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nagromme

macrumors G5
May 2, 2002
12,546
1,196
svenr said:
If you copy songs directly from your Mac/PC to the phone, there won't be ANY airtime charges for anything though.

Nor would that COST the carriers anything because they are providing no part of that experience. It's irrelevant to the carriers. They may as well charge you a per-minute rate to use the Calculator function of your phone.

If they think that buying music DIRECTLY to your phone has value, then they can offer that option and charge what they like. That's a real service they are providing, even though I can't imagine people wanting it :eek:

But don't block the services people DO want--like PC interconnection (be it Bluetooth or music).
 

rlreif

macrumors regular
Jul 13, 2003
142
0
Vancouver
HERE HERE!

legalnut said:
and sell the phone (GSM version that is) without carrier subsidies in electronics stores (as Sony will do with their Walkman phone) ... all I can say is that carriers are one greedy bunch are they not satisfied with the HEFTY data charges incurred with downloads of songs 3-6 Mb each, they even want a cut of someone else's business... let them start their own business but don't exclude others .... can someone say:
A N T I T R U S T !!!​

thank you!
ive been wondering when somebody would say it... I dont see why phone makers dont start selling their phones unlocked with all the intended features in electronics shops.... you can already buy phones this way, but its such a small market that the carriers still have say on the initial design. seems to me somebody could launch one product that by itself could end this greed by the carriers if it had the appeal of the ipod.

make a phone camera (not a camera phone) by putting GSM hardware on an existing 5-7 mp camera... the ultra compacts already have a screen, battery, buttons, etc... adding GSM hrdware would not have to make them much bigger. have a USB port for putting pics, and other data onto phones... use bluetooth for smaller stuff, but be able to use it with everything.... not just what the carriers want. They would be powerless to stop something likke this short of changing GSM specs
 

zelmo

macrumors 603
Jul 3, 2004
5,490
1
Mac since 7.5
Silencio said:
It's not just the wireless providers that want to get > $1 per song: the idea has record industry execs drooling, as well. They also see it in their best interest to break Apple's dominance and try to squeeze more money out of their back catalogs. I seem to recall reading a quote from an anonymous record exec to that effect posted on AppleInsider a couple of weeks ago, but I can't track it down.

I vaguely remember what you are referring to. Wasn't the quote more along the lines of the RIAA bristling because Apple wouldn't let them deviate from the $0.99 per song charge, when they'd prefer to charge less for back catalog stuff to move more volume and also charge premium rates for the hot new songs people are clammoring for?
 

aprilfools

macrumors regular
Dec 15, 2004
213
1
Southern California
I am convinced that Apple is only marketing to a youth driven market anymore and will probably figure out how to make it happen. Kids would like this to happen for sure. My thoughts are this.... Let a wireless phone be a wireless phone, Let iTunes music store exist for your computer so that you can purchase music and add it an MP3 player (iPod ect..) Thats cool stuff. But it is not important to download music to your cell phone. If it is important than chances are you must be a youth. I am in my forties and no one I know in my age bracket could give a %$*& about dowloading songs to your cell phone. I am not a dinasaur and I like all the latest toys too but come on.
 

aprilfools

macrumors regular
Dec 15, 2004
213
1
Southern California
chaos86 said:
i have a crappy old nokia 2210 and it does everything i want it to do. it makes calls. it sounds like a telephone when it rings. it remembers the last few numbers i dialled. you get it? telephone-like functionality. i dont give a about a changable ringtone. i usually feel it vibrate and answer it before the ring sound even happens. on the other pocket, i have an ipod. it does what its supposed to do too. plays music. you know: music-player-like functionality. my point is WILL YOU PEOPLE STOP TRYING TO MUSH ALL MY GADGETS INTO ONE GADGET THAT WORKS HALF AS WELL AND COSTS TWICE AS MUCH!!




sorry ive been needing to say that for a while now.

YES. AMEN AMEN AMEN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

swissmann

macrumors 6502a
Sep 17, 2003
797
82
The Utah Alps
The iPod is no longer so revolutionary. It needs to be a combination of at least two of the following for it to stay on top in my opinion: iPod, Phone, Gaming Device, PDA, Camera, etc. Of course I would love to see all of the things combined into one unit (my pockets would be a lot lighter).
 

bbyrdhouse

macrumors 6502
Oct 2, 2002
300
0
Elm Grove, LA
chaos86 said:
i have a crappy old nokia 2210 and it does everything i want it to do. it makes calls. it sounds like a telephone when it rings. it remembers the last few numbers i dialled. you get it? telephone-like functionality. i dont give a about a changable ringtone. i usually feel it vibrate and answer it before the ring sound even happens. on the other pocket, i have an ipod. it does what its supposed to do too. plays music. you know: music-player-like functionality. my point is WILL YOU PEOPLE STOP TRYING TO MUSH ALL MY GADGETS INTO ONE GADGET THAT WORKS HALF AS WELL AND COSTS TWICE AS MUCH!!




sorry ive been needing to say that for a while now.

I agree, although I do think an ipod/pda device would be very useful and if it came from Apple you know it would be good.
 

dan-o-mac

macrumors 6502a
Oct 12, 2004
721
0
Brooklyn, NY
swissmann said:
The iPod is no longer so revolutionary. It needs to be a combination of at least two of the following for it to stay on top in my opinion: iPod, Phone, Gaming Device, PDA, Camera, etc. Of course I would love to see all of the things combined into one unit (my pockets would be a lot lighter).

It never was revolutionary, it's an mp3 player. :rolleyes:
 

aprilfools

macrumors regular
Dec 15, 2004
213
1
Southern California
swissmann said:
The iPod is no longer so revolutionary. It needs to be a combination of at least two of the following for it to stay on top in my opinion: iPod, Phone, Gaming Device, PDA, Camera, etc. Of course I would love to see all of the things combined into one unit (my pockets would be a lot lighter).

A hundred years ago nobody needed any of this stuff (CELL PHONES, PDA's COMPUTERS, DIGITAL CAMERAS etc..) and everyone got along just fine. But nowdays companies market to convince you that "you need this" and excellerate what is considered revolutionary. My phone is good enough just being a phone.
 

svenr

macrumors regular
May 6, 2003
219
1
nagromme said:
Nor would that COST the carriers anything because they are providing no part of that experience. It's irrelevant to the carriers..
In a sense there are "costs" involved: opportunity costs.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to speak for them and I hate this situation as much as everyone else here. I'm just saying you can see where they're coming from, why it's not irrelevant for them to try and get a slice of the multi-billion dollar pie, and why they're trying such desparate steps, even if it will most likely not work out for them the way they go about it.
 

JohnMacDonald@M

macrumors newbie
Mar 16, 2004
2
0
market size

The article states 'a quarter of the world's population already has a mobile phone' and then extrapolates 1.4 billion.

This just can't be true. Maybe a quarter of those with coverage, but I still doubt it.
 

jebarne

macrumors newbie
Jun 8, 2004
15
5
Cary, NC
Apple Wireless

Actually, it wouldn't be difficult For apple to become an MVNO (Mobile Virtual Network Operator) and offer their own Wireless Service. Virgin Mobile, Amp'd, Qwest and others are all providing the marketing and the device selection, screen savers and ringtones but using the big 3 to actually deliver the service.


They have an intensely loyal consumer base, tremendous brand recognition and could probably do well as an operator.
 

nagromme

macrumors G5
May 2, 2002
12,546
1,196
swissmann said:
It needs to be a combination of at least two of the following for it to stay on top in my opinion: iPod, Phone, Gaming Device, PDA, Camera, etc.
That would be great. In fact, I'll speculate and say it WILL be great.

But not until the device can do all those things WELL and not compromise. If anyone can do it Apple can. But I don't see it happening any time soon, and I don't WANT it to happen until/unless it can be done right. I don't want my music player to be less simple and more bulky.

Any combination of the iPod with another device right now would likely be a step backwards. The exception is when the "other function" is purely an extra added on--something nice that you can use or ignore. The iPod has many such functions already--and I like them (my iPod is all the PDA I need already). But in those cases, the "other function" isn't done WELL--it's basic rather than thorough and complete. So it doesn't truly replace another device. That's OK, but it is what it is and no more. For now...


svenr said:
In a sense there are "costs" involved: opportunity costs.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to speak for them and I hate this situation as much as everyone else here. I'm just saying you can see where they're coming from, why it's not irrelevant for them to try and get a slice of the multi-billion dollar pie, and why they're trying such desparate steps, even if it will most likely not work out for them the way they go about it.


Yeah, I know what you're saying. Really, it's in their best interest NOT to have phones do anything other than wireless communication. They make nothing from calculators, games, or files transferred from a PC.

Maybe the phone hardware makers who DO benefit from being able to sell those functions will prove to be a useful counter to carriers' greed.
 

dicklacara

macrumors 6502a
Jul 29, 2004
973
1
SF Bay Area
varmit said:
Why is it that carriers are going to be stupid this way. I, and most people, will never buy a song that I can only have on my phone, nor wait the long ass time for it get downloaded just to say on my phone. If anything, I want it on my central hub for my music, and that is the computers in this day in age. From there, music can be put onto or into anything the person wants. So f*ck the carriers, I'm stickink with my iPod and iTunes. I already have a good phone. I don't need it to play only 20 songs since that is all it can carry when my iPod can hold up to 10,000, and I can hook into my Mac and my Car.

RIAA and Cell phone carriers are Dumbasses! They would replace lawyers at the top of the hate list, but they employ lawyers to do their dirty work, so lawyers get to stay at the top of the list for now.

Sorry for the rant.

I've not seen it mentioned...

Say you start the download of a typical song:

1) how long will it take?
2) will there be bandwidth/minutes charges in addition to the price of the song
3) can you send/receive voice/text/images while the song is downloading
4) what does downloading/playing songs do to the battery (how many songs could I download & play before I need to recharge)?
5) do the providers have enough bandwith on their networks to do this on a large scale-- millions of users downloading millions of songs 24/7
 

thirdwaver

macrumors member
Jun 10, 2003
62
4
Northwest USA
I am so damn irritated with the money grubbing cell phone companies. They nickel and dime me to death all day long. While I appreciate the service they provide, I wish they'd leave me the hell alone with what I do with the device itself. I honestly believe they'd tax me for using the calculator on my phone if they could find a way.

They should just resign themselves to grabbing every penny they can when it comes to me making use of their communications infrastructure (i.e. data and voice) and let me use the phone I OWN along with the computer I OWN and the music I OWN however I wish.

I'd say it was my two cents but I'd be worried that a phone carrier would take them.

Sean
 

Diavilo1

macrumors member
Apr 12, 2005
80
0
When i got my latest phone, i looked for one w/o any option of a camera and i couldn't find any and the ones with cameras were more expensive because of that. So if phones starting coming as music players, guess what, i won't buy one of those until they don't make them without anymore. What a waste of money.
 

elo

macrumors regular
Feb 6, 2003
140
0
First, there's no evident antitrust problem here. A violation of the Sherman Act requires either monopolization (distinguishable from monopoly, particularly as the term is commonly used, but definitely not in play here) or an anticompetitive agreement between horizontally aligned entities. Mere unilateral decisions to not carry this service, even though they are anticompetitive, are not illegal. This is akin to airlines raising their prices on particular market segments because others have raised their prices. The net effect is anticompetitive, but lacks the agreement required to prove an antitrust violation.

Having said that, though, the result is very unfortunate. I know Sprint has refused to carry some beautiful Samsung phones (that were, in fact, made just for Sprint) because of features that were not specific to their Vision service. They all use some lock-in tactics that are frustrating to consumers and refusing to give the go ahead to Motorola's iTunes phone is probably such an example. I personally don't think too many people want to purchase music through their phone, but they would love to interface with the computer and play Apple's AAC files on non-iPod devices. Hopefully, at least one carrier will step up to the plate.
 

Thataboy

macrumors regular
Dec 31, 2004
219
0
New York, NY
the level of stupidity of these carriers is astounding. WHO would pay for this.... never mind prices 200% higher than itunes!

apple has nothing to be worried about. people don't want all this bs... they want phone, sms, maybe email.

as higher data bandwidth comes, then its important for quicktime to get on the phones.

ideally, id like to see apple create a mobile OS (maybe called Gala :) ) for smartphones and phones. That way they can leverage and promote apple technology while letting phone hardware companies stick to what they're "good" at. palm os is a dead horse, and windows, hell no.
 

d.perel

macrumors regular
Feb 3, 2005
204
0
I don't even CARE about iTunes on phones anymore! Just get me a cool looking Apple-designed Phone already!!!!!!!!! :p
 

synergy

macrumors regular
Jun 12, 2002
248
0
Diavilo1 said:
When i got my latest phone, i looked for one w/o any option of a camera and i couldn't find any and the ones with cameras were more expensive because of that. So if phones starting coming as music players, guess what, i won't buy one of those until they don't make them without anymore. What a waste of money.


You and me both. There are many cool phones I would be but for the fact they have a camera. Why you ask? My employer does not allow them.
Doubt I would buy a music playing phone either unless it was unecumbered by the cell provider.
 
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