Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.
Stop making false analogies.

No other industry that I know of gives you a discount for locking you into a contract except the cell phone industry.

I can think of 2 other similar examples:

Printer manufactures often greatly reduce the price of printers and then recoup this money with high ink costs.

My cable internet provider provides a free modem (and wifi router) if you lock yourself into a 24 month contract.
 
Can't wait for....

I cannot wait for the first post on Mac Rumors tomorrow morning to exclaim ..."THE APPLE STORE IS DOWN !!!" Ahhh, that always gives me goosebumps:):p:D.........:apple:

(internal monologue) "Now.... (searching for wallet) Where did I put that credit card?" :rolleyes:
 
T
I'm already pissed off at the notion of Apple wanting to "put an iPhone in the hand of every mobile user," so if all this subsidy rubbish comes to pass that's exactly what's gonna happen.

So if they now wanna cheapen this top-of-the-line piece o' technology so drastically that every Tom, Dick and Harry can get their hands on one and broaden its availability to every corner of the earth -- then I sincerely truly hope that those same Toms and Dicks and Harrys get inside the OS and wreak havoc with viruses and hacks and all sorts of nasty sh*t...in much the same way they've done to Microsoft and Windows. Afterall it's damn near a fully functioning version of the Mac operating system in this li'l son of a b*tch (I'm using my iPhone right now to type this message LOL)!!!

I'm tellin' y'all but y'all ain't listenin'...this is gonna blow up then fade out EXACTLY like the Moto Razr did! It's all relative.

Hmmpf. A two hundred dollar "next generation" 3G iPhone...with genuine GPS, video conferencing, corporate mail access etc etc etc...for $200????!!! Have y'all lost your f*uckin minds? After millions of us paid upwards of $500 for this piece o'sh*t 8 and 16GB first gens??????

That would be a mess of epic proporations...not to mention that it just doesn't make any sense!!!!

Monday's gonna be very very interesting.

thaitillidie, what took you so long?:D

I have to admit, I think that the iPhone will sell regardless, and just cannot see the reason why AT&T, not Apple, would want to subsidize the phone.

The argument doesn't hold water that more people will sign 2-year contracts because currently AT&T is the only game in town as far as 3G technology is concerned. I know that I wouldn't purchase a 3G technology phone to use on T-Mobile, a company without the technology and whose compatibility to AT&T's 3G technology is questionable at this point, once it implements 3G.

Additionally, with so many countries now getting legit iPhone, the incentive to purchase phones here and taking them abroad to unlock is not as great as with v1.

I don't know if this is rumor will be proven correct; I just don't see this how subsidy benefits either AT&T or Apple.

Jude
 
Why would Apple bow to the pressure of the phone companies if the iPhone is
selling so well and has been a hit. I would think that with the success of the iPhone Apple could be calling the shots.

Dont get me wrong though I would be very happy with a $200 subsidy, happy to sign a new 2 year contract.

Let's hope it's a sign of things to come and that by doing so, AT&T and others can make some money along with Apple but more importantly, the phone becomes like a regular phone, problems in the first year and you're in and out of any store with a new phone in minutes, no more "...you must make a genius bar appointment...." enough already.
:D
 
The iPhone headphone have a play/pause button, and if you double-tap the home button, you can get iPod controls, even when the device is locked. Then push the top-right of the screen from inside your pocket for next song.

You can also use the volume controls when it's locked.

Anyone ever figure out why the headphone jack needed that extended plug when it first came out? What was up with that.!?!? :eek::eek::eek:


If that had been Nokia or Motorola, they would have offered a free headphone extension/adapter and not charge $9.99 for a tooling error.:D
 
Anyone ever figure out why the headphone jack needed that extended plug when it first came out? What was up with that.!?!? :eek::eek::eek:
If that had been Nokia or Motorola, they would have offered a free headphone extension/adapter and not charge $9.99 for a tooling error.:D

It was because the iPhone's headphone jack was intended for use with the headphones which CAME with the iPhone... which has a microphone attached to one of the wires... obviously, it was designed so you could talk on the phone without taking the headphones off...

HOWEVER, most people have their OWN set of headphones they like to use, and those DON'T have a Mic attached for phone use... therefore the need for a separate adapter was necessary... it wasn't a mistake or a design error.
 
I have to admit, I think that the iPhone will sell regardless, and just cannot see the reason why AT&T, not Apple, would want to subsidize the phone.

I don't know if this is rumor will be proven correct; I just don't see this how subsidy benefits either AT&T or Apple.

Everyone might think the iPhone has sold well to date, but in reality it hasn't compared to the total mobile phone sales worldwide each year - over 1.1 billion in 2007. The iPhone has apparently sold about 5 million to date.

If the iPhone had the same market share as the iPod then the potential sales are phenomenal. But the price needs to come down and the product get better for that to happen - hence why subsidising the iPhone makes sense.

Up until now Apple and the phone companies have made a massive profit margin on the iPhone. In the UK, on a £35 a month tariff you'd get a similar phone for free (the Nokia N95 for example) so they could easily do the same with the iPhone. The phone companies make their money on the monthly tariff and other call charges and are used to selling phones at a loss.

It will be interesting to see what happens in the UK if they are subsidised. As no subsidies were given originally you're not tied in to the contract the same as you are normally. You can currently buy a new iPhone and activate it on your existing account and continue the existing cotract.

So at worse I'd imagine O2 will offer existing customers the same deal as new ones. Maybe something better if you return your current iPhone - which they could then refurbish and sell again.
 
Good news, this would bring it in line with the market norm.
However, could we expect monthly contracts to go up because of this (as if they weren't expensive enough!) ?
 
Stop making false analogies.

No other industry that I know of gives you a discount for locking you into a contract except the cell phone industry.
You mustn't use many products or services... Our broadband connection was free and came with a free wireless router and Skype phone. We were locked into a contract with them (1 year I think).
Sky TV was the same. We just had to pay for installation (£40) but we were locked into a contract.
We got a discounted boiler through British Gas so long as we signed up with them.

So no. The "cell phone industry" isn't the only one doing subsidies.

Before the iPhone, anytime you signed a new contract, whether it's being a new customer, switching providers, or just renewing, you got a discount on your new phone. The only exception to this rule was the iPhone. So if discount = locked contract and we never got a discount, doesn't that mean that if we want a discount now they should be able to give it to us as long as we sign a locked contract? Yes.

No it was the same before the iPhone too. Initially top of the line Nokias would set you back a few hundred but then, 3-6 months later they would then be 100% subsidised by the contract. Now pretty much all phones have the same system. Pay as you go is another story entirely which is why the iPhone bombed, soon as o2 knocked the price down £100 (subsidise) they flew off the shelves.
 
YES!!!! I just sold my phone on eBay for 500 dollars! I can get a new phone + extra cash! Life is good...

That sucker that bought your iphone will be pissed.. don't people read the rumor sites?. Who would by a used iphone for $300 knowing that apple is just about to release a more advanced version?. I guess this is what happens when you do not read the news.. I hope they do not wallow in their misery too long
 
Stop making false analogies.

No other industry that I know of gives you a discount for locking you into a contract except the cell phone industry. People don't feel entitled to a subsidy in this situation; they're just saying if there is one they shouldn't be penalized for being early adopters, which are Apple's best customers. If Apple is willing to subsidize, but they tell me I have to wait 6 months, that doesn't change the fact that I'm eligible for a subsidy, just not right now. We're not asking for something they aren't willing to give, we're just asking for it now instead of having to wait for some arbitrary deadline which never should have been set in the first place since we never got a discount on the first phone.

Before the iPhone, anytime you signed a new contract, whether it's being a new customer, switching providers, or just renewing, you got a discount on your new phone. The only exception to this rule was the iPhone. So if discount = locked contract and we never got a discount, doesn't that mean that if we want a discount now they should be able to give it to us as long as we sign a locked contract? Yes.

Man, you must feel like a fool right about now, after so many post of people proving you wrong. Your post was an example of the usual "Apple Fanatics knee jerk reaction without thinking to any criticism of apple". Let me chime in. When i first got Dish Network, i was locked into a 2 year contract, now that i have verizon Fios triple play, i am locked into a 2 year contract for the discount (they do offer the option of no contract but boy, oh boy, the price for that is high.. i like my discount). Before Fios phone, i had vonage, they too hada discount provided i stay with them for a while (not a contract but i got some money if i stayed 3 months i think). I bet you will think before you post next time (or maybe not).
 
Everyone might think the iPhone has sold well to date, but in reality it hasn't compared to the total mobile phone sales worldwide each year - over 1.1 billion in 2007. The iPhone has apparently sold about 5 million to date.

If the iPhone had the same market share as the iPod then the potential sales are phenomenal. But the price needs to come down and the product get better for that to happen - hence why subsidising the iPhone makes sense.

Up until now Apple and the phone companies have made a massive profit margin on the iPhone. In the UK, on a £35 a month tariff you'd get a similar phone for free (the Nokia N95 for example) so they could easily do the same with the iPhone. The phone companies make their money on the monthly tariff and other call charges and are used to selling phones at a loss.



It will be interesting to see what happens in the UK if they are subsidised. As no subsidies were given originally you're not tied in to the contract the same as you are normally. You can currently buy a new iPhone and activate it on your existing account and continue the existing cotract.

So at worse I'd imagine O2 will offer existing customers the same deal as new ones. Maybe something better if you return your current iPhone - which they could then refurbish and sell again.

great, but your comparing the previous years sales (which were NOT WORLDWIDE) to worldwide numbers. Apples to oranges my friend.

When iphone goes world, it will sell better than any phone.

---
And the whole point of a subsidy is to gain NEW business, thus the reason they don't offer existing customers subsidy's (minus those 1, and 2yr offers for upgrades, thats just to get you locked in again).

ATT is hardly the only company offering subsidies, and i expect them to do it with the iphone soon. All the v1 people will whine, oh well, thats business. If you dont like it, go buy a gophone. Your not owed anything for being an existing customer, because YOU SIGNED a contract already, your dues have been paid.
 
There is some truth to that point. The rules of supply and demand are very real, and if the price gets lower when supply is already lower, then that would leave a lot of people waiting, and disappointed. The reality is that apple hasn't had iphones available on their site for about a month. This could be cause of lack of supply, or cause they don't want any bummed customers. The reality is, i am sure they have learned their lesson, and will have plenty of supply available when iphone 3g arrives. The priority to apple and at&t though, is to get as big of a wave of people to get it immediately as possible. a products biggest sales (especially in apple case) tend to be just after they come out (minus holidays). If a subsidy is able to send a larger number of people over to AT&T in the first days of the new iphone, then i feel like everybody wins. The bottom line is, a ton of people bought the first iphone at full price. I feel like after a year, the time has come for the iphone to be subsidized. Turn the iphone from being common, to standard. Get it in everyones pocket.

Not a bad point. I do hope that Apple has learned its lesson with supply, but I don't know if they have. It seems like every new product—even refreshes—have been delayed due to supply issues. I don't know how true that is, but it feels like it. I especially hope that they've learned their lesson this time as I'm going to attempt to drive out to the apple store during my lunch which I'll conveniently take right after the keynote. Of course I'll call first to make sure they have them in, but that doesn't guarantee anything.

I would love to see everyone own one. I work in production. A fair share of people I work with already have an iPhone. That will only come through subsidy. It all depends on the goals that Apple and AT&T want to accomplish and the supply they'll have available.
 
Question: when's the last time you saw an "on sale" sign in an Apple store or on their website?

Apple doesn't do the rebate or discount thing. They don't do it now. They haven't done it in the past. And they never will! They don't need to. So this idea of AT&T offering them is absurd! Apple's an elite brand whether you want to admit it or not. They design premium products -- in form and function -- that command premium prices. That's what elite brands do -- duh! And that's the way it needs to stay!!!

Have sales of the v.1 iphone -- or ANY Apple product for that matter -- stalled? I'm no Apple historian but I don't think so! So why would you lower the price on a newer product with newer technology when the earlier version of that same product was selling like hotcakes in the first place?? And I don't think anybody who truly appreciates the virtues of top-of-the-line technology would have an issue paying a premium price to play.

Even though it lacks certain key features that should be there, anybody with the v.1 iphone right now knows that it still has that "special something" that you can't quite put your finger on (no pun intended) that no other phone has -- not even those "iphony" clones that are starting to flood the market.

So why shouldn't we be willing to pay $599 or even $699 for what it SURE to be THE ultimate must-have gadget?! And I don't think Apple is gonna screw us like it did the first time around by omitting key features that should be expected from a 2nd gen iphone. Matter o' fact I think there's gonna be at least 1 new feature that hasn't been discussed that's gonna blow everybody away!

Or at least there had better be at least 1 new feature that hasn't been discussed that's gonna blow everybody away lol!

So stop all the crying about discounts and rebates and subsidies! If you want the coolest phone on the planet, let's all show Apple our appreciation by paying out of our yahoos for it!!
:rolleyes:, it seems like you didn't get the iPhone on day 1 then. That $200 sure seemed like a screwing to quite a few people. If the iPhone was selling as well as you claim is was I don't think they would have dropped the price like they did (then).

Of course if you were being sarcastic then :eek:.
 
I hadn't thought of the whole jailbreaking and unlocking thing, and I think you might have figured out exactly why AT&T would be inclined to subsidize the phone.

They make their money from selling the plans, not the phone. If everyone buys the phone but uses TMO or sends it back overseas, AT&T loses.

You get a gold star, sir. Brilliant.

True, but how would that come into play now that you can't get 3G on T Mobile's network with the iPhone? Plus, depending on the launch, there might not be as big of an incentive to ship them overseas anymore.
 
So we all know that apple is going to announce the iphone 3g tomorrow, but when can I get my hands on this puppy?
 
new to forum... but i work at at&t and here is wuts up w/ the contract thing.

the iPhone's pricing is with a new 2yr agreement, you cant buy it full cost because they are letting u upgrade no matter your current contract status so u can get the discounted price shown ($399 or $499). other phones for example; the at&t tilt is $599 retail, w/ 2yr disc we give $200 off so its $399 out the door, they list it like this becasue u do have the option if you arent eligable for an upgrade to purchase it without renewing your contract. BUT since you are always eligable to renew when you purchase the iPhone they will never list a full retail cost... if ipod Touch's start at $299 (no contract obviously) then u think for THE iPHONE w/ GSM/EGDE chips and phone capabilities no contract will only be charged $100 more than the touch? those prices include the contract discounts already. so dont cry and say u dont get a discount and have to renew for no reason. just be happy they will let u renew whenever u want for the iphone.

idk who originally posted about it, but jus general info.

i hope they dont subsidize it tho... id hate seeing every kid in junior high and high school w/ the same phone as me, i like being different... although i guess the point for apple is to have one in everyones hands, understandably
 
anyone who bought the current iphone is still eligible to receive any subsidy! this is because you didn't get a subsidy on your last phone so that subsidy is still available on your account! go to your wireless.att.com page and hit the check for upgrade button and you'll see that you can get the upgrade at the subsidized price, you'll just have to renew your contract

Not sure if anyone got to this one yet... but this is not true. My contract reports that I am eligible for an upgrade in 2009 (1.5 years after I bought my iphone).
 
i disagree. i wouldn't buy a nano specifically for the car, but i would definitely prefer the tactile buttons while driving. i have a griffin itouch controller hooked up to my phone in my car so that i have the 'clickwheel' controls available while driving.

I know this might not be real helpful now ( unless you have an aftermarket radio or a current model year vehicle that supports it ), but in most vehicles in the next model year or so there will be USB ports and full iPod controls via the standard vehicle radio ( even the low-end radios ). From what I have seen so far, this is audio only, but works very well. The radio acts like an accessory - think iHome or whatever. The radio will also charge the iPod.

Some may even offer an add-on box to current model year radios.
 
Not sure if anyone got to this one yet... but this is not true. My contract reports that I am eligible for an upgrade in 2009 (1.5 years after I bought my iphone).

were u a new customer or an existing?

what the plan was (idk if it was always the case) if someone is an existing at&t cust, say they are out of contract and eligable for an upgrade, they buy the iphone and their contract is renewed, BUT their upgrade availability is still in play if a new phone comes out they can renew again to get the discount, and there is no upgrade fee involved when purchasing the iphone unlike every other phone.

so basically if someone was eligable for an upgrade in march of 2008, and they bought their iphone june 2007 w/ a 2yr agreement, they are still eligable for an upgrade march of 2008.

this is wut was supposed to of happened, but idk if it was always the case or not, but its been fairly consistant from what i have seen.
 
i still have hopes for a new iPhone around 299 $ with contract considering that some phones r sold for 600 $ here and for 1 $ if u describe to a contract
 
Business Model?

Uh, I know that we're all going nuts about what is going to happen to us when this goes down, but has anyone given thought to the fact that this is a MAJOR business model shift for the iPhone, that will probably end up eating up its iPod business? Why the hell would anyone buy an iPod Touch for $399 when you could get an iPhone, that does everything and more for $200 after contract? Does it make sense for Apple to allow such a severe cannibalization of their iPod business?

As an apple shareholder, if they allow subsidization of their iPhone, I sure as heck am going sell my shares.
 
Why the hell would anyone buy an iPod Touch for $399 when you could get an iPhone, that does everything and more for $200 after contract? Does it make sense for Apple to allow such a severe cannibalization of their iPod business?

perhaps the reasoning is that mobile phones were about to start eating into ipod sales as they are increasingly becoming competent music players and it's better that it's apple's own phone that is doing this rather than those of other companies.
 
Register on MacRumors! This sidebar will go away, and you'll see fewer ads.