Does your TV support Dolby Vision? I'm curious if there will be 4k Dolby Vision 24Hz option. That would resolve pretty much all of my complaints with it.
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Apple TV 4K does not support 24.000fps playback
- Thread starter ActionableMango
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Does your TV support Dolby Vision? I'm curious if there will be 4k Dolby Vision 24Hz option. That would resolve pretty much all of my complaints with it.
Unfortunately, mine does not support DV. I have Samsungs that barely really do HDR, so I'm probably not going to see vast improvements in HDR quality on the ATV4k. Even Deadpool so far looks fairly normal, but I'm also working so I can't give it my total attention yet.
It's not like the naysayers didn't have anything to go on. Apple themselves said it didn't support 24Hz output mode.
I find it somewhat hilarious to read all the rants people make without facts. We simply need to remember that with the release of any new device or tech from any manufacturer including Apple, we won't know the full capabilities until it is released and often not until it has been on the market long enough to develop and mature. Certainly the new Apple TV 4K is one of those the products. Considering its relatively powerful processor, it will be capable of incorporating current and near future technologies. I suspect that there are several more surprises yet to be revealed.
To be fair they specifically stated it didn’t support 24hz. Even went so far to create a support note indicating that HDR material would revert to 30hz if your tv didn’t support it at 60hz. And this is why I’m still a little cautious.
The Verge review says the new ATV won't switch modes, so it'll run DV content at 4K60 with HDR10 (fall back) on the 2016 LG OLEDs. It will not switch frame rate on a per content basis because they are prioritizing UI performance over all else, and lower refresh impairs UI.
It looks like it's possible to force it manually, based on the screenshot posted, but that would require the user to swap it between film and video modes.
It is hilarious that Apple would prioritize their UI over the actual content presentation. We aren't there to watch UI, after all.
Based on the 4k 24Hz HDR Modes Nilay mentions in this tweet, I think Dolby Vision will work at 24Hz too. https://twitter.com/reckless/status/910847305816973312
Sounds like the interface is pretty jittery in 24Hz mode though, although that's not unexpected. Still better than no 24Hz mode!
Sounds like the interface is pretty jittery in 24Hz mode though, although that's not unexpected. Still better than no 24Hz mode!
I don't think I was unreasonable to believe what Craig Michaels, Apple's Senior Product Manager for AppleTV, says about the AppleTV.
What is "somewhat hilarious" to me is that Mr. Michaels doesn't seem to know his own product.
This thread isn't some sort of Apple hater "rant". I don't want people to take it that way at all. I've had 2 iPods, 4 iPhones, 3 iPads, 6 Macs, 4 AppleTVs, and I'm a stockholder too. I love Apple.
Well I'm pretty happy. Why wouldn't I be? I'm asking Apple fix a long standing bug that affects many people on a huge amount of content, and it appears to already be fixed right out of the gate!
I don't understand the "naysayer" characterization though. My thread's purpose is to build support for filling out Apple's comment box to inform them that there are Apple fans who care about this bug. I just want movies to play at their correct framerate. Isn't this a good thing?
Honestly I don't even understand why I'm getting any flack at all for this effort. Are people against playing content back at its correct framerate? I understand people not caring at all, but I don't understand why people are knocking down a request for product improvement.
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As far as I know it is a limitation of the 2016 version LG OLED. Apparently the 2017 LG OLED has more intelligence built insofar as auto-switching. I've taken a look at the reviews over at rtings which is helpful. I am glad I didn't just go out and buy a 4K television when I bought my first ATV4. Many people including many on these forums bashed Apple's decision not to incorporate 4K support into the ATV4. Apple's basic response at that time was that 4K tech was still half-baked at best. Now that new ATV 4K is on the way (should be here tomorrow) I am actively shopping for the best TV having the best matching specs with the ATV 4K. My current Samsung HD TV is officially obsolete even though it's only a tad over two years old!
What TV will it be? Probably a 2017 LG OLED. The ATV 4K must be great news for the manufacturers of 4K HDR DV televisions.
And no I don't think it's hilarious that Apple devotes a significant amount of effort with the ATV UI. I for one really appreciate its UI. Certainly compared to others I have tried (including the awful builtin app on the Samsung and other third party streaming boxes) the ATV UI is the slickest of all.
Not sure what you’re meaning by that. It’s the Apple TV that needs to auto switch and Apple have decided not to build that in. But I would heartily recommend a 2017 Oled. Be warned to some extent though, it’s near black processing will highlight compression artefacts in iTunes content.
I think what the previous poster is suggesting is that given a choice between high quality media playback or a slick interface, he’d pick high quality media playback. He’s suggesting that Apple have sacrificed high quality media playback in favour of a slick interface.
For what it’s worth I don’t think that the Apple TV interface is all that special. I find the tiles a bit big in the movie section (this might be improved on the new one) and navigation of large libraries is particularly problematic. The inability to properly sort titles, or group films into collections is also a bit poor.
Thankfully infuse has a better interface but that isn’t going to work for iTunes content. Things like the arctic zephyr skin on Kodi is also streets ahead of the movie app on the Apple TV in my opinion.
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I think they should have 24p playback too, because as you suggest, why not? But it is important to keep these things in perspective. Most people with a 4k TV who care about 24fps film cadence already made sure that the TV they bought could properly handle 24 fps material from a 60 fps source. If your TV can handle it properly (and is properly set up), then it should make no difference.
That's absolutely massive news, have you tested it with any slow pan stuff to confirm that things aren't getting messed about a bit?
Auto refresh rate switching is something that can 'easily' be baked into an update down the line if Apple decide to give in, IIRC the Shield TV's refresh rate switching has gone through a bunch of changes via updates over the last 2 years as well.
Maybe I'm missing a trick with my setup, but I've got a Sony ZD9 which is renowned for having some of the best motion processing in the business. Whilst it does a better job of ironing out 24fps content via 60hz than my previous Panasonic CR852 did, I can still spot the judder immediately when I disable frequency switching on my Shield TV. Playing with True Cinema helps, but it's absolutely still there.
Auto refresh rate switching is something that can 'easily' be baked into an update down the line if Apple decide to give in, IIRC the Shield TV's refresh rate switching has gone through a bunch of changes via updates over the last 2 years as well.
Maybe I'm missing a trick with my setup, but I've got a Sony ZD9 which is renowned for having some of the best motion processing in the business. Whilst it does a better job of ironing out 24fps content via 60hz than my previous Panasonic CR852 did, I can still spot the judder immediately when I disable frequency switching on my Shield TV. Playing with True Cinema helps, but it's absolutely still there.
We cannot begin to understand or get into the minds of the likes of Mr Michaels at Apple. Only they know the reasons as to why limit either leaks or actual specs on upcoming devices like the ATV 4K. I suspect that conscious decisions to limit or disguise specific information are made to keep the competition on theirs toes. Rest assured the rest of the industry will be rushing to bring to market either new or at least refreshed products that will go head to head with Apple. So the only way to know whether it's hilarious that Mr Michaels does or does not know his product is to read his upcoming autobiography.
Did I use the word naysayer? Oh wait yes I did! If you read many of the postings in this and related forums you will find a significant portion of opinions that are very negative regarding most things Apple including the new ATV 4K. In fact from my reading some of the posts, quite a few of the posters don't even own an ATV and often go to great lengths advocating their preferred platform. Let me offer this final comment. I am all for informed dialogue but we all must be mindful that discussing tech is akin to shooting a moving target.
However I can't wait for my new ATV 4K to arrive! Hopefully with a worthy TV to match! And did you hear that we will be getting free upgrades to HDR/DV versions of iTunes movies we already own (of course dependent on whether an HDR/DV version of available from a given studio)? That alone makes the purchase of the new ATV 4K worthwhile!
I don’t know about that. The 2016 range of Oled TVs that only 6 months ago, were considered the best televisions available don’t support 24fps material from a 60hz source. And I doubt most owners considered it a problem since all Blu Ray players, UHD players and its in built apps are all capable of playing 24fps. It can also pull 24fps from interlaced sources so broadcast tv was also covered.
Is this serious? I think most of the frustration on here is that Apple have once again released a product that is already significantly behind many of its competitors products.
For the past 7 months I’ve been able to play 4k HDR content on my Shield TV at native frame rates. I’ve also been able to bitstream DTS, Dolby True HD, DTS Master HD and fully baked Dolby Atmos.
I’m annoyed because I love Apple products and I was hoping I could sell my shield tv and just use the Apple TV for all my media. Instead I can’t because it’s so far behind the competition. I need to keep my shield TV as my main player and just use the new Apple TV for cheap 4k films.
I've tried everything from Infuse, Kodi, Plex as well as streaming boxes and have come to the conclusion that for for ease of use the ATV is my preferred platform. I probably would not have said that a couple of years ago or even a year ago but at this point my investment in iTunes is significant (400 plus and counting). Slowing but surely I am replacing content that I ripped from my DVD/BluRay collection into a Plex server (300 movies and declining) by purchasing iTunes equivalents. Yes the ATV UI is not perfect but it does what I need it to do to my satisfaction. The ATV 4K in conjunction with an updated HDR/DV TV will be icing on the cake.
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If the ATV 4K were so far behind the far behind the competition it simply would cease to exist and forums like these would be perfectly silent. The fact is there are many many fans of the ATV looking for a devise that will play nice with the iTunes ecosystem. Power users like you don't need a device like the ATV 4K after all you have found the perfect device for your needs. A shield TV is simply of no interest to me native frame rates not withstanding. I am tired of having to switch around media sources and prefer to make some compromises to be able to standardize. Mind you most users can not discern between most of the mumbo jumbo regarding native frame rates and such. All they want is a device that presents their content to their satisfaction. The ATV 4K will do that and more when matched to a relatively new TV set current with current whiz bang technology.
My shields interface is the same way when switching to that. I just leave it in 60hz.
I can't make much sense of this.
The Apple TV needs to output content at its native frame rate. Period. Even if the LG did process DV at 60Hz, I wouldn't want it to have to. We'd just have judder with DV. I currently view film content at the proper frame rate and it's not going to change anytime soon. The ATV will be sufficient for TV shows and such, but it's doubtful that I'll keep it just for that.
In terms of the UI, if that is your priority, which sacrificing the actual content then it doesn't make much sense. Honestly you're just coming off as the Apple white knight. It's really not necessary. There really isn't a way for you to spin this into being anyone's fault other than Apple.
It's too bad that Apple offers 24hz for HDR10 and SDR, but only 60, 50, 30 and 25Hz for DV. Why Apple chose to ignore 24hz output for DV is ridiculous.
As far as the interface, Apple should be able to do just like UHD blu ray manufacturers. Most of their interfaces are at 60hz, but when the movie begins to play, it sends the video as 24hz without having to change any setting. Apple was just too lazy to do that.
As far as the interface, Apple should be able to do just like UHD blu ray manufacturers. Most of their interfaces are at 60hz, but when the movie begins to play, it sends the video as 24hz without having to change any setting. Apple was just too lazy to do that.
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Yes but the shield auto switches to 24hz when playing content.
Anyway...has anybody seen the reviews and accompanying thread on this site. It’s being suggested that the Apple TV plays everything in HDR mode including SDR material. Can somebody please test this and report back as it seems too absurd to be true?
Yes. But the problem is that Apple have made a conscious decision not to allow auto refresh rate (or resolution) switching. They think they’re right and have already justified their stance by claiming that switching is ‘inelegant’ because it causes a momentary drop in signal.