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Apple (2010): Styluses are terrible. Keyboards are for dummies. iPad is different.
Apple (last year): who needs a trackpad or mouse with our beautiful iPad touch interface? Not gonna happen.
Apple (this year): no function key row. Not now, not ever. This time we’re serious.
 
easy backlighting keys are a must
i use 3rd party keyboards - all with func and dedicated backlight keys - so good
 
IMO those with the 12.9" model are much more prone to frustration with the lack of ESC and function keys than those with the 11" model (like me).

The 12.9" model is the size of a notebook, so people expect it to be a full notebook replacement.

My 11" model + Magic Keyboard for me is a tablet with keyboard, I never thought of it as a notebook replacement, I don't complain about lack of some keys on it because I know the space on the 11" model is very limited.
 
The keyboard is designed beautifully, but it clearly wasn’t tested by intended users. There’s no ESC key, no volume control, no brightness control... actually no controls whatsoever.

 
magic keyboard was a mistake
...said no one who owns one.
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The keyboard is designed beautifully, but it clearly wasn’t tested by intended users. There’s no ESC key, no volume control, no brightness control... actually no controls whatsoever.

“Esc” doesn’t have a universal meaning on ios like it does on Mac. CMD-. works well enough for apps that understand Escape, or you can remap to the caps lock key.
 
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Fair, but again, why would Apple put Touch ID on a device that has Face ID? redundant.
In my opinion, on iPad and iPhone, the ideal solution is having both authentication systems, letting you choose according to the situation. If you’re wearing a mask and you can’t unlock it, just recognizing your fingerprint touching the screen could work. Or if you want to unlock it without staring at the screen. But if your fingers are wet or dirty, then using Face ID seems a good idea. Or just to read the notifications. The combinations are endless... using Face ID to unlock and Touch ID to grant access to a higher security level, using both at the same time for purchases and subscriptions, etc.
 
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Its a question of taste. I know a lot of people, including me, which don't like and don't use Face ID.

Well that’s got nothing to do with putting it on a keyboard though has it. They can’t just incorporate it into a device which doesn’t have it in the first place.

And this keyboard doesn’t cater for the devices that have it.

So completely pointless discussion all in all.
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In my opinion, on iPad and iPhone, the ideal solution is having both authentication systems, letting you choose according to the situation. If you’re wearing a mask and you can’t unlock it, just recognizing your fingerprint touching the screen could work. Or if you want to unlock it without staring at the screen. But if your fingers are wet or dirty, then using Face ID seems a good idea. Or just to read the notifications. The combinations are endless... using Face ID to unlock and Touch ID to grant access to a higher security level, using both at the same time for purchases and subscriptions, etc.
Yes I agree. I love Face ID- it’s great on my iPad. I only have Touch ID on my phone, and I believe I would prefer that on a phone.

Having both though, to be used either individually or in conjunction with one another, would definitely be brilliant.
 
An easy way for Apple to solve this issue is:

- A key shortcut would easily open the Control Center

- Once the Control Center is opened, the number keys alone (with no need of cmd, option or control) would act like up and down controls for the sliders on the Control Center. On top and bottom of each slider would be showed the two corresponding numbers that control that particular slider up and down. Aternatively, the left and right arrow keys could be used to navigate through the sliders, and the up and down arrow keys could control the slider currently selected.
 
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Fair, but again, why would Apple put Touch ID on a device that has Face ID? redundant.

I think its not redundand as Apple plans to integrate the Touch ID scanning integrated directly into the display.
 
So if everyone liked it, I should like it? I mean, if people called me an "Apple Sheep" before...what do you call that? :rolleyes:

It's okay to dislike things. You should try and be objective once in a while and not just follow the crowd.
I’m extremely objective, I don’t like the iPod Touch, the Siri remote, the iPad budget, and I could go on and go on. The difference is, I said I don’t like them. I didn’t say they were mistakes.
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MK is pathetically half-baked. Needs function row keys containing at minimum volume controls and display/keyboard brightness controls. It also just looks awkward and is heavy and ridiculously expensive. Just buy a MacBook FFS.

While we’re at it, let’s go back to physical MBP function keys as well instead of the DOA touch bar.

The best new product from Apple in the past ten years has been the AirPods hands down.
I agree that the AirPods are fantastic, but I’ve got to disagree about the magic keyboard. The design is beautiful, with the small exception being the fact that Apple continues to use that terrible fabric material. But besides that, it’s beautiful, and it’s heavy that way it doesn’t topple over when you put your iPad on top of it. A MacBook screen is a lot thinner and lighter than an iPad, and you don’t want your iPad toppling backwards. It’s extremely thought out.
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If Apple designs a product with a very proud price, why it is incomplete and the users need to use some shortcuts to make it work?
I forgot to mention the missing touch ID key....
Clearly you don’t know how touch ID works. The touch ID sensor has to have a direct connection to the processor. This type of keyboard can’t just have touch ID on it, because there’s no direct connection. and external touch ID sensor would be way less secure than one that’s directly connected to the processor, because the data would have to be delivered from the keyboard to the secure enclave. The only way to get this to work would be to add a Secure enclave to the internals of the keyboard, and even then it might not be as secure, because the secure enclave that’s in the keyboard would have to deliver data to the iPad saying that it can be securely unlocked. Also, with the small exception of the times that you are wearing a mask, Face ID works perfectly fine. There’s no problems with it. So just use it
 
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Apple (2010): Styluses are terrible. Keyboards are for dummies. iPad is different.
Apple (last year): who needs a trackpad or mouse with our beautiful iPad touch interface? Not gonna happen.
Apple (this year): no function key row. Not now, not ever. This time we’re serious.
Actually, Steve Jobs made his dislike for stylus known in 2007, and he was talking about phones, not tablets. and to this day, the Apple Pencil still doesn’t work on an iPhone. So their views on that haven’t really changed.
The original iPad in 2010 did, in fact, have a keyboard accessory.
And when Apple talked about putting a cursor on the iPad, they were talking about a Mac cursor. If you’ve ever used the new magic keyboard, or any type of external trackpad with the iPad, it’s not a regular cursor. It’s still a predominantly touch base interface.
So maybe check your facts before you try to be snarky
 
Better battery life for a portable machine? I’d say that a pretty major plus.
Not if my MB + MBP already lasts so long. I never need to bring along a charger to the coffee shop or on the go, so I'm not demanding for a device that needs more battery.


Also, I reckon you would scratch the MacBook screen with the pencil. So there’s that.

You're using a pencil with the magic keyboard? Good luck since your arm is about to fall off.

Good luck with editing 4K video or panning massive RAWs without glitching on that MacBook.

You have no idea what tf you're talking about:

Don’t forget promotion.

I don't need promotion to do work.

I would say that an iPad Pro betters that macbook you speak of in every respect.

Nope. And you're overgeneralizing the point. I'm talking specifically about the work that the magic keyboard is responsible for. I'm not talking about the general device of the iPad Pro.
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For you or in general? I love it.
for the iPad Pro
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Based on what? Your own mind?

Most love theirs me included. Incredible typing experience and built in trackpad, great gestures and great speed when using it.

Based on usage.
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I’m extremely objective, I don’t like the iPod Touch, the Siri remote, the iPad budget, and I could go on and go on. The difference is, I said I don’t like them. I didn’t say they were mistakes.

Nothing wrong with saying something is a mistake.
 
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Not if my MB + MBP already lasts so long. I never need to bring along a charger to the coffee shop or on the go, so I'm not demanding for a device that needs more battery.




You're using a pencil with the magic keyboard? Good luck since your arm is about to fall off.



You have no idea what tf you're talking about:



I don't need promotion to do work.



Nope. And you're overgeneralizing the point. I'm talking specifically about the work that the magic keyboard is responsible for. I'm not talking about the general device of the iPad Pro.
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for the iPad Pro
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Based on usage.
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Nothing wrong with saying something is a mistake.
Well done. It doesn’t work for you. Most likely because you are unable to see the potential, or unwilling to change a few workflows to see the advantage. That’s fine. Go with it.

Me and many many others are not as limited in thinking, and can fully utilise the power it offers. That’s fine also. No need to answer every point everyone makes with your narrow minded views on what others can or can’t do. Just move along.

Me, I’m happy with what I can do, but more happy with the massive massive potential offered by such a device.

By the way- quoting a random you tube video is not at all the same as actually using a device to try to edit multiple 4K streams in real time. Try that side by side with the MacBook 12” v and iPad Pro 12.9, and get back to me. You won’t - of course- but if you did, you would see what I meant.
 
Well done. It doesn’t work for you. Most likely because you are unable to see the potential, or unwilling to change a few workflows to see the advantage. That’s fine. Go with it.

Me and many many others are not as limited in thinking, and can fully utilise the power it offers. That’s fine also. No need to answer every point everyone makes with your narrow minded views on what others can or can’t do. Just move along.

Me, I’m happy with what I can do, but more happy with the massive massive potential offered by such a device.

I looked at the potential and there's no scenario where a magic keyboard can practically perform better than a MacBook 12" except for battery life. Tell me where the magic keyboard can *practically* excel the MacBook for work purposes, or in your own words, "see the advantage"?

Try that side by side with the MacBook 12” v and iPad Pro 12.9, and get back to me. You won’t - of course- but if you did, you would see what I meant.

I literally did this comparison and returned my magic keyboard after. What are you talking about?
 
Does the expression "putting lipstick on a pig" refer to adding a touchscreen to a laptop or putting a keyboard on an iPad to make it resemble a laptop? Why is it considered so terrible to have MacOS support a touchscreen, yet the same people jump to defend putting a keyboard on an iPad? Why do they make false arguments like:
1. It doesn't work well on Windows (First, that is debatable. Second, it implies Apple should not have bothered to create many of today's products).
2. Forced to use a touchscreen on a Mac (It is obviously meant to be optional).
3. Straining to reach a touchscreen (Many touchscreen PC's are highly adjustable).

For people who see office lobbies, libraries, museums and other locations with large interactive touchscreen displays connected to PCs and wondering why they aren't running on Macs, that is not going to happen unless MacOS supports external multitouch monitors. Relying on cobbled together, underfunded open source hacks is not enough. Real support has to come from Apple. Do people honestly expect Apple to make a 40 inch iPad?
 
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I looked at the potential and there's no scenario where a magic keyboard can practically perform better than a MacBook 12" except for battery life. Tell me where the magic keyboard can *practically* excel the MacBook for work purposes, or in your own words, "see the advantage"?



I literally did this comparison and returned my magic keyboard after. What are you talking about?
Here’s an example of a work flow that you cannot do on a MacBook: I detached my iPad from my Magic Keyboard, used Genius Scan to scan several documents, import them into my Files app, sign them with my Apple Pencil, reattach to my Magic Keyboard, then uploaded them to a website where thanks to the scrolling and cursor/trackpad support, was all completely seamless. With the Magic Keyboard and cursor/trackpad support it makes navigating websites so much nicer and on par with a MacBook. You literally get the best of both worlds for almost 99% of all tasks normally done on a laptop, and the iPad Pro/Magic Keyboard combo offers a work flow that you simply cannot do on a laptop. Period. Use it like a tablet or laptop, your choice. This is why the iPad Pro and Magic Keyboard have been such a popular choice.
 
I looked at the potential and there's no scenario where a magic keyboard can practically perform better than a MacBook 12" except for battery life. Tell me where the magic keyboard can *practically* excel the MacBook for work purposes, or in your own words, "see the advantage"?



I literally did this comparison and returned my magic keyboard after. What are you talking about?
It’s does exactly the same thing as a MacBook can with a mouse and keyboard attached, provided the software you use is compatible. Plus many more features which no Mac has.

You edited 4K video on a 12” MacBook by side with an iPad Pro, and you found the MacBook better? I’m sorry, but I don’t believe you 🤣🤣. Often stuff that can make my 32gb 6core i7 2018 Mac Mini stutter, doesn’t stutter on my iPad.
You’re talking rubbish here, and I’m calling you out.
 
It’s does exactly the same thing as a MacBook can with a mouse and keyboard attached, provided the software you use is compatible. Plus many more features which no Mac has.

- Try listening to your own music or podcast while editing video (which I do all the time on my Mac). You can't. Luma fusion stops your music to play audio from the video clip you're editing.

- Try exporting from Luma Fusion in the background while you switch to Slack/Safari. You can't. Luma fusion pops up with an error. You must keep Luma Fusion running somewhere in the foreground to export.

- Same with importing from iCloud that needs to download video clips. After a while, Luma Fusion cannot download videos while in background. Downloading just stalls until you resume the app.

iPad Pro does not do the "exactly the same thing" as the MacBook.

You edited 4K video on a 12” MacBook by side with an iPad Pro, and you found the MacBook better? I’m sorry, but I don’t believe you 🤣🤣. Often stuff that can make my 32gb 6core i7 2018 Mac Mini stutter, doesn’t stutter on my iPad.
You’re talking rubbish here, and I’m calling you out.

Sure did. Imported a ProRes 4k/60 clip I recorded straight from my Blackmagic Pocket Cinema Camera, added a color modifier, and played smoothly with no hiccups. 0 stutters. Proof (along with the Youtuber I linked earlier): https://streamable.com/audh4b

You need to do some research before you call someone out since you were just proven wrong. You have no idea what tf you're talking about.
 
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Here’s an example of a work flow that you cannot do on a MacBook: I detached my iPad from my Magic Keyboard, used Genius Scan to scan several documents, import them into my Files app, sign them with my Apple Pencil, reattach to my Magic Keyboard, then uploaded them to a website where thanks to the scrolling and cursor/trackpad support, was all completely seamless. With the Magic Keyboard and cursor/trackpad support it makes navigating websites so much nicer and on par with a MacBook. You literally get the best of both worlds for almost 99% of all tasks normally done on a laptop, and the iPad Pro/Magic Keyboard combo offers a work flow that you simply cannot do on a laptop. Period. Use it like a tablet or laptop, your choice. This is why the iPad Pro and Magic Keyboard have been such a popular choice.

You missed my point. Not talking about things outside of the magic keyboard (which BTW, your scenario can be done without a magic keyboard seamlessly, as well as done with a MacBook + iPhone faster without the need of a Pencil, but that's off topic). When you take a task that a magic keyboard is meant to accomplish (maybe you're editing some editorial, or doing some Powerpoint slides, or doing some spreadsheets), a MacBook can do it usually better. And if this task is your daily task, a MacBook is a far better choice. If it's not your daily task and you only do it *sometimes*, then it's probably not worth the price tag.

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...said no one who owns one.

I said it outloud when I did own one. And then I returned it.
 
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You missed my point. Not talking about things outside of the magic keyboard (which BTW, your scenario can be done without a magic keyboard seamlessly, as well as done with a MacBook + iPhone faster without the need of a Pencil, but that's off topic). When you take a task that a magic keyboard is meant to accomplish (maybe you're editing some editorial, or doing some Powerpoint slides, or doing some spreadsheets), a MacBook can do it usually better. And if this task is your daily task, a MacBook is a far better choice. If it's not your daily task and you only do it *sometimes*, then it's probably not worth the price tag.

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I said it outloud when I did own one. And then I returned it.
Hey, I get it. You don’t see the value of the iPad Pro and Magic Keyboard, and that’s ok. In my example work flow, even you pointed out it would require a MacBook plus iPhone so even you admit it is not possible to do that work flow with just a MacBook, which again is my point. The iPad Pro and Magic Keyboard is offering a level of flexibility that is very appealing for me and many others. Not to mention, I can use my iPad Pro/Magic Keyboard as my laptop as well as use my iPad to take notes on, then attach right back to my Magic Keyboard and resume laptop functionality. It’s a win win combination that has tons of value for lots of us.
 
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In my example work flow, even you pointed out it would require a MacBook plus iPhone so even you admit it is not possible to do that work flow with just a MacBook, which again is my point.

My point was "magic keyboard was a mistake". Your counter point is essentially: "the iPad Pro has a camera".
Do you not see how irrelevant your point is in response to mine?

The iPad Pro and Magic Keyboard is offering a level of flexibility that is very appealing for me and many others. Not to mention, I can use my iPad Pro/Magic Keyboard as my laptop as well as use my iPad to take notes on, then attach right back to my Magic Keyboard and resume laptop functionality. It’s a win win combination that has tons of value for lots of us.

I can already take notes on my iPad Pro Smart Keyboard cover which works great. You simply paid $120 extra to avoid touching your screen to point at stuff, which if it makes up <=50% of the overall iPad usage, doesn't justify the need. If it makes up >50% of your usage, you're better off with a MacBook since it has a far better pointing experience.

If the Magic Keyboard isn't better than a MacBook at some key tasks for which it is meant for, it has no reason to be.
 
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Sure did. Imported a ProRes 4k/60 clip I recorded straight from my Blackmagic Pocket Cinema Camera, added a color modifier, and played smoothly with no hiccups. 0 stutters. Proof (along with the Youtuber I linked earlier): https://streamable.com/audh4b

You need to do some research before you call someone out since you were just proven wrong. You have no idea what tf you're talking about.

That is not multiple streams, and that is not editing with 4K footage to any extent at all. That’s not proof that the 12” MacBook can compete with the iPad Pro at all. Non of what you’re saying is.
 
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