AT&T Announces iPhone Tethering and New Smartphone Data Plans

[jcmeyer5]

JC - I am not going to continue pounding my head against the wall trying to explain to you and others how businesses set their pricing for these kinds of services. Clearly it is not easily understood.

Oh I understand it... I just dont think it is in the interest of the customers, nor in the long term interest of the company. I GET the averages thing. I just think the way they go about it is dishonest. Base my rates off of what my usage is, not what other peoples usage (the average) is.

If you are on the $15 a month plan great. I hope it works for you. I am glad they added something in at a lower level. I just want to scale better with usage, rather than slapping the crap out of a certain segment of users. Again, I WANT to pay for the data I use, and NOT the manner in which I use it... be it tethered or smart phone. Charge me more ONLY IF my usage warrants it. If $25 isnt enough for a 2GB plan, tell me what is. If $45 is actually the number, then charge EVERYONE who is going to use 2GB $45, and not just the people who tether. That doesnt mean you dont still get your $15 200MB plan. It just means that the pricing on the higher plan better reflects reality and not this "based on average usage" crap.

I get it. I know how they use it. I just think it is wrong and dishonest.

 

[Chwisch87]

... Instead, AT$T knows the 200MB level is set too low. They know this! But, they do not give a rat damn about us. $$$ is the bottom line. ...

LOL ... they are a for-profit publicly traded corporation. They are required BY LAW to get as much profit they can within the confines of the law. They are not in the business of caring about you or whatever your petty needs are.

If you don't like enough to not get an iPhone, it might be best for you to switch to another carrier. They all employ the same nickel and dime practices..

 

[kerbero9]

JC - I am not going to continue pounding my head against the wall trying to explain to you and others how businesses set their pricing for these kinds of services. Clearly it is not easily understood.

Marksman- can u at least give us specific names of "businesses <that> set their pricing for these kinds of services" ???

You come accross like this whole pricing structure is just so obvious and makes perfect sense.. is this some kind of well known model that is tried and true or something?

I'm not aware of any other service providers that operate in this way. You seem to have an intimate knowledge of how these services are priced. Do work in the industry? How do you know that at&t is basing their pricing on the expecation, that on average, users will consume much less data than their cap?

 

[Chwisch87]

I would actually like to say that I am in favor of this new teared model..

Why exactly should i have to pay the same for less data than people who are hogging the network ..

I have never gone over 200 megs of download and probably never will. I came close to 200 by about 40 in April but honesty my average usage is under 100.

This saves me 15 dollars a month. If you don't like it ... well maybe should go to a different network ... i am doing that anyway.

Sooo ... lol.

 

[serenity12]

what to do?

Jumping in kind of late here... but as someone who was all set to switch to at&t and pick up a new iphone (two, actually) when they come out, I've been following the rate plan debates quite a bit. I really want the newest hardware, but I also really want the unlimited data plan (not possible, I know). So I'm wondering... all you existing iphone users, what would you do if you were in my shoes? Pick up 3GSs this weekend to get the unlimited data plan, or wait for the new hardware and be stuck with the 2GB rate plan? What's going to be better overall -- more data availability or a newer phone?

I know the answer to this is probably dependent on how much I plan to use the phone, but having never really used one at length before, I have no idea how to gauge what my usage will be like. Just looking for opinions, really. Thanks!

 

[HardBall]

3) 2 gigs of data for $25 a month (including tethering)

4) unlimited data for $30 a month (including tethering)

I'd sign up for 2 more years for option 4 and a new iPhone. $20 extra for tethering with no extra data allowance is a rip-off, you can tell your managers at AT$T that. Anything else, and I hang on to my old iPhone and bask in the glory of no ETFs while I look for a new provider.

Seeing what they pulled with the iPad plan, and that the TOS has already an escape clause built in where they can pull your unlimited plan at their discretion if you go over 5GB, I don't trust my grandfathered plan to last for the two years I'll have to sign for. Nothing is stopping them from kicking heavy data users off the unlimited plan once they signed for two more years to get a new iPhone.

Guess what, I only use 300 or so MB a month. Point is, I really don't know what I'll use a year from now, and I happily pay $30 / month for not having to worry about it.

I don't see why so many people could have so much angst over something that likely won't affect you at all (well, vast majority of you).

I'm a very heavy user by any standard, and would probably fall into that 2% figure in the tail of the distribution that AT&T quoted. During some months, I can probably use upto 8-10GB on the network, with an average of about half that. But last I checked, well over 95% of that is done on wifi, which are available everywhere, wherever I remain stationary for a period of time. Only when I am moving on the street or on a bus, would I really be consistently using the 3G network.

Think about it this way,

• In an area with 3G, it's likely to be very densely populated, and full of wifi hotspots that you can hop onto.
• And in a less densely populated area, it's not likely to have 3G coverage anyways, much more likely to fall back to 2G or edge; so you are not likely to use much data regardless.
• Most of the time that you are really dealing with the streaming content applications, you are likely to be sitting down somewhere with a wifi connection.
• When you are on the move, you are not likely to be watching a video or streaming live TV. (or you are just asking for an accident).

Realistically speaking, even the heavy users won't have any trouble at all, maybe except those 0.01% corner cases. There are always wifi routers around classrooms, cafes, dorms, apartment complexes, cafeterias; I've never had trouble finding wifi in any place that also had 3G available, period.

So, It's probably all whole a lot of angst for nothing after all, in this thread.

EDIT: formatting

 

[marksman]

Jumping in kind of late here... but as someone who was all set to switch to at&t and pick up a new iphone (two, actually) when they come out, I've been following the rate plan debates quite a bit. I really want the newest hardware, but I also really want the unlimited data plan (not possible, I know). So I'm wondering... all you existing iphone users, what would you do if you were in my shoes? Pick up 3GSs this weekend to get the unlimited data plan, or wait for the new hardware and be stuck with the 2GB rate plan? What's going to be better overall -- more data availability or a newer phone?

I know the answer to this is probably dependent on how much I plan to use the phone, but having never really used one at length before, I have no idea how to gauge what my usage will be like. Just looking for opinions, really. Thanks!

How much access to wifi do you have now?

Do you have wifi at work and at home for instance?

If so, then I would wait. I think the next gen iPhone is going to be really nice.

Plus there is no guarantee that the unlimited grandfather plan is going to last forever. It will change at some point, and while they may let people use it once, I seriously doubt people will be able to go into a third contract with it, which means you have it for 2 years at best.

If you have a lot of wifi access, then I would say you will have little issue with the 2g limit.

If you plan on tethering your phone and have no other internet access, it may make sense to jump early, but I really doubt this is the case.

 

[marksman]

Marksman- can u at least give us specific names of "businesses <that> set their pricing for these kinds of services" ???

You come accross like this whole pricing structure is just so obvious and makes perfect sense.. is this some kind of well known model that is tried and true or something?

I'm not aware of any other service providers that operate in this way. You seem to have an intimate knowledge of how these services are priced. Do work in the industry? How do you know that at&t is basing their pricing on the expecation, that on average, users will consume much less data than their cap?

Because that is how businesses work. I have owned a lot of businesses in my life, including an ISP. This is not exactly advanced business.

I guess it is my fault, because it is fairly obvious to me, but clearly it is not obvious to most other people, and it is my fault for assuming so.. for that I apologize I guess.

I used to offer unlimited web hosting on my ISP many years ago. I have a very good idea how these things work and how you make the numbers work. Any business that offers a service type business like this providing data, bandwidth, web storage, or a host of other things, including as I mentioned Net Flix, models their pricing on that. If you priced these services based on the full service being used by each customer nobody would pay for it. AT&T would have to charge you a price that accounted for you using up a full 2 gigs every month, or on an unlimited plan the cost of you using it 100% full stream 24 hours a day 7 days a week. Then they have to leave room for overhead and profit as well.

This isn't the only place I have faced massive resistance to this... but like I said I am done fighting it. At the end of the day it doesn't matter. It is good for me, and I know why they are doing what they are doing. Does it matter whether or not people believe me? I see people say things like "well it should be 5 gigs for $15 and 10 gigs for $25. People are setting prices completely ignorant of any actual cost structure or overhead.

People will pay what they will pay though, and that is also a key component to the whole thing. It is not just a matter of what things cost, it is a matter of what you can get as well. I am just saying given the way tethering works, their average cost per customer is significantly higher. Most businesses keep track of cost per customer, revenue per customer, cost to acquire customer etc etc. In this case, I am sure AT&T has some relevant metric for data cost per subscriber.

I saw in another thread a quote from an AT&T official a while back saying 3% of their customers use up 40% of their data. That is pretty significant.

 

[macconservative]

It also wouldn't surprise me to see a few months down the road after these plans have been offered, if AT&T slips in an Unlimited Data/Tethering plan for new customers. I think right now they are just establishing their pricing points. So I could see an Unlimited Data/Tethering plan at $60

 

[marksman]

It also wouldn't surprise me to see a few months down the road after these plans have been offered, if AT&T slips in an Unlimited Data/Tethering plan for new customers. I think right now they are just establishing their pricing points. So I could see an Unlimited Data/Tethering plan at $60

I agree with this. Once they give things a chance to settle down, I could see them adding a higher end package depending on how many customers might need it.

 

[serenity12]

How much access to wifi do you have now?

Do you have wifi at work and at home for instance?

If so, then I would wait. I think the next gen iPhone is going to be really nice.

Plus there is no guarantee that the unlimited grandfather plan is going to last forever. It will change at some point, and while they may let people use it once, I seriously doubt people will be able to go into a third contract with it, which means you have it for 2 years at best.

If you have a lot of wifi access, then I would say you will have little issue with the 2g limit.

If you plan on tethering your phone and have no other internet access, it may make sense to jump early, but I really doubt this is the case.

Good points, thank you. I do have wifi at home and I think I have it at work (will have to check). So maybe we'll be fine with the new plan, then. I take it switching onto wifi (when it's available) is fairly easy then?

 

[pacohaas]

saving $45/month now because of this (3 iPhones on our family plan). I was given the choice of making the change retroactive to the start of the current billing cycle, which we did. Using AT&T's iPhone app, we can monitor the usage and if it looks like we will go over in a particular month, just make the switch to the 2GB plan. I've never gone much over 500GB, so this is perfect. Hopefully it cuts down on 3G usage in big cities because when I travel, I've noticed other cities can have spotty 3G reliability during large events.

Seems like a win-win-win to me, even when the iOS4 comes out, video calling will be primarily made from a location where I have wifi so I'm not at all worried about a change in my usage pattern. If something drastic happens, I guess i'll have to keep it under 2GB

usage shows 28.36MB of Unlimited data from last billing cycle, 34.8MB from this billing cycle, seems to be right on track to be under 200MB this month. My sister uses a bit more data since she has less wifi coverage at work.

 

[SAPPete]

I don't see why so many people could have so much angst over something that likely won't affect you at all (well, vast majority of you).

I'm a very heavy user by any standard, and would probably fall into that 2% figure in the tail of the distribution that AT&T quoted. During some months, I can probably use upto 8-10GB on the network, with an average of about half that. But last I checked, well over 95% of that is done on wifi, which are available everywhere, wherever I remain stationary for a period of time. Only when I am moving on the street or on a bus, would I really be consistently using the 3G network.

Think about it this way,

• In an area with 3G, it's likely to be very densely populated, and full of wifi hotspots that you can hop onto.
• And in a less densely populated area, it's not likely to have 3G coverage anyways, much more likely to fall back to 2G or edge; so you are not likely to use much data regardless.
• Most of the time that you are really dealing with the streaming content applications, you are likely to be sitting down somewhere with a wifi connection.
• When you are on the move, you are not likely to be watching a video or streaming live TV. (or you are just asking for an accident).

Realistically speaking, even the heavy users won't have any trouble at all, maybe except those 0.01% corner cases. There are always wifi routers around classrooms, cafes, dorms, apartment complexes, cafeterias; I've never had trouble finding wifi in any place that also had 3G available, period.

So, It's probably all whole a lot of angst for nothing after all, in this thread.

EDIT: formatting

Valid points, and it all depends on the specific situation. I don't use too much data currently, mainly due to not tethering and not streaming anything, since AT$T's network sucks. However, I certainly would like to consume more data, and am not impressed with the new plans. I'd be grandfathered in, but I fully expect AT$T to start booting those people off in the coming months.

I work in the South Bay (San Jose), and the network here is atrocious. In the office, my signal bounces around from 4 bars to nothing. In my hotel I have 1 bar if I'm lucky, and incoming calls totally disappear (no missed call, no voice mail). I wouldn't mind picking up a new phone, especially if it should get better wifi reception, but am hesitant to renew with AT$T.

I seem to hang out plenty of spots with no open wifi. Heck, I was at a Starbucks in downtown San Jose today, and attwifi (the only open option) keep kicking me out, the signal was so weak. Couple blocks from some big ass AT$T building too.

 

[SAPPete]

I saw in another thread a quote from an AT&T official a while back saying 3% of their customers use up 40% of their data. That is pretty significant.

Yep, and they still will do that after the switch with the grandfathered in plans. So what's the point ? Unless, of course AT$T plans to quietly kick them out one by one under the 5GB clause.

"If you are on a data plan that does not include a monthly MB/GB allowance and additional data usage rates, you agree that AT&T has the right to impose additional charges if you use more than 5 GB in a month; provided that, prior to the imposition of any additional charges, AT&T shall provide you with notice and you shall have the right to terminate your Service."

So, let's wait until all the data hogs sign up for new phones and new 2 year commitments, and then kick them off the "unlimited" plan.

 

[landrew4]

Data Charge Analysis

I did an analysis of simultaneous access for a laptop and an iPhone showing what has been the case, what is now announced, and what I think AT&T should have announced. Let me know what you think - more importantly, let AT&T know what you think.

The top row shows what many people have been doing by jailbreaking their phone (or by not upgrading to 3.1) - this of course is the most attractive option except for that whole "illegal" thing. The second line is what has been the only clearly legal option up till now which meant buying a separate data plan for your laptop which at least came with its own data allotment.

The next rows (in blue) show what AT&T has just announced. This includes requiring you to drop to the new "Data Pro" plan to add tethering and then giving you no additional data allotment for the extra $20 you pay for the privilege of sharing the measly 2GB of data with your laptop. Of course you can buy additional GBs at $10/GB which means essentially paying an extra $45/month to get to what jailbreakers are getting now.

The bottom three rows are what I think would have been fair (assuming AT&T would never go for what jailbreakers are doing). 1st option is to let existing "Unlimited" users add tethering to their plan ($20 more than jailbreak tethering). The last two options show what would happen if AT&T actually gave you 2 additional GBs for for $20 for tethering (same as you would pay for additional 2 GB for phone alone). To me, this is a win/win. Many people would pay the additional $20 for the privilege of Tethering without ever using the extra 2GB (so they get tethering and AT&T makes out on data usage). Many people who currently take the risk of the illegal tethering approach would fork over the extra $20-$25 to be "legal". But for the people who really need 5GB, I don't see them paying an additional $45 for no additional GB over what they have now when an additional $60 would get them an additional 5GB (and many would take that on another carrier like Sprint or Verizon which have mobile hotspot devices and can maximize your coverage by having two different carriers).

Thoughts? Better ideas? Petitions to AT&T?

 

[fkntotalkaos]

cutting my data and going with sprint 4g and my EVo. Will wifi hotspot my iphone 4, laptop and ipad

 

[foodog]

Sprint's plan is unlimited everything there isn't an add on data plan + add on text messaging plan. The extra 10 a month if for 4G, that rocks in metro ATL. The ability to tether my iPad to the phone is a huge plus.

I do miss my iPhone, EVO is a second rate phone at best in comparison. I DO NOT miss AT&T dropping my calls constantly. It happend on every phone 2G, 3G and 3GS)

It seems like you're trolling, but people should know its not $10/month for unlimited 4G... its $10/month extra charge on top of their normal 3G data package.

And AT&T is upgrading their whole network to 14.4Mbps HSPA+ this year so between that and these intelligent limits on bandwidth hogs, there should be some improvement.