Apple's decision regarding Mac Mini BTO option pricing is immoral and unethical

[QCassidy352]

However, in this case, if it becomes very obvious that Apple was blatantly taking advantage of their most trusting and loyal customers, that's a very different story.

Taking advantage of their customers?? You're just not seeing this rationally. They didn't force anyone to buy minis at the original price. People very gladly did that on their own. Apparently they didn't feel cheated or you know what they could have done? Yep, you got it - not bought a mini at those prices.

Anyone who bought a mini early did so because they decided that what they were getting was worth the price. Apple didn't do anything sneaky or underhanded. Those who got minis early got exactly what they expected to get for the price that they expected to pay.

Apple made no guarantees, explicitly, implicitly, or otherwise, about prices changing or not. Anyone who chooses to assume when the price is going to change or stay constant does so at their own risk. I have a new style 20" cinema display bought at the old price. Am I crying now that they lowered it by $300? No, because I knew what I was getting and I decided at the time that it was worth the price I had to pay. Subsequent changes in price have no bearing whatsoever on my decision at the time it was made.

 

[Bear]

Apple has just dropped the prices significantly for BTO options on the new Mac Mini (US only apparently):
https://www.macrumors.com/pages/2005/01/20050125124129.shtml

The value of these options has not significantly changed in the past two weeks. This appears to be an attempt by Apple to gouge the Mac fanatics they knew would buy right away and buy with a lot of extras added. After all the early adopters (the ones most likely to max them out) got their computers, they dropped the insane prices on the BTO options before too many people realized how insane they actually were.

...

Actually memory prices have been dropping over the past couple of weeks. Who knows what else Apple had cost reductions on.

If you don't like, go find another sandbox to play in and leave us alone.

 

[johnnowak]

It's time that people learned that Apple is a BUSINESS, which means they are interested in MAKING MONEY. They will raise and lower prices in ways that help them make money just like any other business.

Right. And I am a consumer. I will bitch when I think a corporation does something that appears wrong to me.

If people knew they could get more for $100 less two weeks later, do you think they would've bought it? No way. It very likely WAS an intentional deceptive tactic.

 

[cmvsm]

Yes...and all of you G5 dual model purchasers need to boycott Apple for lowering the prices on those after you spent your hard earned dollars buying them when they just came out at inflated pricing!!! Ooohhh Ahhhhh....yes...and furthermore....WHA WAA WHA WAA....

Give me a break. Surely there's other things to complain about with a little bit of substance.

 

[johnnowak]

Actually memory prices have been dropping over the past couple of weeks. Who knows what else Apple had cost reductions on.

If you don't like, go find another sandbox to play in and leave us alone.

Same for you if you don't like me voicing my opinion here. I'm not making you read it.

 

[jsw]

Right. And I am a consumer. I will bitch when I think a corporation does something that appears wrong to me.

If people knew they could get more for $100 less two weeks later, do you think they would've bought it? No way. It very likely WAS an intentional deceptive tactic.

They can get their money back. Over the phone. And they paid what they thought was a reasonable price then.

Ever buy a PC? This happens all the time. And it is good for consumers.

Same or better product + lower price = consumer benefit.

Always.

Had they increased the price, would you have complained? What is the acceptable grace period before which prices can be reduced?

 

[johnnowak]

Yes...and all of you G5 dual model purchasers need to boycott Apple for lowering the prices on those after you spent your hard earned dollars buying them when they just came out at inflated pricing!!! Ooohhh Ahhhhh....yes...and furthermore....WHA WAA WHA WAA....

Apple didn't drop the prices on the G5s immediately after the first shipment was received. That's different. Prices fall naturally over time. Price do not naturally fall after the first shipment. Not on multiple items all at once in such a drastic way. RAM has not gone down in value 25% in the past week.

 

[Sun Baked]

Right. And I am a consumer. I will bitch when I think a corporation does something that appears wrong to me.

If people knew they could get more for $100 less two weeks later, do you think they would've bought it? No way. It very likely WAS an intentional deceptive tactic.

If you bought a BTO and you think it was, file a complaint with the FTC.

www.ftc.gov

Of course the agent investigating that one will probably be laughing as hard as the school board who is dealing with the student who sued over too much homework.

 

[johnnowak]

They can get their money back. Over the phone. And they paid what they thought was a reasonable price then.

Have you confirmed this? Even for those who placed the very first orders?

Same or better product + lower price = consumer benefit.

MY POINT is that the initial product should've been this price if they intended on doing it a week later anyway. Intentionally gouging unsuspecting people is NOT good for the consumer. Always. The initial RAM prices were crazy, even beyond their usual craziness.

 

[jsw]

Apple didn't drop the prices on the G5s immediately after the first shipment was received. That's different. Prices fall naturally over time. Price do not naturally fall after the first shipment. Not on multiple items all at once in such a drastic way. RAM has not gone down in value 25% in the past week.

It must kill you if a coupon/rebate ever comes out on something you bought four days ago. How horrible that companies lower prices! Horrible! Dear God, the humanity! If only every single consumer could get back the extra money they paid on a mini! No... wait... they can.

 

[jsw]

Have you confirmed this? Even for those who placed the very first orders?

Apple's policy is you qualify if a reduction was announced within 10 days of your ship date. Every mini out there shipped less than ten days ago. Therefore, all mini owners who used the now-cheaper/better upgrades qualify. Every single one of them.

 

[johnnowak]

It must kill you if a coupon/rebate ever comes out on something you bought four days ago. How horrible that companies lower prices! Horrible! Dear God, the humanity! If only every single consumer could get back the extra money they paid on a mini! No... wait... they can.

THINK.

I am OBVIOUSLY not complaining about that. Someone is ALWAYS going to buy a product the day before a price drops. I am not saying what Apple did was wrong because they dropped the price after someone just bought it.

I am saying what Apple did was wrong because they artificially inflated the price for a very short period of time with the intention of screwing early adopters, getting a few extra bucks, and perhaps getting rid of some old Superdrives.

 

[Drgnhntr]

Didn't the mac mini just start shipping 3 days ago? If so, doesn't every single person that ordered one have another 11 days to contact apple and get a refund? Is anyone actually hurt by this price decrease? Have mac users run out of things to complain about that we are now complaining about price decreases?

 

[johnnowak]

Apple's policy is you qualify if a reduction was announced within 10 days of your ship date. Every mini out there shipped less than ten days ago. Therefore, all mini owners who used the now-cheaper/better upgrades qualify. Every single one of them.

Is this process automatic? If it is, I'll shut up right now and apologize for wasting your time.

However, if it isn't, I'd venture a guess that most people won't learn abotu this for at least another few days, if ever, in which case they will no longer be able to get the difference refunded.

 

[QCassidy352]

Right. And I am a consumer. I will bitch when I think a corporation does something that appears wrong to me.

If people knew they could get more for $100 less two weeks later, do you think they would've bought it? No way. It very likely WAS an intentional deceptive tactic.

There was no deception here dude; that's what you're missing. If Apple had somehow promised that the old prices would be constant then and only then would you have a point. But any assumption to that effect was not based on anything apple said, but on your own preconceived notions about how prices usually change or don't change.

I'm not overly religious, but this reminds me of the parable Jesus told about the workers in the vineyard. If you're not familiar, it basically goes like this:

Rich guy needs workers for the day in his vineyard. Goes down to town square and hires people to work for a set amount for the day (say 3 silvers). Takes them to his vineyard, realizes he actually needs more workers. Goes back to town. This happens a couple more times.

At the end of the day, the rich guy pays the workers, and he gives each person 3 silvers. Well, the guys who went to work early starting bit*hing about how it's not fair, they did more work and should not be getting the same amount as the later workers. The rich guy turns to them and says, "We had a deal - you work for the day for 3 silvers. Well, you worked for the day and I paid you three silvers. You got exactly what I said I would give you for exactly the amount of work that you gave me. If I choose to be a little generous with these other workers, how does that hurt you?"

Bottom line is that early buyers got what they expected to get. No one promised them anything whatsoever about what future buyers would get (i.e. future price drops or upgrades). Your apple computer does NOT come with a sticker that says "we promise not to upgrade the product line or drop prices for 4 months after you buy this" despite what some people on this board seem to think.

 

[TheMac19]

Right. If people knew they could get more for $100 less two weeks later, do you think they would've bought it? No way. It very likely WAS an intentional deceptive tactic.

Let's think about this: All together now: there's only a $100+ price difference if you bought a 1gig RAM stick BTO with the mini, right? There are other differences, but we're not at or over $100 without the gig of RAM. NOBODY pays $450 for RAM on a computer that costs $499 total, without some real good reason. Switchers and newbies who were lured by the nice cheap mini weren't conned into buying a gigantic stick of RAM anymore than they were conned into getting a $3000 monitor as an accessory. If you bought a mini, and insisted that it must have a gig of ram in it, then you very likely know how much a gig of RAM is worth... (As we've all said, if you thought it was worth the cash then, great, nobody forced you into it...)

Furthermore, if you must play vigilante for all those "suckers" who were conned out of their hard earned cash by an "intentional deceptive tactic" -- know that the number of people you're fighting for is very small. If the 1gig RAM chips had been flying off the shelves at that price, Apple wouldn't have lowered the price. I'm guessing very VERY few new minis went out with a gig of ram in them. Sure, some did, but for many of those people, money likely wasn't their first concern...

 

[jsw]

THINK.

I am OBVIOUSLY not complaining about that. Someone is ALWAYS going to buy a product the day before a price drops. I am not saying what Apple did was wrong because they dropped the price after someone just bought it.

I am saying what Apple did was wrong because they artificially inflated the price for a very short period of time with the intention of screwing early adopters, getting a few extra bucks, and perhaps getting rid of some old Superdrives.

Had this happened 11 days after first shipment, maybe I'd agree. It didn't.

 

[solvs]

If people knew they could get more for $100 less two weeks later, do you think they would've bought it? No way. It very likely WAS an intentional deceptive tactic.

Intentional! Now I know you're joking. Why would Apple intentionally do this? Just to gouge a few people out of a few hundred dollars? You can't be serious.

 

[takao]

hmm i ordered mine on the 13th,transfered money and got the 'order confirmed' email on the 20th... so should i call as soon as they change specs/prices on the austrian/german sites (if they do) ? from which day does this 10 days policy count ?
my mini is shipping on 17/2 or before

if if they update prcies here to what happens with the money i transfered 'too much' to apple ?

sorry for posting this in here but i'm kinda confused now...

i hope this clears up tommorow...

 

[mrclark411]

Mac mini missing from Target.com

Looks like Target is either changing their mind about the Mac mini or doing something big with it.

http://enterprisemac.typepad.com

 

[jxyama]

guys,

instead of just bashing on the guy, think for a sec. what he is saying is fairly reasonable. i wouldn't say "immoral and unethical" as there are more important things that are "immoral and unethical" than apple price drops, but this is highly unusual and a very extreme case of a price drop, apple or otherwise.

yes, people who bought it BTO the first few weeks bought it under their own terms, etc., etc. but the thing is, it's highly unusual for a brand new product to significantly lower its price so quickly after its introduction - in fact, the price drop occured just a few days after when the initial pre-orders are expected to be delivered. a "complaint" that if they meant to lower the price this soon after the introduction, it would have been the "correct" thing for apple to release at the lower price to begin with.

i agree with the sentiment that apple probably should offer an explanation or a blanket rebate (or at worst, store credit) to the initial BTO purchasers for the sake of good PR. yes, apple is here to make money, but this is an extremely bad PR move if they don't do anything about it. NO, it probably wasn't intentional. but the timing is so bad that if it's not intentional, an explanation wouldn't hurt.

 

[johnnowak]

Intentional! Now I know you're joking. Why would Apple intentionally do this? Just to gouge a few people out of a few hundred dollars? You can't be serious.

So what's the real reason then? I'm waiting for an official, reasonable response. Excuse me for not assuming that a corporation dropped their prices because they had my best interests at heart.

I agree it doesn't make much sense.

 

[johnnowak]

guys,

instead of just bashing on the guy, think for a sec. what he is saying is fairly reasonable. i wouldn't say "immoral and unethical" as there are more important things that are "immoral and unethical" than apple price drops, but this is highly unusual and a very extreme case of a price drop, apple or otherwise.

Thanks man. In regards to the extreme language, I'm just excitable today. I realize its not an international crisis.

yes, people who bought it BTO the first few weeks bought it under their own terms, etc., etc. but the thing is, it's highly unusual for a brand new product to significantly lower its price so quickly after its introduction - in fact, the price drop occured just a few days after when the initial pre-orders are expected to be delivered. a "complaint" that if they meant to lower the price this soon after the introduction, it would have been the "correct" thing for apple to release at the lower price to begin with.

Right. If this happened for a reason, fine. However, if this was the plan all along just to get some extra money, than that should be looked at in a very negative manner.

Nice to see that someone isn't blinded with loyalty here.

 

[Sun Baked]

He's got my vote for MR Member mostly likely to go off his rocker and explode at an Apple Store when the salesperson let's a Pro Plan member cut in front of him at the cash register.

 

[zelmo]

Damn them to hell.
Apple drops the BTO prices on a product that was announced two weeks ago. Umm, have any of the BTO orders even shipped yet? If you have an order waiting to ship, won't they automatically adjust your invoice to reflect current pricing? Even if they shipped your order already, don't you have 10 days from ship date to return it? Most likely, this is a non event, make that a good event, even for the earliest of adopters.
It's also most likely a reaction to the realization that people were complaining about the cost to upgrade the mini, or because people just weren't placing enough BTO orders due to the cost of the options.

Seems like Apple initially priced themselves too high (typical), recognized it quickly (curious), and made a smart adjustment that will not negatively impact buyers (astoundingly good).

Now, if there are people who end up not getting a refund or adjustment, then people can be pissed. Don't be going off half-cocked until we know thw whole story.