Apple to Debut Apple TV With 4K HDR Support at September Event

[samlikesmac]

WestWorld Season 1 is coming out on 4K Blu-ray. There’s a season 2 of the show coming out. I also imagine many of their shows are shot in 4K but are released at 1080p. And they’re also rapidly producing more content that could be released in 4K. I’m honestly confused about your question.

Westworld was filmed on 35mm and delivered in 2K JPEG format to HBO. The 4K bluray version will likely be the same 2K upconvert from the copy that was delivered to HBO.
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What the hell does 'finished' mean? I guarantee you don't even know what you mean when you type that. The studio has all of the original captured scenes in their native resolution. That's why you get 'never-before-seen' bonus BS all the time on future releases because they intentionally hold BS back. They have everything.

I think they mean is was mastered and color graded for theatrical and Home release. The studio (hopefully) keeps their archives in pristine condition so that the original negatives (doesn’t apply to digital unfortunately) can be resurrected should they feel like spending the time and money.

 

[cmChimera]

Westworld was filmed on 35mm and delivered in 2K JPEG format to HBO. The 4K bluray version will likely be the same 2K upconvert from the copy that was delivered to HBO.

So it's upscaled to 4k and has HDR. Why would I not want this as a streaming option?

 

[JamesPDX]

So it's upscaled to 4k and has HDR. Why would I not want this as a streaming option?

Lossy data compression via the transport stream. You'll probably get much higher quality if you can download the episode(s) and watch that way. Give it a try. FWIW, Downloading Amazon Prime yields higher picture quality than their streaming service. –They're basically just a notch up from the "finger-wagging, teachable moments" content of Hoopla.

Try it all and then decide. Go with what pleases your eyes and ears.

 

[Bacillus]

Wont buy any version w/o app backup

 

[cmChimera]

Lossy data compression via the transport stream. You'll probably get much higher quality if you can download the episode(s) and watch that way. Give it a try. FWIW, Downloading Amazon Prime yields higher picture quality than their streaming service. –They're basically just a notch up from the "finger-wagging, teachable moments" content of Hoopla.

I understand that downloading will result in better quality than streaming. Currently HBO doesn't allow this, but Netlfix does. (and maybe Amazon's AppleTV app when it releases) Downloading a video at 4k sounds great! But they first have to allow you to stream at 4k and they don't currently. So going back to what I said originally, I hope HBO upgrades to 4k streams for this Apple Tv.

 

[iBungie]

(do they have 4K blu-ray I don't even know)

Yes
UHD/4K Blu-ray discs are available for sale as are external 4K disc players and internal players/burners

 

[samlikesmac]

So it's upscaled to 4k and has HDR. Why would I not want this as a streaming option?

HBO is far from offering 4K streaming and HDR. They can’t even offer decent 1080p playback yet. Maybe 2019 or later. Hopefully season 2 of Westworld will be mastered at a more proper resolution given that the show is quite good and features some breathtaking shots of the Southwest.

 

[cmChimera]

HBO is far from offering 4K streaming and HDR. They can’t even offer decent 1080p playback yet. Maybe 2019 or later. Hopefully season 2 of Westworld will be mastered at a more proper resolution given that the show is quite good and features some breathtaking shots of the Southwest.

Here's hoping for something sooner than 2019.

 

[Cigsm]

LOLOL I know exactly what I'm talking about. Clearly you don't. In the process of movie making there is a digital intermediary and that is alsmost always done in 2K. Most 4K blu rays have DI's finished in 2k, so it's not true 4K you're getting anyway.

What the hell does 'finished' mean? I guarantee you don't even know what you mean when you type that. The studio has all of the original captured scenes in their native resolution. That's why you get 'never-before-seen' bonus BS all the time on future releases because they intentionally hold BS back. They have everything.

 

[Cigsm]

Many 4K blu rays were originally shot in 2K and then upscaled for a 4k release. It's nothing more then marketing for profit

WestWorld Season 1 is coming out on 4K Blu-ray. There’s a season 2 of the show coming out. I also imagine many of their shows are shot in 4K but are released at 1080p. And they’re also rapidly producing more content that could be released in 4K. I’m honestly confused about your question.

 

[Cigsm]

Figuring most movies are shot in 2k and even more then that have their DI's in 2k, no they won't. Especially considering they have to compress it even further to go through the internet.

Yes they will be.

 

[aaronhead14]

Figuring most movies are shot in 2k and even more then that have their DI's in 2k, no they won't. Especially considering they have to compress it even further to go through the internet.

Most movies are NOT shot in 2K. Most movies are shot in 3.4K or above. (Or 2.8K at the very least, if using an older Alexa). And if you were taking about last year's digital intermediate process, you'd be right. But now, even films shot in 3.4K and 2.8K often have 4K DI's and are mastered in 4K.

However, let's just pretend your claim is true for a second. A 4K upscale of a 2K master is still going to look leaps and bounds better than a 1080p version upon compression. Why? Bitrate. Yes, a 4K upscale of a 2K master is technically not true 4K, but both the file size and bitrate will be higher than the 1080p version, which will make it look much better (even on a 1080p TV or monitor).

When high amounts of compression are involved, a higher resolution is a plus.

Also, my claim is objectively true that Apple will release movies in 4K soon. It's already been reported multiple times, and the info was already accidentally leaked on iTunes like two weeks ago. It'll happen when the new 4K Apple TV releases in September. Not up for debate lol

 

[JamesPDX]

Figuring most movies are shot in 2k and even more then that have their DI's in 2k, no they won't. Especially considering they have to compress it even further to go through the internet.

https://vimeo.com/channels/dolbyvision

 

[cmChimera]

Many 4K blu rays were originally shot in 2K and then upscaled for a 4k release. It's nothing more then marketing for profit

As others have said, the result is better picture particularly when coupled with HDR. I want it.

 

[JamesPDX]

And of course the image quality starts on-set. Lighting>Lens>Camera>Operator>Settings.

High Dynamic Range: The HDR-ishnesh of any production is dependent on shooting in a video RAW format. Production<Post Production<Post Post<Distribution.

No serious production is even bothering to compress audio files anymore, because a 24 bit 48khz stem takes up so little space compared to the 4K video wrapped into Dolby Vision, etc.

https://www.theverge.com/2017/1/5/14180456/hdr-formats-hdr10-dolby-vision-hlg-advanced-ces-2017

 

[Cigsm]

Wow you couldn't be more wrong LOLOL.

Wonder Woman - Shot in 3K, VFX 2K, DI 2K
Bay watch - Shot in 2.8K, VFX 2K, DI in 2K
Fate of the furious - VFX 2k, DI in 2K
Atomic Blonde - shot in 2.8K, VFX 2K, DI 2K
Logan - shot in 3.4K, VFX 2K, DI 4K
Alien: Covenant - shot in 3.4k, VFX 2k, DI 2K
Spider-Man: Homecoming - shot in 2.8K, BFX 2k, DI 2K
Guardians 2- shot in 8k, GX 2K, DI 2K
Kong: Skull Island - Shot in 3.4K, VFX 2k, DI 2K

Most movies are NOT shot in 2K. Most movies are shot in 3.4K or above. (Or 2.8K at the very least, if using an older Alexa). And if you were taking about last year's digital intermediate process, you'd be right. But now, even films shot in 3.4K and 2.8K often have 4K DI's and are mastered in 4K.

However, let's just pretend your claim is true for a second. A 4K upscale of a 2K master is still going to look leaps and bounds better than a 1080p version upon compression. Why? Bitrate. Yes, a 4K upscale of a 2K master is technically not true 4K, but both the file size and bitrate will be higher than the 1080p version, which will make it look much better (even on a 1080p TV or monitor).

When high amounts of compression are involved, a higher resolution is a plus.

Also, my claim is objectively true that Apple will release movies in 4K soon. It's already been reported multiple times, and the info was already accidentally leaked on iTunes like two weeks ago. It'll happen when the new 4K Apple TV releases in September. Not up for debate lol

 

[400]

I can get HDR with a 4k as well, that is well worth it if done well. However, I hope that many film studios will start to up the ante and do a full fat 4k+ from start to finish. Or better.

e.g. my go to would be Planet Earth II. 5k at least I think? Eye popping good. It is absolutely amazing. And my set is not calibrated.

The Mummy trilogy is superb, that was scanned in. The Martian, and Mad Max, 2k involved (bit deeper than that in the process but hey), when they are put together well they come across superb and there is a tangible difference to the 1080p version. I checked.

The genuine 4k, and there are a few, are stunning, though Independence Day 2, what a dud, but what a superb looking dud. N
ow, when Star Wars stuff start to get the treatment, Rogue One, will be first I hope? Disney is looking to start up its own channel, don't know what direction they want to go and what they can 4K up but the future is good.

Oh, and sport, I get that from my ISP. 4K from the camera to my set, of course there is compression but the end result is stunning considering where it has been squeezed through the pipe.

The future is looking good, more we go for it, I hope the better it gets.


Edit.
Oh I say....
http://www.blu-ray.com/movies/Blade-Runner-4K-Blu-ray/181637/#Review

 

[aaronhead14]

Wow you couldn't be more wrong LOLOL.

Wonder Woman - Shot in 3K, VFX 2K, DI 2K
Bay watch - Shot in 2.8K, VFX 2K, DI in 2K
Fate of the furious - VFX 2k, DI in 2K
Atomic Blonde - shot in 2.8K, VFX 2K, DI 2K
Logan - shot in 3.4K, VFX 2K, DI 4K
Alien: Covenant - shot in 3.4k, VFX 2k, DI 2K
Spider-Man: Homecoming - shot in 2.8K, BFX 2k, DI 2K
Guardians 2- shot in 8k, GX 2K, DI 2K
Kong: Skull Island - Shot in 3.4K, VFX 2k, DI 2K

And you're getting this information from where? IMDb is user-submitted, you know.... The information isn't accurate. Guardians 2 definitely was mastered in 4K. Just watch the BTS on RED's YouTube channel.

Also, every example there actually proves you're wrong, not that I'm wrong. Haha. You said most movies are SHOT in 2K but literally not a SINGLE one of those was shot in 2K. Haha. And if the Logan specs are accurate, THAT is a great example of what I was explaining. Shot in 3.4K and mastered in 4K. I suspect more films are like that and the IMDb info is just wrong.

(This is what I do for my work, by the way. Haha)

 

[Cigsm]

As do I.

"Disney upscaled the digital transfer to 4K from its 2K master format (the film was actually shot using the Red Weapon Camera System with its astounding 8K resolution)." According to the notes a reviewer was given by Disney.

I also love how you've decided it isn't accurate. I'll wait for your proof. Otherwise, there's a wealth of information out there showing otherwise.

And you're getting this information from where? IMDb is user-submitted, you know.... The information isn't accurate. Guardians 2 definitely was mastered in 4K. Just watch the BTS on RED's YouTube channel.

Also, every example there actually proves you're wrong, not that I'm wrong. Haha. You said most movies are SHOT in 2K but literally not a SINGLE one of those was shot in 2K. Haha. And if the Logan specs are accurate, THAT is a great example of what I was explaining. Shot in 3.4K and mastered in 4K. I suspect more films are like that and the IMDb info is just wrong.

(This is what I do for my work, by the way. Haha)

 

[cube]

I had given up on my BD/HT combo for playing multichannel SACD but, hopelessly, I decided to try again.

I was going to call it off again, when after fiddling a bit more, it started magically working.

Yes, it is through HDMI (LPCM).

It is so good, and I am playing at 44.1kHz / with fashion 4.1 2.4GHz wireless speakers.

It turns out I could not play multichannel with the TV switched on, so I disconnected it from the HT video out.

I still have to switch it off to start an SACD even if the main HDMI out of the BD player is set to video only, but the HT will not revert to stereo when I switch the TV back on at least.

I did not try what happens if I switch off video on the BD player yet.

 

[aaronhead14]

I also love how you've decided it isn't accurate. I'll wait for your proof. Otherwise, there's a wealth of information out there showing otherwise.

IMDb is user-submitted, like Wikipedia. It's not a reliable source of information. This is an objective fact. "Proof" is not needed for objective facts, lol.
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Many 4K blu rays were originally shot in 2K and then upscaled for a 4k release. It's nothing more then marketing for profit

It's plenty more than marketing for profit. 4KUltraHD Blu-ray discs can hold up to 100GB of information, whereas a standard dual-layer 1080p Blu-ray disc can only hold 50GB. This means that, even if a film was only mastered in 2K, it will still look better on the 4K Blu-ray than it will on the 1080p Blu-ray simply because of the higher bitrate.

And you keep saying most movies were "shot in 2K." Again, that's completely false. Almost no movies are shot in 2K! Even 15 years ago when everything was still being shot on film, that was still much higher resolution than 2K! If you're referring to the film's master, however, then you'd be correct. All films used to be mastered in 2K, and lots of films still are (but tons are mastered in 4K nowadays, too!)

So yeah, you're right in that there are plenty 4K Blu-ray releases that are technically mastered in 2K. But your claim that there is no visual difference between the 4K upscale and the 2K Blu-ray is 100% false. Bitrate is the main factor in the quality of an image, not resolution. So the 4K Blu-rays look better than the 1080p Blu-rays simply due to the higher bitrate.

 

[cube]

Hey, I like dubbed movies, especially anime.

It is true that historic/fantasy animated characters can be annoying with modern American dialog. But I will still demand the original version.

And historic movies in general can be unrealistic/confusing when spoken in the wrong language.

 

[Cigsm]

I didn't get my info from IMDb and I didn't say there's no visual difference between bluray & 4K.

IMDb is user-submitted, like Wikipedia. It's not a reliable source of information. This is an objective fact. "Proof" is not needed for objective facts, lol.
[doublepost=1504220459][/doublepost]
It's plenty more than marketing for profit. 4KUltraHD Blu-ray discs can hold up to 100GB of information, whereas a standard dual-layer 1080p Blu-ray disc can only hold 50GB. This means that, even if a film was only mastered in 2K, it will still look better on the 4K Blu-ray than it will on the 1080p Blu-ray simply because of the higher bitrate.

And you keep saying most movies were "shot in 2K." Again, that's completely false. Almost no movies are shot in 2K! Even 15 years ago when everything was still being shot on film, that was still much higher resolution than 2K! If you're referring to the film's master, however, then you'd be correct. All films used to be mastered in 2K, and lots of films still are (but tons are mastered in 4K nowadays, too!)

So yeah, you're right in that there are plenty 4K Blu-ray releases that are technically mastered in 2K. But your claim that there is no visual difference between the 4K upscale and the 2K Blu-ray is 100% false. Bitrate is the main factor in the quality of an image, not resolution. So the 4K Blu-rays look better than the 1080p Blu-rays simply due to the higher bitrate.

 

[aaronhead14]

I didn't get my info from IMDb and I didn't say there's no visual difference between bluray & 4K.

By defending IMDb sources in your last post, you implied that you did get your info from there.

And by saying that 4K Blu-rays derived from a 2K source are just "marketing for profit," you implied that there's no visual quality difference between the 4K and 1080p releases.

So... yes, you did say those things.

 

[cube]

It turns out I could not play multichannel with the TV switched on, so I disconnected it from the HT video out.

I still have to switch it off to start an SACD even if the main HDMI out of the BD player is set to video only, but the HT will not revert to stereo when I switch the TV back on at least.

I did not try what happens if I switch off video on the BD player yet.

I just tried, and disabling video output on the BD player does not help.

Restarting a disc with the TV on will still revert the HT back to stereo. I need to eject and reload the disc with the TV off for it to start playing in multichannel.

Setting the TV to output audio via the TV speakers and even lowering it to 0 does not help either.

HDMI is so great.