Apple's Retail Store Staff Compensation Criticized

[faroZ06]

By 'capitalism' you mean feudalism, then yes.

Feudalism is completely different. If everyone went by "company success = higher wages", then:

1. Successful companies will be forced to have higher prices.
2. Nobody will want to work for small companies, even ones that may become very successful.
3. You could get more pay with few skills just by being lucky enough to get a job at Apple or Exxon.
4. Government workers would be paid negative money.

This article is just an attention-getting stab at Apple, and they've now succeeded.

 

[Abazigal]

Raise demand for employees just because Apple makes so much money, and not because the current salary isn't enough, doesn't sound so right. If the employees feel stressful about their salary (which I doubt they do), they can quit at anytime and many others are more than willing to take their place.

I think this pretty much sums up the entire argument.

I find it hypocritical that a company which is already paying its employees better than the market average is being singled out for apparently not doing enough.

Sometimes, I wish Steve was still around. All these criticism of Apple is starting to get tiresome, and I think only Steve would have the arrogance to remain unfazed yet faintly amused by it all.

The more they try to troll for change, the more Apple shows them the middle finger by continuing to do just the direct opposite. That will show them.

 

[Thunderhawks]

What is all the whining about?

You apply for a job full well knowing what the job pays and entails.

You get the job!

When you start , you already know what you agreed to , say $ 12 an hour, 401K, health benefits, discounts etc..

You are already ahead of the curve compared to other employees, who work for $ 7.25 an hour.

If you shine in your job it will be noticed and I am sure you can become the head honcho for a store, get promoted if you want etc.

Now where does it matter WHAT you are selling and who you are selling for.

They are paying you as agreed when they offered the job.

You didn't have to take the job, if you think you can do better some other place.

It is not any company's job to have you participate in how much money they make, unless you have an agreement for commission etc.

How about a reality check?

Stop whining!

 

[faroZ06]

If Apple were to have some sort of commision based pay as some here suggest, it would destroy part of what make the Apple Store sales model so sucessful. Apple Stores are a place where people can go and hang out, check out products, and get answers from employees if they have them. It is about creating an experience and letting the products sell themselves. The second you add commision to the equation, the Apple Store becomes just another high pressure electronics store with employees hovering over potential customers like buzzards. Whether or not their hourly wage should be increased is another debate, but commisions aren't the answer.

Circuit City comes to mind... That place was terrible. A guy there would say that Windows Vista was the best OS even though XP had already come out, so the computer was behind a version, and the "best" computer would have the worst specs.

Once I get the notion that employees are paid commission, I just leave. It's too annoying.

 

[chirpie]

Personally, I'm of the opinion that anyone who writes "it's just retail" has never actually worked it.

It should be required to graduate college to have either worked in a restaurant or department store.

If nothing else, it'd make people be nicer to each other out of understanding.

^_^

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Circuit City comes to mind... That place was terrible. A guy there would say that Windows Vista was the best OS even though XP had already come out, so the computer was behind a version, and the "best" computer would have the worst specs.

Once I get the notion that employees are paid commission, I just leave. It's too annoying.

Um, Vista was after XP, and wasn't it actually worse in a lot of ways?

As for the commission thing, it's hit and miss. Even though Best Buy doesn't have commission, they have lots of other stuff. Anything from pushing magazine subscriptions, extended service contracts, and accessories... I don't think that's all that great either.

 

[Rebecca341]

Wow, yet another anti-capitalism, anti-Apple diatribe from the NYT. What a surprise. Perhaps the government should mandate pay rates based on a company's success in the marketplace. Am I right comrades?

 

[Glassed Silver]

We recently put a job opening up on Craigslist for a small retail store in NY for pretty much a stock boy / delivery boy position at 8 bucks an hour with no health benefits. We got over 200 applicants in 7 days.

Making 12 bucks an hour, plus full medical and 401K in a mall selling computers that essentially sell themselves is pretty sweet in my opinion.

That comparison is weak as hell.

I pity anyone forced to feed a family at 8 bucks an hour.

Glassed Silver:mac

 

[Abazigal]

Personally, I'm of the opinion that anyone who writes "it's just retail" has never actually worked it.

It should be required to graduate college to have either worked in a restaurant or department store.

If nothing else, it'd make people be nicer to each other out of understanding.

I worked as a waiter during my undergrad days through an employment agency at S$6.50/hour. (works out to ~ US$5/hour?).

What's your point?

 

[Jryll1]

Why is Apple different?

I'm curious, did the NYT ever do a story on Wallmart's profit vs retail pay scales, or any other US retailer. I find it amusing how certain media will drum up ridiculous stories targeting whomever is doing well in a veiled attempt to make them look bad somehow. Its almost like success is something to be frowned upon in the heart of capitalism.

The story says Apple pay scales are above average, the end, this is a non story. If Apple's pay scale was way below retail average you have a story, but its not. These are still retail workers who know only a little about the product they are selling. I was in an Apple store just this week and the retail employee had to ask a genious if the new Air had in store upgradable RAM. (I wanted an Air with 8GB and all they had in store was the 4GB models) As far as I know no recent Air has had upgradeable RAM, SSD yes through third party vendors, but not RAM (maybe I'm wrong).

But again, retail worker, not genius.

 

[faroZ06]

Um, Vista was after XP, and wasn't it actually worse in a lot of ways?

I was kidding. You know, how people always say "I upgraded to XP"? I'd even take Windows 2000 over Vista.

 

[chirpie]

I worked as a waiter during my undergrad days through an employment agency at S$6.50/hour. (works out to ~ US$5/hour?).

What's your point?

My point is it's snide and under minding, regardless of the perceived value of the task. What's yours? Because going by your tone I'd have wagered you were being sardonic.

 

[dubprocess]

Its so funny how people on here are backing capitalism like its something set in stone and cannot be changed or adapted to fit a particular economy. These employees are not just selling electronics but are held to a higher standard of having certifications and deep technical knowledge of their products. This knowledge requires weeks spent in Cupertino, endless product meetings, and certification testing that requires certain positions to really know their stuff.

I am very thankful these employees are getting raises and the spotlight is on Apple to lead the way in carving a new path for retail infrastructure.

Any reasonable company knows that its employees are the true success of a profitable company.

 

[the8thark]

If the Apple Store don't like their salaries, they are more than welcome to go work somewhere else.

Capitalism wins here.

I agree 100%.
Or in the current climate it's more like better any job then no job at all. So quit complaining. (I refer to people in general, not the poster I quoted).

 

[chirpie]

I was kidding. You know, how people always say "I upgraded to XP"? I'd even take Windows 2000 over Vista.

OK, good, faith in humanity restored.

 

[faroZ06]

Wow, yet another anti-capitalism, anti-Apple diatribe from the NYT. What a surprise. Perhaps the government should mandate pay rates based on a company's success in the marketplace. Am I right comrades? ImageImageImageImage

Nobody likes you, nobody. I hope your site gets DDOS'd and hit by viruses.

 

[sclawis300]

Have they not heard of supply and demand? It applies to the work force too. If a monkey could do your job, then you don't need to be paid very much.

 

[Ryth]

Yes those soldier are paid way to much, time to cut most of those benefit after all they did volunteer no one forced them. Would you not all agree its time to drop those salaries and health benefit not our fault some people lost their body parts.

Yes, because we all lump the 'military' in with government workers...use some common sense dude. When people talk about 'government workers' they are talking about everyone BUT the military...hence the term MILITARY.

Last time I checked, those desk jockies at the department of education aren't losing body parts.

 

[faroZ06]

Its so funny how people on here are backing capitalism like its something set in stone and cannot be changed or adapted to fit a particular economy. These employees are not just selling electronics but are held to a higher standard of having certifications and deep technical knowledge of their products. this knowledge requires weeks spent in Cupertino, endless product meetings, and certification testing that requires certain positions to know their stuff.

I am very thankful these employees are getting raises and the spotlight is on Apple to lead the way in carving a new path for retail infrastructure.

Any reasonable company knows that employees are the true success of a company.

You don't need much training to be an Apple Retail Store employee unless you are in some kind of tech support. Any Apple fan from Apple's huge fan base could do it right now. If they receive training in Cupertino (which is not true), then that is paid for by Apple anyway.

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I worked as a waiter during my undergrad days through an employment agency at S$6.50/hour. (works out to ~ US$5/hour?).

What's your point?

When were your undergrad days? You have to adjust for inflation, which I'm assuming there was since those wages are under our current minimum.

 

[blumpkin]

This is why our country is turning to ****. Because self-righteous "anti-capitalist" little ****s genuinely believe they deserve handouts just because they roll out of bed at 9 AM.

Give me a ****ing break. I bust my ass and sold my youth to get to where I am today. I'm not "lucky" to have my job you whiny c*nts - I earned it and I'll be god damned if any of you hipster douches tell me otherwise.

It's YOUR fault that you were dicking around on the internet while the rest of us were sleeping 3 to 4 hours a night for weeks on end, slamming knowledge into our minds with the hopes of making ourselves useful.

It's YOUR fault that you slum around coffee shops, whining that nobody acknowledges your alleged brilliance, while what you should really be doing is trying to contribute something to society beyond some vaguely witty Thoughtcatalog essay.

It's YOUR fault that while you were tucked up, the rest of us were cleaning up.

It's YOUR fault, accept your position in life, and shut the **** up.

 

[faroZ06]

Have they not heard of supply and demand? It applies to the work force too. If a monkey could do your job, then you don't need to be paid very much.

I'm sure they have, but it's just about getting attention (probably from the Occupy Wall Street followers). They tend to be pretty unoriginal.

 

[robflys]

What is all the whining about?

You apply for a job full well knowing what the job pays and entails.

You get the job!

When you start , you already know what you agreed to , say $ 12 an hour, 401K, health benefits, discounts etc..

You are already ahead of the curve compared to other employees, who work for $ 7.25 an hour.

If you shine in your job it will be noticed and I am sure you can become the head honcho for a store, get promoted if you want etc.

Now where does it matter WHAT you are selling and who you are selling for.

They are paying you as agreed when they offered the job.

You didn't have to take the job, if you think you can do better some other place.

It is not any company's job to have you participate in how much money they make, unless you have an agreement for commission etc.

How about a reality check?

Stop whining!

WHINE WHINE WHINE.....
You know what I'M sick of?

Apple fanboys/girls who throw around the word "whine" or the phrase "stop your whining" left and right.

People have opinions. They express it. It's NOT "whining". Get over it. And stop YOUR "whining".

Talk about an overused phrase. Geez, it practically LABELS you as a fanboy/girl when you use that word or phrase. Get over yourselves already.

And yes, I see the irony...in your eyes, I'm "whining" in this post. You know what? Get over that, too!

 

[NetCatman]

The costs are already very high to send soldiers. Remember when Obama sent 30,000 to Afghanistan? That cost $30G, or $1M per person.

Point being? If we can't afford to pay then what they are worth, then don't send them. Simple.

 

[617arg]

What is it with this black and white notion of 'no one gets rich'?!? How about making a living wage?

What's a "living wage"? If you mean enough to support a family and pay a mortgage then of course it's not enough, but most of these employees tend to be college kids (or maybe a bit older). If you're trying to support a family you should probably be looking for something which requires a trade or a degree, or at least a higher degree of risk.

That being said, I don't see what's wrong with having jobs out there for people to earn a few extra bucks and learn some responsibility while transitioning into adulthood or getting on your feet. We can't all expect to earn a "living wage" just because we showed up to work in the morning, can we?

 

[Mad-B-One]

I think the real issue is...

... that, as others mentioned, that this can be the end of your career ladder nowadays. However, scrutinizing Apple is like saying that - although they pray at the Vatican - they don’t pray enough there! These jobs (retail) were usually done by highschoolers and wives as supplemental income to the household and now, they are many times the income of the household. Apple pays benefits - and their wages are almost there where people with BA/BS have their entry positions. That itself is not bad, but looking at the longer perspective, it bears some problems: I am not far above that pay scale working on my Masters right now and having a social worker position for a State Agency. But compared to retail, I am on the lower steps of my career. I suspect I will get further up, in fact I will get an automatic promotion within 6 months (right before Christmas, haha) and that will get me a nice raise and I get increasing longjivity pay. Now, if I wouldn’t have found my prior job right away after graduation from my BS, I might have jobbed in retail for a while – basically in the old tradition of retail: minimum training, minimum wage. These jobs are gone so far because turnaround is so low and people cling to it because many don’t have options. I also have a $23,316.89 benefits/year package retailers can just dream off because it pays for all of my insurances for me and my family. Something I had to learn when I came to the U.S. – there is almost no social system.
Now, back to Apple: Criticizing Apple is just pointing fingers instead of pointing to the problem. Their package is actually adjusted to the new reality. Apple Retail employees can work having insurance, can even retire if they never find something else. I wonder if there is any other major retailer in the U.S. you could say that about. Wal-Mart is known to send their employees to the State Department for Human Services to apply for Medicaid because they pay so bad that their employees qualify for low income benefits even though they work close to full-time (and they don’t hire full-time to prevent these costs).

 

[faroZ06]

Point being? If we can't afford to pay then what they are worth, then don't send them. Simple.

I wasn't really trying to make a point, just showing how much it costs at the moment. I'm just wondering how it costs $1M to send a soldier... That must be a very inefficient process.

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That being said, I don't see what's wrong with having jobs out there for people to earn a few extra bucks and learn some responsibility while transitioning into adulthood or getting on your feet. We can't all expect to earn a "living wage" just because we showed up to work in the morning, can we?

Yep, I'd take a job at the Apple Retail Store over the summer. It sure beats my current job.