Apple's notebooks are not loaded with peripherals

[hogfaninga]

I'm sure there's reasons people desperately need a Firewire 400 port, but fortunately there's a simple solution. Don't buy the new Macbook. Funny how easy that is, eh? I'm sure Apple will cope with the 1% of lost sales.

Can you provide a link where there is proof they only lost 1% of their existing base (people who won't it again because of this) due to them not adding FW? I find it funny you just threw out a percentage without any basis of truth or fact. Now if you said they didn't lose a large % and most likely gained that back from people buying an Apple because of the cool factor then that might be more believable.

 

[darienphoenix]

Ugh. I'm giving up Tosser, we're going around in circles.

Since you have professional reasons for needing Firewire, the Macbook is not intended for you. I don't much care whether you think Apple's distinction between 'Pro' and 'Consumer' is marketing, because every laptop manufacturer on the planet does the same thing. Firewire is not common on consumer laptops, period. Hell, it's not even called Firewire by anyone but Apple.

Since you have a problem with the new Macbook Pro's Firewire, can I suggest your problem is with the Pro, and NOT the lack of Firewire on the Macbook?

Finally, you ENTIRE argument is that Apple's design decision was a bad one because a minority of users, namely yourself and other people with specific needs for Firewire, have been screwed over.

Seriously, QQ. Firewire is going to die at some point ANYWAY. That's it, end of story. As soon as USB 3.0 comes out, Firewire will be going the way of PS/2.

Just buy a godamnn Dell and hackintosh it. Seriously.

 

[darienphoenix]

Can you provide a link where there is proof they only lost 1% of their existing base (people who won't it again because of this) due to them not adding FW? I find it funny you just threw out a percentage without any basis of truth or fact. Now if you said they didn't lose a large % and most likely gained that back from people buying an Apple because of the cool factor then that might be more believable.

Fair enough.

They didn't lose a large %, and most likely gained that back from people buying an Apple because of the cool factor.

PS: the 1% was not meant to be taken as a realistic estimate, which I thought was rather obvious, but hey.

 

[macbookairapple]

I have to agree with you there, as nice as Apple's designs are if they did not have OSX they would not have the following they do and they wouldnt be able to charge as much. If Apple was just another company like HP or Dell that just ran Windows people would bitch about the lack of features in their laptops.

Apple gets away with the lack of peripherals and putting the same hardware in their laptops that Dell and HP put in a $800 laptop because of their operating system which is seen by many people as superior and much more stable than Vista.

That and Apple hooks alot of people through the "halo" effect, why do you think they push iPods so much?

Well they aren't just another company soo too bad.

 

[macbookairapple]

My only recommendation... More USB Ports!!!!

A USB hub is not acceptable. I have trouble connecting my iPod to a USB hub, my TV tuner doesn't like the USB hub... a lot of things don't like the USB hub. My old Dell has 4 USB, and is sub $1000... Also has firewire, modem, ethernet, vga, headphone, microphone, card reader, s-video, etc... all of which still work after 3 years. They do not take away from the design at all in my opinion.

Just throwing that out there. It's doable, but I don't think we'll ever see it.

That's what I need, more USB sports, card readers, hdmi, and the rest of all that crap is useless to me.

 

[Beric]

Well they aren't just another company soo too bad.

They're just another company that happens to have a good OS. If Apple were to kill OS X and just put Windows on all their machines to compete with other manufacturers, they would go broke. Why? Their machines are so overpriced and underspecced it's unbelievable. Apple survives with its lackluster hardware because it has its OS. I could not believe when the new Macbook came out that reviewers were actually recommending it, despite the fact that it costs 50%+ more than a comparably-specced PC.

 

[macbookairapple]

They're just another company that happens to have a good OS. If Apple were to kill OS X and just put Windows on all their machines to compete with other manufacturers, they would go broke. Why? Their machines are so overpriced and underspecced it's unbelievable. Apple survives with its lackluster hardware because it has its OS. I could not believe when the new Macbook came out that reviewers were actually recommending it, despite the fact that it costs 50%+ more than a comparably-specced PC.

Right it's only Apple that sells expensive computers, what about the likes of Sony who are charging like 4000 dollars for some of their laptops?

What makes their laptops stand out for the rest that they can charge that much but Apple can't, at least Apple has OSX. Look a company can charge whatever they want for their products, if Apple wanted they could charge 10 000 for their laptops, if people were willing to pay that much, why the heck wouldn't they want to charge that much. Apple has found a sweet spot which their customers are willing to pay for their computers and they are getting their moeny. You don't think the likes of Dell would like to charge those prices? Which company doesn't want your money?

Specs and all that crap are becoming irrelevant for 90 percent of the consumers out there. Most people don't give a damn how many cores their computer is, they just want a computer to check a couple of youtube videos, use facebook, play a couple of games, read their email, watch movies, etc. Most of the computers being sold nowadays are more than capable of handling those tasks. Sure there may be a couple of people who need more people, but the majority of the people don't, at least for what they'll be using for their tasks. For all the flak the Mac Mini gets on these boards, for the average consumer looking to use youtube/facebook, iwork, whatever, its good for them. Maybe it's not good for what you need but it's good for them. Apple products are not 50 percent more expensive than PC counterparts, that is a lie. Sure some are cheaper but there is also the likes of Sony who charge the same prices like Apple, if they can why can't Apple and by the way no one is forcing you to buy anything from Apple. You can go spend 500 bucks for a Dell.

 

[Beric]

<snip>

I'm not going to disagree with you that consumers can do whatever they want. But what if you want a simple notebook computer that can access the internet and type Word documents? You get a $300 netbook PC. Your cheapest Mac is a $1000 MB.

Pick up a $2800 MBP and I can find you a $1400 PC that matches it with a 9800-series Nvidia graphics card.

All I'm saying is that before a customer buys a Mac, they should think about how much they're paying for OS X. If they feel it's worth it, good! But if they realize that OS X isn't worth $500 for them, then making an Apple purchase is a mistake. And yet so few people actually make this simple comparison. "Is OS X actually worth $X00 for me in this situation?"

 

[No1451]

A few things:

Those of us who don't need all those extra ports are not morons, and buying a laptop based on aesthetics doesn't make us stupid, it just means that we have a different set of priorities.

Personally, I don't care for memory card readers, I had one on my old laptop, and I didn't use it once. So it doesn't bother me much, though it might be nice to have the option.

Point of it all, don't bitch that one product doesn't have what you want, get the one that doesn't, or failing that buy a machine that does.

 

[Tosser]

A few things:

Those of us who don't need all those extra ports are not morons, and buying a laptop based on aesthetics doesn't make us stupid, it just means that we have a different set of priorities.

Personally, I don't care for memory card readers, I had one on my old laptop, and I didn't use it once. So it doesn't bother me much, though it might be nice to have the option.

Point of it all, don't bitch that one product doesn't have what you want, get the one that doesn't, or failing that buy a machine that does.

The moment you guys argue that it doesn't matter how many ports they nix, how it doesn't matter to us since it doesn't matter to you, then you certainly are morons.

The moment some idiotic member from the iPod Crowd comes waltzing in telling people who has been on the platform for decades that Apple's direction is all fine and dandy and it's a matter of simply choosing not to buy and go buy another product, yup, then you're not only morons, you're the archtype of morons. The epitome of moronic behaviour.

 

[darkmeton]

talking about ports, has anyone tried the mini-display port to DVI and then connect it to a DVI to HDMI adapter?? does it work?

PS. I love my new macbook. If only the adapters weren't such a rip off...

 

[darienphoenix]

I was mildly annoyed that Firewire was nixed, since my current external HDD's use Firewire, and I bought them specifically for their Firewire interface. However, they also use USB 2.0, so it's not like it was a huge problem.

The moment you guys argue that it doesn't matter how many ports they nix, how it doesn't matter to us since it doesn't matter to you, then you certainly are morons.

No one said it doesn't matter. They said it doesn't matter TO THEM. Which for the majority of people, would be true - hence why Apple ditched the port.

Do you really think they do these things without checking what the impact on marketshare might be? For Apple, the benefit (easier internal packaging, less cost) outweighed the downside (a minority of users acting like Apple just killed their dog).

Tosser, stop living up to your name. Being an Apple user for decades doesn't give you some sort of superiority when it comes to talking about Apple's design decisions. It IS a matter of simply refusing to buy the product, if it doesn't appeal to you. No one is forcing you at gunpoint to buy an AlBook, so if the lack of Firewire kills the purchase for you, don't buy it. Seriously, what the hell is the problem with this?

Hell, if you were an Apple user pre-OS X, you're not enlightened, you're a masochist.

 

[Tosser]

No one said it doesn't matter. They said it doesn't matter TO THEM. Which for the majority of people, would be true - hence why Apple ditched the port.

When such a statement is preceded by something like "It doesn't matter", "get used to it", their (lack of) needs are being used to generalise that NOONE should ever have any more needs than them. And, funnily enough, when those people, obviously from the iPod Crowd, post those "commentaries" it's always in an attempt to make believe FW is "old technology" or that we, as pros (!!!), are hanging on to ass-backwards inferior old technology.

Do you really think they do these things without checking what the impact on marketshare might be?

Ah, yes, and there it was again: The appeal to popularity: Since not ALL users or even a majority use XX feature, it must be removed. Otherwise we cannot sit at the very bottom of the lowest common denominator

For Apple, the benefit (easier internal packaging, less cost) outweighed the downside (a minority of users acting like Apple just killed their dog).

Well, this move will actually cost a lot of people quite a lot of extra work and quite a lot of extra money when we migrate to another OS, having to buy new software and so on.
Not all of us are able to simply switch because we "feel like it". We have far more specific needs than any of the iPod Crowd. Yes, I know it must be hard to fathom.

Tosser, stop living up to your name.

Darien, stop acting like an eight-year-old, trying to get at back at someone by making moronic jabs at someone name (or nick as is the case here). It really can't get more idiotic than that.

Being an Apple user for decades doesn't give you some sort of superiority when it comes to talking about Apple's design decisions.

Nope, but it sure as hell gives me perspective –*something a moron that thinks of Apple as "the iPod company" certainly don't have.

It IS a matter of simply refusing to buy the product, if it doesn't appeal to you. No one is forcing you at gunpoint to buy an AlBook, so if the lack of Firewire kills the purchase for you, don't buy it. Seriously, what the hell is the problem with this?

As has been explained numerous times, but obviously not understood by anyone from the iPod Crowd, is that since we have bigger needs than simply connecting our iPhone and/or iPod and write an email, browse the web and write an essay for school, we have to MIGRATE everything. You see, we compete with our peers. And we have to deliver. And that within a deadline. Audio and video apps have steep learning curves, and not many of us have the time to change because of the whims of some ceo who doesn't even know enough the basics of video cameras (yes, you heard right). Not only do we have to buy other software, many of us will have to make entirely new workflows. And that takes time before something like that is implemented and efficient.
However, since the MB (and MB"P") isn't an option at all, there really is no "choice" to not buy. It would be like buying a newton. It's utterly useless to some of us. This, however, will propably once again be missed entirely, and some moronic statement will once again flow from the hands of some ignoramus from the iPod Crowd.

Hell, if you were an Apple user pre-OS X, you're not enlightened, you're a masochist.

Ah, yes, don't we all love the lowest common denominator consumer spouting ignorance …

 

[darienphoenix]

Ah, yes, and there it was again: The appeal to popularity: Since not ALL users or even a majority use XX feature, it must be removed.

Actually, no, that's called good business sense.

Well, this move will actually cost a lot of people quite a lot of extra work and quite a lot of extra money when we migrate to another OS, having to buy new software and so on.

The hell? WHY? Who's forcing you to buy the new models? Don't tell me you're one of the 'iPod crowd' who always needs the latest gadget?

PS: This 'iPod crowd' comment of yours makes you look like a senile old man.

Nope, but it sure as hell gives me perspective –*something a moron that thinks of Apple as "the iPod company" certainly don't have.

I hope you're not referring to me here, because I have been using Macs since OS 8.

Never liked them until recently, but that's mostly because I never gave them a chance.

As has been explained numerous times, but obviously not understood by anyone from the iPod Crowd, is that since we have bigger needs than simply connecting our iPhone and/or iPod and write an email, browse the web and write an essay for school, we have to MIGRATE everything.

Seriously Tosser. WHAT. THE. HELL.

You don't HAVE to buy the new Macbook or Macbook Pro. You ARE aware of this, correct?

However, since the MB (and MB"P") isn't an option at all, there really is no "choice" to not buy.

Ah. Finally. Some sense. Now stop bawling all over the forum, don't buy an AlBook, and stay happy.

Ah, yes, don't we all love the lowest common denominator consumer spouting ignorance …

Sorry, but Mac OS before OS X was a P.O.S. Even compared to Windows.

'iPod Crowd' sightings whilst replying to this latest post from some Tosser: 3.

 

[Tosser]

Actually, no, that's called good business sense.

Ah, yes, saving a dollar to loose a thousand. Yup.

The hell? WHY? Who's forcing you to buy the new models? Don't tell me you're one of the 'iPod crowd' who always needs the latest gadget?

Sheesh! Are you S.L.O.W?

NOT buying it means that we will have to MIGRATE everything. BUYING it means the same thing, as it's utterly useless. You see, it DOESN'T matter what people like me do, they're forced to switch platform should they be in need of a laptop an don't buy used hardware.
It has nothing to with "needing the latest gadget" – you once again completely missed the target. A computer to us is not a gadget. It's a platform and hardware wherewith we make our money. In other words: It's a tool. Without firewire it's a toy.

PS: This 'iPod crowd' comment of yours makes you look like a senile old man.

Perhaps, but as you already have discovered when you put the phrase into use in your gadget-sentence above, it covers a lot more ground than age. In your example it means "people who have to have the latest gadgets". Which it does. It also means: Lowest common denominator Morons who really couldn't care less what computer they have, people who propably could get by with a netbook, because they have such low needs, people who buy into hype, people who know Apple as "The iPod Company", people who buys Macs because it's "trendy", and far from least: People who really know nothing of the platform, but act like the morons they are, and implies that if anyone has any more specific needs than they have, they should switch platforms, buy new inferior audio and video gear.

I hope you're not referring to me here, because I have been using Macs since OS 8.

Never liked them until recently, but that's mostly because I never gave them a chance.

Perhaps not, but you sure as hell mimic them pretty well.

Seriously Tosser. WHAT. THE. HELL.

You don't HAVE to buy the new Macbook or Macbook Pro. You ARE aware of this, correct?

Ah, I see. You STILL think that the notion that noone is forcing anyone to actually buy anything means noone's hands are forced and that we shouldall be happy with whatever is offered at any time.

Ah. Finally. Some sense. Now stop bawling all over the forum, don't buy an AlBook, and stay happy.

Ah, just like I said. See the many posts where this has been s.p.e.l.l.e.d. out for you.

Sorry, but Mac OS before OS X was a P.O.S. Even compared to Windows.

Sure it was. At times. On the other hand, it was the platform where I could get my work done properly and well.

'iPod Crowd' sightings whilst replying to this latest post from some Tosser: 3.

Really? I guess I should've known you had one of the very reflective glassbooks.

 

[millar876]

If I want to watch TV, I go to my TV. I don't use a TV tuner.

Yeah, I dont get the people that inscist on putting TV tuners in PC boxes, then plugging that box into a TV (with a built in tuner) that also has a Tivo or sky+ or "insert prefered PVR option here" then switch on the TV, then the PC, turn the TV to the PCs A/V channel start media center and watch a Live TV show on their pc on their TV. it baffles me and defies logic IMO

 

[darienphoenix]

Sheesh! Are you S.L.O.W?

NOT buying it means that we will have to MIGRATE everything. BUYING it means the same thing, as it's utterly useless. You see, it DOESN'T matter what people like me do, they're forced to switch platform should they be in need of a laptop an don't buy used hardware.

...

...

You're right, I must be slow.

Because poor silly me doesn't seem to figure out why you'd have to migrate ANYTHING if you're NOT buying one of the new Macbooks due to the lack of Firewire.

Please clear this up. You make no goddamn sense.

 

[Tosser]

...

...

You're right, I must be slow.

Because poor silly me doesn't seem to figure out why you'd have to migrate ANYTHING if you're NOT buying one of the new Macbooks due to the lack of Firewire.

Please clear this up. You make no goddamn sense.

B E C A U S E_ I will lose my income should my computer break down since I can't buy a useful one. I _C A N N O T_ simply use whatever is out there as I am – as many others - _D E P E N D E N T_ on my software to be productive. And in the case of Apple that means the hardware matters.

Further, this is _P A R T_ _O F_ _ A_ _T R E N D_, meaning this is one of the final nails in the coffin abandoning the support for pro users, and since we cannot continue using our present computers forever, eventually we will be forced to migrate.

Quite a few of us have to think "future", as - unlike people from the iPod Crowd we can't just move to something else on a whim. It's called investing time and money in something and "making a living".


If it STILL doesn't make "no goddamn sense" to you, try rereading my posts over and over and over again. At some point the callus should've been rubbed off.

 

[hogfaninga]

Tosser is the one that is using common sense here and I understand completely where is coming from.

Tosser you won't be able to win an argument with the new people to Mac or the extreme defenders to anything Apple does. It is a no win situation. Eventually Apple will cut something out they need and the tables will be turned. They will say they will just buy another brand or they won't care to save face though.

 

[Cole Slaw]

You know, if Apple only designed the Macbook with an ExpressCard slot so many problems would be solved.
Want Firewire 400? Get an ExpressCard for that.
Firewire 800, eSata, card readers, tv tuners, whatever.
Give the customer the ability to use the Macbook the way he or she wants.
You can differentiate the Macbook from the MBP by giving the MBP faster CPUs, better graphics cards, and higher quality lcds.

 

[KamiNoYadoru]

At this point I kind of want apple to create a computer with ZERO ports just to hear you guys whine, whine away. Like, literally, some sort of tesla-inspired wireless charging, or something.

I currently have a Macbook Air that does everything *I* need it to (I'm a Sr. Consultant at a Fortune 100 company), and the only times I've ever used the USB ports on my system were to sync up my iPhone, which is completely capable of wireless syncing though Apple hasn't implemented it just yet. Given that I travel all the time, the fact that the chassis is sleek and as thin as possible without having to worry about a parallel port is a value to me as I travel a lot and I probably wouldn't have bought the MBA if it didn't have that.

The engineering advances made possible by ditching peripherals that I personally don't care about anymore (such as an optical drive) have allowed them to make a product that does things for me that nobody else does. If you really enjoyed those ports, then I'm sorry, but if the back of a Mac laptop looked like an Alienware M17x I probably wouldn't have bought it. Sounds like a few people in here are just bitter that Apple has decided to stop marketing to you and started marketing to me. Given their annual reports the last few years, it looks like they made the right decision. So keep on whining, boys.

 

[hogfaninga]

At this point I kind of want apple to create a computer with ZERO ports just to hear you guys whine, whine away. Like, literally, some sort of tesla-inspired wireless charging, or something.

I currently have a Macbook Air that does everything *I* need it to (I'm a Sr. Consultant at a Fortune 100 company), and the only times I've ever used the USB ports on my system were to sync up my iPhone, which is completely capable of wireless syncing though Apple hasn't implemented it just yet. Given that I travel all the time, the fact that the chassis is sleek and as thin as possible without having to worry about a parallel port is a value to me as I travel a lot and I probably wouldn't have bought the MBA if it didn't have that.

The engineering advances made possible by ditching peripherals that I personally don't care about anymore (such as an optical drive) have allowed them to make a product that does things for me that nobody else does. If you really enjoyed those ports, then I'm sorry, but if the back of a Mac laptop looked like an Alienware M17x I probably wouldn't have bought it. Sounds like a few people in here are just bitter that Apple has decided to stop marketing to you and started marketing to me. Given their annual reports the last few years, it looks like they made the right decision. So keep on whining, boys.

Thank you for the post, Mr Fortune 100 exec.. You set us straight.

 

[KamiNoYadoru]

I wouldn't have gone to the whole job card if Tosser wasn't acting like whatever he does with his laptop is so much more important than what anyone else does. That's all I'm saying, I'm not using it for "only WP and e-mail." Plugging in audio interfaces isn't the only sort of high value use a computer can have. I'm not trying to throw around status.

 

[macbookairapple]

At this point I kind of want apple to create a computer with ZERO ports just to hear you guys whine, whine away. Like, literally, some sort of tesla-inspired wireless charging, or something.

I currently have a Macbook Air that does everything *I* need it to (I'm a Sr. Consultant at a Fortune 100 company), and the only times I've ever used the USB ports on my system were to sync up my iPhone, which is completely capable of wireless syncing though Apple hasn't implemented it just yet. Given that I travel all the time, the fact that the chassis is sleek and as thin as possible without having to worry about a parallel port is a value to me as I travel a lot and I probably wouldn't have bought the MBA if it didn't have that.

The engineering advances made possible by ditching peripherals that I personally don't care about anymore (such as an optical drive) have allowed them to make a product that does things for me that nobody else does. If you really enjoyed those ports, then I'm sorry, but if the back of a Mac laptop looked like an Alienware M17x I probably wouldn't have bought it. Sounds like a few people in here are just bitter that Apple has decided to stop marketing to you and started marketing to me. Given their annual reports the last few years, it looks like they made the right decision. So keep on whining, boys.

Dude well said. We are moving towards a wireless society. I'm sick of all these laptops being filled with all these ports. If you need all those ports get a friggin desktop. The MBA showed the way, that's how laptops will be in the future.

 

[darienphoenix]

Tosser, seriously, stop using the 'iPod crowd' term. It's completely meaningless.

Besides which, you first castigated me for making a distinction between 'consumer' and 'pro' users, and you're now making the exact same distinction yourself. Hypocrisy is fun, isn't it?

Your entire problem, it seems, is that if you need to buy a new laptop, you need to buy one which can run Mac OS X. You can't buy one of the new aluminium models because of the lack of/apparently useless firewire (the latter problem I still don't quite get, but I'll take your word for it).

Either buy a previous-gen Macbook Pro/Macbook as a replacement, buy a Whitebook, or buy a HP/Dell/any other manufacturer's laptop, and install OS X on it. Problem solved.

Better still, find a new interface to use which isn't Firewire. Firewire is on the way out all across the industry, not just on Macbooks.

If none of these options are suitable, and I can see why they might not be, then bad luck, **** happens. Of course, you're still in a minority of users, which is why Apple made the design choice in the first place. the benefits outweighed the negative comments they'd get from hardcore Firewire users.