Apple Testing Multiple Foldable iPhone Prototypes, But Has Concerns Over Display Technology and Market

[metapunk2077fail]

If a design really needs to fold, why not just have two separate screens with zero bezel between them?

That's what Microsoft made last year and it was also gimmicky.

It's seriously difficult to just beat the simplicity, durability and usability of the iPhone and iPad. Adding folding, multiple screens, hinges, etc introduces friction and various points of weakness.

Very often tech looks for new revenue streams and they chase bad ideas up the wall because they saw something in a sci-fi movie or animated video and didn't spend enough time to think if that stuff would actually work well in real life.

 

[bvdecicco]

Foldable is just a gimmick. The next true GUI is AR.

I played with the Samsung foldable in Best Buy recently and the screen just felt like plastic junk. The fold/seam was clearly evident and just had a terrible feel to it.

 

[spacehippo]

I don't need to be convinced about foldable phones being a thing. I need the ugly crease not to be a thing. I was very close to getting the new Samsung Galaxy Z Flip 3 but for the a) display crease and b) battery life. Would love to have a bigger phone fold into a small form factor, that's the ideal for me. I hate to carry around big phones but the crease is ugly and it might not bother some people but it bothers me when I tried it out in shop.

 

[akbarali.ch]

Foldable are great, i want one and honestly if you make something so fragile, then make sure it is not expensive. i mean, i dont want to buy $2000 fold-gile phone that cant survive more than 2yrs, but i can still buy that same fold-gile phone if it comes in $500-600, for that price, even if it dies after 2 yrs i'm OK considering the gains in screen real-estate and user experience it will deliver.

Foldable, rolable, whatever that magically increases screensize on demand, is the san future.

 

[akbarali.ch]

A foldable iPhone will eat into the iPad market, will Apple allow that?
Foldables have a weird formfactor once unfolded, square. Not a good screen size.

I could see a trifold work, maybe…

They would rather cannibalize their own product instead of someone else taking away both of them. They made Macbook 12 inch extremely thin and light even when they had a very successful macbook Air market.

 

[VulchR]

Two screens, one precision hinge. Folding a screen is bound to cause errors and shorten the lifespan of the phone.

 

[Ramchi]

Foldable mobiles makes sense only if it has easily replaceable screens for dirt cheap. Otherwise, mobiles have long entered a stagnated innovation especially iPhones, so I don't see Apple going to adopt it, unless Android OEM makes user removable/replaceable flexi displays less than $800. I like Samsung Flip except for its battery capacity. Samsung Fold 3 is too bulky(but cheaper than iPhone 12 Pro Max, yes NOT 13 Pro Max). But I am sure someone will crack it sooner

 

[Amazing Iceman]

Except for the devices with non-user replaceable batteries and glued shut enclosures.

It's either that or goodbye IP67 and thin device.

 

[Amazing Iceman]

Foldable mobiles makes sense only if it has easily replaceable screens for dirt cheap. Otherwise, mobiles have long entered a stagnated innovation especially iPhones, so I don't see Apple going to adopt it, unless Android OEM makes user removable/replaceable flexi displays less than $800. I like Samsung Flip except for its battery capacity. Samsung Fold 3 is too bulky(but cheaper than iPhone 12 Pro Max, yes NOT 13 Pro Max). But I am sure someone will crack it sooner

I've seen the Samsung foldable and I really don't like their displays. That crease I'm sure will eventually get damaged or break. And it feels like a piece of plastic, not solid. What's being displayed on the crease looks distorted too.
And Android sucks too. An OS made by a personal-data-mining company doesn't earn my trust. And I keep confirming this every time I have to provide support to users of Android phones.

 

[Danfango]

Foldable is just a gimmick. The next true GUI is AR.

This person gets it

 

[montycat]

My friend has the foldable Samsung phone. The crease in the screen is very obvious and distracting. It seems to be getting worse as time goes on.

 

[spinedoc77]

Looks like conversations is not what you want with this thread. Fine by me. Bye.

Conversation/discussion is fine, but not if you want to base it on zero evidence. But yeah, buh bye.

 

[biracialfamily91]

I’m interested but not 100% convinced. I want a glass creaseless foldable, the same size as a 13 Pro Max when folded and the size of an iPad mini when unfolded. The tech is just not there yet. If Apple does release this, it’s coming later rather sooner.

 

[spinedoc77]

That's what Microsoft made last year and it was also gimmicky.

It's seriously difficult to just beat the simplicity, durability and usability of the iPhone and iPad. Adding folding, multiple screens, hinges, etc introduces friction and various points of weakness.

Very often tech looks for new revenue streams and they chase bad ideas up the wall because they saw something in a sci-fi movie or animated video and didn't spend enough time to think if that stuff would actually work well in real life.

I don't think he was asking for something like the Duo, which still has a significant hardware line between the screens, IMO it's meant more as a dual screen device than a device with a single large screen. I'd be curious if 2 bezel less displays could be butted up against each other, but even then I still think a crease would look much better. Personally I stopped noticing the crease after about half a day, you'll see this common sentiment in reviews and from others experiences.

What frustrates me is the lack of imagination and confidence that technology will solve this issue (not you, just in general). Even Apple is working hard, they patented a method to eliminate creasing: https://tinyurl.com/munhd7ez The new Huawei Mate X2 makes the crease much smaller, Motorola's Razr has a smaller crease due to how it slides open, LG is experimenting with different materials for the folding part of the screen, etc.

I'm also not agreeing 100% on durability, each scenario depends on the user. My current 13 pro max is already scratched up from putting it in my pocket after only a couple of months, but a year of using the Fold 2 and not a single blemish on the inner screen because it's folding design actually makes it less susceptible to external damage when folded. Same with my iPad mini that gets stuck into my back pocket, less durable. I don't disagree that more moving parts is inherently riskier, I just think that gets very blown out of proportion. Seeing how badly the press jumped on the Fold 1's flawed first iteration, I think we would have seen a big backlash if their foldables were not robust. But we actually see the opposite, reviewers for the most part are happy and not reporting any damage with long term use. It's not like iPhones don't have their own hardware issues, that's just something you accept with cutting edge technology.

I don't know, I just don't feel like my Fold is a device that didn't have enough thought put into it for real world use. I feel quite the opposite, it allows me to have a larger screen in a much smaller pocket, the real world use of that is priceless.

 

[jmgregory1]

The funny thing is, AR Glasses will actually be more fragile than foldable phones, maybe also have lower longevity. But they are supposedly "the next big thing" and foldable smartphone are bad because they are fragile.

AR glasses will be as fragile as any pair of glasses. But you won’t put them in your pocket or toss them into a bag without being in a case, for the same reason you don’t do that with a normal pair of glasses (sun or vision). No matter what anyone says about the folding screens, you can’t have a rigid glass panel that also folds, so you end up tradiing the strength of typical glass for foldability. What’s offered today is effectively a plastic covered micro-glass that has all sorts of failure points - and all you have to do is look at the warnings that every company offering these screens makes people aware of. If you lived through folding devices back in the ’90’s to early 2000’s, and the typical plastic covered screens, you’ll know why it’s not going to be the future. There is no magical technology that will allow a clear material to be both hard/rigid and foldable, other than having two separate panels meet up to create what appears to be a single screen.

 

[spinedoc77]

Don’t think they are the future. The biggest issue I have with them is how soft the screens are so they scratch easily. Ewww no thanks. Until we can get glass that can fold over and be durable enough to do it thousands of times then folding phones are no interest to me.

The future is AR/VR. They could be the next big thing. folding phones are just that….folding phones. headsets will completely change we interact with the world. put your headset on and get an augmented reality.

• walk into a restaurant and the menu pops up in front of you.
• go to a supermarket and prices appear beside whatever you’re looking at.
• shop online and see what the products would look like in your house.
• Maybe you’re in a foreign city and can’t read the language so now street signs will auto translate.
• Maybe you’re going somewhere new so will see large arrows pointing you were to go.
• Playing a game like Pokémon go will make it feel like Pokémon are real.
• You could have a virtual pet or even partner.
• Instead of buying things like wallpaper, posters, ornaments they will appear virtually Inside your house.
• If you’re at a sports match you can see live stats around the stadium

and that’s just a small list example. Virtual reality is a whole other situation. i Really do think this is our future. I don’t think smartphones will go anywhere for a long time but AR/VR feels like the next big step. the way we interact with the internet is through touching our phones and staring at a screen. AR/VR will take it to a whole other level and it will literally be right in front of our eyes all the time.

How close is AR? I mean a true AR solution, not only hardware which is not fragile, small enough for consumers to wear all the time, and also the ecosystem behind it, and let's not forget the cost? AR is the future, no argument there, but not for a solid 5-10 years for mass adoption. It will be interesting to see everyone who whines about a folding phone's delicateness to suddenly have no issues with a delicate set of oversized goggles sitting on their head all the time.

 

[bobcomer]

Apple is experimenting with multiple foldable iPhone prototypes, according to leaker Dylandkt, but a foldable iPhone may not be coming in the near future because Apple still has concerns over foldable display technology and the market for foldable smartphones.

In a tweet thread, Dylandkt said that Apple is working on a possible future device, but that foldable display technology is not advanced enough and there are still too many "compromises" to deal with.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1479157616983130113

Apple is also reportedly concerned about whether foldable smartphones will continue to be popular with consumers or will become obsolete in the coming years.

Before releasing a foldable iPhone, Apple wants to be sure that a foldable design isn't a "regression from the current form factor of the iPhone," which could indeed happen if there are issues with display longevity and quality because of the folding functionality. Dylandkt's comments suggest that Apple is continuing to take a wait and see approach to foldable smartphone technology, but some other rumors have indicated that Apple could release a foldable iPhone as soon as 2023.

Apple analyst Ming-Chi Kuo said in May 2021 that Apple is developing a foldable iPhone with an 8-inch flexible OLED QHD+ display that's set to be released in 2023. Display analyst Ross Young in December said that Apple would not release a foldable iPhone until 2023 "at the earliest," with 2024 being a more likely target date. Bloomberg in early 2021 said that Apple had started "early work" on an iPhone with a foldable display, indicating that there are a few years of development left.

Foldable iPhone rumors have been circulating since 2016, and we've previously heard reports about various prototypes that Apple is testing. Samsung has allegedly provided foldable display samples to Apple for testing purposes, but development has not yet expanded beyond a display.

At least one of Apple's foldable iPhone prototypes is said to feature two separate display panels connected with a hinge, a departure from single-display designs that Samsung has introduced. Another has been described as a foldable iPhone with a clamshell design similar to the Galaxy Z Flip.

Samsung has been releasing foldable smartphones for years now, and other Android manufacturers have also embraced foldable technology. Smartphones with foldable displays continuing to face issues with durability and build quality, and they also have high price tags that far exceed the cost of standard smartphones.

Article Link: Apple Testing Multiple Foldable iPhone Prototypes, But Has Concerns Over Display Technology and Market

You snooze, you lose. I have a Samsung Flip3 in addition to my iPhone, and I like the Flip3 more, when folded the screen is protected and takes up less space in your pocket. When unfolded it's a very nice looking OLED screen, better than my iPhone's screen.

Yes, the fold is noticeable, I still like it better.

 

[appleArticulate]

Sure it is, it just depends what your needs are. The iPad mini 5 seems to always have rave reviews, I don't recall much complaining about it. I get that movies get cut off, but on the other end the aspect ratio is better for documents and web browsing, so it really depends on the user. Personally I prefer the ipm5 screen versus the ipm6 screen.

The fact the most people don't buy it, and buy larger more expensive tablets instead. And have since the beginning of the iPad. As I said, it doesn't matter how much iPad mini owners like their iPad mini. There aren't that many of them to begin with. Which is why the iPad mini has been the neglected child of the iPad lineup since its inception. This isn't hard. It's important for people to recognize the difference between what they like and what the market likes.

 

[DanteHicks79]

So your saying that apples laptops are all destined to have displays fail

Uh, have you never noticed the pages and pages of forum posts of people complaining about MBP displays not working after a certain period of time? It's a component that will fail on any/every laptop, given enough time. The problem is, Apple has in fact had a history of displays failing well in advance of when they should. The word "flexgate" ring a bell?

Hell, my old white poly unibody MacBook display finally gave up the ghost about 6 years into owning it (which is a decent lifespan, actually), and I just adapted by hooking it up to an external monitor.

iFixit makes a specific point in their teardowns to comment on the display ribbon cable of each new generation of MBP that comes out, and if it seems to be more or less susceptible to failure than previous generations.

 

[appleArticulate]

Uhh, the Fold has the same screen size as the iPad mini 5 and before, it's just a tad smaller than the 6 but really that's just a different aspect ratio. That's actually smaller than what 2 iPhone Pro Max's would be together. Although the aspect ratio might be a bit wonky, that would be a very good tablet size IMO.

If the rest of the tablet market agreed with you, then it would have a chance. But they don't, so it doesn't.

 

[M3gatron]

AR glasses will be as fragile as any pair of glasses. But you won’t put them in your pocket or toss them into a bag without being in a case, for the same reason you don’t do that with a normal pair of glasses (sun or vision).

So they will be way more fragile than foldable smartphones and will need to be handled with care be kept in special cases.

No matter what anyone says about the folding screens, you can’t have a rigid glass panel that also folds, so you end up tradiing the strength of typical glass for foldability. What’s offered today is effectively a plastic covered micro-glass that has all sorts of failure points - and all you have to do is look at the warnings that every company offering these screens makes people aware of.

Yeah and in practice those folding screens aren't as fragile as you trying to suggest, I mean it's not like the glass on normal phones is industructible or something, it also has it's own weaknesses like: it breaks, cracks.

If you lived through folding devices back in the ’90’s to early 2000’s, and the typical plastic covered screens, you’ll know why it’s not going to be the future. There is no magical technology that will allow a clear material to be both hard/rigid and foldable, other than having two separate panels meet up to create what appears to be a single screen.

It's totally not the same thing with current foldable smartphones.
Anyway it's been 3 years and folding smartphones are still there, I wouldn't be as quick to think that they will just disappear or something.

 

[CheesegraterMac]

Rollables are much better, no crease, less screen issues, so on. My only concern is safety with these rolly guys.

 

[spinedoc77]

AR glasses will be as fragile as any pair of glasses. But you won’t put them in your pocket or toss them into a bag without being in a case, for the same reason you don’t do that with a normal pair of glasses (sun or vision). No matter what anyone says about the folding screens, you can’t have a rigid glass panel that also folds, so you end up tradiing the strength of typical glass for foldability. What’s offered today is effectively a plastic covered micro-glass that has all sorts of failure points - and all you have to do is look at the warnings that every company offering these screens makes people aware of. If you lived through folding devices back in the ’90’s to early 2000’s, and the typical plastic covered screens, you’ll know why it’s not going to be the future. There is no magical technology that will allow a clear material to be both hard/rigid and foldable, other than having two separate panels meet up to create what appears to be a single screen.

I still don't get this in the short term. Long term yes I agree, but then again we don't know what long term technology might bring. You speak as if you know the future, but what if folding phones develop another paradigm which makes them more durable? Or what if phones and AR co-exist, I like to think of The Expanse where they still have handhelds but can swipe out what appears to be an AR screen.

But again, in the short term I highly doubt AR is going to be the solution, my guess is at least 5-10 years. Your arguments on the delicateness of folding screens, which don't make sense in the face of Samsung's own torture tests, still don't account for the delicateness of AR glasses. You don't think consumers will do their worst? No, consumers absolutely excel at destroying technology, just wait until Jerryrigeverything gets his hands on a set. And AR glasses will be MORE delicate than current glasses, have you every tried to break a set of polycarbonate glasses?

Size will also be a major issue, minituarizing the technology will take significant time, even if the make them as small as today's sunglasses that will still be a chore to many. Personally I'd rather wear a mono contact lens than a pair of reading glasses because I just hate wearing glasses, even though reading glasses are much better. I can only imaging what an oversized set of AR goggles will be like to most people. Another issue is the ecosystem, that takes time to be built. Not only on Apple's side, but to integrate with the rest of the world.

Finally there is the issue of cost, while many are happy to pay the Apple tax, in order for technology to become ubiquitous it needs to be available to most people. Google glass is a good example, $1500 clunky glasses with very little ecosystem sure didn't become a big hit. They are great in specialized industries such as healthcare and manufacturing, that's why Google now has them only for specific industries.

How about privacy issues? Do you really want everyone to walk around recording 24/7? How will you ensure you are not being recorded? What about issues like driving? There was a lot of talk about banning google glass when driving back then. Again, I definitely agree that AR is the future (well until something else is the future), but it's not as close as we think it is, at least not in replacing simply having a larger screen. But at this point a lot of things could be "the future." Maybe Musk's neuralink is the future, and AR is just a clunky, delicate, expensive, not universally integraged hodge podge solution, who knows? Me, I'd rather live in the present.

 

[clevins]

With a folding phone you aren't forced to carry an iPhone and an iPad, you are forced to carry two iPhones.

All the time. Even when you don't need the other 'device'. Most people do not carry both now, so the extra weight and bulk is useless to them.

 

[bobcomer]

Rollables are much better, no crease, less screen issues, so on. My only concern is safety with these rolly guys.

They could well be, but we'll have to wait until somebody makes one to see. In the meantime, I'll take foldables.