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WHAT A STUPID LOGIC

cable you get extra contents/feature for paying extra (HBO, Showtime, HDTV)
with data, you dont get any extra (data =data)
from what i learned and remember, 1 will always be and =1.
so if you paid for 2GB data, it should be 2GB data no matter how you wanna used it.

Then why should we pay for voice minutes. I can promise you that is just Data and they are not using an Analog signal to transmit the voice so it is data (1's and 0's)

Remember a computer can do a lot more things at the same time over the internet than a phone. Generally speaking a computer is going to be able to and will draw more data over the same length of time putting more strain on the network. It is the huge multitasking that computer causes the problems on.
 
Then why should we pay for voice minutes. I can promise you that is just Data and they are not using an Analog signal to transmit the voice so it is data (1's and 0's)

Remember a computer can do a lot more things at the same time over the internet than a phone. Generally speaking a computer is going to be able to and will draw more data over the same length of time putting more strain on the network. It is the huge multitasking that computer causes the problems on.
your logic doesnt justified the meaning of data 1=1. bro
 
You do realize the phone, aka the system, was designed to do this and that AT&T is going out of their way to charge people double for what they are paying for?

It would be no different if your home ISP tacked on a $20+ charge each month for having a router at home.

I'm waiting for the class action lawsuit as this is wrong. The service that people have bought is not somehow giving them more bandwidth or a higher amount of download data simply because they are tethering through the phone. The phone can only download so fast to begin with so any device you connect to it will still be limited.

Why are you just taking it like it's okay, this is wrong. That's why i can't buy an iphone
 
I've never really understood this. If I'm paying for unlimited data, why does it matter how I choose to distribute it? What if i used the same amount of data on my phone as when I tether my iPad? It's flawed, greedy logic on their part. I know it's in the contract not to use it blah blah, but that doesn't mean it makes sense.

First, I would say that it should be one hundred percent illegal to sell an "unlimited data" plan that is not unlimited - it is fine with me to say have three data plans "low usage", "medium usage" and "high usage" at different cost and then specify somewhere _exactly_ what the user gets for each plan.

Second, it should be illegal to demand excessive payments for exceeding the limits of a data plan. I would find it acceptable to offer that data access is cut off at the limit, slowed down significantly when exceeding the limit, automatically update to the next higher plan or something similar, but a situation where a user can use twice the limit and pays ten times the price is unacceptable.

But now to your question: A company could offer, just as an example "up to four GB per month as fast as we can supply it, and then unlimited data at recduced speed of 100 kbit per second up to 50 MB per day". Many customers will take this offer. On average they will use a lot less than four GB per month. Because of that, the company can offer this deal at a price that is below the cost of actually providing 4 GB of data per month! If the average use is 1.3 GB per month, then the company can charge every user for the actual cost of 1.5 GB per month and make a good profit. If the company charged each of the users for the actual cost of 4 GB then they would make tons of money except that customers wouldn't buy it because it is too expensive.

The important point is that the cost to the end user can be lowered because the average use is much less than 4 GB. Now assume that people who don't tether use 0.9 GB on average and people who tether use 2.7 GB on average. And half the customers tether, so the average use is 1.8 GB. If the company offers one contract only (tethering allowed) they have to charge everyone for the 1.8 GB average use. If the company offers two different contracts (tethering allowed or not allowed, everything else is the same. Obviously the contract that doesn't allow tethering can be sold a lot cheaper than the one that allows tethering, because the average cost to the data provider for these contracts is lower.

Now you could say that maybe every user should be charged _exactly_ for the amount they use, which would make perfectly sense. Except that measuring the exact usage also costs money. Every time a little bit of data is moved to your phone the exact amount would have to be recorded somewhere. So the cost would now be fair, but a lot higher. The system as it is (different prices for tethered and untethered) is relatively cheap and reasonably, but not completely fair.

So you think you shouldn't pay more for tethering. Well, maybe a competitor offers _only_ a contract where tethering is always allowed, which is precisely what you want. That competitor would have to base the price on the cost for the average data use of _all_ its customers. Its plan would be in cost between the untethered and the tethered price of the first company. People using tethering would like the deal, people not using tethering would hate it. So this second company would initially get more customers who tether (like you). That means their average data use per user is higher, so the company needs to charge more, until only people who tether use it.

I've written to my members of Congress to get the FCC to step in and forbid extra charges for tethering. If I pay for 2 GB of data, it's irrelevant HOW I consume it. I've paid for it and it's mine to use as I see fit! The idea of charging ANY fee based on my method of connecting is asinine! If I go over my data limit, either with the phone OR notebook, I get charged for it. AT&T could actually MAKE money, legitimately, from excess data usage.

Ask them to change asinine way how car insurance works as well. I shouldn't pay for the risk that my car an my driving ability and style represents, but only for the damage that I actually cause. Wait a second... We don't need any car insurance at all, because that is exactly what you pay without insurance.


I don't think they know crap.. They are basing it on usage, and if you admit to them on the phone after your hate mail message. PLAY STUPID!!! Ask them when the last time you "tethered".... And to what device. What Mac address? If they can't answer.. Ask for someone who can..

Here is dangerous ground: AT&T can identify you (roughly, may not be hundred percent correct, and without having legal evidence of tethering and send you a message). You then either change your contract and pay for tethering, or you stop tethering and don't pay for it, or you can continue tethering and say "AT&T has no proof". In that third case, AT&T can and will collect and produce evidence, and they can then claim that you have been knowingly and even after their friendly reminder continued to breach the contract.
 
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Then why should we pay for voice minutes. I can promise you that is just Data and they are not using an Analog signal to transmit the voice so it is data (1's and 0's)

Remember a computer can do a lot more things at the same time over the internet than a phone. Generally speaking a computer is going to be able to and will draw more data over the same length of time putting more strain on the network. It is the huge multitasking that computer causes the problems on.


The phones are computers, all Modern smart phones are computers, this argument of multitasking:

My Iphone 4 has a 1ghz processor, 512 ram, that does multitasking and is more powerful then the Laptops of just 5 years ago.

Further more the new Iphone is reported to have a Dual Core Processor, it may be more powerful then the Netbooks of today with single core.

Also the idea that some how a laptop will use "More data and strain" is ridiculous nonsense, Data flows at certain rates no matter what is on the line.

there is a cap always and you use only X amount

Friend X amount is X amount

Data = Data
 
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They can offer an unlimited data plan that is truely unlimited for everyone if they want..

It would just cost $85 a month. Why don't you people understand this... It doesn't matter what you want... Nothing in the world requires them to provide an unlimited data plan for $30 a month for crying out loud.

If they do what many of you say they should be forced to do then the price would go up 200%-250% without a question.

So people who don't use excessive data would be paying $85 a month for 1 gig.

It is like none of you actually think any of this through before you stick your flag pole in these ridiculous positions.

AT&T can do what you want, the cost of them doing it though, is that the price for unlimited access will go up dramatically... And there is nothing you can do or say about that.

By the way for those of you who think Jailbreaking and tethering is just breaking a contract, you should realize a very strong case could be made for theft of services, which is a crime.

If I have a contract to come in the grocery store every week and pick up 2 cases of soda for my mini-mart, and one week I also pick up a case of beer, without paying for it. I am not just breaking my contract, I am stealing.
 
I support this.

The number of corporate shills and self-righteous pricks on here is unbelievable.

Oh wait, I'm already a thief because I jailbroke to change my SMS tones and add a calander for my upcoming cases to the lockscreen. :rolleyes:

I'm not a shill and I dabbled with jailbreaking my iOS devices and ultimately restored them to factory firmware shortly thereafter. Is it really worth the relative instability for some trinkets?

Strangely Roger/Fido (not sure if Telus does) here in Canada offers free tethering for data plans over 1GB, usually we lag the US in our mobile plans. :)
 
Is [jailbreaking] really worth the relative instability for some trinkets?
It hasn't been unstable in quite a while. Even Winterboard, I hear, is much better. I just leave that off though and have had no issues regarding stability. It's just as reliable as stock only with a lot more customization. Occasionally you'll find a rogue app but they're few and far between and as long as you're careful with what you download there is no problem.
 
Glad to see the productive turn this thread has taken...as all threads on MR do.

Anyway. I'm alright with the news. I pay $45 a month for tethering, why shouldn't you also?

Because we were GF in with unlimited at $30 ( you pay 25 plus 20) and At&t will not allow us to ad tether for $15 or $20, the only option is to Opt out of the unlimited..............

So who's the prick? At&t is.

Its an underhanded way to get everyone off of unlimited what a ploy!

Plus why should we have to pay more to use Data? We already pay per month for Data.

I'm not a shill and I dabbled with jailbreaking my iOS devices and ultimately restored them to factory firmware shortly thereafter. Is it really worth the relative instability for some trinkets?
then you did something wrong when you JB, its been stable for awhile when done right.

And Its legal

Strangely Roger/Fido (not sure if Telus does) here in Canada offers free tethering for data plans over 1GB, usually we lag the US in our mobile plans. :)
Hmm, I just responded to poster that said it would cost 10's to hundreds more a month to provide unlimited with tether, again the Americans prove our logic is greatly flawed.

Since the 2000's America has dumbed down and we the people bend over and accept anything.................
 
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Because we were GF in with unlimited at $30 ( you pay 25 plus 20) and At&t will not allow us to ad tether for $15 or $20, the only option is to Opt out of the unlimited..............

So who's the prick? At&t is.

Its an underhanded way to get everyone off of unlimited what a ploy!

Plus why should we have to pay more to use Data? We already pay per month for Data.

I don't understand the great allure of unlimited data. Granted 2GB a month may not be suitable for everyone, but its not like you are forced to pay $200 in the event that you do go over. $10. And another 1GB. And AT&T sends you multiple messages warning if you are near your limit. The people who need more than 2GB rightfully should be paying more as they're the ones using the most data. Something just doesn't sit right if you use a couple hundred megabytes of data a day on your phone.

You bring up a good point with your last statement though. It doesn't make sense that we have to pay more to use the same data, even if we don't use it all in one month.
 
How in the heck did you make up this price? ( Ficticous?) There is an Enterprise unlimited Data and voice for $45 a month

This is based on what?
You have no basis for this statement, we are not the ones who advertised for 2 years unlimited Data plans at At&t, then decided to Grandfather in people to keep the business, its At&t who did, why should we not expect At&t to provide the product they claim to provide?

Is is not a lie to provide unlimited Data then fine people for using it?

Sorry I do not see your point?

AT&T sets the prices based on average usage. If people tether, the average usage goes up. When the average usage goes up, they will charge more to cover their increased expenses and maintain their profit.

It is not rocket science. It has nothing to do with how much data one person uses or even how much they say you can use. The only thing that ultimately impacts the price are how much profite they want, and how much the average person uses.

How much the average person uses.
How much the average person uses.
How much the average person uses.

When you add in things that noticeably cause how much the average person uses to go up (like tethering as nboody is going to start tethering and use less monthly data so you guarantee it goes up), then the price has to go up. It is that simple.
 
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can they transfer users to different data plans just like that?
Here in Greece doing something like that would be out of the question and the company would have serious penalties to face .

The company (vodafone GR ) that i have contract with started locking out the tethering future and asking 10 euros per month in order to use it, but fortunately another one started giving it for free so many iphone users have changed mobile operator.

I paid for my iphone data plan and i want to use it anyway i like.
 
Glad to see the productive turn this thread has taken...as all threads on MR do.

Anyway. I'm alright with the news. I pay $45 a month for tethering, why shouldn't you also?

The real question is why should you have to?
 
And for good reason....but this is not one of those reasons (which tend to involve commercial contracts for the sale/purchase of supplies used in production or manufacturing). This is more like breaking a lease.

Yes, this is true, and that's why they teach it to you in law school. *But* that gives the misleading impression that this is common; in actual fact, it's not common at all. Almost all actual contract litigation involves a dispute about whether some action was covered by the contract or not. No one will reform a contract because it calls for you to pay for an extra convenience that doesn't happen to cost the provider anything. You might as well try to overturn a lease containing a rental increase by proving that the landlord's costs didn't go up. Except in the .0001% of leases covered by specific rent control laws, this won't fly. If it's too much, you move to a place with a more reasonable rent.

Think harder.
1. AT&T isn't going after people with unlimited data plans. They are going after people who tether. Tethering has never been permitted as part of the unlimited data plan, and this has always been clear; the "data pro/plus" plans were introduced with tethering, and switching to one of those plans was a requirement of tethering.

2. Even if you were right about misleading advertising for the unlimited plan (and I don't think you are), what good does voiding the contract do? It leaves you with an AT&T phone that you can't use because you don't have a K. Of course you could switch to Verizon, but that would require $2-$300 for a new phone and a new two year K. And Verizon's K is more restrictive than AT&T's - it still costs $20 more to tether, but you only get 2GB rather than 4GB.

Perhaps you could then jailbreak and avoid the extra cost - but that would assume that Verizon wouldn't do the same thing AT&T is doing now.

So it's not really a great remedy.

It would be much more useful in those European countries that already have several iPhone carriers...although they already tend not to charge for tethering.

Well, except that this case is about tethering, not about unlimited data. And that AT&T's advertising is not misleading and they reference the 5GB cap in their terms of service. And don't use the term "unlimited."

So it doesn't look that similar to me.

This is about unlimited data, because if consumers were under the impression that they were paying for the data itself (aka the right to use an unlimited amount of it), restricting that use makes it no longer truly unlimited -- it is unlimited under certain circumstances. That is how it is similar to the Verizon case. The Verizon suit that settled was that by restricting the uses of unlimited data, it wasn't unlimited. Technically, however, the amount of data was unlimited -- so long as you only browsed.

I think the key question in court would be whether the unlimited data advertised by att implied that there were no limitations on data usage, both quantity and type. Verizon settled to avoid this question. I suspect att would do the same.

You're right that the remedy would probably be limited to a refund of ETF to people who had terminated due to this previously, but that's the biggest problem anyway. Att is basically saying "you can't use your data how you see fit, and if you don't like it, pay us hundreds more to leave." Att can certainly run their business how they see fit, but not many courts are going to look favorably on what amounts to hostage taking.
 
This is about unlimited data, because if consumers were under the impression that they were paying for the data itself (aka the right to use an unlimited amount of it), restricting that use makes it no longer truly unlimited -- it is unlimited under certain circumstances. That is how it is similar to the Verizon case. The Verizon suit that settled was that by restricting the uses of unlimited data, it wasn't unlimited. Technically, however, the amount of data was unlimited -- so long as you only browsed.

Yes the main point::::::
I think the key question in court would be whether the unlimited data advertised by att implied that there were no limitations on data usage, both quantity and type. Verizon settled to avoid this question. I suspect att would do the same.

If its unlimited its Unlimited, since At&t has 2gb and 200mb plans its not that At&t has trouble defining what the plan is.

If unlimited means 5gb then they could of called it "5GB Data Plan" they didn't and still don't, this is At&t's downfall.

People need to wake up and stop taking At&t's side, they are not the perfect little company, they provide 71 million with wireless and have a lot of power over US but they are not above being responsible for what they do.

If they get more customers by signing them to Unlimited Data plans then they are obligated to deliver it.

I do not agree to the abuse of unlimited

but I also do not agree I should pay extra to use my USB cord to connect my phone to my computer ( like for Itunes) and then the internet is used from the phone as well ( Tether)
 
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29 GB last Month

I have a friend who uses his iPhone to tether as does his girlfriend. She hardly ever tethers and he does it all the time. She has gotten the Text from AT&T and he hasn't. In fact he used 29 GB's last month tethering movies and all sorts of things to his home computers. I am thinking the text's must be random if she got one and he hasn't. He averages about 10 to 12 gigs a month at a minimum. Yeah he is abusing it bad!!! lol I myself have only tethered a small amount and haven't received any text or email from AT&T.
 
This is about unlimited data, because if consumers were under the impression that they were paying for the data itself (aka the right to use an unlimited amount of it), restricting that use makes it no longer truly unlimited -- it is unlimited under certain circumstances. That is how it is similar to the Verizon case. The Verizon suit that settled was that by restricting the uses of unlimited data, it wasn't unlimited. Technically, however, the amount of data was unlimited -- so long as you only browsed.

I think the key question in court would be whether the unlimited data advertised by att implied that there were no limitations on data usage, both quantity and type. Verizon settled to avoid this question. I suspect att would do the same.
I don't know why they would - look at their TOS:

AT&T DataPlus/AT&T DataPro plans with Tethering may be used to tether such SMARTPHONE and BlackBerry devices to a personal computer. If you are on a data plan that does not include a monthly megabyte allowance and additional data usage rates, the parties agree that AT&T has the right to impose additional charges if you use more than 5 GB in a month. Prior to the imposition of any additional charges, AT&T shall provide you with notice and you shall have the right to terminate your Service.

That seems really clear to me. (There's a separate section prohibiting tethering):

Data Services sold for use with AT&T RIM BlackBerry devices, and SMARTPHONEs may not be used with other devices, including but not limited to, personal computers, PC Data Cards and the like, either by tethering devices together, by SIM card transfer or any other means.







You're right that the remedy would probably be limited to a refund of ETF to people who had terminated due to this previously, but that's the biggest problem anyway. Att is basically saying "you can't use your data how you see fit, and if you don't like it, pay us hundreds more to leave." Att can certainly run their business how they see fit, but not many courts are going to look favorably on what amounts to hostage taking.[/QUOTE]
I do agree that they couldn't make you pay the ETF.
 
I have a friend who uses his iPhone to tether as does his girlfriend. She hardly ever tethers and he does it all the time. She has gotten the Text from AT&T and he hasn't. In fact he used 29 GB's last month tethering movies and all sorts of things to his home computers. I am thinking the text's must be random if she got one and he hasn't. He averages about 10 to 12 gigs a month at a minimum. Yeah he is abusing it bad!!! lol I myself have only tethered a small amount and haven't received any text or email from AT&T.

Just for a 'me too' story..

Just checked my bill for this last billing cycle. For all of the data that I use (including any tethering), I've totaled 51.3MB. That's it. My SO, on the other hand, with all of her data (read: netflix, Farmville), her total? 48.8MB.

My 51.3MB is consists mainly of (in order of app with most data used): an air traffic control scanner app (LiveATC), checking the weather and airport delays, the occasional Ebay search, and tethering for work for no more than 1 hour, once per month. No text message to me or my SO from ATT on this, nor do I really expect one. We are on a family plan with unlimited data. And with that little data being used compared to others tethering for movies and such, I think I'm pretty much in the clear to continue what I am doing.

BL.
 
I've said it before and will say it again: AT&T is cheating its customers by charging separate for a tethering plan. You pay for data. Period. If you are forced to pay for tethering data in addition to your paid data plan, you're paying twice for the very same data. If AT&T wants more money, then charge more for data. But they shouldn't do it by charging twice for the very same thing. Who cares if someone tethers and someone else doesn't? Does it really make a difference if you watch Netfilx over your iPhone or iPad or computer? AT&T simply sees an opportunity to rob their customers and that's what they're doing. I really wish that an attorney would institute a class action law suit against AT&T for this practice. That day may come.
 
I've said it before and will say it again: AT&T is cheating its customers by charging separate for a tethering plan. You pay for data. Period. If you are forced to pay for tethering data in addition to your paid data plan, you're paying twice for the very same data. If AT&T wants more money, then charge more for data. But they shouldn't do it by charging twice for the very same thing. Who cares if someone tethers and someone else doesn't? Does it really make a difference if you watch Netfilx over your iPhone or iPad or computer? AT&T simply sees an opportunity to rob their customers and that's what they're doing. I really wish that an attorney would institute a class action law suit against AT&T for this practice. That day may come.
Yep, it's double dipping at it's finest simply because only a few cell companies have so much control over the industry. I also think a class action suit or something will happen over it.
 
I've said it before and will say it again: AT&T is cheating its customers by charging separate for a tethering plan. You pay for data. Period. If you are forced to pay for tethering data in addition to your paid data plan, you're paying twice for the very same data. If AT&T wants more money, then charge more for data. But they shouldn't do it by charging twice for the very same thing. Who cares if someone tethers and someone else doesn't? Does it really make a difference if you watch Netfilx over your iPhone or iPad or computer? AT&T simply sees an opportunity to rob their customers and that's what they're doing. I really wish that an attorney would institute a class action law suit against AT&T for this practice. That day may come.

Actually they are not, I am paying for the tethering and I get 4GB not 2....
 
Actually they are not, I am paying for the tethering and I get 4GB not 2....
I have unlimited and cannot pay for it............At&t wont let me unless I give up unlimited for the 2gb+2b plan and if I go over 4gb then I pay more

Unlimited with a $20 charge would still be cheaper so yes they would be raping me.:rolleyes:
 
I have unlimited and cannot pay for it............At&t wont let me unless I give up unlimited for the 2gb+2b plan and if I go over 4gb then I pay more

Unlimited with a $20 charge would still be cheaper so yes they would be raping me.:rolleyes:

I had the unlimited for 3yrs .... The most I use is 1gb...I have cable Internet at the house. The mobile Internet is not intended to replace your home Internet. It is mobile. The only thing I wish ATT will do is have rollover data :)
 
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