that can affect durability.

It took how many years from the first gorilla glass to Victus? And that’s just a plain sheet of glass.
 
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I had a Galaxy Flip 1st gen. The problem wasn’t the screen, I was quite happy with that, the problem was it was Android and running an Exynos chip. Apple need to start being a bit more adventurous. Theres a big market for early adopters.
 
A foldable iPhone will eat into the iPad market, will Apple allow that?
Foldables have a weird formfactor once unfolded, square. Not a good screen size.

I could see a trifold work, maybe…
Yeah that’s the big question. Apple is well known for not releasing products that will canibalize sales of other products.
 
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I wonder how important the “use while partially open” use case is for the success of a folding phone. It’s a neat trick to set a phone down and fold it like a little laptop. But, if it would be cheaper/easier to produce a device where the screen is off until you fully open the screen (and, as a result, no screen crease) isn’t that how most folks would use it anyway?

I do like how companies are iterating year over year on a design that, at one point, was unthinkable :) I actually kinda liked the idea of the roll up screen, but I guess that’s gone bye bye now.
 
Yeah that’s the big question. Apple is well known for not releasing products that will canibalize sales of other products.
Depends. If I'm not mistake, Apple (I think even Jobs said it himself) had stated that if there's going to be a cannibalisation, it's better for them to cannibalised their own products. Take iPhones cannibalising iPods. I think if Apple sees that the new product will replace the old product in the future, they would have no issue making it to self-cannibalised. Of course, Apple will put in a pricing strategy that makes that to benefit them the most (eg. iPhone's profit margin is way higher than iPods).
 
Uhh, the Fold has the same screen size as the iPad mini 5 and before, it's just a tad smaller than the 6 but really that's just a different aspect ratio. That's actually smaller than what 2 iPhone Pro Max's would be together. Although the aspect ratio might be a bit wonky, that would be a very good tablet size IMO.
It's definitively not a good tablet size according to the entire history of the tablet market. Opinions on forums dedicated to the idea notwithstanding.
 
I want to hold a phone in one hand so maybe slightly larger than the Pro Max unfolded would still work, but if I have to use 2 hands to hold it like an iPad, definitely a NO for me. So, I’m not sure what a foldable phone would bring but options are a good thing.
How do you feel about the whole “screen on the outside” thing? I’m going back and forth on whether that’s something that’s required, or just a cool feature. I mean, what I REALLY want is a folded iPad Mini :), so I’d be happy unfolding it every time I wanted to use it, no external screen required.
 
You say that without knowing what future iterations will bring. I think people need to figure out if they are saying they don't believe the Fold 1/2/3 will succeed, or if the entire concept of foldable phones will not succeed, or even if we are talking about foldable phones versus phones which get larger through different means such as rollable screens.
Foldable phones roughly double their thickness when folded. Rollable screen etc are a fantasy right now. If they or other things become technically feasible we can talk about them at that point but if we're talking about what Apple might do in the next 2-5 years, it's with current tech.
But my biggest difficulty with this is the simple fact that people want larger screens in smaller form factors. If you can do all your work on the go on your phone then more power to you, but having a tablet or even laptop along for the ride are just a really big deal in many consumers work flow. You rarely carry your iPad mini outside of the house, but if you could magically fold it, it seems you probably would if eventually technology offered the ability to make it thinner.
" if you could magically fold it" - we're not talking about magic, fantasy stuff. We're talking reality here and I don't want to have a phone that's significantly thicker for the very few occasions when I'm out and about and a larger screen would be nice.

If I'm out for work, I have a travel bag and can carry.. BOTH devices.
 
Seems like it should be impossible that a material could be folded many dozens of times a day and stay in decent shape.
I think there’s definitely deteriorations and the screens will fail sooner than a non-folding screen, but if they can make it so that “degradation” happens at, say 20 + years, based on a hinge use of 300+ times a day, then it’s effectively just as good as a non-foldable screen over that 20 years (which is likely greater than the useful life of the device).

I don’t think they’re there, yet, but it’s a manageable goal to hit.
 
I want a tablet in my pocket. Folding phones. There is the solution.

All the doubters in this thread are going to feel foolish in a few years.
I still enjoy doing a quick search to peruse the truly delicious “Apple will never make their own Mac processors.” posts. MMMM, such delightful claim chowder!(tm)
 
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thanks but no thanks. i am happy with the size of my phone now. if i wanted to carry around a tablet i would do that. folding phones are lame.
 
How do you feel about the whole “screen on the outside” thing? I’m going back and forth on whether that’s something that’s required, or just a cool feature. I mean, what I REALLY want is a folded iPad Mini :), so I’d be happy unfolding it every time I wanted to use it, no external screen required.
I’m not an iPad guy, I use iPhone and a MBA in addition to my imac. My wife has an iPad mini and now an Air, I just prefer a laptop over an iPad for a variety of reasons.
I would really have to see the offering to determine if it would be useful or not. A foldable iPad mini that would also serve as a phone would be too big and bulky for me to replace a regular iPhone, but it would serve a market segment I’m sure.
I like the idea of foldable, just need to see it to determine if it’s for me.
 
Why, though? I get the 'people who carry iPad and iPhone' concept but a) how many people do this, b) in a foldable you're forced to 'carry' both (that is the device is always one that can fold out to be bigger, regardless of whether you want that in any given situation).

With a folding phone you aren't forced to carry an iPhone and an iPad, you are forced to carry two iPhones.
 
Good friend of mine is on his 3rd gen Samsung now. 1st two were truly awful, with screen issues, such as bubbles/delaminating and dust in the fold pretty early. Awful battery life and rather thick when normally folded. The 3rd Gen screen has been better regarding the bubbles and delaminating. But over several months now, the fold is more apparent. As if the plastic material stretches slightly due to the constant fold, and when open, the fold is more noticeable now. It is not convenient to unfold when single-handed, so he typically keeps it folded, where the front screen is fairly narrow and nowhere near as usable as on traditional phones. When opened, a lot of sites don’t transition to the screen ratio change appropriately, and need to be reloaded to recognize the shift. I only see him use it in the open mode when at a bar or similar, with two hands available.
 
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