Apple's Director of Machine Learning Resigns Due to Return to Office Work

[pshufd]

Sorry. I believe it is true. From The NY Times (not a conservative paper by any measure):

‘Not Good for Learning’ (Published 2022)

New research is showing the high costs of long school closures in some communities.

www.nytimes.com

Policy makers and health officials will sometimes make mistakes. Those things happen. We need to learn from those mistakes rather than pretend that they did not happen or that these officials are infallible.

Throwing together school at home with some homes not having internet, computers, tablets or parents at home isn't a good idea. It can work if well planned and thought out but there wasn't time or motivation for this. I suspect that some students, perhaps the vast majority, don't work well in school from home environments.

 

[dysamoria]

I will admit envying those with the distinct privilege of being employed by a world-class company like Apple, and that includes having the opportunity to work in an environment like the world-famous Cupertino “spaceship.”

Well that's a start. Good job on admitting that.

I feel little more than pity, however, for those who can’t or don’t wish to professionally separate their work and home worlds and who are apparently so inept that they can’t derive anything but frustration and annoyance from in-person interaction and collaboration.

Who are you talking about? None of that was in this article. Also, not everyone is the same. Some people are energized by social interaction, and some are drained by it, and there's a huge variety in-between.

A LOT of hard-core programmer and engineer types like to have their own space and not be bothered by workplace BS. WFH is ideal for them. Apple and others would be shooting themselves in their collective feet to refuse to accommodate a WFH preference for programmers, especially in specialist areas of expertise that can't be filled with "dime a dozen" script-authors, over the issue of "we need to have people inside this ridiculous building we spent an insane amount of money to build (and we're also super paranoid and therefore create creepy workplace culture and workgroup silos that cannot communicate with each other)".

 

[I7guy]

The discussion is, that employers have overreached and are using position and influence to undermine employee rights. This isn't about should employees be able to work from home, but how do we ensure that employers have no say.

No that is not the discussion.

If you are claiming employers have a right to dictate policy then we need to fix that misunderstanding.

Yes, within the framework of applicable laws, employers have the right to define an employees work requirements and work experience. There is no misunderstanding that is the objective truth.

 

[pshufd]

I can’t have any insight into answering that question. Everybody is replaceable, some more easily than others. But it does seem as if Silicon Valley has a round Robin of employees leaving one company to go to another.

Jeff Wilcox led Apple Silicon and Alder Lake development which is why AMD is on the defensive right now. It would have been nice to have him for M3, M4, M5, etc.

 

[dysamoria]

Humans collaborate most effectively and build and maintain productive, mutually beneficial relationships when mixing in groups face-to-face. That’s just how we evolved to become the dominant species. Nothing is going to change that except maybe a few hundred thousand years of Zoom, so I can see why a company like Apple is keen to not destroy that aspect of their working culture.

One study suggests creativity/brainstorming might be more varied with in-person interaction, but I have questions about that study, and brainstorming is not the model of all workplace tasks. Most can be WFH. Article after article publishes showing that productivity is better when workers can CHOOSE to work from home, can avoid stressful commutes, undesirable office politics & socializing, set their own hours, etc...

 

[4jasontv]

No that is not the discussion.

Yes, within the framework of applicable laws, employers have the right to define an employees work requirements and work experience. There is no misunderstanding that is the objective truth.

It's the problem, and people cling to it like it's a good thing. We can see here that even in the face of evidence, experience, and logical thinking people are resistant to accepting it. If we can't have rational people in positions of power then they need to either be removed or restricted.

Resisting WFH will harm leadership far more than embracing it.

 

[dysamoria]

I’m a die hard free market capitalist. Apple has the right to pursue its best financial interests and the person that quit has the right to pursue theirs. Just the same way I have the right to pursue mine and you have the right to pursue yours. I don’t care what political associations you affiliate yourself with, if you think that your economic cohort is somehow entitled to a more noble standing than some other and that they owe you something then you believe in entitlements and socialism. No one owes me and I don’t owe anyone (other than my parents). I don’t begrudge someone else being more financially successful than me or pretend that my life is any more virtuous than theirs. That is the province of envious people who want to blame others for the adverse conditions in their life instead of recognizing that the most important factor in determining where they are today is their own past decisions.

You're entitled to have self-respect for your own work and your own choices, but there are way more variables involved for success vs adverse conditions than someone's "past decisions".

Survivorship bias - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[sorgo †]

@dysamoria seethe and cope

 

[dysamoria]

Well stated and fair enough. Hopefully Mr. Goodfellow can too eventually share in that recognition that as a perfectly capable adult he isn’t owed special treatment.

Where are you getting that this guy expected that he was "owed special treatment"? He negotiated with an employer to remain in the model of work-from-home that has recently been proven to be quite effective (and even BETTER in some circumstances). The employer declined his request, and he cited that as one reason he left. That's his right as a free agent, and luckily for him, he can afford to actually exercise his free agency.

 

[dysamoria]

We bought a Keurig machine at the start of the pandemic and have been enjoying coffee made by a robot for a couple of years.

If it's one of those "millions of little plastic cups" machines, that "robot" is wasting resources...

 

[dysamoria]

God willing. I just hope you work-from-home fetishists are happy when Apple issues another dismal, bland release with iOS 16.

Nobody here has taken work-from-home to an extreme worthy of calling them fetishists. You're trolling.

 

[Scotticus]

Because of what? Asking people to come in to work? I doubt that. Covid aside it’s a ridiculous thing to say. In light of covid it’s less ridiculous but certainly an issue which need to be resolved one way or another. Sometimes going in to work is more beneficial than just working.

What? They are coming to work, and have been for the entirety of the pandemic.

 

[4jasontv]

If it's one of those "millions of little plastic cups" machines, that "robot" is wasting resources...

San Fransisco Bay makes k cups out of potatoes. They require commercial composting, but they are actually cheaper to manufacture than plastic cups. They have a home compostable outer packaging too, but due to its design, it can't support more than 2 lbs.

 

[I7guy]

It's the problem, and people cling to it like it's a good thing. We can see here that even in the face of evidence, experience, and logical thinking people are resistant to accepting it. If we can't have rational people in positions of power then they need to either be removed or restricted.

Strawman. General statement that doesn’t really mean anything.

Resisting WFH will harm leadership far more than embracing it.

This has a grain of truth. This over time will be measurable(or if not measurable will have shown to be hyperbole) and can be a case study in the annals of history.

 

[dysamoria]

I’m neither happy nor sad with iOS releases. They’re not important to my mental well-being.

Software quality definitely impacts my mental well-being, because software is so bad as to result in hardware that is non-deterministic in behavior, and we end-users have ZERO remedy (because everything is mostly equally broken, there's no competitor to choose for almost any tool or product). Swearing at it doesn't help; throwing it across the room is equally unhelpful (and potentially expensive). The device will not learn to behave better (that would be ACTUAL AI, which we don't have even a hint of in any product that the term "AI" is thrown on).

I think the mental health of many people in society would be a lot better if we weren't constantly fighting with garbage software making our expensive hardware act like it's overtly HOSTILE to us, and if corporations were held accountable for products being perpetually half-broken.

 

[Naraxus]

... you're still doing it. Why are you acting like this employee's choices are personally offensive to YOU?

Because I want Apple to make the best products it can and when loafers like this entitled freeloader want to vacation at home Apple can't do that.

Clear now?

 

[Mainsail]

Kids weren't as vulnerable from covid, but they can stiil carry and pass it on to family members at home who are more vulnerable. It was the right decision.

Per The NY Times article:
“In places where schools reopened that summer and fall, the spread of Covid was not noticeably worse than in places where schools remained closed. Schools also reopened in parts of Europe without seeming to spark outbreaks.”

There are a variety of reasons for this outcome. One often cited is that just because schools are closed that does not prevent children from congregating and playing together, so there was no noticeable difference in spread. When you look at the damage done to education and social development, particularly in underserved communities, I think it is very difficult to justify especially given what we know now about the harmful impacts. If there is another surge, I seriously doubt you will find very many officials and health experts advocating for school closures.

 

[Deasnutz]

Good for him! Not the right time to force people back in, Apple needs to write off that ridiculous campus until people are ready to go back. It will take more time, but who knows, a surge of young single developers might be what they want.

 

[Rafterman]

Because I want Apple to make the best products it can and when loafers like this entitled freeloader want to vacation at home Apple can't do that.

Clear now?

Did you see the guy's resume and list of impressive accomplishments, including books written about AI?

Obviously not.

 

[4jasontv]

Because I want Apple to make the best products it can and when loafers like this entitled freeloader want to vacation at home Apple can't do that.

Clear now?

No. It's not clear at all.

 

[Naraxus]

They also probably hate the notion of student debt being wiped out so that society can move forward...

Being off-topic I'll still reply and say I do hate having to pay for your poor choices. You made the decision to persue higher education. You made the decision to get a degree in a poor paying profession.

I and others should not have to pay YOUR bills.

 

[CoolSpot]

You're not a marriage counselor to work from home. You work at a company that builds products, some are life-changing products, products that require maximum focus, productivity, discipline, quality check, again and again. At-home productivity will never equal at-work productivity. At-home discipline will never equal at-school discipline.

Just like you'd never be comfortable with a home-schooled heart surgeon; or get on a rocket built by engineers who worked from home.

Anyway, that said, good riddance to him. There are no irreplaceable people.

Losing high level staff because you don't want to be flexible about in-office hours is dumb as hell.

If you are a director of machine learning at Apple, you don't need a boss or the office to be productive. You already have the innate drive for better and for more.

The only people that care about in-person vs remote are mid-level managers who have proven over the last two years that they don't really serve a purpose at most businesses and are panicking as a result. If your reports are managing themselves (as everyone did during lockdown), it looks pretty silly to have an overpriced do-nothing as manager.

The dumb thing is that upper management will never be able to see this because the only people that have contact with them are the mid-level managers. You don't get to tell upper management directly that working from home has been a godsend and that without pointless interruptions and a commute that you're doing better work than ever. You get your ******* manager in his ear telling him that things just aren't working out with everyone remote and that its missing all these unmeasurable unprovable intangibles like synergy or workplace culture that's only there when everyone is in the office.

We've already seen dumbass politicians offer the same ****. That somehow saving hours a day in commuting and being able to save money on gas and food counts for nothing and that the most important thing in the world is filling overpriced Manhattan offices and patronizing ****** food courts.

Apple used to be a place for thinking differently. Allowing yourself to fall for boomer ******** about the need to be in an office isn't thinking differently. Shame they had to lose this director over it.

 

[dysamoria]

Working from home certainly doesn’t seem as productive in my experience. Necessary during lockdown does not mean better overall.

My children were not getting as good an education from teachers during homeschooling and it wasn’t even close. So either teachers aren’t as productive working remotely or they were just slacking.

Personally I believe, without hard data, that working remotely damages teams and makes it easier to move on. When you work with Bob every day, and joke about sports teams and share pictures of kids, you are friends (sort of, at least). When Brand X offers you 5% to jump ship, you think, “Gee, I really like working with Bob, and my boss Cheryl is really cool, too. I am not sure what I would be getting into starting over.” Working remotely, you are no better than social media friends. Brand X offers you 5%, and you poke Bob and Cheryl in the forehead to unfriend them and take the extra cash.

No a team that fragile is in no way as productive as a tightly knit team that occasionally breaks bread together and helps each other out from time to time.

You have defined your own experiences, and a hypothetical one that may or may not exist. Your experiences are certainly valid, but are also anecdotal, and cannot be applied to all people and all jobs.

As for your hypothetical scenario itself... I hate sports and don't have kids. I have literally been put off by workplace banter about sports and kids because I have no interest, nothing to contribute, and it's wasting my time to hear two bros going on about sportsball while I am trying to work on something that I could focus on better if they weren't standing around the corner blabbing about non-work nonsense. I don't need to hear my coworkers bitching about their spouses (FFS, don't marry, if that's the level of respect you have for your spouse!).

I liked some coworkers, but the real cause of me leaving jobs was that the boss was a bullying sociopath, the HR department was committing abuses for their own convenience, and just generally the fact that the entity I was working for showed such hostility and DISloyalty to their workers that there's no way I could ever have felt the slightest bit of loyalty to them.

Just like how our healthcare should not be tied to employment, our social lives should not be dependent on our jobs.

 

[dysamoria]

I’m sure you’re right on both points. Yet they also didn’t give up their leases or sell the properties. The companies people point to as making remote work able to replace office work aren’t themselves willing to live on a diet of their own dog food.

There's no rule that says a company selling a product believes in the marketing they promote for said product, nor that they are any less trapped in status quo thinking than any other company.

 

[cupcakes2000]

What? They are coming to work, and have been for the entirety of the pandemic.

If you see my other posts regarding this, I’m agreeing with what you say. But there are certain situations where being in a room together can help.